[swiftnfurious]

Wonderful list. And I completely agree on the amazing "value" these bikes bring in the used market.

The good things about enthusiast bike is that they mostly are well taken care of. And I myself is a beneficiary. But then beware, generally Honda owners in the market are a snobbish lot.

I got my CBR 250 for about 80K while a brand new one goes for about 2.5L. The bike was really good and well maintained so I have been having just the regular checks and replacements.

My thread : https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motor...000-km-up.html

However, for the Honda, the problem is with not having good mechanics even in the A$$ and some parts shortage. A good FNG is much required (Highlander in Bangalore and Motodynamics in Chennai are two good options I have utilized).

Am so looking forward to a touring bike in the preowned market, but I guess I may have to spend few years before I grab a good deal on a Vstrom or KTM Adv 390.

PS: The Yamaha R3 came with ABS & Michelin tyres standard from 2018 onwards.

[petrolhead_neel]

Great idea for a thread, but it's surprising to see some of the bikes (like the Hornet) on this list. Again, the definition of 'enthusiast bikes' is very subjective, especially when it comes to bikes. But here's what I think.

Royal Enfield 350s: Why?

I don't get why the Classic 350/Thunderbird 350 should be on a list of "enthusiast" bikes. They're one of the most boring, uninvolving bikes that I've ridden. If anything, I should be biased. My father has a 6+ year-old Classic 350 and I have ridden it a lot.

There are pre-650 era Royal Enfields that I'd include, of course!

Continental GT 535

Source: This wonderful thread!
RE's first attempt at seriously creating something for the enthusiast, albeit a failure in a lot of areas. Feels special to ride, very old school, lots of character. The launch of the 650 GT (which I absolutely LOVED when I rode one a few days back) makes second hand purchases very accessible. Ownership will probably have hassles, though. Got the dynamics and style, and the engine feels stupidly fun being the largest UCE single that RE has made. Great platform for custom builds as well.

Himalayan

Photo: From the time that we were lucky enough to rent and ride a brand new BS4 Sleet in Goa last year

Great bike for what it is. BS3 (carb) had tons of issues, but a lot of that was solved through warranty. As a result, they go for really, really cheap and make for great off-road fun with a few mods. The sweet spot is of course the BS4 Fi with ABS, with all major problems solved. The BS6 updates make it even sweeter, but a used BS4 is very VFM. The Himalayan is a great bike for anyone that's looking to tour this country and/or ride off road. (There's fun to be had off road, trust me)

Two Strokes:: Yamaha RX100/Bajaj KB100 RTZ/Suzuki Samurai/ RX-Z etc

Brilliant project bikes that make for fun urban runabouts. It's still a dream to own and ride a two stroke someday. Lots of options, from abused till un-rideable to restored to factory glory. Personally, my greatest issue with them would be how much they pollute.

(from the forum)

Of course, the unicorn in this list would be the legendary Suzuki Shogun.

Honda CB Twister

My beloved!



If you think I'm biased because this is my bike, just ride one. I have ridden almost all modern commuter bikes in the 100-125cc category and this one is special. The Twister ditches all commuter traits and feels like something that was designed to have fun with. It's no wonder that Honda didn't sell a lot of them. Brilliant starter bike: super fun and super reliable! Big con (especially for beginners) is the bad brakes. 2010-11 issues of Overdrive/ZigWheels/BSMotoring will tell you how this bike was supposed to change the commuter bike scenario.

Maybe I should write a whole thread...so many stories about a bike that deserves to be talked about!



Yamaha FZ1


Source: Team-BHP thread (My Yamaha FZ1: Homecoming of a 12-year old following, 0.2642 gallons of fun)

A legend, known all over the world! The thread linked above is a very interesting and detailed read.

Hero Impulse

Source: deelipmenezes.com, check out his build!

Probably my favourite!

Before the XPulse came into being (which is quite recent anyways), it was the Impulse which ruled. From MX racing to dual sport touring and trail riding, this one did (and still does) it all. Has some quirks, but has the heart of a lion (no, not talking about the engine). Robust cradle frame makes it a brilliant project bike. ZMA/ZMR swaps are very well documented all over the internet. Having had the pleasure of riding one extensively, as an XPulse owner, I'd still like to have one someday.

