[vedirah]

Originally Posted by rohan_iitr

Why can't the car manufacturers put some protective wrap on the painted surfaces to prevent damage during transit ? The cost would be negligible if done at the factory level.

OK, I already see a problem with this - some morons will never remove the protective wrap.

Rohan

Another issue with this is that a freshly painted surface needs to 'breathe' in order to cure properly. I believe the correct terminology is called 'outgassing' of the paint solvents. I'm not sure whether the new water based paints need this process too, but I'm quite sure about this for VOC based paints.

If you go to a good detailer with a spanking new car and ask for a PPF, if they're knowledgeable enough they should advise you to wait a couple of weeks before you get it done.

[lapis_lazuli]

Originally Posted by rohan_iitr

Why can't the car manufacturers put some protective wrap on the painted surfaces to prevent damage during transit ?

Many do, already, in India! For example :

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offic...ml#post5440381 (Skoda Superb : Official Review)

[Kedrock]

Thank you all for your valuable suggestions.

As pointed out by many esteemed members Trust is important. To gain the trust we have to be transparent. Either we can leave the dents and scratches as it is - for the customer to see - with a promise to fix it to the best of our ability or highlight the repainted panel to the customer before delivery and hope for the best.
The above exercise of gaining trust always does come with a lot of expectation of discount but it is the best course of action for us (dealers) and we will continue to do so. I guess it's a part of doing business.

[dipen]

Two keywords: trust and faith

• For any dent, scratch; show it to the customer before any work. Show empathy instead of things like its nothing, its very minor, this is routine, no one can spot it easily. Transparency and care is the key to faith here. Sometimes the scratch or a small ding can be lived with. Share a transparent opinion with the customer if they can live with it with the intent of not just saving an internal cost but with the intent of preserving factory paint and finish. In lieu; recommend value adds to the customer which may not cost the dealer much but customer can see value like 2-3 free labour services, any single panel, bumper, door repaint anytime in the future which the customer can use in the next 5 years, maybe offer a higher discount on accessories. And yes in writing please whichever is mutually agreed.
• In case the customers wants it repaired, agree to the same while welcoming the customer to the service center to view it personally, so that he /she feels there will be a quality job done with all genuine OEM specs and parts. Provide a 5 year warranty for the repair job on paint fade, rust on the impacted panel / part. Again in writing please.

Basically make the customer feel you are completed motivated for ensuring the feel of a new car feel / hassle free, trouble-free from customer standpoint.

Build the confidence that you will support 100 % whatever the customer is comfortable with. If the customer is also reasonable and believes in you; based on your approach; he or she will not be adamant for a new car or ask for an unreasonable discount.

[Vtach]

Thank you first up for getting this rather uncomfortable conversation started.

As I understand it, the two parties here have a fundamental conflict of financial interests.

The dealership, as any business would, aims to maximize its profits by squeezing the maximum out of the customer's pocket in lieu of providing a brand new car from the OEM (insisting on insurance from the dealer, handling charges, "compulsory" accessories, inflated RTO charges, least possible expense on training & paying the staff, storage yards open to elements etc).

And the customer would hope the opposite, to pay the bare minimum possible for the same car. So you see, there's always going to be a bit of back and forth in such a transaction.

As most car buyers aren't as aware as say an average BHPian, the dealership has an upper hand mostly in the negotiations, eg the option of taking the insurance from outside isn't even brought up unless specifically asked for as that would mean losing a fat commission.

In this light let's see the issues brought out here

1. The deal is for a brand new vehicle from the manufacturer, not a refurbished one. The original paint from factory is also a vital & prominently visible part of the product. By definition, brand new would mean the condition it's supposed to be in as it left the factory. Now, if for some reason, things have been changed (body panels refurbished in this case), it's no longer in factory condition.

Would you accept a Rs. 25,000/- Van Heusen 3 piece suit from a showroom if on inspection you find some patchwork done on the seat of the pants? And yet the car buyer is somehow expected to take this massively more expensive thing (20 lakh in the recent Skoda thread) in his stride just to save the seller some business loss?

If the dealer promises factory condition but delivers a refurbished one, how is this not fraud? I'm sorry but this attempt on the part of the dealership to pass on this occupational hazard of their business onto the buyer is simply unethical and deplorable.

