[SaiSW]

The Endeavour was the only car even slightly giving competition for the Fortuner. Now that Ford has called it quits, it's free reign for Toyota.

They can remove the half decent JBL sound system and replace it with the mediocre 6 speaker system which actually should belong in a 5 lac rs hatchback, they can increase the price even more, they can remove rain sensing wipers, auto headlamps and cruise control. They can even give it halogen headlamps for crying out loud, and people STILL would queue up to buy one of these. That's the sad reality of how a monopoly works.

[Born 2 Be Wild]

Welcome step for those planning an audio upgrade, the first thing my guy asked me when I called him for upgrade was, hope you did not get the JBL version, or we have to change the HU! Sad news for people who actually do not want to upgrade and are happy with stock systems. Will Toyota suffer, hell no, they will still be similing all the way to the bank! The Japanese are all about functionality and reliability, having a second Toyota I would say yes they are leagues behind the competition in terms of features on offer vis a vis the the other brands, however having owned the Endeavour before and seeing the wonderful service of Ford! I would say, Japanese each time every time. Having the Isuzu MU-X and the Fortuner now I am content. To each his own ��

[GoBlue]

Audio is the one of the easiest mods to do on a car, especially given that the Fortuner will come with dedicated mounting points for the remaining 5 speakers (a subwoofer included perhaps) which have been deleted.

Having said that, Skoda did the same thing on the Octavia L&K (12 speaker Canton system deleted, replaced by an 8 speaker Harman substitute), yet people bought it for the fantastic engine/gearbox combination and great interior.

Life is too short to not buy good cars because of lesser speakers.

What I find lacking in the Fortuner is the interior quality, fit and finish, it's unacceptable for a 50L car.

[varunswnt]

IMO, this time Toyota-Kirloskar themselves felt that further price hike on already expensive non-premium vehicle (but priced with hefty premium) might tip people in favour of other vehicles in that price bracket. Even they realize that price hike will make it that more illogical to justify buying this car, patrons might even switch to Hycross ZX. So, instead of absorbing the loss they went with deletion of JBL system (I don't think it is about inventory). They never dig into their profits, they just pass it onto customers, that's the Toyota way.

I think hatred (remember that song from movie Delhi belly - "I hate you like I love you") for this car comes from the fact that Fortuner brand tries its best (they always find reasons to price it out of competition) to remain elusive or unattainable to many enthusiasts.

[Sankar]

Guess the Fortuner 11 speaker system is - 3 way speakers up front with woofer and tweeter on door and midrange on dash corner for a total of 6 speakers up front + a midbass and tweeter on the rear door for a total of 4 speakers in the middle, + a subwoofer for a total of 11 speakers? Doesn't seem to have a center channel. Its a 5 channel system.

For the discerning audiophile an aftermarket high end 2 way or 3 way installation with a DSP and amplifier should fill in the missing frequencies and add a few more. Adding a 6th channel for center speaker is also possible. All of this is possible without cutting any of the stock wires including one that goes into the headunit by using a OE-stereo-harness extender.

[Govind]

Originally Posted by d3mon

To see how much money Toyota is milking out of the Fortuner, I tried comparing the Australian prices for a 2.8 Diesel Automatic Fortuner and a 330i MSport.

Australian Prices:
Fortuner 2.8D Auto 4x2 Base ~= 50K AUD (27L INR)
BMW 330i MSport ~= 93K AUD (51L INR)

Indian prices:
Fortuner 2.8D Auto 4x2 Base = 37.4L INR
BMW 330i MSport SWB (before recent discontinuation) = 52.9L

India to Australian prices ratio:

Fortuner = 1.38x
BMW 330i = 1.04x

Draw your own conclusions about the price-value equation here.

I had seen some interesting calculations as Toyota is getting only peanuts compared to what the government is getting while selling a Fortuner.

See one explanation here: https://auto.hindustantimes.com/auto...667801923.html

It is like Toyota gets about Rs 40k per Fortuner, the dealer gets 1L, while our Govt is getting Rs 18L. Probably this might be the major contributing factor to the Australian price difference.

Toyota previously said the difficulties in growing in India as this: https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/20...dia-expansion/

So the only option for them would be to reduce some 'value addition', which they think JBL is a good one, to begin with.

/Govind

[umairalvi]

It is absolutely unbelievable how this strictly average product manages to sell in huge numbers. We, Indians are experts at ignoring a world class product and making such products a success. People will call me a Fortuner hater but I am saying this as a car enthusiast more than anything else. Fortuner is synonymous with 'netas' and 'lal battis' imo. It is become more of a symbol of showing strength than anything else. It is beyond my imagination how people manage to ignore luxury brands when they are spending those big bucks on a car.
A car that used to sell for 25-30 lakhs a few years ago is gradually approaching the price of its older sibling, the LC Prado.

[SYR]

Toyota’s making it so much easier for me to persuade my father to buy an x3. I am all for it because the fortuner is nothing but a cash cow now. If you really want an offroader, just spend a couple of lakhs more and get a wrangler. The value proposition is true but the thing is, any major repairs on parts like the front suspensions are gonna be very expensive.

[AROO7]

IMHO music is a very important part of everyone’s life only the intensity differs. Remember how Steve Jobs with the iPod not only decimated the rivals (Sony’s walkman and others) but in turn helped drive the sale of iMacs in the process.
Now coming to a car, for an enthusiast a good engine+gearbox alongwith a fantastic music system is non-negotiable. Heck Tata understood that and enjoys a huge fanbase just for their JBL music system. Cars like Seltos, Creta, and Hector give so much emphasis in marketing Bose sound system offered in them.
But when you talk about Toyota Fortuner of all the cars in the world, it seems like Toyota is living on a completely different island and catering to God knows what kind of customer demands. As a product now Fortuner is just a BOF, powered by a great oil burner, a well put together SUV and nothing more. I will discount the off-road prowess because majority Fortuners are just mall-crawlers.

