[androdev]

Thank you for sharing your test drive experiences. A touch and feel short test drive is worth more than reading through all the online opinions including mine :-)

Originally Posted by nxshar2

I expect to use my city (till we get a replacement) for local everyday runs

This may sound like I am going off on a tangent, but you should first replace your Honda City with a Camry Hybrid, replace the 18" wheels with 17" and you will have the best car for city traffic. You can consider new or a sparingly used one. Toyota dealers run a division called U Trust for selling used cars and it is very safe to buy a Toyota car from them. Make few calls and check it out.

Once you buy a Camry for city usage, your demands from German performance cars would be more in line with their strengths. When I read through your test drive feedback, it felt as if you are looking for Camry while driving in the city traffic. Camry is smooth, comfortable and effortless to drive. A good performance car would be jerky, hard and a pig to drive in busy traffic. This is all relative and too subtle to observe unless you do few back to back test drives with ears to the ground.

While I have no hesitation in recommending a Camry Hybrid (in fact, there is no alternative IMHO) for city drives, suggesting a German performance car is always going to tricky. I feel you need to do some more homework/test drives to narrow your shortlist.

There is the desirability, prestige and exclusive factor. Porsche is clearly a step above the big three. In a city like Mumbai, you are bound to find a good used Porsche with good loadings as an option. Keep in mind, it will never be value for money like other brands and service support is not that good - that is precisely why it is a bit more exclusive.

If you are convinced that you are not going to pay big bucks for the Porsche badge, then you can explore the performance cars from other brands. Test drive the usual suspects like M340i and S5, etc. and then see which car appeals to you the most. Get the Camry like today and then take your own sweet time to finalise the big purchase.

[nxshar2]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

These cars are pretty good overall - just that some parts may not be as easily available so down time could be significant & do not skimp on extended warranty for any reason!

I think this combined with androdev's comments makes me rethink if I can truly keep an 10 year old city as a back up for such a car. Though I have already started planning a cross country road trip assuming delivery by July .

Originally Posted by androdev

This may sound like I am going off on a tangent, but you should first replace your Honda City with a Camry Hybrid, replace the 19" wheels with 18" and you will have the best car for city traffic.

Agreed, as mentioned above.

A good performance car would be jerky, hard and a pig to drive in busy traffic. This is all relative and too subtle to observe unless you do few back to back test drives with ears to the ground.

So far I have managed with light touches barring a couple of jerky brakes but one of them happened with the Lexus as well.

In a city like Mumbai, you are bound to find a good used Porsche with good loadings as an option.

My apprehension is any used performance vehicle would be abused and in general not be as fun to drive a pre-owned compared to a brand new one. On the other hand I might luck out with a generously optioned one as you said. Then it becomes a waiting game with no clear end in sight.

[lamborghini]

Originally Posted by nxshar2

I think this combined with androdev's comments makes me rethink if I can truly keep an 10 year old city as a back up for such a car. Though I have already started planning a cross country road trip assuming delivery by July .


My apprehension is any used performance vehicle would be abused and in general not be as fun to drive a pre-owned compared to a brand new one. On the other hand I might luck out with a generously optioned one as you said. Then it becomes a waiting game with no clear end in sight.

If you have parking, the resale of the City is dismal and could be worth keeping around just in case of emergencies and for odd jobs where a bigger car could be a pain.

Regarding used performance vehicles : It is very important to see the vehicle. There are many owners who baby the vehicle and there are also many owners who would thrash the vehicle.
Hence the mantra of finding something within warranty, getting a paid pre-purchase inspection done, combing through the service & insurance records (look for frequent tyre replacement, replaced suspension components, etc. as these are major indicators of abuse especially if it's a low run, daily driven car).
There is actually a blue Audi S5 current generation up for sale which could be worth looking at in the case you decide to maintain a two car garage : one tourer (in which case, do look the Lexus NX too though it would mean stretching your budget), and one that makes you wake up super-early on sunday mornings and plan breakfast outings with your friends to far away restaurants, like the S5 / M2 / Cayman, etc.

[LilBimmer]

Originally Posted by nxshar2

GLA 45 - Absolute beauty of a car, the pure AMG engine noise and acceleration/ braking/ handling is just mind boggling. Of all the three, this one feels nimble, light on its feet and super responsive. Both front seats are spacious and comfortable, we didn’t bother with the rear seats on this one.

Did you mean a GLA35, or an A45s??? I wasn’t aware that there was an AMG GLA45 available in the current model line up???

[nxshar2]

Originally Posted by LilBimmer

Did you mean a GLA35, or an A45s??? I wasn’t aware that there was an AMG GLA45 available in the current model line up???

I am not sure about the lettering. Since it wasn't going to be on my shortlist so didn't get a quote or inquire further. It's the hatchback CBU at Prabhadevi and definitely is a 45s with HUD etc.

[androdev]

Originally Posted by LilBimmer

Did you mean a GLA35, or an A45s??? I wasn’t aware that there was an AMG GLA45 available in the current model line up???

Not only it's there, but also they offer 8 years warranty on drivetrain is what I heard.

