[girimajiananth]

Originally Posted by mkpiyengar

Hi,

My questions are:

1. Is the asking price of AT less or more in Used market compared to MT. Since AT would be low mileage so less takers, making it cheaper.
2. What are the pros and cons of AT in terms of maintenance.
3. What safeguards to take for AT.
4. Expecting mileage of 9-10 for AT is realistic.
5. Things to watch out for other than brakes, suspension.

I saw "tappet cover packing leakage " what does this mean ? How much to fix it ?

Cheers
MKP

1.I think price depends on the ODO reading of the car. I have seen 4-5 year old A star ATs fetching nearly 4-4.5L. These days there is a sudden demand for AT cars. They are priced equally.Do not be under the assumption that AT cars are cheaper.

2. Most AT cars have poor fuel efficiency.If you buy an AT ,chances are slim that the next door FNG will be of any good.You may end up taking the car to authorized service station everytime. Repair may not be pocket friendly.

3.Overtaking requires some planning, I am not sure how engine braking can be used or if engine braking is available on AT cars. Just make sure that you get an accident free car.

4. Yes with sedate driving 9-10 can be expected.

I am not aware of tappet cover , I will keep a close watch on this thread about this information from other.

Since you are planning for corolla , you might even consider Camry AT. 2006 or a 2007 camry can be available for 3-4L Rs price range. A friend of mine bought one from Toyota U trust and it is really a good car. Company maintained right from day one of the purchase.

[mkpiyengar]

Originally Posted by girimajiananth

1.I think price depends on the ODO reading of the car. I have seen 4-5 year old A star ATs fetching nearly 4-4.5L. These days there is a sudden demand for AT cars. They are priced equally.Do not be under the assumption that AT cars are cheaper.

>>>> All examples is see are in the range of 65K - 75K. Also, these are at dealerships, so am not sure about the accuracy. Am asking them for service records though to eliminate tampering. Also, cartrade has their certification mechanism to vouch for the condition of the car. They don't say anything about the mileage though.

2. Most AT cars have poor fuel efficiency.If you buy an AT ,chances are slim that the next door FNG will be of any good.You may end up taking the car to authorized service station everytime. Repair may not be pocket friendly.

>>>> Significant point. I prefer mechanically functional units than gadgets with electronics ( less things to go wrong ).

Since you are planning for corolla , you might even consider Camry AT. 2006 or a 2007 camry can be available for 3-4L Rs price range. A friend of mine bought one from Toyota U trust and it is really a good car. Company maintained right from day one of the purchase.

>>>> Camry would be too big and also automatic would be heavy on pocket.

Cheers
MKP

[vigsom]

Having owned both an AT and an MT over 6 years , my replies to your points are as follows:

ATs are either H3(fabric seats) or H4(leather seats).My recommendation would be a post Aug2005 H4 as it comes fully loaded(steering controls, auto headlights, leather seats, ac cabin filter, wood finish steering) .If the car is kept well,even 1 lac on the odo is nothing.

1.ATs are rarer to get so generally command a better resale

2.If the transmission is smooth, you have nothing to bother about - the transmission fluid needn't be changed for life and the torque converter type AT is absolutely trouble free

3.Nothing except that you can drive the car light to get better FE ; before finalising on a car, please drive and observe for jerks when the transmission shifts from 1-2-3-4.If jerks are experienced , say goodbye to the car. The other thing to look out for is excessive whine in the transmission.Little or no whine is the way to go.

4.You can expect around 10 in average driving conditions ; the Corolla AT returns better FE than the i10 AT

5.Nothing at all - just that the car should have been maintained well ; KMs no bar. The spring action on the flip cover above the ashtray should be intact. If the flip cover is loose, someone hasn't fixed the dash back properly after an ac service.

Tappet cover leak - I fixed this in both my cars - the tappet cover rubber gasket can be got for as low as 300 rupees in the open market - fixing it is normal fare.

