[ebonho]

Originally Posted by ku69rd

Doc,

Honestly I don't think it will sell if they were to launch it. They sold during those days only due to a hard lambretta, an inefficient Vijay (Fuel) and license Raj.

Even if they had not stopped production, Chetak would have bit the dust when faced with Honda. Activas deliver more mileage when compared to Chetak (*Obvious to the fact that Chetak is a 2 stroker and Activa is a 4 stroker. But you know how the typical buyer would look at it. )

My dad still rides a Chetak incidentally. And I might be wrong but I think its a 4 stroke. He will not give it up for an Activa. There are still many like him.

There is a sardar friend of mine who has a booming business buying these old scooters for 2-3 thousand bucks and doing them up in some pretty vibrant funky colors. They get a pretty pile. The nostalgia market is high.

[ku69rd]

Originally Posted by ebonho

My dad still rides a Chetak incidentally. And I might be wrong but I think its a 4 stroke.

The nostalgia market is high.

Doc,
The later Chetaks were 4 strokers but flopped badly.
The initial models were all 2 strokers with 150 CC and if my memory is correct used to deliver 7 or 7.5 BHP. No remembrance on the torque figures though

Yes the nostalgia market is at its peak.
Can you imagine a Bajaj Cub 1984 Model sells like around 40 to 50K?

[D4D]

Originally Posted by GTO

Bajaj denies any comeback in the scooter segment.

That's just plain sad. The company can have turnaround like how honda had since they launched their first diesel car.

Quoting from the same article:

Giving an example, Rajiv Bajaj said he would rather be a Harley-Davidson, which makes huge profits and sells few bikes, than a General Motors that sells the most cars worldwide but doesn't make profits.

Utter nonsense. If that's the case, I ask you Mr Bajaj, what's the need for launching 2 new 100cc bikes in 2015? There's the Platina, CT100, Discover 100 now. While it's the pulsars that created the first impression for Bajaj, it's the discover that has been their bread and butter.

India is still that two wheeler market where a big name like Bajaj is better off selling a lot products with a wafer thin margins along with a few premium products.

[ksameer1234]

Originally Posted by D4D

India is still that two wheeler market where a big name like Bajaj is better off selling a lot products with a wafer thin margins along with a few premium products.

What if Bajaj is not just focused on India but wants to sell bikes globally? In which case it is better to channelise energy in developing better bikes than going off course for scooters. Today Bajaj has capability of producing 400cc bikes is fast spinning multiple models from a common platform. I doubt Bajaj is big enough company to develop such bikes while also producing scooters.

[ku69rd]

Originally Posted by ksameer1234

Today Bajaj has capability of producing 400cc bikes is fast spinning multiple models from a common platform.

Mate,
If i were you, I would put it as Bajaj has 'acquired' the capability of producing 400 CC bikes. Do remember they are able to do only post acquiring KTM Stakes. But nevertheless its not a minor feat

[rajeev k]

Bajaj not to ride scooters.

Excerpts from a news article in Hindustan Times.
Link: http://www.hindustantimes.com/htauto...1-1337040.aspx

“We have no plans to reenter the scooter segment. The Chetak is not coming back,” said Rajiv Bajaj, managing director, Bajaj Auto Ltd. “We are a specialist motorcycle manufacturer. The history of companies worldwide shows that very successful companies were those that focussed on only one thing.”

The rebuttal by Bajaj comes at a time when the company was rumoured to have developed an automatic scooter with its patented DTS-i engine technology.

[Tushar]

I wouldn't outright state that Bajaj won't ever come back to scooters, but the Chetak name making a comeback seems impossible. Every manufacturer today is targeting the young audience because they are more willing to spend money and because they are the right audience to develop a sense of loyalty from.

The Chetak was a successful name, but has the "old-man" baggage. Considering how Bajaj's design is getting increasingly outlandish in order to capture the imagination of younger buyers, why would Bajaj revive the name that has no/negligible connect with this generation?

