[pqr]

• In 2023, Toyota and Maruti sold 14,220 vehicles with hybrid drivetrains.
• Which is 2.1% of total passenger vehicles sold in 2023.
• BEV sales in 2023 is 11,038 units, which is 1.6% of the total passenger vehicle market in 2023.
• Tata Motors has an 82% share of the Indian BEV market.
• The Tata Tiago EV is the best-selling electric vehicle in 2023.
• With limited BEV production capacity, Tata seems to have prioritized Tiago EV supply in early 2023.

Note: Toyota Vellfire sales are at 82; Bubble is excluded from the current chart as it is an outlier.

[SoumenD]

Pretty obvious isn’t it? I mean no matter what one says, we are just taking baby steps in terms of EV infrastructure.

Hybrid is tailor made for India in absence of Diesels. With scale I hope the prices come down and they become accessible to more and more people.

[ninjatalli]

Those sales are because of Toyota's particular model (Innova for eg) success and not the hybrid drivetrains. If it was the opposite, the Camry would be selling a lot more than the 100-odd it did. The combination of Toyota (&Maruti) reliability + successful brand (Innova, etc) is the reason for the numbers.

Toyota is playing the catch-up game as seen on the global EV scene, although they now state that they aren't placing all their eggs only in one basket. A true comparison would be if they (Maruti or Toyota) had an EV option next to the hybrid drivetrain option, but that unfortunately is not going to be so for a while.

[ron178]

Clearly Toyota and Maruti have the upper hand here. By pricing their products well they are encouraging adoption, even if the selling point is the car rather than the powertrain. Interesting to see that the Camry features on the chart, but the Honda City e:HEV doesn't! Hopefully the Elevate is priced more competitively because they don't have the first mover's advantage.

[On4Wheels]

It is too early to say whether the Toyota's bet is getting paid off or not. However, I think Toyota's decision to bring the hybrid technology to India is the best decision that they have ever taken for Indian market. Currently, the EV owners are in honeymoon period: the scenario will be entirely different once the volume increases. The uncertainty over the diesel engines (DPF issues and 10 year scrapping policy) makes the hybrids sweeter. Also, any increase in fuel price will definitely force more customers to move to hybrid. Above all, considering the complexity of Indian power scenario, I think, more and more buyers may gravitate to hybrid because of the following reasons:

• Meeting the increase in per capita power consumption itself is a challenging task. The EVs will definitely make the power deficit wider which may lead to load shedding and power cuts.
• The existing supply chain for the petroleum products is extremely good and hence, there is no uncertainty about the availability of the petrol/diesel and there by no range uncertainties also.
• I think, the transition to EV ecosystem due to the obligations of Paris Agreement will be slow in India due to many factors viz., lack of infrastructure, electrical energy demand etc. Hence, to keep the pollution in check, government may take steps to promote the hybrid cars.
• Currently, there is a good number car owners who do not have own parking place and it will be difficult for those owners to migrate to EV. Also, it will be difficult for multi-car owners to charge more than one EV at home.
• At present, we wait five to 10 minutes in cities to fuel the car (a queue of two to three vehicle). The hybrid car reduces the frequency of fueling. Whereas, the EV owner would be waiting in the queue to get his car charged and even if we get a charging infrastructure comparable to present fuel stations, we may have to wait at least one hour to put the car in charging.
• The acceptance of hybrid technology to the mass market would be faster when compared to EV technology.

Further, I think, the decision to discontinue the diesel engines by Maruti Suzuki was right. Many other manufacturers were forced to take the decision later. Similarly, I think, Toyota and Suzuki has made a right decision in bringing the hybrids to market. I personally feel that the automatic switching between the battery and the engine brings lots of comforts to the driver and other road users, especially in heavy traffic conditions.

[DicKy]

I would say this is more of hybrids taking diesel's place and filing the void left in the market since BS6.

[Nilesh5417]

Am with you on the view that it is honeymoon period of EVs. The escalation in electricity prices is nothing short of electrifying. 6% inflation in electricity prices every 2-3years is what I read somewhere. And if you are in the state of MH or Telangana, you are already paying 12-15rs for all units above 300. That's still much much cheaper than fossil fuels today barring the infra issues that prevent mass adoption.
Now 10yrs down the line, broadly speaking, I don't think running an EV is going to be any cheaper than what running a diesel car today is going to be. India's power sector is really really in need of desparate overhaul. It is bankrupting states like no other business is. Someday the party will end and i suspect the impact on middle-class as always will be significant. Only thing that will keep the cars going, EVs maybe, is lack of options- the government will probably leave you no choice but to buy an EV or some alternate fuel prevailing at that time under the garb of some law or other.
Though I doubt any industry is going to get green as aggressively as individuals will be forced into it.

