[cool_dube]

Can't help but smile on the fact that till last year we used to hear questions to the tune of "Why don't we have any affordable 4x4s?" and now when we have this lovely, not-so-expensive jeep called the All New Thar, which can be used as easily as your daily drive to work as your weekend mud-plugger, we modify the question to "Why don't we have any affordable 4x4 other than the Mahindra Thar?" Oh, the insatiable human mind

[Sran]

We have one brilliant and affordable 4×4 in our midst and no one is buying it or bought it in numbers, it's called Force Gurkha. It has got everything which people claim they want in 4×4, proper gear ratios, ladder on frame chassis, boxy design, snorkel but without korean gadgetry.

[Aafaq]

I don't think new Thar is affordable anymore and its five door version is going to be even more expensive when launched!

There are very less options of 4x4 under 20 lakhs and there has been a recent trend of manufacturers are doing away with the AWD options as in Xuv 500, Scorpio, Duster. This goes on to show that there is less demand for such cars in the market.

However I wish there was a car with all key features and a proper 4x4 in this segment.

[cool_dube]

Originally Posted by Sran

It's called Force Gurkha

I guess we are digressing from the original post. It talks about a 4x4 more "luxury oriented" than the new Thar, so this rules out the Gurkha anyways since we all know how bare bones it is.

Originally Posted by Aafaq

I don't think new Thar is affordable anymore

Well, as someone already said earlier on this thread, affordability is relative. While most vehicles these days are slightly overpriced, I'd say the Thar is priced well for what it offers and most importantly, given that it has almost nil competition right now.

As many have already pointed out, most automotive manufacturers in India cater to "mass" market which gives a damn about AWD/4x4. As long as they have a hatch on stilts (read compact SUV) with umpteen gizmos, sunroof, a touchscreen bigger than their TV at home, cameras all around, AND gives 20 kmpl, they are happy. Why should manufacturers bother about the remaining 0.1% of the customer base? Hats off to Mahindra for challenging the status quo and giving us a wonderful enthusiast's vehicle in the Thar, while being prepared for low volumes (which did not turn out to be the case, as we all know ).

Coming to the original post, it is too generic. What's the use case here? 4x4 is a very generic term, used very loosely these days. Does one want to go for serious mud-plugging and/or take part in proper OTR events? Or is the requirement to do with a family tourer which can go that extra mile when other cars stop? Specific answers warrant specific questions, IMHO. Alternately, this is a good topic to rant and debate, anyday

[Bluebird_7]

Hi All,
I beg to differ from the majority view in this case. The booking numbers of Mahindra Thar speaks about demand for such vehicles even when it is very difficult to accept it as the only vehicle in a home.Think of a mechanically good product which can take you anywhere and the choices are extremely limited to Thar, Gurkha, V Cross in sub 20 lac segment. Duster AWD was good but cannot compete with part time 4WD. When Creta was launched general viewpoint was it is too expensive and look at the sales, same is with Seltos and Hector. These cars are expensive in my viewpoint but it appeals to their target segment and they are willing to pay higher price. Same is what i believe is the reason for good sales of Thar, people are complaining on all SM forums about delivery but are also mentioning if it would not have been Thar, they would have cancelled the booking . If i get mechanicals of Thar and comfort and features of compass i am willing to pay 3-4 lac premium over current Thar. Open to viewpoints of others

[Kosfactor]

Unlike old Jeeps that are used as utility vehicles, Thar 2.0 is a vehicle nobody needs. Bolero series of commercial vehicles are better suited for working in Jeep trails apart from Major and older Jeeps of course.

But is there a market for a third fun vehicle in the Garage? Yes.

But product has to be desirable, period.

Will I buy one? Yes, does my wife want one? Yes. Do I want one? Yes.

A modern version of Gypsy can be a desirable thing too. I can't think of any other off-road specific vehicles that occupy customer's mind as much.

[Emvi]

As already mentioned, the demand/market for such vehicles is relatively low. Take for example the previous gen Thar. I don't have the exact numbers, but from what I have heard is that the sales numbers for the 4wd version wasn't great compared to the 2wd version. The 2wd was a lot cheaper as well. There was a time when people in rural areas had no other choice but use an UV as a family car owing to the poor road conditions. Times have changed now. It is also true nowadays that the 4x4 UVs are more of a lifestyle vehicle than anything else. Although the new Thar is doing great numbers, once the initial euphoria settles down, I think the sales numbers will come down drastically. A bare bones 4x4 UV may not appeal the masses, and the one with all the bells and whistles will definitely not be cheap and not for the masses. It is a niche market and it is not so big for other automakers to atleast think about it. That's the reason probably automakers are not keen on developing more such vehicles.

[vjbox]

My personal take on this: Cars have always been a very aspirational, status symbol purchase for most of the Indians. Bragging rights come associated with cars so the next door uncle or a distant relative can take note and throw some appreciation. How many of the commoners purchase them for absolute necessity ? Cars for us Indians need to exude some amount of elegance, comfort and in modern times, a lot of gizmos. A hardcore 4X4 doesn't really offer all of these in one package. I strongly believe Indian manufacturers very well know these factors and shape their product offerings accordingly. They know people will be happy with soft-roaders that can be positioned and masqueraded as SUVs here. With majority of them using their vehicles in urban and highway conditions, 4X4 seldom finds it way.