2. The buyer's fear of being taken for a literal ride is real. This forum itself is full of horror stories, there's even a thread on an older unsold Skoda Rapid being refurbished by the Skoda dealer cosmetically to resemble the (then) recently launched Black edition and passed off to an unsuspecting dude as the newly launched version. The cheek of it!

What else has not been disclosed apart from this repainting? Was the car involved in an accident? Was it used for joy rides/test rides and the meter reset/disconnected? There's no way to be sure of any of this except not to settle for anything less than a brand new vehicle.

3. Dealerships know this all too well, that a buyer isn't likely to accept a vehicle considered damaged in any sense, or will use it as a bargaining chip for discounts. So, accepting their mistake (coming clean & offering extended warranty etc as suggested above) is likely to cause them financial loss; anathema to the basic financial premise of being as profitable as possible. Hence the strong incentive for them to hide it, do some "jugaad" and hope the customer doesn't notice it/downplay it as a minor thing.

On the same, don't dealers insure their cargo against such damages while transit/storage/ being driven by their employees from unloading point to stock yard/showroom? If yes, then doesn't the insurance take care of the dealers' interests? Or do they skip that to maximize profits again, is that part of the problem here?

[Dry Ice]

Originally Posted by Kedrock

I guess it's a part of doing business.

Welcome to the forum, and thanks for trying to do the right thing for your customers.

What is the percentage of cars that suffer such trivial/minor scratches during transit? When you do repair these cars, who foots the bill for the repairs? OEMs/insurance?

If you suffer such damage on a regular basis, did you try to analyse these incidents to find the common factor? A particular driver, location, route, time of day, specific areas on cars etc? It might help you out of this conundrum if you can mitigate (or reduce) these mishaps in the first instance.

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by Kedrock

Dear all

I request you to share your perspective on the topic.

As an automotive dealer, we handle the new cars with utmost care however, on rare occasions (while shifting the cars from stockyard to showroom) the new vehicles may get scratches, tiny dents. We send these cars to workshop and get them fixed (panel or panels repainted) before delivery.s

First off, I appreciate your open-ness.
And your intent to do the right thing. I wish that all dealers of products including but not limited to cars, had the same attitude to their customers.

I have only a few small suggestions.

1. Process. Establish and solid and strong process at the dealership itself.
2. Invest in attitude training and process training for all staff.
3. Invest in covered parking with a cement/ concrete floor for the yard.
4. Ensure you keep limited ready inventory so as to save your cash flows, deal with your central principals to work on Just in Time.
5. Always make sure that the new vehicles are covered in that film and brought in to the dealer yard in a transporter only.
6. Move the vehicles between the yard and the showroom(s) only on a flat bed which means you may need to buy your own flatbed. This can also act as your brand advertisement - you can label the vehicle as XYZ Motors Showroom Delivery Vehicle or similar. And let it float around town a bit to show people.
7. Train your mechanics and staff in soft skills. Ensure that they wear clean gloves when handling all vehicles. And make sure before sitting in any car the car seats are covered with loose covers.
8. Do NOT give your dealer cars to any stupid YouTubers and wannabe video makers/ testers.
9. Do NOT oblige various relatives and friends either by lending them cars or treating them differently to a paying customer.
10. Make sure your keep your test driver cars in perfect shape. Never let them get filthy and uncared for. Sell them off when they reach 10K Kms and replace them.
11. Make sure the staff handle all cars with respect.
Ive too often seen the dealer staff of multiple top brands mis-handling the dealership cars.
12. Make sure staff are rewarded adequately somas to be able to cope with these changes and embrace them too. But then, at the same time, don’t be afraid to sack people if they aren't conforming to the standards you set. Always lead by example. There has to be only one set of rules for all. Iron Discipline!
13. Work on the discounts you offer. Do not over discount. Make sure your margin covers the above investments. Yes customers including those on this forum demand discounts. Sometimes they are unreasonable. And the general feeling is one of great sense of achievement having diddled the dealer out of a few thousands or lakhs depending on the segment. I would say take a hard call and reduce your urge to over discount just to meet numbers. Try and first show all the customers and your principals these above steps and be prepared to lose a few sales in the initial period. Stick to your guns, weather the storm and believe me, if you hold on to your principles you will see an uptick. Serious customers who are appreciative of your steps will come. The riffraff will be weeded out.
14. If you are able to, enlist the support of at least one more dealer in your town, preferably of the same brand, and convince him/ her to do the same things as above. This will start making some difference at grassroots level.
15. Start a ruthless ‘war on waste’ - paper,
Printouts, stationery, etc. Try and do all your workflows electronically. You ll be surprised how much you save.

