[Ashutosh]

Mr. Harbir,
have u read the article that have been linked earlier? If not,
Baseball, Apple Pie...and Mahindra?

In the second six months of 2009, it plans to sell just 18,000 vehicles, followed by 45,000 in 2010.

Mahindra is going to target the three groups it believes will be the most receptive to its vehicles—consumers who identify themselves as "green," people who have bought Mahindra tractors, and the close to 3 million Indian expatriate households in the U.S. The plan is to generate buzz with these buyers, then hope the word spreads to the mainstream.

When it manages to go through the toture that are country side roads of here, I'm sure it will sail thru the silky roads in the US of A.

[Nitin]

Apart from just working in Indian roads,and proving itself for many decades, the reliability & stability of M&M will be questioned, the very same way all the Jap/Korean car makers were subjected to intense scrutiny in the '80s & '90s.

Even if M&M comes close in competition,it'll be a while before locals (read Americans) give it a try. At the forefront would be Indians,Hispanics & African-americans who have a tighter budget. And of course,there'd be the handful of Americans who want to try something different.

[Harbir]

Originally Posted by Ashutosh

When it manages to go through the toture that are country side roads of here, I'm sure it will sail thru the silky roads in the US of A.

We shall see, Mr Ashutosh

[directinjection]

Mahindra has probably dropped the idea of using APPALACHIAN as the brand for the Scorpio-derived pick-up planned for US. Now it'll just be called Mahindra followed by some alpha-numeric model designation. Seems like they want to capitalise on the existing familiarity with Mahindra brand there, courtesy Mahindra tractors.

Mahindra's diesel pickup drops 'Appalachian' name - Autoblog

Also, Mahindra has caught the attention of American truck makers and at least one of them is already studying and testing the Scorpio Getaway that it has specially imported for the purpose.

PickupTrucks.com: Caught - Mahindra's Diesel Pickup Spied, Looking for New Name

[RedMM340]

45,000 orders of Scorpios in the U.S.? What kind of fantasy land is the guy who claims this living in?

No such thing. There are no orders for Scorpios as of yet. Any reports of Scorpio bookings are total marketing spin.

M&M is going to get bloodied and lose really big $$$$ in the U.S. market, and then pull out.

No one in their right mind will ever take a chance on a M&M product. What the heck kind of credentials does M&M have in the U.S.? Oh right they make good tractors. Do you have any idea what type of bad publicity and ridicule M&M will face when the start selling.

The pit-bull class action attorneys are ready and waiting for the first accident involving a M&M vehicle. They just can't wait to file a mult-million dollar lawsuit against a 'third world' manufacturer trying to dump inferior quality products below their manufacturing cost in the U.S. market.

All major auto manufacturers in the U.S. are developing high efficiency diesels, so M&M won't have any unique selling point. Nor will price be a USP for M&M. Do you really think that Ford, G.M., & Toyota will hesitate to drop prices for competing products, and take a loss for a couple of years to completely kill M&M sales and make an example out of them for any other 3rd world/chinese/etc. auto manufacturers that dare to take a piece of the U.S. market?

[sujaylahiri]

Originally Posted by RedMM340

45,000 orders of Scorpios in the U.S.? What kind of fantasy land is the guy who claims this living in?

No such thing. There are no orders for Scorpios as of yet. Any reports of Scorpio bookings are total marketing spin.

M&M is going to get bloodied and lose really big $$$$ in the U.S. market, and then pull out.

No one in their right mind will ever take a chance on a M&M product. What the heck kind of credentials does M&M have in the U.S.? Oh right they make good tractors. Do you have any idea what type of bad publicity and ridicule M&M will face when the start selling.

The pit-bull class action attorneys are ready and waiting for the first accident involving a M&M vehicle. They just can't wait to file a mult-million dollar lawsuit against a 'third world' manufacturer trying to dump inferior quality products below their manufacturing cost in the U.S. market.

All major auto manufacturers in the U.S. are developing high efficiency diesels, so M&M won't have any unique selling point. Nor will price be a USP for M&M. Do you really think that Ford, G.M., & Toyota will hesitate to drop prices for competing products, and take a loss for a couple of years to completely kill M&M sales and make an example out of them for any other 3rd world/chinese/etc. auto manufacturers that dare to take a piece of the U.S. market?