However, some examples are overpriced and for someone who's looking at something that's ready for doing trails, a used BS4 XPulse (or a new one) makes a lot more sense. The Impulse is worth getting for 20-30k though.

There are a lot of niche bikes like the legendary RD350, which I'm not including in this post because I simply don't know enough about owning and maintaining one. Maybe the 2 stroke experts can shed some light. Also, there's bikes like the Yamaha R6. Legally imported examples keep popping up from time to time.

All bikes are fun, I think. I loved it when I thrashed around my friend's old Platina on a sand trail a few days back. If we are having a separate thread for enthusiast bikes, might as well talk about the special ones. Also, the real pick here is the 1st gen 390! Man, they go for cheap!

Cheers,
Neel

[greenhorn]

Just curious - what is everybody's stance on older premium commuters - CBZ, and especially the Classic pulsar (esp 180) - I am seeing them beginning to have resales values rise to collector prices

[jetsetgo08]

Neat compilation Karthik.

Suggestion to include, 1-2 year old RTR200's with the slipper clutch are available under a lakh. This may make it a bargain buy over the newer gen. of Hornet/X-blade and FZ's.

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by clementw

Nice list!
Just curious that none of the TVS bikes made the list? Not good used buys?

Originally Posted by evilmessiah

Anyways, as AP said, wonder why TVS bikes were left out of the equation. Even I would have been interested in an RTR 180 for dailying if I were in the market for buying a used bike.

Leaving out the Apache was an unintentional mistake, might have overlooked it because I was attending to a long list of bikes. I mentioned to AP as well, I'll dig out the data on that and have the thread updated with an entry on the RTRs. Thanks for your suggestions! This was indeed a good find and a nice addition pending.

Originally Posted by petrolhead_neel

Great idea for a thread, but it's surprising to see some of the bikes (like the Hornet) on this list. Again, the definition of 'enthusiast bikes' is very subjective, especially when it comes to bikes. But here's what I think.

Royal Enfield 350s: Why?

I don't get why the Classic 350/Thunderbird 350 should be on a list of "enthusiast" bikes.
They're one of the most boring, uninvolving bikes that I've ridden. If anything, I should be biased. My father has a 6+ year-old Classic 350 and I have ridden it a lot.

They were not under enthusiast bikes, they were classified under commuters

Why classic 350? Good question. It simply sells a lot due to the image. I'm not a classic 350 fan myself, but there are a lot of folks who use the 350s for urban duties (they are quite comfortable and torquey for city use), and because there were so many flooded in the market I just included it to complete the retro angle of commuters.

Continental GT 535
Attachment 2065254
Source: This wonderful thread!

No doubt, Neil's bike thread is in a class of its own! But how many of this bike can someone find on sale in the used market?

Himalayan
The sweet spot is of course the BS4 Fi with ABS, with all major problems solved. The BS6 updates make it even sweeter, but a used BS4 is very VFM. The Himalayan is a great bike for anyone that's looking to tour this country and/or ride off road. (There's fun to be had off road, trust me)

I love the Himalayan myself and it is a very capable bike. Especially in the BS6 guise all the initial niggles have been sorted out. I excluded it from the thread because most used bikes (2016-19) in the market will be from the initial era. Like you said, the BS4 guise finds a good balance but one still finds niggles cropping up every now and then even on the BS4 bikes. I shouldn't be recommending known nigglesome bikes and therefore the himalayan was left out , once the BS6 bikes prove their reliability maybe we could add them into the recommendable list, just my view.

Two Strokes:: Yamaha RX100/Bajaj KB100 RTZ/Suzuki Samurai/ RX-Z etc

Brilliant project bikes that make for fun urban runabouts. It's still a dream to own and ride a two stroke someday. Lots of options, from abused till un-rideable to restored to factory glory. Personally, my greatest issue with them would be how much they pollute.

