[sunikkat]

Originally Posted by vigneshkumar31

Have you driven both variants? What would you recommend between i20 iVT 1.2 vs DCT 1.0 turbo ?

I had driven IVT, DCT and IMT back to back. DCT is more fun of the lot and picks up the speed well- but I would still rate Polo TC more fun than i20 DCT.
IVT in new i20 is much better than I expected. The IVT version has 88 BHP against manual 82 BHP. I felt this is better than Jazz too. You drive with light foot and you don’t even get that rubber band effect.
IMT honestly was a confused drive. I am okay to buy IMT as my only car and if I want a compromise between manual and automatic. But at the same time it neither has the fun of manual nor the convenience of auto. So if you are someone with strong preference towards manual or auto, IMT will not satisfy.
For my requirement I booked an IVT.
So if you are looking for a smooth drive in city traffic with not much of highways go for IVT. But if you want a comparatively faster car then DCT. On reliability front I guess IVT 1.2 NA will be a better choice.

[vigneshkumar31]

Originally Posted by sunikkat

I had driven IVT, .
For my requirement I booked an IVT.
So if you are looking for a smooth drive in city traffic with not much of highways go for IVT. But if you want a comparatively faster car then DCT. On reliability front I guess IVT 1.2 NA will be a better choice.

Thanks for feedback.
I have rejected iMT outright now , as I feel it’s neither here nor there.

What’s the waiting time quoted?

[sunikkat]

Originally Posted by vigneshkumar31

Thanks for feedback.
I have rejected iMT outright now , as I feel it’s neither here nor there.

What’s the waiting time quoted?

While booking it was quoted 4 to 6 weeks, but it’s been 3 weeks but dealer has still not received the allotment in spite of their repeated follow ups. Might be because of year end.
However they have ready stock available for N Line and another 2 DCT variants

[colcol]

Originally Posted by padmrajravi

My vote is for the i20 IVT. Honda is not the quality king it used to be. And I don't have confidence in their long-term future in India. Polo may be pulled anytime. i20 looks great and will be reliable enough. Don't expect mileage from the Hyundai petrol though. I think the FE will be lower than Jazz.

I agree that Honda's quality has deteriorated. This is apparent in comparing the newer version City and Amaze with the previous avatars. For the Jazz, which doesn't sell well, it has probably not been worthwhile for Honda to make the capital investment to switch to cheaper parts. Instead, cost cutting has taken the form of removing features like magic seats. I think it can still be considered an "old Honda" product and also suffers from the lack of latest gizmos, especially compared to the i20, as a result.

The Polo definitely has a more exciting engine and superior transmission. The Jazz's CVT does come with a sports mode and 7-speed paddle shifters. So, there is something for those who enjoy being able to shift gears at will. The 1.2L engine is definitely a bit underpowered, though, and I would not recommend it if the car has to be driven in the hills.

I do share your concern about Honda's long term future in India. If the plan is to sell the car in a few years, buying any Honda product is risky.

[ashutoshb]

Since you are familiar with Tata after sales and service, I would recommend the Altroz and Tiago.

The Tiago rides well, is feature rich, has decent power and looks yum in red



Do do check fellow bhpian janakiram_m's thread.

[rpm]

Originally Posted by ron178

Well, it's not exactly the best idea - even with similar steels there can be differences in performance, for a lot of reasons. The most obvious of them would be engine intrusion for different engines and excessive pedal displacement for which the specific market car will have to be separately engineered.

What's not so obvious is differences in the quality of welds - and there's absolutely no way to figure out without access to solid crash test intrusion measurements, or otherwise by stripping the car (even then it's only possible to check for density and not strength). And that would obviously upset the Hyundai dealer here. Spot-welding is a time-consuming and expensive process, and manufacturers often use lower quality welds for certain markets - either less dense welds or less time or discharge voltage. A release of spot welds, either intentional to save cost/time or due to poor production control can lead to intrusion, or even rupture of footwell seams (look at this interesting test for example).

About the BIW diagrams - they're certainly a very interesting read. But we still don't know for sure whether they explain the differences in crash test performance, though in some cases it's very likely. All cases of different BIW parts have led to differences in crash test results too - but we can't say at all that having the same body-in-white will lead to similar crash test results, not least because of the right hand-drive nature of our market. That said, diagrams for the i20 would certainly be interesting to see. The closest I could get is a very vague diagram of the related European Hyundai Bayon in the Euro Rescue app.
Attachment 2244223…………..

I agree that this isn’t the best idea, and don’t get me wrong, I have duly mentioned that this would not conclusively prove the crash rating of the Indian i20 (perhaps should have emphasised on that part a bit more), but I think the best idea (a crash test) isn’t very certain to happen soon, or at all (unless GNCAP or Hyundai decides to surprise us). Forget spot welds, looking at just the grade of steel used doesn’t conclusively prove anything about the crash rating of a car, because the same thread notes that it is possible to engineer an all HSS (High Strength Steel) car to achieve a high ODB score, viz. Latin Creta.