Wow that's a very bold statement you're making. I mean every auto manufacturer deserves a chance to try out new markets in order to grow, and just because a country is lawsuit happy shouldn't stop them from selling their vehicles there.

Mahindra can always crank up their quality control and produce a small fuel efficient turbo-charged diesel engine for their pick-up.
I saw a lot of positive comments on Autoblog where the readers were looking for a small truck mostly to carry tools and other equipment around, and for which they didn't need full size or mid size trucks.

And how many small pick-ups with car like fuel efficient engines do you see in the States? None.
And that's a damn good thing in these days of almost $5 a gallon gas prices.

[Mayavi]

Originally Posted by RedMM340

All major auto manufacturers in the U.S. are developing high efficiency diesels, so M&M won't have any unique selling point.

Well, they are worried enough to import one over to US just to see how it drives.



PickupTrucks.com: Caught - Mahindra's Diesel Pickup Spied, Looking for New Name
Caught! Mahindra's Diesel Pickup Spied, Looking For New Name

We recently wrote about GM's small Brazilian pickup that you can't buy stateside, but If you've ever wondered what an Indian-built diesel pickup would look like on American highways, here's the answer to that (oil)-burning question.
You wouldn't be the only one wondering either. At least one domestic manufacturer wants to know how it drives too, so they bought this overseas version of Mahindra's upcoming U.S. pickup to try out in Michigan.

[Mpower]

Well said RedMM. Mahindra lawers should read the case study of flipping Suzuki Jimmys in the 80s and more recently Ford Explorer tire blowout/flip lawsuits to understand the liability involved in selling to Americans.

I can understand M&M are bouyed by the success of their branded tractors, but the only similarity between tractors and SUV are that they both have 4 wheels.

Originally Posted by Mayavi

Well, they are worried enough to import one over to US just to see how it drives.

That looks like freeway I-75 N in Troy Michigan with the Chrysler building in the background!!

[ph03n!x]

Originally Posted by Mpower

understand the liability involved in selling to Americans.

Exactly what was running in my mind while reading through this thread - i hope they dont get sued for quality (or lack of it) or for some mishap!

[Mayavi]

ummm... it is ok to have high respect for American market but please do not idolize it. If Americans were only buying high quality products then all the Detroit big 3 would have folded long back in face of Japanese and European competition. The American Junk still sells, doesn't it?

No one gets sued for bad quality, the company will get a bad name and lose market but they wont get sued for it. If Bad quality results in law suits, please get me in touch in with one of the Pit bull lawyers, I want to sued Mercedes and Jeep. Buyers would over look cheap plastic and rattles as long as the product is reliable and does it job. Every year thousands of cars get recalled for bad quality parts.... even the venerable TOyota, Nissan and Honda have recalls. They didn't get sued and their market share hasn't been effected, did it?

The only situation where a company gets sued is design deficiency resulting in a safety hazard. Mahindra's pik-up has been a success in many markets and has been thoroughly tested on field in developed countries that are no different from America. If it had any design flaws they would have already identified it and rectified before introducing into the market.

I am sure Anand Mahindra and his team of lawyers and advisors have worked out a plan for the American market.

[ph03n!x]

What I actually meant was a bad quality component causing a mishap - an accident or a blow-up or something - am sure that would leave M&M in a mess if, god forbid, it happened!

[shankar.balan]

Yes Vijay
I would agree with your surmise.
With the global prices of crude and the general slowdown, we may see a lot of people migrating to more efficient, less guzzling, smaller sized compact pickup/ SUV/MUV type vehicles, despite the US having the tag of being the most gas guzzling nation in the world.
This is a distinct possibility and Im sure the Mahindra team have thought it through. Dont forget two of their top honchos are from the US Market and have a lot of knowledge and experience in that market from Design, Manufacturing to Marketing - Mr Arun Jaura and Dr Pawan Goenka.
Personally, I wish them great success because I believe that company has the right attitude coupled with the necessary humility, to succeed.

