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Old 7th April 2023, 15:51   #121
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

Originally Posted by MotorDev View Post
Better Space Management : Went I went to check out the slavia and kushaq with my family, I was actually dissapointed by the space on offer for 3 people at the back. Just FYI, we all are lean too. But still 3 people at the back was a very tight fit. I really don't understand where the segment best width, wheel base etc. really translated inside. Skoda should have given more importance to space management as nowadays space is very important in cars and somewhere these cars take a bit of a hit in this department when compared to the competition. The main problem is shoulder room of the passengers.
The rear seat space for 3 passengers were one of my primary reasons to reject the VW 2.0 cars.
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Old 25th April 2023, 15:25   #122
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

I think main point which was missed in the post was lack of service and sales touch points across the country. Comparing with Hyundai sales which have 1500+ sales touch points with VAG would be unfair. Skoda and VW in total would be having close to 350 touch points within the country. Cars sold per dealer by a VW or Hyundai would be on par.

Second, most VW and Skoda dealerships are available in same cities so the competition within the group also could be a negative for sales to happen. A VW or Skoda potential buyer is well aware of the fact that their cars are more or less similar - manufactured from the same plant barring few differences which are very minimal. Skoda and VW should have merged the service operations and increased their presence in cities where they never existed.

Being an owner of both 2.0 products and PQ25 Polo TDI I can say that yes the quality levels are down from VW standard but not that their competition has something extra ordinary. Compare the build of a segment leader Honda City 5th gen with a Virtus/Slavia and one would know where the focus was by VAG in the new platform development. Dynamics are the best they can offer in their respective segments.

Sure the SUVs were smaller in length but Sedans had the best street credentials in the segment and are doing 3400 cars a month together which is good considering City/Verna are doing almost similar. By VAG standards, the sales numbers are good, before launching their next set of cars they should focus more on increasing sales and service touch points across the country.
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Old 25th April 2023, 16:39   #123
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

Originally Posted by lamborghini View Post
points that are easily downvoted by majority in favor of 'more important points' (space, comfortable ride, low maintenance, features, killer design, etc.).
Low maintenance and a VAG seems to be a dream 😅. But I think they have been working on it. Maybe the India 2.0 scheme will see their cars in a better state 10 years down the line. The saddest bit would be their ASS trying to justify part failures and changes with the performance oriented nature of their cars.

Originally Posted by lamborghini View Post
They can even capitalize on the fun to drive factor with a vRS option mated to a manual with some added punch, etc. Some of these will definitely help to make their product more attractive to buyers.
It's strange the t-roc had rear discs while the taigun and kushaq don't. How much would that have added to costs especially in a new platform?
But coming to performance, I feel the 1.5 TSI does well and I don't think they'll find buyers for a more pricey vRS. I also won't be surprised if the ambition dsg trim starts selling well for them.
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Old 25th April 2023, 23:45   #124
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

As someone who owns a Kushaq 1.0 AT ambition, and thoroughly researched the segment when we bought our car, I would like to summarise the (poor) sales into the following points:

1. The mass engine the award-winning 1.0 Turbo, makes you fall in love with it every time you drive it. Even non-enthusiast friends are blown away by this engine. But the fact of the matter is that the masses do not understand the concept of turbocharging and forced induction, and frankly they are not interested in understanding it. Skoda and VW could have managed to get customers that would have been influenced by a few turbo badges and marketing campaigns. But as far as the masses are concerned it's an inferior engine even to the swift. Oh by the way in Delhi-NCR traffic, our 1.0AT is returning 800-850+km to the tank(50L), so we are getting 16-18Km/L consistently for the past 7000-8000Km. (Highway trips return 19-20kmpl without any hypermiling, while maintaining traffic speeds)

2. Perception about Features, I will take braking performance as a metric. Creta and Seltos both have all-4 disc brakes against rear-drum brakes in Kushaq. The masses will perceive that the Koreans will have better braking, but practically Kushaq has a shorter stopping distance. VAG should have marketed this till they were meme'd on this detail. Segment leading braking performance. The reason I bring this up is, it shows how bad the marketing has been. The car has some downsides as others have pointed out, but they have just not highlighted the upsides. I don't know why this was lower in the marketing campaign as compared to the recess in the dashboard for Diety.
2a. I personally find the additional features in the Kushaq to be very useful. For example, the VAGs don't have 64 color ambient lights but have them in every door handle, window switch, door pocket, and of course the front dash. The Hyundais don't have rain-sensing wipers, but the VAGs do, not sure about the competition but I found cornering lamps to be very very cool and useful in so many conditions.