The dilemma of what ‘unrated’ means is not an easy one to address, and while it would serve to be objective and unassuming in case a crash rating isn’t available so as to not mislead yourself and others; personally, when buying a car, I think one has to work with at least some assumptions, otherwise it would be maddening to go ahead with the purchase. For example, most people would generally assume the BMWs, Volvos, and other luxury brands of India to be highly safe products, even when they do not have a GNCAP rating. Are they wrong? Who knows for certain, but to be able to go ahead with the purchase, majority will most likely assume the cars to be safe (safe = high GNCAP score here), maybe because they have a reasonable expectation of safety at such exorbitant prices, or because these brands have consistently put out high scoring results around the globe. Now, if you had access to say, the body weld diagrams of these luxury cars, and if the manufacturer were to (hypothetically) use a different (presumably with lower tensile strength) grade of steel for certain parts, it wouldn’t conclusively prove the crash rating of the car, but it woud make you question why you aren’t getting the same car as the one sold abroad despite paying the luxury price. The reason could be anything, one of which could be they achieved similar crash performance with that configuration and it would increase profits in the long term, but it would help reinforce the idea of ‘do not assume anything’, contrary to the popular assumption. On the other hand, if the same grade of steel was being used, your post sufficiently proves why one still shouldn’t assume anything without a crash test.

Take the Seltos, for example. With the top variant costing 20+ lakhs, people were expecting it to be a reasonably high scoring car (which goes against the philosophy of not assuming anything, but I guess that is how humans work to a large extent). When the results dropped, it sent shockwaves among auto enthusiasts. The result wouldn’t be as disappointing if nobody assumed anything in the first place, but a lot of people were disappointed because they had assumed something regardless (even if subconsciously). If, for example, before buying the car or assuming anything about its safety (which is synonymous with a GNCAP score for many people), people had looked at the body weld diagrams, they obviously still wouldn’t know how much the car would score exactly, but at the very least, they would know that the grade of steel being used at certain places has been ‘Indianised’ and it would more heavily reinforce the idea of ‘do not assume anything’. The intangibles like intrusion, pedal displacement, quality of welds (like you have mentioned in your post), R&D of the crash performance after altering the grade of steel used would still remain a question mark, but it would give them at least some information that this isn’t the same car sold abroad (being unassuming in this case would mean you wouldn’t know if they were the same or not), and hence that might be something to consider when buying the car with any expectation of safety (or GNCAP scores).

I’m not suggesting that the OP draw any conclusions about the crash rating from body weld diagrams, but because they have mentioned that a good safety track record is vital (which Hyundai India doesn’t have), it may be worthwhile to gather a little more information since a crash rating (the best metric) isn’t available at the time. Hence, it would be interesting to see, if at the very least, changes have been made to the grade of steel used for the Indian variant, and then make a decision. Spot welds, their density, LHD to RHD conversion, intrusion and pedal displacement would still remain intangible variables (without a crash test), but the grade of steel used wouldn’t be one of them anymore. It is a shot in the dark, and you wouldn’t know who or what you end up shooting unless someone comes in with the GNCAP results in hand and turns on the lights (there you have it, another terrible analogy ). At the end of the day, this was just a suggestion because I thought it would be interesting (to have one piece of the puzzle since GNCAP ratings aren’t available); the OP may feel differently about it. There is no one size fits all; everybody has different requirements, and the Altroz despite having a 5-star GNCAP rating, doesn’t offer an automatic transmission and side airbags even as an option (as you have said).

I do appreciate the detailed explanation you provided about why body weld diagrams don’t conclusively prove the crash rating of a car though, so that in case the OP does manage to go ahead and look at the body weld diagrams, they wouldn’t assume a similar crash performance either, in case the grades of steel being used do happen to be similar.

[jithin23]

I'm also in a hunt for a car and I'd say Polo and Altroz are better than most hatch backs in the market. Altroz diesel and turbo petrol are quite fun to drive. I didn't find i20 quite interesting to drive.

[GreasyCarb55]

Originally Posted by vigneshkumar31

I appreciate your direction of thought. That’s the territory we are looking for.
Is this the i20 n line we are talking about?

From what I know the N-Line is a cosmetic job, so a normal i20 should suffice here.

Not really sure about OTR prices in Port Blair but according to CarDekho the i20 Asta Turbo IMT is around 10.40 Lakh OTR Port Blair while the another extra 25-30k gets you the Asta Turbo IMT Dual Tone.

You may go about 40-70k over budget with the Asta Turbo IMT over the Sportz Turbo IMT but the extra features should make the Mrs happy, especially the 7 Speaker BOSE sound system.

[amol4184]

Honda Jazz while it is still being sold - solid reliable car with Honda badge, great interiors, sedan rivaling space everywhere, huge boot, looks not bad and has CVT. It won't please enthusiasts but it is still 10x better than any AMT from any manufacturer.
Get it while you can. There may be discounts and ready availability considering it gets ignored by majority.