EDIT: My bad. It's GLA35.

[LilBimmer]

Originally Posted by nxshar2

I am not sure about the lettering. Since it wasn't going to be on my shortlist so didn't get a quote or inquire further. It's the hatchback CBU at Prabhadevi and definitely is a 45s with HUD etc.

So, the dark grey A45s with the sports seats and HUD???

[nxshar2]

Originally Posted by LilBimmer

So, the dark grey A45s with the sports seats and HUD???

Not sure about the colour, sorry! If it helps, I remember E53 was blue and C43 was grey. Yes sports seats, HUD and it's a pure AMG - one engine one hand. About 1.15-1.2 OTR though because it's a CBU.

Originally Posted by vivekrvcse

If you haven't test driven the X5, please do.
It is amazing how you don't feel the bulk after 1 week, and just the amazing performance

The car does look great and ride quality is excellent both at front and back - better than all SUVs so far I think. Could only test the acceleration and braking in a very limited way as I did a short test drive only. It did feel big (not bulky) as I suspected though.

Originally Posted by Sahil

You could consider the Velar if you remap it.

I think the car looks brilliant. Not boxy IMO

The car does look brilliant in person. Somehow the images don't do it justice. The ride height is among the highest even for SUVs and ride quality is stiff. I was driving lightly and it all seemed fine but the sales rep insisted on driving us around for an experience and it turned out to be an experience for sure. We both almost got motion sick even on Powai internal roads and I could feel all the bumps along the way. Only if it would ride was a bit more cushy. Definitely has the looks with Range rover printed in front etc.

I did inquire about Defender as Turbanator said but no old stock as they cleared all during the first phase of the pandemic it seems.

Originally Posted by androdev

This may sound like I am going off on a tangent, but you should first replace your Honda City with a Camry Hybrid, replace the 18" wheels with 17" and you will have the best car for city traffic.

Camry is smooth, comfortable and effortless to drive.

Hi, drove the Camry yesterday and it's basically the same as the Lexus. The only difference I felt with ES300 were the driving position - felt a bit low and the lack of thigh support. Pick up and power is nice enough (not great) to suit any overtaking needs I felt. Drove on slightly rough patches of Eastern Express Highway at speed and the small potholes and uneven road surface is absorbed well by the suspension. The small bumps do register but you don't feel them even if you accidentally go little fast on those steep ones. Wife also sat at the back and said ride quality is more comfortable in the back. CVT felt OK to me and didn't feel lagging on highway, steep slope or low speeds. Ventilated seats are a blessing to boot. It's so quite at low speeds that a food app rider came almost in front at a turn (of course he was on the phone).

The only practical reason (at a cost of ~28 lacs) to go for the ES now would be the thigh support. Being your daily driver, you ever felt the lack of thigh support an issue?

Of course there is the badge value and the looks

[androdev]

Originally Posted by nxshar2

Hi, drove the Camry yesterday and it's basically the same as the Lexus. The only difference I felt with ES300 were the driving position - felt a bit low and the lack of thigh support. Pick up and power is nice enough (not great) to suit any overtaking needs I felt. Drove on slightly rough patches of Eastern Express Highway at speed and the small potholes and uneven road surface is absorbed well by the suspension. The small bumps do register but you don't feel them even if you accidentally go little fast on those steep ones. Wife also sat at the back and said ride quality is more comfortable in the back. CVT felt OK to me and didn't feel lagging on highway, steep slope or low speeds. Ventilated seats are a blessing to boot. It's so quite at low speeds that a food app rider came almost in front at a turn (of course he was on the phone).

I have had the good fortune of driving some nice cars in India and the two cars that really blew me away are Polo DSG and Camry Hybrid (I drive the previous gen). Price-to-delight ratio is off the charts. VW corrected the mistake of giving something nice to Indian masses by taking off Polo DSG from the market. I wonder why Toyota is keeping the Camry Hybrid in the market - maybe this car is used by all Japanese expats and there must have been a representation/lobbying by them to keep the Camry in the Indian market. I think every senior exec of a Japanese company in India drives a Camry.

My comparison of Camry Hybrid is with S Class petrol that I own for the last 10 years. I find Camry absolutely delightful and effortless to drive at low speeds - which is most of the time in Bangalore. My family members are also very happy with Camry within city.

The only practical reason (at a cost of ~28 lacs) to go for the ES now would be the thigh support. Being your daily driver, you ever felt the lack of thigh support an issue?

Of course there is the badge value and the looks

I have no issues with seating position (mind you the car I drive is prev gen) and I have also taken it on long out station trips just to check it out. It's no match to the Germans on the highways (or for spirited driving within the city) so unfortunately I wouldn't recommend it as a city+highway car unless you are a very sedate driver. It's responsive and has power to overtake etc. but let's just say the Germans outclass it very easily. Go for dark coloured Camry - it hides their silly front design better and looks pretty upmarket.