3. The size, There is no denying the difference in the road presence of the car as compared to competitors. However, I find it to be more comfortable in the rear seat as compared to a friend's Creta, but only with 2 of us in the rear with the armrest down, and AC on blast in Delhi summers. If there are three of us then Kushaq's rear is very uncomfortable owing to the scooped-out bucket seats. They hug you nice and tight, but then the space for the middle passenger is non-existent. When you move to the side, the bolstering pokes in the middle of your back. But with 2 in the rear, you have loads of legroom and segment-leading. Skoda could have added a little more overhang or further increased the width of the car to resolve the road presence issue, I am not a chassis engineer, but if the sedans could manage the much longer size and still be just as good at handling and dynamics, why can't they do the same for the SUVs?

4. Not offering the 1.5L engine on all the variants, If not active variant at least they should have offered it on the ambition variant. And the same for the Taigun, if they offered the GT variant why was it only with the manual and the GT+ only with the DSG? They have fixed this now, but still, they aren't offering a Virtus GT with a manual, only in the GT+. I don't understand why they are waiting more than a year to launch these variants and still didn't get it right. This is where I feel Koreans do well, variants. They offer you every PnC. If my memory serves me right the Nexon gets a sunroof in all variants including the base model! This is a genius idea for a market that loves sunroofs.

5. Every other person I talk to about the VAG cars warns me about the high service cost, we bought the 4-year/60,000km service pack for ₹16,000. So it turns out to be 26paise/km(for the first 4 years, time will tell after that). I think this is one thing holding them back.

6. Not sure about the business sense of this, but could the VAG group offer built-to specifications(Buy a variant and get features added to it)? They have a large parts bin that is shared across so many brands and cars, what's stopping them from offering features like 6 airbags, sunroof, ventilated seats, auto-headlamps, rain-sensing, different alloys, keyless entry, digital cockpit, tinted windows(VW1.0), different dash trims(like the diff b/w active/ambition/style). We would have bought the Style variant but didn't want the sunroof at all, but wanted a lot of other features. Some people want a sunroof, offer an option in ambition and you suddenly are able to grab the 17L OTR customer who definitley wants a sunroof.

7. Poor interior quality this has been a big talking point in the context of these cars, and it is true compared to VW1.0, but even today they are much ahead of the segment leaders. And as someone up there said, Indians don't care about it as much as people on forums claim, about 15k km and 17 months and there have been no rattles, not a long enough time frame, but I do not relate to the "Kushaq rattles like a Maruti" group of people.

Also, they replaced the 10-inch screen with the 8-inch one. Why would they do this? Just increase the waiting period, if supply is the issue!

Will add more points if I find any, but these are pretty much the reason why they aren't doing the numbers they deserve. Truly amazing cars.
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Old 26th April 2023, 07:29   #125
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

Dimensions on par with competitors.
Showrooms and service centers in tier 2 cities.
Added safety features like good quality 360 camera with dynamic guidelines and a good reliable AC. These are needed in 2.0 products in order to do well in Indian market in addition to the existing positives like 5 star safety, driving pleasure etc. Poor interiors, door rattling, window noise would still be forgiven by the masses. When it comes to mileage 2.0 products do give decent mileage depending on how you drive and in most families I know of nobody drives more than 100 to 120 on highways and many are happy to cruise at 80 or 90 km per hour.

Yes as someone said SAVW need to be active on team- bhp to understand the Indian buyers needs.

Last edited by Sheel : 26th April 2023 at 07:54. Reason: Punctuation spaces.
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Old 26th April 2023, 07:52   #126
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

People perceived VAG to be "Premium" brand because they were also selling Superb, Octavia, Kodiaq, Tiguan. I think the thought about higher maintenance cost could also been a derivative of them selling such cars. Now that Octavia is gone and soon Superb too, there is only one car in each VW and SK (Kodiaq and Tiguan) that is slated above Kushaq/Taigun.

Now question in my mind is - by removing "premium" cars in their lineup, are they saying that they are just another Hyundai/KIA? What is that VAG brand stands in India for now? If they are not "premium" brand, then they are going to be royally crushed by Maruti/Hyundai/KIA. If they are still going to maintain the "premium" brand then Kushaq/Taigun should ooze premiumness inside and outside, which is not currently.

I see them in the same spot of bother as Nissan/Renault twins in India. Even these are global brands, but their Indian cars are so ordinary looking, coupled with poor service stories. Now VAG is also in that same (rocking) boat - they are calling themselves global brand, but their 2.0 cars are not looking anything like that.
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Old 26th April 2023, 10:18   #127
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

We term VW-Skoda as enthusiasts' cars, which is the reason some of us buy those cars. It would be interesting to see wether it still stands after the launch of new Verna 1.5L Turbo.
As Hyundai keeps bringing their learnings from rally sport into their consumer segment cars, I think it'll give germans a run for their money in "enthusiast" segment as well.
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Old 26th April 2023, 11:59   #128
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

You missed an important point - Reliability

Despite being a driver’s enthusiastic car, Volkswagen is not the name you associate with reliability on any car market including US, where brands have to extra careful to sustain their presence and reliability. When KIA came to Indian Market, it gained the trust as Hyundai’s sister brand. Nissan and Renault’s Duster n Terrano were received well. Renault gained the trust with Kwid. Indian market prefers reliable cars. On a different note, Piaggio struggled after initial years of Vespa due to lack of service network. Lot of Vespas are abandoned by local mechanics and service networks is pretty bad beyond a couple of cities.