[mkpiyengar]

@vigsom,
Thanks for your inputs.
I went to test drive 2 cars both manual. First one was 2006 model single owner driven and well maintained and second was 2004 model with dealer.

Both the cars I could not get a comfortable driving position due to my height and did not get adequate under thigh support.

The clutch was hard on both the cars, so seems normal for the Corolla's. Also, with my driving seat pushed back to comfortable position there was a squeeze in rear seat, which is the problem I face in my Ikon too.

So looks like the Corolla is not the right car for me. I need to re-evaluate and may be get City or Dzire (Old shape).

My requirement being a reliable petrol sedan with comfortable seating and ease to drive.

BTW, Looking at the used car options in the market, I'm really pleased with how my Siena drives after 12 yrs. Only if the electrical niggles don't surface and parts are more freely accessible it would be more easy to own.

Cheers
MKP

[vigsom]

^^ The old DZire is a good option , but please get the Z variant as it comes loaded with safety features. This car is a much more comfy car to drive.

If seat height in the Corolla is the only issue,I would suggest propping the seat up with a cushion/folded bed cover -I did this in both cars and it worked.

The sx4 zxi with the vvt engine(post2009) is a very good option, if you want all of Corolla's virtues. The vvt version zxi comes with multispoke 16" alloys.

My experience says that the Corolla is better on FE and build than the other two discussed here.

[swami69]

MKP - I respect your views, but do not discard Corolla so quickly. If the seating position is a problem, as suggested, you can buy an aftermarket cushion. I do no know your height, but I am 178 cms and I usually have a habit of pushing the seat so that my arms are neatly stretched over the Steering wheel. After doing this, there is absolutely nice space for the back seat passengers in my car. No issues there.

Clutch - The clutch in my car is not hard at all, it is quite comfortable, but you may have your benchmarks and there is a reason for you to feel so. May be, try few other corollas and you may get a good one. Good luck.

As updated in my thread, I am trending approx 12 kms per litre and will confirm this one more time in my next tank fill. It is not bad for a 1.8 L engine.

Swami

[Swapnil4585]

MPK sir, I agree with the views of vigsom and swami here. If padding, etc helps in achieving the desired seating position, that should be tried. The Corolla is better in almost everything than the Dzire or City.

The hard clutch problem can be due to a number of reasons. If you are finding it harder to press the clutch pedal, most probably, the problem might be a malfunctioning clutch cylinder. If not, may be the clutch needs some adjustment.

Originally Posted by vigsom

The sx4 zxi with the vvt engine(post2009) is a very good option, if you want all of Corolla's virtues. The vvt version zxi comes with multispoke 16" alloys. My experience says that the Corolla is better on FE and build than the other two discussed here.

According to my friendly used car dealer, the SX4's fuel economy should be lesser than that of Corolla. And I agree with you. The build quality of a Toyota is always better than a Honda or Maruti or Hyundai.

[AWD]

Originally Posted by mkpiyengar

Both the cars I could not get a comfortable driving position due to my height and did not get adequate under thigh support.

The clutch was hard on both the cars, so seems normal for the Corolla's. Also, with my driving seat pushed back to comfortable position there was a squeeze in rear seat, which is the problem I face in my Ikon too.

Right observations, I own the car & have been writing about it for quite some time now. Im also tall & its impossible to get comfortable behind the wheel. Also the left knee touches the lower dash/gear console. Lack of steering adjustment for reach means that you drive with arms stretched out, a poor driving position w.r.t. to comfort.

Yes the clutch gets hard past ~70k kms. Rear seat legroom is not great when front seats pushed all the way back.

Coming to maintenance of the car, parts are really costly. Overall I give a thumbs down to the car unless you are getting a great deal & a slick piece.

This was one of earlier Toyotas in India & they did an Earth lot of cost cutting on the car, which is very evident in almost aspect.

Better choose Honda City2nd gen. or some other good car.