Speaking just from my heart I wish that Toyota is shown it’s place by its customers. Mahindra with the XUV700 and Scorpio N has proved that others can have SUV which are so much more than a Fortuner in many areas and also not insanely overpriced. Just for the latter part I not for once discount Toyota for being the company who earns peanuts on it so they have to keep on increasing its price and delete features. That being said, other brands need to make Toyota’s product look ridiculously outdated and overpriced to make them even think of giving us something better.

[TorqueIndia]

Originally Posted by Govind

I had seen some interesting calculations as Toyota is getting only peanuts compared to what the government is getting while selling a Fortuner.

It is like Toyota gets about Rs 40k per Fortuner, the dealer gets 1L, while our Govt is getting Rs 18L. Probably this might be the major contributing factor to the Australian price difference.

/Govind

Does that mean BMW is sacrificing a lot for existing in India, might be doing something as a part of charitable contributions to India ?

Toyota is benefitting a lot in the intermittent processing for imported parts and technology sharing between Toyota Kirloskar India and the parent group which are hidden in those promoted calculators.

The music system and also beefed up insulation is very important for Toyota diesels as the NVH are not the finest. Most of the owners invest 25K for apple carplay adapters , 50K for further noise insulation and the dealers charge another 50K for 360cam. The customer undergoes a day light robbery while purchasing a Toyota only in India.

[sandeepmdas]

Originally Posted by Govind

It is like Toyota gets about Rs 40k per Fortuner, the dealer gets 1L, while our Govt is getting Rs 18L.

@Govind, I am not trying to mock you; what you have posted is correct, this is indeed what TKM has said. These are my thoughts about their statement:

AFAIK the arrived calculation is the final, net, everything-discounted-after figure that they take home.

That is, they discount the taxes, overheads, production expenses, salaries, wages, advert costs, dealer commission, freight, royalty to the parent Toyota Jidosha Kabushiki Kaisha, subsidy for masala dosha in canteen etc. etc. and finally walk into the bank with 40K in their hands.

Toyota is not making an attempt to make both ends meet here, nor they're fighting for survival. With every such "facelift", both the demand and the price for the older versions will go only north.

[lionheart_mm]

Originally Posted by umairalvi

It is absolutely unbelievable how this strictly average product manages to sell in huge numbers. We, Indians are experts at ignoring a world class product and making such products a success. People will call me a Fortuner hater but I am saying this as a car enthusiast more than anything else. Fortuner is synonymous with 'netas' and 'lal battis' imo. It is become more of a symbol of showing strength than anything else. It is beyond my imagination how people manage to ignore luxury brands when they are spending those big bucks on a car.
A car that used to sell for 25-30 lakhs a few years ago is gradually approaching the price of its older sibling, the LC Prado.

I can understand why Fortuner sells in India. We've one in our extended family, we also have a Merc E class and an Audi A6. With Audi or the Merc I've to plan the routes I'm traveling, and my heart aches driving it through the potholes in Kerala, while driving the Fortuner i don't have to care about any of these things.

Also, there are other things like reliability and service cost, which is similar to a Maruti. The resale value is an icing on the cake.

However, there are other global products which could work in India like the Mitsubishi Pajero sports or the Mazda CX 9, but we don't have them in India and is only left with an ugly SUV from MG as an alternative.

[DrZhivago]

Originally Posted by lionheart_mm

Also, there are other things like reliability and service cost, which is similar to a Maruti. The resale value is an icing on the cake.

However, there are other global products which could work in India like the Mitsubishi Pajero sports or the Mazda CX 9, but we don't have them in India and is only left with an ugly SUV from MG as an alternative.

I totally agree with the part about the confidence the Fortuner gives as we drive it through bad roads but I must tell you that the service cost has gone way beyond maruti territory and is now in VW territory I feel even though it's not yet at par with the mercs. A simple oil change and filter changes will way above 15k or more. Add brake pads and all then we can see it Speed up. And yes, if only MG made the Glister look more mainstream and naturally butch. God Speed

[vredesbyrd]

I remember the performance of the 11 speaker system during my test drive. It was okay (my superb had far better audio quality and my vento has way better volume)

OT:
To be honest, doesn't seem like a big loss but we know what comes next. 2-3L price hike.
Next they are going to remove android auto and carplay and bump the price up by 5-7L.
Reverse camera next and another hike of 10-12L.

Soon, it will be cheaper to buy an Embraer Legacy than a Fortuner.
Request current owners not to sell now because in a few years, a used Fortuner may easily net you 2-3Cr

[Thekalacoatwala]

The Fortuner did have this 11-speaker JBL setup. Now, they go ahead and delete it? That's news to me. IMHO, even if they remove all the seats, people will still buy it. Like people dancing to generator sounds after the DJ stops.

Man, these Toyota guys are really smoking something weird.

On a side note, I went to check the Hycross. Even my mother was impressed with the seating and space and features and all, right till the point when the SA told us the price - an eye-watering 32L OTR and her comment was that even my old 1.6 S-Cross has better interior quality. Ain't paying 3 million for plastic. Not at all.

She didn't even bother with the Fortuner. Just an overgrown mini-truck, she said.