[B O V]

Originally Posted by navin_v8

my heart says I have all the engines and motorcycles from most of the generations except the 500 CI, 500 LB, G series from early 50's

Then I'm afraid that your heart has its work cut out for itself

Royal Enfield as a brand,Had a lotta engine variants.The "Bullet" itself had a fair few other variants(engine wise) other than those you've mentioned.Among those the one model,that I feel was the most beautiful bullet ever,would the the Royal Enfield J2.

Also I think this might be worth mentioning that there was a UCE model(350) back in the 60's.That's a full 50 years(approx) before it found its way here.

http://www.royalenfields.com/2008/08...models-is.html

Did the B2 you have come with the slightly heavier looking D shape mudguard at the rear?Good to know that you have most of your original parts.

I think you should get one book called Royal Enfield:The Post War Models-Roy Bacon.I've been tryin to get my hands on it myself through my friends in the uk.

Happy thumping!

And it was still a Bullet at heart

Could you explain this?

My purist cousins keep comparing the new bullets to other motorcycles(which I won't mention).

I've always wondered what people mean when they say this.The only motorcycle I've ever ridden(and riding) an '83.And whenever I ride my friends uce's I feel like something is lacking(Not that it isn't good).Is that "feel" what folks mean?

[navin_v8]

Originally Posted by B O V

Then I'm afraid that your heart has its work cut out for itself

Royal Enfield as a brand,Had a lotta engine variants.The "Bullet" itself had a fair few other variants(engine wise) other than those you've mentioned.Among those the one model,that I feel was the most beautiful bullet ever,would the the Royal Enfield J2.

Dude BOV I never said that I have all the motorcycles from all the generations I said I have it from most of the generations, especially the ones mass produced here in India. I am very well aware of the plethora of motorcycles and engines from RE's stable. Like today in those days too the engine was more or less same with minor tweakings and were called different models. The J1, J2, G1, G2, B1, B2, and many other engine types were available, one can't have them all at once, but it is not impossible. There were other iconic motorcycles from RE like the Interceptor(700 to 750cc Parallel Twin), Meteor(500cc Parallel Twin), Super Meteor(700cc Parallel Twin), Constellation(700cc Parallel Twin), Continental GT (250cc Single), the legendary Flying Flea(125 cc Single), a couple of V twin models, and many many more. All I said was that I am satisfied with my current collection. Life is long and who knows I might lay my hands on the Big Daddy from RE's stable the Legendary RE Interceptor 750 cc Parallel Twin. I saw one Interceptor 750cc in Flesh and By God it took my breath away. What a Beauty!

Did the B2 you have come with the slightly heavier looking D shape mudguard at the rear?Good to know that you have most of your original parts.

B1 dude not B2, I have the B1. The D shape mudguard at the rear was completely damaged by years of beating and abandonment. We had to cut the bottom side and it now looks like the normal mudguard you see on other Standards, the front mudguard was saved though as it held strong and had taken quite a beating by nature's elements. As I mentioned I am painstakingly and patiently restoring it to its original form for the past 2 years. The result is expected early next year.

Could you explain this?

My purist cousins keep comparing the new bullets to other motorcycles(which I won't mention).

I've always wondered what people mean when they say this.The only motorcycle I've ever ridden(and riding) an '83.And whenever I ride my friends uce's I feel like something is lacking(Not that it isn't good).Is that "feel" what folks mean?

BOV you from Kerala? me too but born and brought up in Bombay. Out of the many times I have visited Kerala I have seen them mallus are suckers for CI Standard Bullets both 350 and 500, especially the old ones the early 70's and early to late 60's ones. According to my experience riding CI bullets from most of the era's that feel is about the pure mechanical machine which rides in tandem with your heartbeat. The blast of that piston, the rumble of that heavy crank, the rocking of those push rods, the jumping of the tappets, carburretor pumping in the fuel, and finally that famous Thump which the CI bullet so proudly wears on its chest. The whole bike is like Art in Motion, it looks simple yet elegant while at the same time has a regal look, it is a timeless beauty. Needless to say it has an old world charm when things were more simpler and mechanicals and electricals ruled. But the new generation RE motorcycles if not equally better have a charm and "feel" of their own and come with a host of features which is very good especially the EFi.