[Sojogator]

Originally Posted by Tushar

...

The Chetak was a successful name, but has the "old-man" baggage. Considering how Bajaj's design is getting increasingly outlandish in order to capture the imagination of younger buyers, why would Bajaj revive the name that has no/negligible connect with this generation?

It should attract the retro, classic crowd big time IMO. If they keep the looks of it closer to the original one with blings of modern tech

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Sojogator

It should attract the retro, classic crowd big time IMO. If they keep the looks of it closer to the original one with blings of modern tech

I agree. Old used Chetaks, even non running ones, are going for serious prices here in Pune. And the parts are still available (its like the Yezdi of scooters).

Simply put, for reasons that evade my comprehension as a biker, scooters have become cool and hip.

[Tushar]

Originally Posted by Sojogator

It should attract the retro, classic crowd big time IMO. If they keep the looks of it closer to the original one with blings of modern tech

No doubts about that, but considering the fact that Bajaj is all about profitability, realistically speaking will the investment amount to audience size ratio be lucrative enough?

[Viju]

Originally Posted by rajeev k

Bajaj not to ride scooters.

Excerpts from a news article in Hindustan Times.
“We have no plans to reenter the scooter segment. The Chetak is not coming back,” said Rajiv Bajaj, managing director, Bajaj Auto Ltd."

With all due respect to Rajiv Bajaj and the way he has transformed Bajaj into a motorcycle manufacturer since the advent of the first gen Pulsar, all that this statement means to me is - Bajaj will not launch any scooter till his next press release. Mr. Bajaj has made many contradicting statements over the past few years about exiting segments and gone back on pretty much on every single one of them.

Right now, Bajaj is sitting pretty as a ''specialist motorcycle manufacturer'' because they have 40% stake in KTM and access to their technology and expertise. Seeing the way the scooter market is growing, I think it is a pretty dumb idea to stay out of it the way Bajaj is doing.

I cannot think of one innovation Bajaj has made in the past decade and a half, except the so-called-all-new dual / triple spark technology (and in the process, wasting a commendable effort by TVS which was the Flame). Bajaj was a specialist in scooters. Just because he goes back to scooters does not mean that he is trying to be a Mahindra. Scooters and motorcycles - are like bread and butter. Period.

[ksameer1234]

Originally Posted by Viju

Right now, Bajaj is sitting pretty as a ''specialist motorcycle manufacturer'' because they have 40% stake in KTM and access to their technology and expertise. Seeing the way the scooter market is growing, I think it is a pretty dumb idea to stay out of it the way Bajaj is doing.

I cannot think of one innovation Bajaj has made in the past decade and a half, except the so-called-all-new dual / triple spark technology (and in the process, wasting a commendable effort by TVS which was the Flame).

Quoting from this article on KTM website: "The small-engine street motorcycles – developed in cooperation with our Indian partner, Bajaj – open up a new, global segment for KTM."

I would like to believe the cooperation from Bajaj went beyond offering production facilities and suppliers. And Bajaj has many achievements to show whether it be perimeter frame, perfect front:rear balance of 200ns, managing three-spark plugs and four valves in a 200cc engine and so on. I am not even counting things like exhaustec.

I still feel this would not have been possible if Bajaj had its feet in Bike and Scooter boats. Definitely Bajaj is losing a share of pie by giving scooters a miss but it has its plate full with bikes.

[nug1]

They were undisputed leaders in scooters segment once which they lost out to Honda as they said that they are moving their focus to motor cycle segment, motor cycle segment was then dominated bby Honda (with Hero) and it still does, while Bajaj has no presence in scooter segment now.
In my view, today, they are neither perceived as a niche player, nor do they appear in top 3 two wheeler player in the country. Whatever is their strategy, market also doesn’t seem to understand it. Their share price is more or less at similar level as it was 3 years back. See a quick comparo with TVS which stands at ~6 times what it was 3 yrs back…

[PNTLovesNano]

Originally Posted by Viju

With all due respect to Rajiv Bajaj and the way he has transformed Bajaj into a motorcycle manufacturer since the advent of the first gen Pulsar, all that this statement means to me is - Bajaj will not launch any scooter till his next press release. Mr. Bajaj has made many contradicting statements over the past few years about exiting segments and gone back on pretty much on every single one of them.