This should be a whole new category called Antiques or Classics or Restoration project section. For that matter even the legendary RD 350 should make it here

Honda CB Twister
My beloved!
...

Maybe I should write a whole thread...so many stories about a bike that deserves to be talked about!
...

Yamaha FZ1
...

Hero Impulse
Source: deelipmenezes.com, check out his build!

Probably my favourite!

However, some examples are overpriced and for someone who's looking at something that's ready for doing trails, a used BS4 XPulse (or a new one) makes a lot more sense. The Impulse is worth getting for 20-30k though.

Thanks for bringing out some more valuable options, made for a very interesting read!

[ebonho]

Why no Duke 200?

It's the undisputed King of the urban jungle. And cheap as chips. 60-75k.

It's more capable than 90% of Indian riders can approach the limits of.

Built tough. Cheap spares and service.

It's a completely different category to its elder stablemates that are twice its capacity.

It's the RX100 /Shogun of the new millennials.

Cheers, Doc

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Why no Duke 200?

It is right at the top of the enthusiast segment list

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by KarthikK

It is right at the top of the enthusiast segment list

Sorry bro. My bad. I saw just the two 390 twins and was scratching my head in disbelief! Lol

Cheers, Doc

[evil_grin]

Thank you KarthikK. This is an exhaustive and in-depth summary of used bikes. It's a great cheat sheet for anyone looking to buy a bike.

[Meer]

Great compilation Karthik, very meticulously done, thank you!

I can vouch for your selection based on my personal experience as well. Having sold my Yamaha RX135, Pulsars 200 and 220 and Honda CBR 250R, each of these went quite easily in the used market without much trouble, the RX135 and CBR250R do stand out.

I agree with you that there should be separate category for nostalgic bikes as their resale works in a different way - I sold my RX135 to a close friend for 17K who then sold to another friend for 18K after a year of use. However, I got genuine offers for the bike for 35k-45k later as well when people spotted the bike in my facebook photos. And RX135 is no way near bikes like RX100 or RD350 in terms of fan following!

I sold my 8 year old CBR250R for 60K to a close relative and he then sold it for 75K after a years use, talk about appreciation in used bike segment!

[AlQuazi]

The Himalayan and the Mojo are two valuable prepositions missing in this otherwise comprehensive list.

I'm not quite sure of the resale prices the Himalayan fetches. However, as far as bang for buck from a used bike goes, the Mojo is a very good value preposition. Having taken that route myself, I can wholeheartedly recommend it to other enthusiasts.

Let me explain - The bike didn't sell well to begin with. So it sells for dirt cheap in the pre-owned market. Barring Bangalore and Kerala, the bike is very hard to spot and nobody recognises it even after 5 years of launch and continuous sales. What this means is that the resale value is terrible, especially for the first owner.

The XT variants are an especially enticing buy. In MH, a 2-3 year old XT will set you back betweeen 80k - 1.2 L depending on the condition. For that price you get a proven, reliable and smooth engine, comfy suspension and that lovely dual silencer exhaust note. For someone looking to buy start touring on motorcycles, this is an unbelievable bargain!

The newer iterations (UT300, ABS version) aren't the most VFM since they lose out on the extra silencer and USD while still commanding a similar asking price.

Moreover, a new BSVI Mojo would cost you around 2.2L on road and still not give you the complete experience. While the loss of one silencer and USDs have only improved the vehicle's dynamics, they've reduced the value preposition and showboating potential of the bike vis-a-vis its earliest iterations.

The only caveat are the limited service centers. However most metros do have atleast one POC for the Mojo.

[KPR]

I was close enough buying one pre worshipped bike like many others in this forum : CBR250R. But my family members are against two wheelers for touring as they find them totally unsafe. So dropped those plans and took a TB500 (with better pillion comfort) for occasional local commutes at less than 30-40km a day.

[neil.jericho]

What a fantastic compilation, KarthikK! Truly this is another PhD worthy effort from you and this is a thread that will be of immense help to all our forum members as well as other readers. You are also pretty much spot on with the market prices, at least in South India, so that is a fantastic frame of reference for enthusiasts who are just entering this space.