[B O V]

Originally Posted by navin_v8

Dude BOV I never said that I have all the motorcycles from all the generations I said I have it from most of the generations, especially the ones mass produced here in India

Well,you do know your Enfields,I just felt like I shoulda mentioned the J2(such beauty).No offense meant.

Man I sincerely wish I could ride some of their parallel twin models.You know its quite weird that back when Enfield-Redditch was in its heyday they did strive to do their best in terms of competing against the then competition.Although selling them wasn't their strong point.Although I do hope that RE India will re-introduce 'em(Might be naive of me)

Sorry that was a typo(Since I had my mind on the J2).Man you will not believe how badly people want those old mudguards now.Do you need that mudguard?I've a very resourceful mech,plus my cousins also know where to source them from.If you need any parts that you have trouble with,let me know.

Yes I am from Kerala too.Although I was born and bought up in Bahrain.Yep our people certainly do love their loud,ticking over at god knows what rpm,flashy bulls(most of em),Oodles of brass work etc.And those ugly alloys too.Some times they've got weird stuff written on em too.And that weird(loud) muffler which expands in the middle in a weird way.

I own a slightly customised '83 deluxe(was a deluxe).
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motorb...83-bullet.html

Personally I don't care much for the UCE vs CI debate.The only time I felt the perceived lack in "feel" was for the 350 UCE.But damn when I ride my friends 500 efi.All forgotten(Might be due to my only CI riding experience).

[navin_v8]

Originally Posted by B O V

Well,you do know your Enfields,I just felt like I shoulda mentioned the J2(such beauty).No offense meant.

Man I sincerely wish I could ride some of their parallel twin models.You know its quite weird that back when Enfield-Redditch was in its heyday they did strive to do their best in terms of competing against the then competition.Although selling them wasn't their strong point.Although I do hope that RE India will re-introduce 'em(Might be naive of me)

Sorry that was a typo(Since I had my mind on the J2).Man you will not believe how badly people want those old mudguards now.Do you need that mudguard?I've a very resourceful mech,plus my cousins also know where to source them from.If you need any parts that you have trouble with,let me know.

Yes I am from Kerala too.Although I was born and bought up in Bahrain.Yep our people certainly do love their loud,ticking over at god knows what rpm,flashy bulls(most of em),Oodles of brass work etc.And those ugly alloys too.Some times they've got weird stuff written on em too.And that weird(loud) muffler which expands in the middle in a weird way.

I own a slightly customised '83 deluxe(was a deluxe).
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motorb...83-bullet.html

Personally I don't care much for the UCE vs CI debate.The only time I felt the perceived lack in "feel" was for the 350 UCE.But damn when I ride my friends 500 efi.All forgotten(Might be due to my only CI riding experience).

No offense taken mate, I do know my Enfields and have been researching and learning about them since I was 10 years old. Even I feel RE should bring out the Interceptor 750 cc Parallel Twin model, although one can opt for the Triumph Bonneville as it is readily available and a wonderful motorcycle. I was actually contemplating on buying the Bonneville (was really tempted after reading Avi's thread) but decided against it as I have my eyes set on the Adventure Motorcycles that I would like to buy in the future. I thought I could save some money now by buying the Thunderbird 500 and later buy the big one. I have my eyes set on the Triumph Tiger 1200 XC for now, but I'm open to other Adventure bikes as well namely Suzuki V Strom 1000 and BMW R1200 GS (currently on offer in India), Kawasaki Versys 1000, Yamaha Super Tenere, KTM 1290 Super Adventure, etc. as and when they hit our shores.

Your customised 83 Deluxe Bullet looks yummy, very nicely done up and a brilliant restoration. I saw your thread as I never miss a thread about Enfields.

Thanks for the help mate about sourcing the mudguard, I was contemplating fabricating the rear mudguard but I am not doing it now maybe later. Here in Bombay one can get everything but PM me your number just in case I need to source the mudguard.

Enjoy your 83 Bullet to the max and ride safe

[navin_v8]

The Diagnosis and Repair Dilemma coming up…

[tharian]

Originally Posted by navin_v8

The Diagnosis and Repair Dilemma coming up…

Sounds like an issue with the new TB's. I remember reading the exact same issue of battery overheating on another thread.
Waiting for the rest of the story.