[IP_Man]

Tata Safari and Mahindra Scorpio use to offer affordable 4 x 4 capability on select models but as GTO pointed out before, their weight was enemy in the deep slush negating or limiting usefulness of 4 x 4 capability is one of the reason of low sell.

Most of the rugged 'Body on frame', 'Rear Wheel Drive' and 'Engine Protection Skid Plate' e.g. 4 x 2 Tata Safari Storme can take most of the difficult terrane of hilly north eastern region do not require 4 x 4 capability. Difficult terrane of Gurudongmar lake is perfectly doable in such vehicles.

The only nimble and capable Renault Duster's AWD version was rejected because of extremely bland interior and feeble feature set for the price it was asking for.

[vox_alienus]

I have been thinking of exchanging my Polo for a small 4x4 or AWD that would not be significantly larger than it, and would have high safety ratings, but found none yet. I think a Subaru would do well here, but they don't seem to be interested.

[H0RSEPOWER]

Well the answer why the manufacturers are not selling affordable 4x4 private vehicles is surely the less demand of the same as mentioned by a lot of other fellows earlier.
But why the demand itself is not there? Now the answer for this is, even though we have frequent road undulations (read - sometimes craters!) & huge speed breakers (read - step mountains), but still in the current era the road condition in most of the Indian roads do not require any 4x4 at all in most of the scenarios. Only thing required in 99% scenarios is may be greater ground clearance. The slushy or muddy no roads scenario of the rural areas have been now modified a lot to accommodate FWD cars.
Here in Canada people opt for AWD/4WD mostly because of the snow in the winter. Same is the case for a lot of European countries. But in India, this snow related issues happens only in the states of Sikkim, Kashmir, Himachal, Uttarakhand, Northern parts of West Bengal, and Arunachal Pradesh. And even in those ares I have seen people tackling with fwd hatchbacks also!
Now we mostly see the need of 4x4 is more for fun, than for need. And hence, when people are going to sign the cheque book, in most of the times practically prevails and they don’t opt to pay extra for something which would almost never be required apart from having fun in off road only once in a blue moon!

[viXit]

Originally Posted by IP_Man

Most of the rugged 'Body on frame', 'Rear Wheel Drive' and 'Engine Protection Skid Plate' e.g. 4 x 2 Tata Safari Storme can take most of the difficult terrane of hilly north eastern region do not require 4 x 4 capability.

In fact, a BHPian has done a Leh trip even beyond where civilians are allowed in a 4x2 storme.
Link to thread here (Ladakh'ed in a Tata Safari Storme)

[apachelongbow]

A hardcore 4*4 can never be a primary family car. A family car/SUV with a 4*4 will never be an out and out hardcore off-roader, unless you buy a g-wagen or a defender. We can't really blame the manufacturer here since the market for a 4*4 is so tiny. Mahindra I believe has done a fine job on the new Thar in taming the off-roader, yes its more expensive than an entry level hatchback, but knowing the conditions of India, this is probably the cheapest we can get.

[Miel]

Originally Posted by justwheels

How many buy the compass trail hawk version vs the 4x2 version.

Well actually the Jeep Compass Trailhawk is not the 4x4 version of the normal Jeep Compass, but yet another 4x4 version of the Jeep Compass although with different 4x4 mechanicals and features. The Compass always had and still does have a non-Trailhawk 4x4 version on sale. The Trailhawk was Dead-on-Arrival not due to being a 4x4 variant, but due to being a very expensive 4x4 variant of an otherwise reasonably priced car . But, yes, I do agree that 4x4 variants of any given car sell much less than their 4x2 variants in India.

The mass market consumers in India prefer an SUV / Crossover more for the space, upmarket and butch looks, and less for any go-anywhere capability. In the rare event they decide to take their "SUV" to Leh, there are always other friendly motorists willing to tug them out of trouble. As for the ones who venture far off road alone, they get to choose a used 4x4 or a brand new Thar or Gurkha. That market is miniscule.

Originally Posted by GTO

The 2nd-gen Thar's success has got everyone's attention for sure and no one - not even Mahindra - expected these booking volumes. They actually had to increase production! But I think it's a one off because the Thar currently enjoys almost zero direct competition and has copycat looks (not everyone can pull this off or will want to).

GTO is absolutely right! I would even go further and say that if Mahindra decides to make 4x4 optional on its latest Thar, then the sales will tilt heavily towards the 4x2 Thar variants. We did have a 4x2 Thar DI on sale until recently which was lapped up by the rural market and government agencies. I bet that the Thar 5-door will have 4x2 variants, just like the Scorpio, XUV500, Fortuner, and Endeavor.

[bhansali_hardik]

A simple first reason is why would you want one?
We do not have Many trails, if you try exploring trails you land in trouble, you do land in trouble by cops or locals or forest department! If you manage to negotiate all of the above factors, you might not have a great mechanical rescue around!
Even if you’ll buy One, as a tertiary car, how many of us do have the luxury and space to keep such cars and maintain them?

We have a endeavour 3.2 AT 4x4 in our family and it’s been around 3 years since we bought it and guess what? I can think only a few 100 kms at best is where we actually needed the 4x4 capabilities! Heck, we did the agham shyok route using a 2x2 xuv! So, all in all these 4x4 for folks living in cities make no sense! They are fuel guzzlers and even if we want to use their capabilities we’ve to travel far and wide! Rather why not hire out any 4x4 enjoy the trails where all the headache is literally paid off for the hefty fees and have a good mannered road cars.

Only if there was a huge population living remote and had money and a purpose only then this category will actually log numbers!