There is just so much value in pre worshipped bikes these days, that it hard not to consider them at all, even if you are a new bike sort of person. My broad recommendation list at different price points would be
- Rs 75K : Honda CBR250R
- Rs 1 L : First gen Duke 390
- Rs 2 - 2.5 L : Interceptor 650
- Rs 3 L : Tough to say really, nothing really stands out to me
- Rs 4 L : Current gen BS4 Z650 / Ninja 650 / Vulcan 650
- Rs 5 L : Triumph Street Triple 675 or Honda CBR 650F
- Rs 6L - 7 L: Triumph Speed Triple 1050

For riders who are experienced with bigger capacity bikes, I will strongly suggest that they look at low run Triumph Speed Triple 1050 options which is at least a couple of lakhs lower than it's Kawasaki competitor, the Z1000.

Beyond say Rs 7 - 8 L, its very subjective. I must mention that Kawasaki's Z800 and Z900 seem to demand a much higher price than its competition, so there is less value in them at the rates that sellers are looking for.

I will restrict most of my points below to the buying experience of the bigger capacity segment of bikes since I am not very well versed with the lower capacity bikes these days. We probably need a separate thread on how to buy a used bike safely, maybe this can be your next thread after your upcoming Adv 390 (did I guess it right?) ownership thread?

Originally Posted by KarthikK

[i]There are multiple threads on the forum explaining about the value proposition preowned vehicles bring to the table. Bikes are not very different from cars in this regard. In fact there are some added benefits with preowned bikes especially in the enthusiast segment(s):

• Most enthusiast bikes are babied, pampered with accessories, serviced on time, well cared for and hardly run much due to strict weekend use. You basically get an almost new bike.

As some of you will know, I purchased a Triumph Street Triple 675 around July 2018. The bike had done just 16,000 odd kms on it at the time and it was with it's second owner. The bike's complete service records were available and the bike was parked at a fellow TBHPian's house. The gentleman who owned it had pampered the bike with almost every required accessory including a quickshifter, Ohlins adjustable rear suspension (I still thank him quietly in my prayers for this ) and I only had to purchase the radiator guard (around Rs 10,000), fill petrol and ride the bike back to Cochin. In fact, the purchase process was so smooth that I actually didnt get a chance to meet the gentleman who was the owner, until much later, when he was visiting Cochin in the process of buying his next motorcycle. We still keep in touch on a regular basis.

But I must warn potential buyers, this is not going to be case for 8 out of 10 instances. This might sound obvious, but as you go up the price bracket, the chances of finding a well maintained and properly serviced bike is a lot higher in metros and big cities than in smaller towns. Take your time and search patiently till you find a bike that has been taken care of just the way that you would have taken care of it.

Originally Posted by KarthikK

Not really. Most bikes today just require routine maintenance and run without too much of intervention or frequent visits to the service centre. Barring consumables such as brake pads and tyres, unless you get a very old bike or a lemon or meet with an accident, servicing a few years old bike remains more or less similar to you buying a brand new one and going through the ownership journey. Obviously the older it gets, the more maintenance you will need. When purchasing a preowned bike, newer the vehicle the better, preferably still under warranty.

If someone is stepping into stepping into the preowned route for the first time with bikes above 650cc, I will say try and get as new a bike as possible.

Originally Posted by KarthikK

Interested in a preowned bike but unsure on where to seek out these bikes?

I will always suggest the friends of friends route when looking for a preowned bike. The motorcycling community is a well knit one and unless one is searching for something that is very rare, getting the bike that you want from a friend of a friend will not be a challenge. It might take time but a known devil is better than an unknown devil.

Originally Posted by surjaonwheelz

Excellent effort Karthik.

Honda Unicorn is one bullet proof bike in the commuter segment and has been around for ages!

For the big bikes,
- Kawasaki gives an excellent starting point with the 650s.
- ABS models should be preferred

Yes! ABS is a must as one goes up the ladder towards higher capacity motorcycles. I will always suggest the ABS versions of even the 300 cc bikes in the market over the non ABS ones.