Volkswagen cars until recently have been like old gen REs where the failure is just around the corner.

Once could argue that, Tatas are also similar but Nexon and Safari are selling well. Tata’s issues are on the service line and sales inefficiencies. Their cars are good. Even though Skoda n VW offer good driving experience, they are very very expensive to maintain.
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Old 26th April 2023, 15:52   #129
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

as per me these are some factor which might be affecting as well

1) Brand name: It should be local if you want to target the majority, easily understandable by even the remotest people of this country. Maruti has it, tata has it. Hyundai doesnt, somehow they managed to get the attention by marketing well by hooking Sachin Tendulkar for Santro advertisements in the initial phase, VW or SKODA advertise and market their vehicles just like they do in western region, it is bound to fail miserably.
skoda? kya? soda? doesnt ring any bell, sorry!
even the names of the vehicles are out of this place. Kushaq? seriosuly? taigun? *** were you even thinking VAG? sorry, these names dont connect well with majority of the buyers.

2) second, first impression is the best impression. it matters very much for anyone who is looking to buy new car. any first time buyer, tries to search for same vehicle which he sees most on the road, or the one that impressed him by its new looks. the design and likeability will grow on him. If new model is affordable and is eye catching, he is bound to go and try out this hot chick on the road. and if it impresses him, oila you have yourself a winner no matter what he tries after that.

3) Some of the Maruti and Creta like cars have soft suspension and superb NVH. Most of the test drive roads are not well laden in India, these cars makes you feel very comfortable at slow speed on rough patches compared to other vehicles which offer hard suspension. nowadays, all car dealers open showrooms nearby other brands. the comparison becomes even easy driving on same road and feeling comfort of soft suspension cars compared to the contrary. Majority of the people hardly know how suspension affects highway stability.

4) service, reachability and reliability is very underrated. most of the buyers take loans for their first cars. they dont want to buy unreliable cars on other hand keep paying hefty EMI regretting their decision. it simply doesnt work. PEACE OF MIND triumphs anyday.

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Old 26th April 2023, 17:35   #130
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

I see many more Skoda/VW on the road now than I used to see earlier. The presence has increased even in Tier-3 & smaller towns. India has become Skoda's 3rd biggest country by sales. I don't think they don't sell; they are selling well considering the market penetration & the product portfolio they have (no presence in the hatchback, compact sedan, or compact SUV segment that bring in the largest volume).

Last edited by amit1agrawal : 26th April 2023 at 17:36. Reason: added a sentence.
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Old 26th April 2023, 19:22   #131
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

It's really that bad ha!?

I was browsing spinny since the past few days, just for the heck of it. Until yesterday, there was just one Taigun AT available (highlighted in yellow). Two more have suddenly popped up today (highlighted in pink)!

Really sad to see this, seems like people are selling the brand new car away, left-right and center.
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Old 27th April 2023, 00:22   #132
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

I once saw a Punch alongside Kushaq and dimension wise both were looking almost similar. Punch also being a 5 star rated car is half the price of Kushaq. I hardly saw any advantage of the Kushaq over Punch unless one is going for the 1.5 DSG.

In real world practical scenario, Creta's rear seat space for 3 people (along with service cost and number of service centers) score much more with people than Kushaq`S 5 star safety rating.
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Old 29th April 2023, 13:40   #133
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Re: The real reason why Škoda Kushaq & VW Taigun don't sell - A Case Study

I was always confused by the term REDHOT. Thank you SKODA for making me understand the meaning when I sat inside my wife's red Kushaq Montecarlo edition1 TSI AT. The AC is horrible and we Indians don't deserve that. It was taken to the service centre multiple times.
First visit: went in the morning and send back the vehicle without fixing it. Reason- server down
Second visit: Fixed the AC, but didn't fix the driver-side window issue. Reason - issue with a flash drive
Now we have to send it again with no guarantee that the work will be done.
I appreciate SKODA for making safe cars but their localization is partially a flop. How come they didn't test the AC? We had Vento DSG and Skoda Superb and Tiguan Allspace is our daily driver. Those are a class apart from the 2.0 offerings. The team at aftersales service are courteous, but it doesn't take off all the bad experiences due to a half-baked product.
My take is 2.0 is for you if are an enthusiast with safety in mind. If you need peace of mind and reasonable service- LOOK ELSEWHERE. I am not talking about the money involved at all since that is another area of debate.
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