[McLaren Rulez]

This reminds me of that old joke about Land Rovers.

Did you know that over 90% of all Land Rovers ever made are still on the road today? Yes, and the remaining 10% have made it to their destination.

Joking aside, I do understand the logic put forth by some owners though. There's a reason why VAG cars with that problematic first gen DSG still sold well in India. Land Rovers are the same in their class - the desirability makes it worth the unreliability for some.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by benbsb29

Toyota for sure didn't do that out of the goodness of their heart. It did take lawsuits and ACCC threats to make that happen.

I did not say that either. But it is also true that it is not a catastrophic engine reliability issue.

Originally Posted by benbsb29

Agree with the sales numbers analogy. By the same yardstick the Ford Ranger was also right up there giving strong competition to the Hilux. Yet we don't see the Ranger or Endeavour being called the symbol of reliability.

The Ranger infact has higher sales than Hilux if you take into account private sales only. They arent called unreliable for sure but is it true of all the other Ford models? No. But its true for almost all Toyota's sold from their cheapest to their most expensive. Like it or not but the unreliability of a model within the range rubs to the other models which are totally fine. Toyota's legacy has built over multiple decades of producing reliable long lasting cars and not few exceptions here and there. Humans by nature are risk averse.

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by kiku007

And most Endy, Fortuner owners in India take their vehicles off-road for us to draw similar conclusions around reliability or capability? IIRC Ford was selling more 4X2 Endys than 4X4.

I do understand the target clientele in India.

Saar, I referred to offroading because you brought that perspective after your trip. Yes, Endeavour and Fortuners owners also rarely go off-road, but their cars are not 1+ cr and breaking down as often. I personally have three friends or acquaintances who have had such issues with LR, not including the Saboos.

My point remains that LRs are not as reliable as Prados, Pajeros and LCs. The markets back that up with sales figures, just like the Marutis obliterated the Ambys and Padminis. Now there are odd instances of Ambys running flawlessly for five decades, and they worked fine with regular maintenance, but to compare the two is not feasible.

[kiku007]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

Saar, I referred to offroading because you brought that perspective after your trip. Yes, Endeavor and Fortunes owners also rarely go off-road, but their cars are not 1+ cr and breaking down as often. I personally have three friends or acquaintances who have had such issues with LR, not including the Saboos.

My point remains that LRs are not as reliable as Prados, Pajeros and LCs. The markets back that up with sales figures, just like the Marutis obliterated the Ambys and Padminis. Now there are odd instances of Ambys running flawlessly for five decades, and they worked fine with regular maintenance, but to compare the two is not feasible.

Sorry to know about the experience of your friends. 1CR or not, no one. wants cars to breakdown. To bring Amby into the picture, I guess your friends must have had some real bad experience.

I also agree on the not as reliable as LC, Prado part but only with the addition that they aren't trash either. It's ok to disagree.

[BlackPearl]

I think both sides have valid points, Toyota fans will continue buying Toyotas and it is the same with the Land Rover fans. There is no point in debating further on this I believe.