Btw, Congrats on the TB.

[navin_v8]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Navin, surprisingly as a Bullet lover you do the Bullet great disrespect when you keep bringing in the bikes you have been bringing in to prove your point.

I choose to ignore all your lines except for this one. I wonder what surprises you I am appalled to read that line, maybe you haven’t come across a Bullet enthusiast like me before. I have the same feeling when you say I show a great disrespect to Bullet. I haven’t come across any one telling me that “purists” included. I brought the above motorcycles into the discussion not just to prove my point but for everyone to know and it is the truth that today we can see equally legendary motorcycles like Bonneville, CB 1100, Kawasaki W800 and Z1000, BMW R 1200 GS, Triumph Tiger, Norton Commando, etc. being accepted and bought by bikers around the world including India. So these bikes sporting modern EFi system, performance based punchy motors, versatile new platform, reliable electricals, etc. do not really matter Wow!

The Bullet is different. Always has been different.

The Bullet never died. It kept being made year after year for decades, virtually untouched, unchanged.

The longest unbroken production run of any bike in the history of motorcycling.

I am well aware of the Bullets’ inception, history and heritage and am I no way tarnishing it (according to you), in fact I am accepting, appreciating and welcoming the new fold of bulleteers to the fraternity rather than telling them that their bullet is not the “Real Bullet”.

A lot of your examples died, were buried, forgotten, and then their BRANDS rose from the ashes, reincarnated.

They are not the same bikes. And even their owners, knowledgeable ones like Ram here, will concur that they are not riding a bit of history, but a modern machine bearing the same name, looking the same, but completely different.

Not so with the Bullet. A living piece of history. A legend in its own right.

Not exactly Enfield India was on the brink of bankruptcy during the early 90's as they had just one model bread winner at that time the Standard Bullet CI 350, the advent of bringing in new avatars of Bullet in the form of Bullet Electra, Bullet Machismo (there were two variants Machismo CI and Machismo AVL LB both 350 and 500), Thunderbird AVL LB 350 saved the company from the brink of collapse, for purists this is where the Standard Bullet CI started rising from the ashes thanks to the other Bullet variants it survived and flourished again. Not all the brands were buried the BMW R1200 GS, the Triumph Bonneville, Tiger, etc. were and still are in production. The truth is the reincarnated motorcycles were equally loved and bought by biking enthusiasts as they know a legendary history is associated with this bike even though the engine dynamics are different.

If that one most important point cannot be apreciated, then we are talking past one another.

You are just assuming that I do not appreciate, that the Bullet is a legend and a living piece of history, if you think I do so, then I can’t help. Seriously!

P.S. I see the enduring theme of "respect" coming up at multiple places in your last post. Calling the Thunderbird a Thunderbird, or Royal Enfield motorcycles as RE bikes, but not Bullets, does not imply disrespect for them. It is simply pointing out facts.

By respect I don’t just mean the motorcycles from RE’s stable but also their riders new and old school alike whether they ride the “real bullet” or not does not really matter.

I could conversely claim (would be silly, admittedly) that comparing these to and calling these Bullets is disrespectful to a legendary bike. But then we are bikers here, speaking on what we are passionate about. There is no respect issues implied here.

Being passionate does not mean belittling others by saying theirs is not a “real bullet”, also respect in my book of thoughts mean appreciating and encouraging the new age RE owners and their rides and not telling them again and again that theirs is not a “Real Bullet”. I again repeat all this is very subjective and to each his own

P.S. Mods please delete this post if you think it is inappropriate. I am not going to report any more posts on the "Real Bullet" henceforth on this thread. Thanks.

[navin_v8]

The Diagnosis and Repair Dilemma (this is a long one so please bear with me)

As Sunday was a holiday I had to wait till Monday Oct 27 2014 to hand over my Tbird500 to the service centre. At home too there was a gloomy atmosphere my mom, sister and brother in law were consoling me and saying such things happen, you are lucky that the bike stalled inside Vasai market area, had you been on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad highway it would have been more challenging. I couldn’t sleep for the whole night and it was the first time I was so eagerly awaiting Monday morning. I knew that RE service centre opens at 10.am. I started from my home at around 9.am. in order to reach my friends’ workshop (at Sakinaka) where the bike was by around 9.30.am. I got aboard my Standard 350 CI and started riding towards my friends’ workshop at Sakinaka; I reached there and pushed out my dead Tbird500 from the workshop. Now comes the interesting part where I visit RE authorized Synergy Auto showroom as I don’t know where their service centre is located. I enter the showroom and this is what happens…