I believe in being strong, tough, yet fair.
I also believe that one must have very deep conviction so as to act consistently in the ‘right way’.

Times may get tough for a bit, yes, but the sun will shine through in the end.

Your own principals will see the difference and it wont hurt to ‘lobby’ a bit with them too, once you start with these changes.

[pavi]

Originally Posted by Kedrock

As pointed out by many esteemed members Trust is important. To gain the trust we have to be transparent. Either we can leave the dents and scratches as it is - for the customer to see - with a promise to fix it to the best of our ability or highlight the repainted panel to the customer before delivery and hope for the best.

Buddy, you are missing the bigger picture here. Which brand dealership you are talking about. If it is VW/Skoda/Nissan/MG (etc.), then being transparent or not transparent has its own implications. No matter what ever level of transparency you come up with, people will find reasons to 'paint' you. If you paint it, they would bash you with 'a factory finish is a factory finish' comment. If you don't paint it, then 'you handled it carelessly'. So you end up as a fraud/careless dealer in most cases.

A niggle prone TATA or Mahindra would be done away with 'we are just beta testing' comments and a repainted panel in some brands would result in 'we should boycott' comments. Between Mahindra and TATA, the former is a more safer choice for dealership. If you are having a Maruti dealership, come up with a 'its normal in Maruti cars' reason, a large majority would be content with it. Yes, I had heard a lot of this reason while we had Maruti cars for 12 years, especially from service centers.

So applying the same logic to different brands would not be fruitful. You can be transparent with the repainting or the scratch if the customer is 'reasonable'. No, 'reasonable' does not mean 'knowledgable'. Like say, some one who understands a car is not packed in a box with all sorts of foams to protect it from external impacts like how a mobile phone is packed and transported. Please note, my 'reasonable' customer is not a 'blind' customer.

Note: by 'large majority' or 'most customers', I do not mean 'all customers'.

[Nithesh_M]

Easy solution. Just ask the factory to take back the damaged panels in the same truck it was delivered as damaged. Tell factory to send painted panels straight from factory to maintain same finish for end customer.

This whole paint matching business at your dealership end can be skipped then and nobody will notice the thickness difference after delivery and cry about it

[Apex1815]

I have used the cars from Maruti, Hyundai & TATA. I have observed that the cars at Dealer Stockyards (& Service centres) are badly handled by the Sales & Service Team, therefore please train your staff to be careful.

You are well aware that a Car is an aspiration for a buyer and is a Second big ticket purchase of life (first being the home), so there are a lot of emotions attached to this as a buyer needs to do a lot of savings and financial planning from their hard earned money before handing over Cheque to you.
So please do not expect that a customer will happily take a repainted car.

Now coming to the other part, what if a car is repainted at dealer level because of a minor scratch ?

The answer to this : It is a Dealers responsibility is to inform customer and ask for his consent before repainting a panel. In most (around 100%) of the cases, customers are not aware of any such job performed on the vehicle and spots the same only while taking delivery or later. This will only raise suspicion in the mind to the customer like either the car may be a Test drive car, or accidental case etc.

However, the final decision of accepting repainted car should always be with the customer as he has payed you 100% upfront and has the right to get the brand new car without any scratch/repaint.

After all you yourself will never accept a Rolex watch/An I-phone with scratches on its body.

Now what Preventive measure a Dealer can take here to avoid scratches on the vehicle :
You can consider introducing a Check point system in your organization w.r.t all the stages involved at your end:

1) Unloading the car from trailer at Stockyard
2) Storage of car
3) Transporting car from Stockyard to the showroom
4) Car preparation by service team for delivery

At all these stages, introduce the inspection for any scratches and dents and identify the person who is responsible for the same and have suitable penality system. This way you staff will be more careful and such incidences will significantly reduce.