Originally Posted by prabhuav

Harbir,

Going by conventional wisdom, the scorpio will bomb in the US.

But , the scorpio dealer in Geogia was on the next street as my client, and there was a lot of interest from people who were into farming.
For example a client AVP of mine has a farm and owns a mahindra tractor - swears by it. He was very happy to hear that mahindra was bringing out a diesel compact pickup, coz the breed doesnot exist there.

It is people like these that Mahindra is targetting, and I believe they will buy.

Vijay

[vasudeva]

If the thread headline was factually correct, then that is a good thing for M&M. But ,
Firm orders for 45000 Scorpios from whom?. Cars/SUVs are not industrial items or commodities bought in bulk (example Indian Government imports 1 million tonnes of rice). Have the customers paid for it in advance. Is it the Government. Is it the dealers who keep stock. This is sending 45000 cars to the US, not selling it and getting cash and profits in the books.

The present situation as reported in WSJ last week is here.

Mahindra Bullish on U.S. - WSJ.com

Since this will go off free viewing in a day or two, the gist is:



M&M plans to take a small Mahindra-badged pickup to the US next summer, and follow up with a midsize SUV, likely sometime in 2010. Mahindra and its distribution partner in the US. have delayed the SUV launch, partly because of shifting market conditions. Mr. Goenka said that even though those two body styles have fallen out of favor, due to their association with poor fuel economy, Mahindra's plan to fit the vehicles solely with diesel engines will immediately put the brand on the map. Eventually, the company plans to launch crossovers and hybrid vehicles into the US. "If anything, the current situation makes our vehicles more desirable," he said, pointing to the recent success of smaller crossover SUVs as evidence that there is still life in the segment. Given that Mahindra is a new brand in the US., Mr. Goenka said people may be willing to take a flier on its diesel vehicles, which typically offer 20% to 30% better fuel economy than gasoline-powered ones.

Mahindra vehicles are already sold in several markets around the world, but tens of millions of dollars are being invested in an effort to re-engineer the vehicles for US standards and consumer tastes. Mr. Goenka believes there is still core demand for trucks and SUVs in the U.S., especially among commercial buyers and families looking for roomy transportation. Mahindra is betting on the combination of utility and efficiency to help it sell at least 10,000 vehicles annually, which would be enough to break even in the US business.

Diesel prices typically run at least 15% higher than gasoline. That means that the economic benefits of a more-efficient diesel engine will be somewhat offset. When it comes to alternative fuels, Americans typically prefer hybrid-electric vehicles, such as Prius.

Although Mahindra's distribution partner in the US, Global Vehicles USA, based in Atlanta, has signed up about 300 dealers to distribute the vehicles, the brand is unfamiliar to most Americans, who either associate the name with tractors that are sold in the US or haven't heard the name at all.

Mahindra and its distributor plan to spend about $50 million on advertising annually, said Global Vehicles' marketing chief, Xavier Beguiristain. Mahindra and Global Vehicles, which is closely held and independent of Mahindra, will both contribute to the budget.

[sujaylahiri]

Originally Posted by ph03n!x

What I actually meant was a bad quality component causing a mishap - an accident or a blow-up or something - am sure that would leave M&M in a mess if, god forbid, it happened!

But that could happen to any automaker, big or small. That's why they have recalls, warranties and service bulletins.

Just because some component might fail on someone doesn't mean they should stop selling altogether. It's an engineering challenge and that's what engineers are for.

[ph03n!x]

I guess I am still not making my self clear. Here is the train-of-thought:

M&M have minimal presence in the US, that too not in mainstream autos. Americans kind of feel Japanese and such countries make good products, and India is a Elephant & Snake infested country (believe me, I have had "Do you travel by elephants?" / "Wont the snakes bite you?" kind of question asked by Americans atleast twice in the last one year!) - am not saying all, but a size-able population still feel that way. And now the kind of problems consumers in India face with car-makers in India would result in a different last-word if they exist with car-makers in the USA (We do not have too many recalls here, if at all any!). I hope you get the picture - we have a consumer base that is not as finicky as them. Now for an Indian company of stature like M&M beginning operations there need to be extra-careful because... - i hope i have made myself clearer