Me: Hi my name is Navin and I have a Tbird500 EFi which broke down on Saturday 25th Oct 2014. It is just roughly 3 weeks since I have got the delivery and here are the papers. The bike is at my friends’ workshop near the Sakinaka Metro station; since I don’t know where your service station is located I have come here. We need to take the bike to the service station and I also have to go to my office.
Showroom Staff: (note that this is the same guy I spoke on the phone while I was on my way from Vasai to Sakinaka, he is very rude and unapologetic) You have to put it on a tempo and bring it to the service centre.
Me: I don’t think your service centre would be so far from here, besides I have already paid Rs. 2000 for the tempo charges while I brought it from Vasai to Sakinaka!
Showroom Staff: Where is the bike now?
Me: (I’m baffled at his reply) I already told you the bike is near the metro station just adjacent to this road.
Showroom Staff: Which metro station?
Me: (I think he is testing my patience now) Which is the metro station adjacent to the road? Is it not Sakinaka? (I ask him sarcastically)
Showroom Staff: You have to put it on a tempo and bring it to the service centre which is on 90 feet road, just across that lane.
Me: (I tell myself, Is he a robot or what) Dude which tempo guy would come for such a short distance and besides I have already paid Rs.2000 for the tempo as I said before, I don’t want to spend more. Kindly arrange for a person so that me and him together can push the bike and take it to the service station.
Showroom Staff: (Rudely) We have no one at present, kindly arrange a tempo and take the bike directly to the service centre.
Me: (My lid blows off!) Hey listen! The distance between your service station and where the bike is will be about 400-500 feet max, I am telling you, me and one of your guys will push the bike to the service centre. It will take all of 10-15 mins. Man!
Showroom Staff: I told you we have no staff, put it on a tempo!
Me: Ok at least send your service centre mechanic to see if he can start the bike temporarily? (In the mean time I call up the RE Brand store in Bandra from where I purchased the bike and tell the other person on the line about the situation and speak to the Synergy Auto showroom guy, the Synergy Auto guy calms down when the RE Brand Store from Bandra speaks to him on my phone.)
Showroom Staff: Here, this is the mobile no. of the service centre manager, speak to him and arrange for a mechanic.
Me: (I tell myself Wow what a customer service are these guys only here for doing timepass! A thought comes to my mind “Do not blow a trumpet in front of a buffalo it will make no sense.” I take the number and call up the service centre manager.) Hello, my bike Tbird500 is broken down and is near Sakinaka junction and I have been asked to speak to you, can you arrange a mechanic to take a look?
Service Centre Manager: Yes sir let me see who is available; most of the staff is on vacation due to Diwali holidays.
Me: Do it fast as I also have to leave for office (the time now is almost 11.00.am.).
Service Centre Manager: Yes sir wait for 5 mins. I will send someone (and cuts the line).
Me: (I tell the showroom staff) Thanks for the help and I never wish to see you again!


While waiting outside the showroom the service centre mechanic arrives after 10 mins. I take him where my bike is located and he checks the fuses and wires but the bike is as stubborn as it was before, it doesn’t budge at all. I tell him let’s push the bike to the service centre and you can diagnose the issue, he says the bike needs to be carried on a tempo to the service centre. I tell him I have already spent so much I don’t want to spend more and tell him take me to your service centre I want to talk with your manager. I reach the service centre and give a piece of my mind to the service manager, surprisingly he also says I need to put it on a tempo and it will take about 150-200 bucks. Rather than wasting my time I decide to pay him 100 bucks for bringing the bike to the service station and give him the insurance policy photocopy and leave for my office. I get an SMS from my friend in the afternoon at around 3.pm. that the bike was just taken by two people pushing it. Wow! I tell myself and what was I telling them since morning all this for just 100 bucks I was a fool not to know about the “chai paani” tradition in India.

