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Old 3rd September 2018, 15:53   #46
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Default Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

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Originally Posted by nair View Post
I think Mercedes strategy has been their strong point. Yesterday Ferrari failed to call Mercedes bluff. LH pit crew was outside and this prompted Ferrari to pit Kimi. As soon as Kimi pitted LH pit crew just went inside. An incredible bluff that should not have worked. If only Kimi had stayed out longer he could have defended much better.
If Kimi had stayed out, pretty sure Lewis would have boxed in next lap or two, and he would have jumped Kimi. Mercedes clearly wanted the track position and they knew Bottas would come into play later. Ferrari were handicapped by having only car at the front to fight against two Mercedes cars. Only way Kimi could have won yesterday was if he was able to clear Bottas quickly. He had a gap of 5.2 seconds to Hamilton after the stop, and that amounted to nothing after spending time behind Bottas.

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Hamilton is lucky to have won despite the flawed strategy. Keeping him out for so much longer was crazy - the gap to Kimi (after Kimi's pitstop) dropped from 22.50 seconds to 18! Considering he was putting in fastest lap after fastest lap when Kimi pitted, Lewis had a very good chance of coming out ahead.

Kimi was already pumping in fastest sectors on his out lap, and Lewis was just about matching/bettering him marginally which wasn't enough to jump him. Initially the team thought Lewis could go quicker and hence the message to him saying he had more pace in tyres, but they realized soon that he will not be able to jump Kimi in pits, so they tried to delay it as much as possible. Obviously, they did what they did because they knew they had a wingman. Without Bottas in the picture, yes - the strategy wouldn't have worked.

Another factor - any safety car or VSC at the time would have worked nicely to Mercedes's advantage, with Lewis getting a free pit stop to cover Kimi. When Ricciardo retired and parked the car by the side, I almost thought there's going to be a VSC and Lewis would luck into a win.
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Old 3rd September 2018, 17:22   #47
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

The only thing that could have assuaged Ferrari's hurt at Monza was a win by Raikkonen. However that was not to be and Raikkonen looked quite shaky in the face of Hamilton's challenge. The degradation on the rear tyres of the Ferrari was the proverbial nail on the coffin that saw a quick demise of whatever challenge Ferrari could mount after the first lap incident.

Raikkonen is a great racer not doubt but I am not sure his race craft is updated. Lewis said he had the greatest respect for Raikkonen and how fair he raced. Unfortunately Lewis respect does not prevent him from exploiting Raikkonen's fairness as a weakness either and there is no reason why he should not do that either. The new breed of F1 racers including Hamilton and Vettel are increasingly aggressive which is only tempered by what is deemed legal and what is not. Racers like Verstappen even more so in this respect. In Monza Hamilton did just that. Legally he had the corner and was well within his right to crowd out Vettel which meant Vettel could hold his line which he did or give up that defence. In hindsight he should have perhaps done the latter and cut his losses. A third place would have been easy.
Raikkonen on the other hand would have left Vettel enough space even perhaps to the extent of compromising his line into the next corner. Unfortunately Raikkonen is peaking at a point where he is not going to do either himself nor his team a whole lot of good let alone the WDC. The problem with Ferrari is that they do not have a Bottas.

Vettel's mistake at the German GP is going to turn out to be extremely critical. Against a team like Mercedes, clawing back a 32 point deficit is going to be extremely hard. Full credit to Mercedes for snatching that race from Ferrari like they did. And modifying their strategy to use Bottas when Hamilton's "hammer time" pace failed to pay dividends showed them thinking on their feet.

Drive on,
Shibu.

Last edited by shibujp : 3rd September 2018 at 17:28.
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Old 3rd September 2018, 23:22   #48
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

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Originally Posted by shibujp View Post
<snip>
In Monza Hamilton did just that. Legally he had the corner and was well within his right to crowd out Vettel which meant Vettel could hold his line which he did or give up that defence. In hindsight he should have perhaps done the latter and cut his losses. A third place would have been easy.
Raikkonen on the other hand would have left Vettel enough space even perhaps to the extent of compromising his line into the next corner. Unfortunately Raikkonen is peaking at a point where he is not going to do either himself nor his team a whole lot of good let alone the WDC. The problem with Ferrari is that they do not have a Bottas.
<snip>
Vettel needs to merge his first lap aggression with some strategic thinking. With Kimi ahead, sandwiching Hamilton is a sure fire way to ruin his tires. That is what the Mercs did to Kimi, never let him settle to a rubber saving pace. Winning by attrition gives the same amount of points as winning by first corner antics. Seb should have let Hamilton through and then hounded him at his pleasure till the Merc destroys its tires. When you have two genuinely fast cars on the track, be a <expletive> team player and don't race your teammate that aggressively till the main challenger is contained. Ferrari has a better Bottas, but it is just that they are clueless on how to use the other Finn.