[bhaskar.guru]

Originally Posted by GreasyCarb55

From what I know the N-Line is a cosmetic job, so a normal i20 should suffice here.

N-Line has retuned suspension and rides much better than the regular i-20.

[Kousie_Arima]

The new i20 would be perfect! Speaking from personal experience I have the new i20 Asta IVT Petrol, a gem of a car for your requirements! Mine were pretty similar too with the addition of being easy to drive! Go with it, I guarantee you won't regret it.

[vigneshkumar31]

Update: Booked the Hyundai i20 Turbo 1.0 L Turbo Petrol DCT Asta(O)


Thanks a lot for the great response and inputs to my What Car query fellow BHPians.
The majority of recommendations in the thread pointed at the i20 clearly. So there is collective wisdom going for it, however I objectively evaluated the following shortlisted options and here's the decision process.

Volkswagen Polo GT TSI
Pros
+Well built solid car
+Tractable TSI and Superb DSG.
+Entry Level Access to German engineering.
+Classic and timeless design lines.

- Feels too long in the tooth now
-Confusing availability/uncertainty regarding next refresh/Polo's future?
-Interiors are of good quality but vanilla.
-Really not for those looking for features.
-Worries of expensive spares and long term maintenance costs.
-No touchpoints in Port Blair (temporary location specific con).

The Polo would have been my pick if we were buying the hatch for me. Since missus was the primary driver, the Polo didn't make the cut.

Honda Jazz ZX CVT

+Looks largest in segment but actually has a smaller footprint than i20.
+Despite above point, excellent space liberation in cabin. Honda packaging
+CVT+Paddle shifters!
+Sunroof (My son's only non-negotiable requirement)

-Nothing exciting. No special hook factor. Dead Centre political orientation in all departments.
-No Magic Seats (Great USP Lost)
-Honda's quality has definitely seen better days.
-Does not beat the other cars conclusively in any department.

Tata Altroz
+Design Looks impactful.
+Well built and feels solid.
+5 star GNCAP
+Rides and handles better than any other Tata that I've driven till date.

-No Autobox for a premium hatchback.
-2 airbags only, even in top variant.
-Standard Warranty only 2 years (Hope Tata shared our trust on its flagship hatch by giving longer warranty)
-Question of should we go Tata again?


Hyundai i20 Asta(O) 1.0 Turbo DCT
+Most powerful hatch in the segment.
+Fun to Drive ( I love this motor+ autobox combination)
+Long list of features with many segment USPs.
+All black interiors works for us.
+Love the 1.0 Turbo petrol and the DCT combination.
+Hyundai's wide service network.
+Sharp styling and looks the part for a premium hatch.
+Sun roof (My son is happy, Note: Won't be allowed to poke his neck out in motion though)
+Best enquiry, TD and booking experience at showroom (small and temporary factor but this one stood out compared to others)

-Top variant Pricey. Various engine+gearbox combinations available, but once you need the turbo the differential value proposition pushes you up to the peak variant quickly.
-Paddle shifters would have made the package complete.
-Forces one to move to top most variant for getting all safety features.
-Hope that DCT doesn't throw reliability surprises.
-Untested by GNCAP yet, so went with the variant with all safety features.
-Would've traded multiple useless features for ventilated seats.

Overall, the i20 ticked all the boxes for us. Wife was really happy (and that's all matters does'nt it? ) So ended up booking the top Asta(Option) variant in Polar White.

Another i20 at the Showroom in Starry Night.





Thank you TBHP community for the inputs!

Mods: Request edit the thread title with my choice.

[sunikkat]

^^
Congratulations, great choice. i20 though pricey, with the features and space on offer makes you feel VFM. Safety rating is a question, but hope it’s good.
I am expecting the IVT Asta delivery by this weekend.
Good decision on not exploring Polo option. Even after booking i20, I kept trying for Polo GT in almost all VW showrooms in Bangalore (though it is cramped and less features) but no one had any stock.

[vigneshkumar31]

Our white i20 arrives at the stock yard.

[car-dent]

We are in the market for a diesel hatch back which will be primarily driven by wife. We have zeroed in on i20 sports crdi and Altroz XZ variant.

Both of them have most of the common features expected at this point but a few features are unique to each. The price for both is exactly similar.

Altroz (Extra features not present in i20 Sportz)
- Alloy Wheels
- Rear wiper, Washer
- Projector Headlamps
- Keyless entry and Push Button Start-Stop.
- Adjustable rear seat headrests and rear armrest

i20 (Unique Features not available in Altrox XZ)

- 10bhp more power and 45 Nm more torque
- Digital Instrument Cluster
- Six Speed Gear Shift (so i expect slighly better mileage)
- 10mm broader tyre
- Tyre pressure monitoring system

None of the unique features in either is a dealbreaker for us.
We are concerned about long term reliability and overall comfort and refinement.

Any suggestions?