Why don't you take another test drive with proper seat adjustment - I am sure you know the seat base has rake and reach adjustments? Don't go for ES. You will be better served by a two car setup. A Camry (for carefree effortless comfortable city commute) and a German speed machine would make a terrific combination. I think just about everyone needs the former. The latter is a very complicated decision. What is spacious won't be nimble. What handles sharply wont be comfortable. What is desirable won't be cheap. You will have to figure out the sweet spot by yourself.

PS: Please keep posting those test drive experiences. They are brief and to the point :-)

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by nxshar2

Hi, drove the Camry yesterday and it's basically the same as the Lexus. The only difference I felt with ES300 were the driving position
The only practical reason (at a cost of ~28 lacs) to go for the ES now would be the thigh support.

If you are Ok to try the Japanese over your initial preference of German, will suggest you go once more to Lexus and Toyota.

Camry is not the same as ES! Any surface that you touch will look and feel completely different and though looks are subjective, I find ES more sporty, pleasant and different than others in this segment.

Just have a look at the enclosed pictures, go and physically check and then update here

Camry Dash/ Steering (ignore bubbles)



ES

[nxshar2]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

I would also suggest taking these cars for a test drive on the eastern freeway during sparse traffic timing - start to end as it would be a great way to get the know how these cars behave on different conditions - battered roads leading up to freeway, freeway too has some rough patches, undulations, smooth corners, etc.
This would help give you an idea of what to expect from each of these cars in terms of masking speed, low speed ride, high speed ride, handling on different surfaces, etc. and see which one suits you best!

Thanks lamborghini,
Always thought it would be too much to ask for such a long test drive but finally did one and I am not sure I can go back to regular 20 minutes test drives ever again . Not only does everything you say hold true, you also get an idea of what kind of driver you are and what you really want from the car.

[nxshar2]

Hi All,
It's looking like the GLC 43 AMG. Final questions (I hope).

1. In a car like GLC 43 amg, do the running boards provide any utility? We both found that they actually get in the way while getting in/ out.

2. Will the low profile tires - (size 20) be a pain while touring? Some friends suggested to get all 4 changed with normal 18s. Could that impact handling/ cornering/ ride quality?

3. Does PPF serve any utility on a dark colour like black/ grey?

Thanks again in advance!

[lamborghini]

Originally Posted by nxshar2

Hi All,
It's looking like the GLC 43 AMG. Final questions (I hope).

1. In a car like GLC 43 amg, do the running boards provide any utility? We both found that they actually get in the way while getting in/ out.

2. Will the low profile tires - (size 20) be a pain while touring? Some friends suggested to get all 4 changed with normal 18s. Could that impact handling/ cornering/ ride quality?

3. Does PPF serve any utility on a dark colour like black/ grey?

Thanks again in advance!

1. I personally think they're just decorative for most part.

2. By SUV standards, yes it could be a pain while touring; but by luxury sedan standards - most have thinner sidewalls.
If you drive it responsibly : avoid taking the rough pothole ridden bumpy road at full speed like you would in a fortuner, etc. you should be fine otherwise can consider downsizing to 19".
Downsizing would improve ride, but handling could take a little hit when pushing it.

3. I personally am not a fan of PPF unless it'll be prone to picking up scratches. I'd stick to getting the bumpers in PPF and leaving the rest as it is : keep the money for touch ups / detailing sessions - nothing looks better than a well detailed, gleaming, dark car!

[iliketurtles]

Congrats! Weighing in with my 2 cents of wisdom.

Originally Posted by nxshar2

Will the low profile tires - (size 20) be a pain while touring? Some friends suggested to get all 4 changed with normal 18s. Could that impact handling/ cornering/ ride quality?

I get where your friends are coming from, because travelling with low profile 20 inch wheels could be dicey given the fabulous condition of Indian roads. Swapping them out for 18s would definitely offer advantages, while trading off some performance for greater comfort and peace of mind.

However, I don't think 18s will fit (check with someone more knowledgable on this at AMG or at a tire/tuner shop). My concern are the front brakes, and whether they can be housed inside 18 inch wheels. I think the rear wheels shouldn't be a problem. I'm not even sure you'd get many aftermarket options for an 18 inch wheels offset for the GLC43, meaning you might be stuck with OEM wheels, which means paying a premium.

19 inches would definitely fit, and you'll get lots of aftermarket options too in them, so that's what you should look at if you're swapping out the wheels. You can sell the 20 inch stock wheels for a decent price too, ensuring it's virtually a like-for-like swap.

Originally Posted by nxshar2

Does PPF serve any utility on a dark colour like black/ grey?

Self-healing PPF will protect against chips and light scrapes, while helping avoid the development of swirl marks too if treated right. I've even heard of some PPF's coming with a built-in ceramic coating layer for added gloss. Fascinating stuff.

If you don't want to spend that much on it, just do the bumpers and bonnet. You can rest assured you'll pick up lots of paint chips on your bonnet during high-speed rides, so it would protect against that.

Maintaining black is a pain in the you-know-where, so this is something I'd definitely get done from a reputed installer if I were you, partially or fully.

[androdev]

Originally Posted by nxshar2

Hi All,
It's looking like the GLC 43 AMG. Final questions (I hope).

Is it a done deal? Should I forever hold my peace?