Originally Posted by saisailendra

Thank you so much for the information provided.

I weirdly developed an interest in bikes since the last 1 ~ 1.5 years. I have my heart set on the Daytona 675. I will surely get her in the coming years. There seems to be no information on the internet, more like a proper guide as how to go hunting for a premium used bike, specifically in India. Your thread shall surely provide the basic info and tips to many others like me.

I will keep following this thread for all the useful information.

I have some pointers that I have accumulated over time when hunting for preowned bikes. Let me try to pen them down in a logical manner. Maybe Dr KarthikK's how to buy a pre-worshipped bike thread will be the right place to post it.

Originally Posted by evilmessiah

Buying a pre-worshipped bike can save big bucks. The caveat is 'pre-worshipped'. Getting a good one is the key.

Absolutely agree. Very often when a 'dream bike' is in front of you and the price is tempting, one tends to overlook the obvious flaws and issues and go with the heart. There is a huge difference between pre owned and pre worshipped. The trick is to find pre worshipped.

Originally Posted by petrolhead_neel

Continental GT 535
Attachment 2065254
Source: This wonderful thread!
RE's first attempt at seriously creating something for the enthusiast, albeit a failure in a lot of areas. Feels special to ride, very old school, lots of character. The launch of the 650 GT (which I absolutely LOVED when I rode one a few days back) makes second hand purchases very accessible. Ownership will probably have hassles, though. Got the dynamics and style, and the engine feels stupidly fun being the largest UCE single that RE has made. Great platform for custom builds as well.

Thanks a lot for your appreciation! You asked the question before I got a chance to do so.

I think the Continental GT 535 is a good value for the current prices in the market, which is around Rs 1 lakh. You get a sporty (well, for a Royal Enfield, at least) and fun motorcycle with good dynamics as well. Spares are not as easily available now as they used to be but if you have a good parts distributor in your town, they can source it from Royal Enfield without any issues.

Originally Posted by greenhorn

Just curious - what is everybody's stance on older premium commuters - CBZ, and especially the Classic pulsar (esp 180) - I am seeing them beginning to have resales values rise to collector prices

Buying these bikes is easy, the challenge is with maintaining them and get a steady stream of parts when required. I personally would avoid.

[greenhorn]

I don't think the First gen Duke/RC390 are that great bargains. I have three friends who have first gen KTM 390's, and they all became too much troublesome to maintain (including one guy who was a partner in a bike workshop), they all sold them off and replaced them with current gen 390 versions. All of them had gremlins in the electricals/electronics and became too unreliable

[mohansrides]

Nice list. You have covered all the usual suspects. However, I do think that you should have a super premium segment of over 14 lacs. In that segment, two bikes that you should absolutely include are the Monster and the R1200/1250GS.

Actually it’s a shame that we don’t get the big Monster 1200 in India. That bike is an absolute hoot with its huge V-Twin that sounds sweet and pulls like a truck. In any case, at the very least, the 821 should make your list. Monsters are super fun; and at under 8 or 9 lacs, they are a great value in the used market.

Talking about the big GS; it is a veritable legend; the granddaddy of all Adv bikes. At some 30 lacs on road, it is a super expensive bike. That’s where the seconds market makes sense. I have seen 2 year old GSAs go for around 17 lacs. Now that is a great value if ever there was one. Anyone who gets on a GS simply cannot believe the experience. Bike looks massive. Handles like an RX100. No jokes. Of course, our more dirt focussed brothers should stay the hell away from big Advs. However, for most of us who want solid touring chops from a bike along with the ability to tackle bad surfaces well (but not with as much aplomb as a full-on dirt bike), the Tigers, the V-Stroms and the GSes make perfect sense. And in that list, there is nothing close to the big GS in terms of capability alone. Maintenance costs though are another conversation. But if one gets to save 12 lacs off of the purchase price straightaway, then it is easier to reconcile with the high maintenance costs in keeping the bike. The important thing is to find the right piece though.

Cheers