[ashutoshb]

Welcome to the forum, brother.

Originally Posted by Kedrock

We send these cars to workshop and get them fixed (panel or panels repainted) before delivery.

Does your sales staff inform the buyer, that some paint job has been done to their car?

Originally Posted by Kedrock

Many a times the dealer is labelled as fraud.

Your answer to my question, should answer this one.

[SoumenD]

Welcome to the Forum.

Being honest upfront is the key. A dealership maybe handling 100s/1000s of same car daily so it might look like a small deal for them. But for a buyer its a once in 5-8 years (at times more than a decade) experience. So they would definitely feel cheated if the truth isn’t shared. Btw I always wondered if a customer refuses to accept such a car, can’t dealership inform the same to manufacturers and get a new panel? Or sell it at a discounted rate and claim it from manufacturer?

Btw is it a coincidence we have two threads from opposite perspectives around same time?

Link

[sarfraz1997]

Honest mistakes always happen in every place. While it is not a good experience to have to purchase a car with a repainted panel and having to find out about it in the wrong way, it is always better for both the dealer and the customer if issues of this sort are dealt with honesty and empathy.

The major cause here is mishandling by the staff, because of lack of restrictions and penalties on the staff. In most cases, the responsible staff just gets an earful if caught, and if unnoticed, nothing at all. This makes these type of issues tolerable to the dealer and staff. While it is difficult to bring a change in staff mindset, it has to start somewhere some day, maybe in the form of dealer policies. However, to a buyer who plans and saves up to purchase a car in let’s say, once in five years, this is going to be a big deal as others have pointed out. Discounts and freebies might help those who wouldn’t mind a repainted panel, or the more folk who take satisfaction in getting a good deal over an imperfection.

In my opinion, the very least a dealer can do is, instead of repainting the panel, replace the panel with a brand new one, and paint this brand new panel. This has to be topped off with a discount or freebies such as the SVP’s on offer these days. If a mistake is made, a price has to be paid, and merely repainting the same panel and trying to hide it or pass it on is unjust to the customer.

[Gildarts]

Originally Posted by Kedrock

Now, as we are delivering a new car we expect the prospect to treat the car as new only but almost all the times prospect demand a huge discount/ different car. On this forum also, almost everyone who's been delivered a repainted car treats the new car as a lemon/ used/ defective one. Many a times the dealer is labelled as fraud.
Regards

Well, when a brand new cellphone with scratched display or body panels is considered a defective piece, how can a car be any different?
If a dealer sells a repainted car (even if it's just touch-up) without informing the buyer, then it is fraud.
If a car is scratched or dented, show it to prospective buyers and when a customer agrees to accept the car after repair work, then undertake the process with full knowledge of the customer. The customer is likely to demand discounts. It is to avoid this cut in their profit margins, that the dealers attempt passing off such cars without informing customers.

[ArTigor]

Yes it is a big deal if the brand new car being handed over to me is repainted at the dealer level. Frankly, if it is just some scratches which have been flawlessly repainted then it would have been fine to me, but then there is a lack of trust because of the following reasons:

1. I do not know why was it repainted, whether it was a surface level issue or some greater damage.
2. I do not blindly trust the executives at the dealership.
3. There have been instances in the past where I have known of, where cars badly damaged while being driven/transported from the yard to the showroom were repaired and sold.
4. When you sell me your car you do not let a penny off your earning, why should I accept something inferior/refurbished?
5. Generally patch-up jobs at dealership level are done in a haste and come out as inferior quality(not all, but most of them do), My colleague had purchased an Ertiga in 2019 with zero discount, when I saw the car I told him the rear quarter panel and hatch door looks like they are repainted, he said there is no issue as it may be a minor touchup, one year later that car had rust bubbles in the exact same spot.
6. While 90% unsuspecting buyers would not even recognize these touchups, neither do dealers voluntarily go ahead and inform these unsuspecting customers, that's where the 10% knowledgeable buyers have an eye of suspicion always.
7. Lets put it this way, those dealers who indulge in the malpractice of brushing things under the sheet have themselves made things bad for the handful good dealers in these scenarios, as in general there is lack of trust, No laws to protect the buyer makes us even more cautious.