With the benefit of hindsight, even I think MSIL read the scenario specific to India very well. That or they had insider information on how fast/slow the government was going to push the EV ecosystem.

[DRPSREDDY]

Let us all get a clarification here. Thought Maruti Suzuki and Toyota claim to have sold more Hybrid cars than BEV, we should also ponder upon one more information. They are selling cars on two variants.

Mild Hybrids and Strong Hybrids.

Do we have a clarity on how many of them are strong Hybids? Coz only Strong Hybrids should be classified as real Hybids. Mild Hybrids are again a kind of fake hybrids.

Even Mild Hybrids have waiting period while strong Hybids are available with minimum or no waiting period.

[pqr]

Originally Posted by DRPSREDDY

Thought Maruti Suzuki and Toyota claim to have sold more Hybrid cars than BEV

It is not their claim; I just happened to spot it while doing regular analysis.

Originally Posted by DRPSREDDY

Do we have a clarity on how many of them are strong Hybids?

The numbers reported here are for strong hybrids only. Which is why vehicles like the XL6 and Brezza are not mentioned.

Originally Posted by DRPSREDDY

Mild Hybrids are again a kind of fake hybrids.

They are not fake; as the name suggests, they are mild. It reduces CO2 emissions (2–10 g/km, based on effectiveness, 12V/48V etc) and improves fuel efficiency, thus helping automakers meet CAFE standards.

[nettooran]

At this point of time, economically, I do not see any sense in BEVs. Of course, the green fuel, cleaner air tag may have an advantage ( then again it is said that it is nuetralized in the mining process of the raw materials required for the battery).

I wonder what the resale value of the BEV vehicles are going to be. The battery costs about 50% of the total car cost and post 3 to 4 years of ownership no one is going to pay you anywhere near to 50% of the car cost if there is a need for you to sell your car. Most of the money you saved would be gone in the initial premium you paid for the BEV. Coupled that with the ultra low resale value, time spent in recharging and ever increasing electricity cost, I hardly see any advantage in BEVs.

That was my thought. Correct me if I am wrong.

[neerajku]

Think the reasons are obvious, as many of you have articulated it so well; lack of EV infra, lower range than proclaimed, some fear of the unknown, prices, no big brands, life of battery etc. Personally I feel Hybrid is an intermediate tech though it wont disappear in the next 15-20 years as EV infra will cost a lot of Money. But ultimately it will be EV only.
One question I have always had, why dont Petro companies invest in research on hybrid if their future appears bleak. Why not collaborate with strong Car companies? Or may be they do. I dont know. Such collaboration is not unknown in the business world. Other places through Advt expenses, like De'beers. Here it could be design and development.

[audioholic]

All it needs is a Maruti or a Toyota EV to completely reverse this statistic So I am not sure how this comparison even holds good except for the numbers itself which is good to know. What would be more interesting is to see how ICE cars and EV+Hybrid cars sell against each other in our market. I am sure there will be a nice trend line that will be formed.

[DarthVeda]

Originally Posted by nettooran

At this point of time, economically, I do not see any sense in BEVs. Of course, the green fuel, cleaner air tag may have an advantage ( then again it is said that it is nuetralized in the mining process of the raw materials required for the battery).

I wonder what the resale value of the BEV vehicles are going to be. The battery costs about 50% of the total car cost and post 3 to 4 years of ownership no one is going to pay you anywhere near to 50% of the car cost if there is a need for you to sell your car. Most of the money you saved would be gone in the initial premium you paid for the BEV. Coupled that with the ultra low resale value, time spent in recharging and ever increasing electricity cost, I hardly see any advantage in BEVs.

That was my thought. Correct me if I am wrong.