Pretty much the bold part! Launch-update-unplug strategy worked for them in the beginning with Boxer replaced by CT100, Caliber115 by Discover 125, CT100 by XCD, and then XCD by Discover 100. I can predict with precision when Bajaj will return to the scooter segment. The day Pulsar share falls below 30% in its segment along with Discover/Platina sales falling below 50K, Bajaj will quickly launch by upgrading Kristal 100 cc to 125cc and with slightly different clothes as Chetak.

Bajaj is more about profitability, not that it is wrong, and it gets it anywhere, its fine. I thought they were sincere about the newly launched CT 100. However, looking at the initial dispatch of mere 5000, I expect them to pull the plug in six months down the line. As of now they have 4 models in the 100cc segment, CT 100, Platina 100 (with single spark plug, aka CT 100 engine only), one DTSi Platina 100, and Discover 100. All put together are not getting them the sales of a simple Hero HF Dawn.

[Viju]

Originally Posted by ksameer1234

Quoting from this article on KTM website: "The small-engine street motorcycles – developed in cooperation with our Indian partner, Bajaj – open up a new, global segment for KTM."

I would like to believe the cooperation from Bajaj went beyond offering production facilities and suppliers. And Bajaj has many achievements to show whether it be perimeter frame, perfect front:rear balance of 200ns, managing three-spark plugs and four valves in a 200cc engine and so on. I am not even counting things like exhaustec.

I still feel this would not have been possible if Bajaj had its feet in Bike and Scooter boats. Definitely Bajaj is losing a share of pie by giving scooters a miss but it has its plate full with bikes.

ksameer1234

As much as you would like to believe that the co-operation from Bajaj went beyond offering production facilities and suppliers, the bitter truth is, Bajaj has zero technical expertise to offer to a firm like KTM. I have been working in Indian automotive R&D since the past 10 years, and I know very well where our Indian OEMs stand as far as R&D capabilities go. If there is one Indian 2 wheeler OEM that has some R&D capability, it is TVS. Hero, since it's split with Honda, is now trying hard to improve their engineering abilities.

Exhaustec (resonator box in simpler words) and DTSi were technologies which were present decades before Bajaj claimed to have invented them. They just gave them fancy names and conveniently patented them in the small motorcycle class. And the perimeter frame and perfect 50:50 balance came after Bajaj acquired stake in KTM, not before. Bajaj can squeeze in 5 spark plugs and 8 valves into a 200cc engine, but the end result is output that the customer gets. What is the advantage the extra spark plugs of the Bajaj triple spark plugs over the regular KTM Duke engines?

Trust me, I am no TVS or Hero fan-boy and have owned a P180 classic and a P220F. But Bajaj's strategies - to me - are flawed. Rajiv Bajaj's press releases of exiting and re-entering statements show more of a sour grapes phenomenon - if you can't beat the competition (example, Hero in 100cc volumes or Honda in scooters), simply exit the segment and after 6 months, quietly launch five 100cc motorcycles and call them 'sports commuters' and claim to have created a new segment. They are not kidding anybody! And the sales graphs show that very well. With the kind of economy pricing they can afford (Bajaj does not have the brand image of a premium bike maker like HD), their low volumes are not going to turn into 'high profitability'.

And Bajaj having their R&D plate full with basically 2 Pulsars (200 and 400, with their faired and unfaired version) with engines readily borrowed from KTM? Really?

Coming back to the topic of Chetak, the day Mr. Bajaj gets to acquire a scooter making firm with good R&D capability, he will conveniently come back to the scooter segment also. Not that there is anything wrong with it. Just that his statements are becoming a bit boring to read these days.