[mkpiyengar]

Originally Posted by AWD

Better choose Honda City2nd gen. or some other good car.

You have exactly echoed my sentiments. Now, I'm considering Honda City. Only question if i go for second generation automatic vs manual, what are the cons.

Is it safe to go for 2004/2005 Honda City Zx cars?

Cheers
MKP

[mkpiyengar]

Originally Posted by swami69

Clutch - The clutch in my car is not hard at all, it is quite comfortable, but you may have your benchmarks and there is a reason for you to feel so. May be, try few other corollas and you may get a good one. Good luck.

As updated in my thread, I am trending approx 12 kms per litre and will confirm this one more time in my next tank fill. It is not bad for a 1.8 L engine.

Swami

Thanks For your inputs. I'm just saying based on the cars i checked. In fact the individual owner whose car i checked said that they got 3 Corolla in their Company and this one was hard compared to others. He was suggested by Toyota guys to not change anything as there could be reliablity issues. The car has been duly serviced every 10K kms @ Toyota with service records.

The engine was smooth to drive so no complaints on that front.

Originally Posted by Swapnil4585

MPK sir, I agree with the views of vigsom and swami here. If padding, etc helps in achieving the desired seating position, that should be tried. The Corolla is better in almost everything than the Dzire or City.

The hard clutch problem can be due to a number of reasons. If you are finding it harder to press the clutch pedal, most probably, the problem might be a malfunctioning clutch cylinder. If not, may be the clutch needs some adjustment.

Hi Swapnil, I face similar issue in my Ikon regarding the under thigh support. Also, the cushion etc. and not comfortable in long run. Only option is update the seat by adding cushion in front for under thigh support. Looks like i have to try that with the Seat upholstery folks.

Best part of Corolla is the Boot. So much space that 2 guys can lie down

Will evaluate how City zx fares in comparison @ < 2.5lacs for 2006-2007 models.

Cheers
MKP

[AWD]

Originally Posted by mkpiyengar

Now, I'm considering Honda City. Only question if i go for second generation automatic vs manual, what are the cons.

Is it safe to go for 2004/2005 Honda City Zx cars?

Yes the awkward looking Honda City, don't remember the generation correctly, 2nd complete over-haul I think, is the best bet.

Yes Hondas age well, only the condition of the vehicle has to be good. Automatic is always better than a manual, see if you can find a good eg.

Avoid the 1st Gen Honda City, that wasn't a great car & Corolla by no means, its just a pt. A to B commute, with not much comfort, poor FE & expensive spares. Not to forget, a pathetic Ride Quality & a bad driving position & space.

[mkpiyengar]

Don't wish to high-jack Swami's ownership thread, so have PM'ed you my comments.

Cheers
MKP

[avi@98]

Hey, the clutch of my 1.35K Kms run 2007 Corolla has got all tight and vague. Showed it to a workshop and the technician says it may need replacement. How much does it cost to replace the clutch at the Toyota ASS and outside?

[abs182]

Originally Posted by avi@98

Hey, the clutch of my 1.35K Kms run 2007 Corolla has got all tight and vague. Showed it to a workshop and the technician says it may need replacement. How much does it cost to replace the clutch at the Toyota ASS and outside?

I recently sold my 2005 corolla at 1.1 lacs kms. One of the reason for the decision was the clutch plate needed replacement along with a host of other things. I was quoted about Rs 30000 just for the part plus labour. I didn't get a quote from outside though.

[MetalBuff]

Originally Posted by avi@98

Hey, the clutch of my 1.35K Kms run 2007 Corolla has got all tight and vague. Showed it to a workshop and the technician says it may need replacement. How much does it cost to replace the clutch at the Toyota ASS and outside?

Got a similar work done on my Esteem for 2.4K (labor included), last week. Even if we factor in Toyota's premium on spares, should not exceed 4K if you get it done from an FNG.

Cheerio,
-Shivang Gandotra