Let me correct you then, if you are a heavy user of car then travelling 10k km will save you roughly 1L provided that you used charging at home or at govt. DISCOM rated below 9 rs per unit. If you are like me and charge at office for free then you can enjoy the saving even more.
Now coming to your comment about neutralised during raw materials, do you know lithium is not the major component of a Battery by weight? and the effects of mining is one time only, it's not recurring. Battery tech is changing every year, this year will see onset of Sodium ion battery and guess where Sodium is going to be mined? You also need to think that Petrol/Diesel aren't exactly coming gushing out of geysers or natural spot and they are also drilled in offshore, causing so much documented damages to the environment and marine life. But hey!! let's gloss over that shall we!

Why would you want to sell your vehicle is 3 to 4 years? for some reason you want to, you can check equivalent resale value of EV vehicles outside india, since we do not have the history right now.
Coming to spiraling electric cost, what spiraling electric cost, you mean like how petrol went from 60 rupees to 110 rupees in a year? something like that. You are always free to generate electricity through roof top, wind mill, etc. Can't say the same about Petrol/Diesel can we?

As an EV owner for 3 years, and clocked only 25k KMs (lost 1/2 year due to covid), I am very happy with the car and have done inter state trips as well, yes, the charging stops are a bane given that Nexon EV charges at only 21kw while other competitors are going faster and faster, but a trip should not be a rush to POINT A to POINT B in record time, it's enjoying the journey, which I do, given the awesome drivability of the EV and lack of noise, so that I can talk to folks inside the car.

Originally Posted by neerajku

Think the reasons are obvious, as many of you have articulated it so well; lack of EV infra, lower range than proclaimed, some fear of the unknown, prices, no big brands, life of battery etc. Personally I feel Hybrid is an intermediate tech though it wont disappear in the next 15-20 years as EV infra will cost a lot of Money. But ultimately it will be EV only.
One question I have always had, why dont Petro companies invest in research on hybrid if their future appears bleak. Why not collaborate with strong Car companies? Or may be they do. I dont know. Such collaboration is not unknown in the business world. Other places through Advt expenses, like De'beers. Here it could be design and development.

Occasionally, before posting comment like "Lack of EV Infra", please visit plugshare.com and see the growing infra each week. BPCL has gone an spree and covered lots more highways in Karnataka and south. It took decades for fuel stations to be at the state where they are now, EV is growing at even rapid pace than that. A EV car owner need not rely on external EV charging station solely for his/her needs. Your home or office setup will do nicely. the EV infra will come into question for your vacation, which I presume most of the folks won't be doing weekly. I am with you on the comment about lower range than proclaimed. ARAI range is ARAI range, manf. should not emphasize too much on that. It is the same on petrol/diesel, you will never achieve the proclaimed efficiency in real world anyway.
Nobody is investing in Hybrid in big way because it is worst of both and a stop-gap before fully going electric, some manufacturers are clinging onto fuel variants and going for hybrid to prolong their beloved assets and IPs and what nots. The future is electric drive, what powers the electric will be dictated by R&D, Economics and Markets.

[shortbread]

Originally Posted by DRPSREDDY

Let us all get a clarification here. Thought Maruti Suzuki and Toyota claim to have sold more Hybrid cars than BEV, we should also ponder upon one more information. They are selling cars on two variants.

Mild Hybrids and Strong Hybrids.

Do we have a clarity on how many of them are strong Hybids? Coz only Strong Hybrids should be classified as real Hybids. Mild Hybrids are again a kind of fake hybrids.

Even Mild Hybrids have waiting period while strong Hybids are available with minimum or no waiting period.

True and that will most likely reveal a totally different statistic. Because the first real hybrid introduction ie. the City, simply fell flat on its face.

[professortarzan]

I don't like Maruti for the corners they cut mainly in the safety department, but I have to admit they get the strategy right so often. They seem to have a very good idea of what the market wants by 'complying' with regulations in place.

1. A basic but affordable car that can get you from A to B? Done, here's the Alto. And we have a lot more.
2. Need an automatic that makes driving easier but still cheaper? Done, we present you AMT.
3. Sharing parts across models to reduce manufacturing costs? Check.
4. Availability of spares and service stations? We got you.
5. Don't want to spend a bomb on fuel? Say no further, here's our lineup.
6. Concerned about EV Infra and Range Anxiety? Don't worry, we worked with Toyota to get you the best of both worlds.

We may be marching towards an EV future, but deep down I have the confidence that MSIL will pounce when the time is right.