Proactive that I am, I call up the service centre next day to find out what the issue is? The service manager says the battery is shot and we are charging it to see if we can fix it. I tell them how a maintenance free factory sealed Exide battery can go kaput so soon? I get no reply. I decide to visit the service centre on Wednesday 29th Oct to check the progress only to find that my bike is parked in one corner with the speedometer and rpm needle still stuck in the middle. I go to meet the service manager and ask him what have they diagnosed so far, he says the battery is faulty, I tell him did you find the source of the problem, why was the battery so hot? Was it due to overcharging? Have you checked the wires, alternator, regulator-rectifier unit, etc.? Just by giving a generic reply saying the battery is faulty is not enough, what if the new battery also conks off and I am stranded in the middle of nowhere, I would not like to go through this ordeal again. I seriously expect some quality from a 2 lakh rupee bike for crying out loud, telling this I leave from the service centre for office. I decide to send a mail to the RE customer care on 29th Oct about the problems (I also attach all the required documents in my mail) and wait to see if they respond. Next day itself I get a reply from the customer service reassuring me the best of their support. I also get a call from the RE Mumbai Territory Service Manager the very next day and he assures me the best of service, I tell him just by saying that the battery is faulty is just not done your guys need to diagnose and pin point the issue. The bike is just 3 weeks old and this is really not expected I am really disappointed. That week passes by and I follow up with them on the phone next week, what I hear next comes as a shock to me, they tell me that the starter motor too is faulty! I tell them how earlier you said the battery is faulty and now you say the starter motor is faulty, I fear if I have got a lemon! I shoot an email to the RE customer care and this time a stinker mail on 5th November, note that the bike has now been in the service centre for almost 10 days, no reply from customer care. I call up the service centre on 6th November and ask them the status, they say the battery has been replaced with a new one and the order for a new starter motor has been placed and is now in transit. I ask them when will I receive my bike, they say since Friday is a weekly off for them I can expect the bike on Saturday or Monday to the max. I decide to visit the showroom on Saturday 8th November; I speak to the service manager who says he will receive the new starter motor today. While in discussion with the service manager the RE territory manager himself arrives and recognizes me, I thank my stars and tell what a coincidence that he is visiting the service centre today. I tell him about my experience so far and he asks the service manager to speak to the logistics guy to check the progress on the starter motor, the logistics guy on the other line tell that the starter motor is already delivered and should be in the service centre. A service centre mechanic appears from nowhere and says we have received the starter motor and shows the invoice and delivery challan to us. Wow what a coordination these guys have among themselves where they have no idea as to what is coming in and going out, they don’t communicate and update each other I guess!

The territory manager assures me that I will get my bike in less than 15 mins. I sit inside the customer lounge area and chat up with a fellow RE rider who has come to fix his Continental GT. The bike is ready and I am asked to take a trial, I ride it for about 5 kms and test it, after the ride I open the battery box cover and touch the battery to see if it has turned hot, fortunately it is not is cool to touch. I go back to the service centre and carefully go through the job card and sign the necessary documents and fill the RE customer feedback form. I have a small chat with the RE territory service manager before leaving and book the first service appointment after about 2 weeks (on 24th Nov) as my bike had covered about 280 Kms before conking off and had been in the service centre for 10 days. “Aall is well” I tell my heart and ride off towards home.

In short
Problem diagnosed: Faulty battery and starter motor
Problem resolved: Yes both the battery and starter motor replaced with a brand new unit.

Meanwhile I tested the bike on Sunday 9th Nov by going for a 40 Kms ride and checked the battery again wherein I touched to find if it was cool to touch and it was. The bike has been running flawlessly so far. Guess what guys? I am gonna take the bike to the same Vasai location (I wasn’t able to visit the Vasai Fort and Suruchi Beach due to the breakdown earlier) on coming Saturday to break that jinx and to visit those places which I wasn’t able to do before. Wish me luck guys!

[navin_v8]

Originally Posted by tharian

Sounds like an issue with the new TB's. I remember reading the exact same issue of battery overheating on another thread.
Waiting for the rest of the story.

Btw, Congrats on the TB.

Hey tharian thanks for the wishes man. Even I had a doubt of this as a known issue on new Thunderbirds, but we might be wrong as one of my friends who owns a April 2014 Thunderbird 350 hasn't had such issues so far. But I will keep my eyes and ears open. Thanks again.