And what was Ferrari doing with the medium tires when Seb pitted after Lap 1? Did they really expect him to claw his way up on mediums and then attack Hamilton with 45-odd laps old tires? Should have put on the supersofts, he had 10 of them. I feel that the a set of options on the first pitstop should have given him a better chance with the slower cars and the primes towards the end would have made podium a genuine possibility.
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Old 4th September 2018, 06:23   #49
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Out of topic: isn't it a Safari you see here at Monza?
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Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix-1536022314484.jpg  

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Old 4th September 2018, 10:00   #50
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

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Out of topic: isn't it a Safari you see here at Monza?
Wait a second, you have Kimi chasing Bottas for the lead, and you're looking at the background? Get outta here, you don't belong

Humour apart, that's some eagle eyes, and good identification. The C/D pillar arrangement, as well as the "handles" on the roof between those pillars make it almost definitely a Safari (apart from the obvious front end). I recall that Tata sold the Safari in Europe, so it is quite likely to be serving as a track-side vehicle.
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Old 4th September 2018, 10:04   #51
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

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Originally Posted by manoj_joseph78
Out of topic: isn't it a Safari you see here at Monza?
Yep. Last year as well.
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/intl-...ml#post4262447 (Formula 1: The 2017 Italian GP)
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Old 4th September 2018, 11:03   #52
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

Unlike Spa, Ferrari simply didn't have the race pace to pull off from Hamilton's Mercedes. Even at the time of pit stops, Kimi was still around a second gap from Hamilton. While Kimi was successfully able to defend this on the super softs in cleaner air, which simply didn't work out chasing Bottas and Hamilton persevering behind him. Had Ferrari not called Kimi in first, Hamilton would have undercut the gap in a lap or 2 at the most. Had Vettel not spun out, it would have helped Kimi's cause.

In the end great racing by Hamilton to wait for the opportunity to strike, something that Vettel failed to do.

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Originally Posted by manoj_joseph78 View Post
Out of topic: isn't it a Safari you see here at Monza?
Yes that is the Safari. They are there in Italy, a little more rare than Indica.

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Originally Posted by sun_king View Post
And what was Ferrari doing with the medium tires when Seb pitted after Lap 1? Should have put on the supersofts, he had 10 of them.
If they had fresh super softs, they'd have swapped that on the 2nd stop no? I think he exhausted the super softs over the weekend. Mediums would have been a much slower strategy. Having spun out on lap 1, this was the best he could have achieved without a SC or VSC to help.
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Old 4th September 2018, 12:06   #53
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

I somehow feel that Kimi has lost the killer instinct. He is No.2 and it shows. I do think that given Hamilton maybe Vettel should not be in such a hurry to overtake. But then racing is racing!
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Old 4th September 2018, 13:30   #54
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

In all this talk between Ferrari and Mercedes, the person who did commendable job was Max. He was capable of keeping Bottas at bay for such a long time.
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Old 4th September 2018, 14:32   #55
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
I somehow feel that Kimi has lost the killer instinct.
Atleast not this time at Monza. The No. 2 Kimi would have let Hamilton when overtaken him first and would not have overtaken him again. What happened at Monza was due to his tyre issues and he has to handle both the Mercedes which are more or less the same cars as his.

Last edited by jpcoolguy : 4th September 2018 at 14:34.
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Old 4th September 2018, 16:30   #56
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

From the looks of Kimi's tyres, he was extremely lucky to even complete the race. Leave alone finish #2. No wonder the team asked him to stay off the kerbs during the closing stages of the race.

Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix-kktqkym.jpg
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Old 4th September 2018, 17:40   #57
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

Italian Grand Prix: Race Highlights



Top 5 Moments | 2018 Italian Grand Prix

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Old 4th September 2018, 18:40   #58
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
I somehow feel that Kimi has lost the killer instinct.
For the state of his tires, which was shown live and Ashwin has posted. He did a good job of it. He didn't have the luxury to pit another time and emerge ahead of Max-Bottas pair.

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Originally Posted by fz_rider View Post
In all this talk between Ferrari and Mercedes, the person who did commendable job was Max.
It was marred by his collision, otherwise for a much slower car he did a good job. This was partly helped by Bottas' delayed pit stop by Mercedes.
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Old 4th September 2018, 18:58   #59
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

That was one helluva exciting race from start to finish!
I have nothing to add to Vettel's impatience that has not already been said.
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Old 4th September 2018, 19:22   #60
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Default Re: Formula 1: The 2018 Italian Grand Prix

Pirelli has explained the exact reasons behind Kimi's tyres suffering at Monza.


Him being stuck behind Bottas being one of the more prominent ones.



Source


Here's a much more clear image of Kimi's degraded rear tyres.


Name:  KkTqKYM.jpg
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