[riziali]

Hey navin,

Been keenly following your thread since I've decided to go ahead with my purchase of the Thunderbird 500, (booked mine in July but waited since I wasn't decided all this while) mine is a marine too. In my case the immovable object came in between me and a Bonneville :-(. Anyhow, I'm still gonna save up for it and use the Thunderbird till the time i get a Bonnie.

Whats concerning is the fact that so many of the Royal Enfields have reliability issues like this and various others too and I'm scared I might end up with a 2 lakh rupee lemon myself!! From the chassis and engine number I've received, it indicates an October manufacture and I hope its not a manufacturing defect across the lot.

I plan to get an ownership thread up soon if time permits, in the meantime wish you safe riding and happy trouble free miles.

[man_of_steel]

Damn! That sucks on a brand new bike! Anyways, glad to know that the issue is resolved. That Exide battery of the UCEs has always been a headache! I remember mine developing problems within 7 months into the ownership or so, and finally gave up completely after 2.5 years in the middle of nowhere during a ride! This happened even after I refilled and recharged the battery just the previous day! But I was able to restart the UCE350 TBTS with a 9A Amaron battery and reach back home!

Aah... Good old days! Enjoy and ride safe!

[navin_v8]

Originally Posted by riziali

Hey navin,

Been keenly following your thread since I've decided to go ahead with my purchase of the Thunderbird 500, (booked mine in July but waited since I wasn't decided all this while) mine is a marine too. In my case the immovable object came in between me and a Bonneville :-(. Anyhow, I'm still gonna save up for it and use the Thunderbird till the time i get a Bonnie.

Whats concerning is the fact that so many of the Royal Enfields have reliability issues like this and various others too and I'm scared I might end up with a 2 lakh rupee lemon myself!! From the chassis and engine number I've received, it indicates an October manufacture and I hope its not a manufacturing defect across the lot.

I plan to get an ownership thread up soon if time permits, in the meantime wish you safe riding and happy trouble free miles.

Hi riziali welcome to the club, nice to know that your Tbird500 too is marine blue color, the color is extremely rare to find on roads. Don't have these doubts in your mind about ending up with a lemon, these things do happen, these thoughts will spoil the overall fun of your ownership. The Triumph Bonneville is in a different league altogether, glad to know you are considering it. Thanks for the wishes and looking forward to your ownership thread. Bring it on!

[navin_v8]

Originally Posted by man_of_steel

Damn! That sucks on a brand new bike! Anyways, glad to know that the issue is resolved. That Exide battery of the UCEs has always been a headache! I remember mine developing problems within 7 months into the ownership or so, and finally gave up completely after 2.5 years in the middle of nowhere during a ride! This happened even after I refilled and recharged the battery just the previous day! But I was able to restart the UCE350 TBTS with a 9A Amaron battery and reach back home!

Aah... Good old days! Enjoy and ride safe!

Yeah I know so many issues on a brand new bike is just not acceptable. Does Amaron make 12 Volt 14 Amp battery for these bikes, if yes I would like to get them. I vouch by amaron as they have been faithfully doing duty on my cars since I have owned them. Although Exide is good and has been doing duty on all my other rides but I still feel Amaron is better.

[man_of_steel]

Originally Posted by navin_v8

Does Amaron make 12 Volt 14 Amp battery for these bikes, if yes I would like to get them.

No, as per my knowledge. There is Exide and another couple of brands which I do'nt remember, who makes those 14Ah batteries. And even I found Amaron to be far better than Exide.

[Nick_Wanderlust]

Originally Posted by navin_v8

The Diagnosis and Repair Dilemma (this is a long one so please bear with me)

The bike has been running flawlessly so far. Guess what guys? I am gonna take the bike to the same Vasai location (I wasn’t able to visit the Vasai Fort and Suruchi Beach due to the breakdown earlier) on coming Saturday to break that jinx and to visit those places which I wasn’t able to do before. Wish me luck guys!

Navin, I would rather wish you to have "JOYFUL as well as GUSTY" ride and break the jinx rather than "Luck"!

Please Enjoy/Pamper/Love the TB500 and forgive its faults.

I hope the service centre staff should not count these 10 days since the bike has been kept in their workshop for its first service. Hope the first service appointment should be after 24th Nov.