[procrj]

Slightly OT but I thought the Ham enthusiasts here might have more knowledge about this, hence posting here.

Use case: Over the last 2 years, a few friends + families have started travelling together. We do like to travel to remote, off the beaten track areas which have limited or no mobile network connectivity. In the recent past, we have had the need to communicate with others but haven't been able to in these no network areas.

The need: We are looking to buy a set of 3/4 2 way radios which have a 2-3 kms range and can be legally used in India.

Questions:
1. Can someone point me to policy around license free usage of these radios in the VHF range?
2. Amazon has a selection of radios which use the VHF range, which claim to have 8km usable range whats the real world range I can expect from something like baofeng 888s
3. Any recomendations given the above use case and need?

[Jaguar]

Originally Posted by procrj

The need: We are looking to buy a set of 3/4 2 way radios which have a 2-3 kms range and can be legally used in India.

Questions:
1. Can someone point me to policy around license free usage of these radios in the VHF range?
2. Amazon has a selection of radios which use the VHF range, which claim to have 8km usable range whats the real world range I can expect from something like baofeng 888s
3. Any recomendations given the above use case and need?

If you don't want to go through the hassle of getting licenses, get CB Radios. They are not very popular and not cheap like the walkie-talkies available on Amazon, but are the only legal option.

446 Mhz (UHF) up to .2W power is license-free, but you won't easily get radios for this.

The baofengs available on Amazon are not legal and you may use them at your own risk. The real-world range on a highway will be around 1km, line-of-sight.

[bejoy]

Originally Posted by procrj

Questions:
1. Can someone point me to policy around license free usage of these radios in the VHF range?
2. Amazon has a selection of radios which use the VHF range, which claim to have 8km usable range whats the real world range I can expect from something like baofeng 888s
3. Any recomendations given the above use case and need?

The current license free spectrum for two way radios are only in UHF range. And the power is capped at 0.5W, with no external antennas. Don't undermine this, these signals go easily 2-3 kms. And since it is UHF, it penetrates buildings and vegetation. Works out of basements to many floors above, tunnels, trains, ships etc. VHF don't fare well in these scenarios. As @Jaguar mentioned, the Baofengs that are available off Amazon are not fully compliant, as in they don't carry an Type approval Certificate, though they are programmed for frequencies and power to comply with the WPC specs.

Checkout this radio from sancharcomm.in. http://www.sancharcomm.in/Product/li...nchar/g3u/3463 Technically this is similar to Baofeng, but I think these folks give out a Type Certificate copy along with the radio. I have not personally bought any, but I saw in some YT reviews mentioning about the same. It may be worth to contact the seller for details.

Note: License free radios have fixed channels and cannot be programmed by the user. So any radios with keypad and LCD screen don't fall in to this category.

[TKMCE]

Have been following this thread for some quite time and I have some questions.

I am just a few years away from the typical retirement age for a Sarkar Babu (although I don't have the luxury of being one). And it is 20 odd years since I last wrote an examination. But I do have time on my hands and looks like old times of "work, work and work" is not going to come back. So I am seriously thinking of trying to study for the license now that equipment prices are also coming down at least for the basic ones.

But before i jump into it , I have a few questions and grateful if someone here can throw some pointers

1 As mentioned I have not prepared for any sort of examination in last 20 years. And my last study of anything related to electronics was 30 + years back and to be frank I hated the stuff. So in short, I am zero in Electronics which I understand is Part I Section A of the exam- Radio Theory and Practice (please correct if not so). So will Section I Part A be a stumbling block for someone of my profile and especially my age ?

2 Section I Part B - Radio Regulations (I assume), I don't expect too much problems for someone like me because in my area of work , I do have to be familiar with going through various regulations and I also have an interest in aviation communications. But is there any good study material for Part B of the exam as well as Part A ?


3 Morse Code- If I decide to go for the exam, I might as well as attempt for the General License . Are there any practice websites where I can learn Morse?


4 I am Kochi based and likely to be in the state for some time. I believe WPC Trivandrum conducts the exam in Kerala. How frequently do they do so THESE DAYS? I do not want to start preparing and then wait an year or so for the actual exam. I understand there is no fixed schedule and it is each WPC's convenience.

5 Have the actual exam shifted to online mode ? I saw in an earlier post here the applications are now online but how about the exams itself ? Is it online mode or Pen and Pencil Type ?

6 And regarding actual exams.... are these (Part I - A and B) Multiple Choice or Short Answer types or do you have to write descriptive answers with drawing circuit diagrams etc. for Part 1 Section A ?

Apologies for the innumerable questions. I first came across a HAM when I was a college student. He is no more now (VU2-BUD) and he sparked off an interest which has refused to die down. So I am now seriously thinking of finally going for it now that it looks like I have some time on my hands.

[bejoy]

Originally Posted by TKMCE

Have been following this thread for some quite time and I have some questions.

I am just a few years away from the typical retirement age for a Sarkar Babu (although I don't have the luxury of being one). And it is 20 odd years since I last wrote an examination. But I do have time on my hands and looks like old times of "work, work and work" is not going to come back. So I am seriously thinking of trying to study for the license now that equipment prices are also coming down at least for the basic ones.

But before i jump into it , I have a few questions and grateful if someone here can throw some pointers

Its never late I know many elders who have taken up the exam and got their license. For a very technical person like you, it will be much easier, trust me.

1 As mentioned I have not prepared for any sort of examination in last 20 years. And my last study of anything related to electronics was 30 + years back and to be frank I hated the stuff. So in short, I am zero in Electronics which I understand is Part I Section A of the exam- Radio Theory and Practice (please correct if not so). So will Section I Part A be a stumbling block for someone of my profile and especially my age ?

It should not be that hard. The theory part is definitely elaborate and takes time to learn. Good thing is there that are question banks available with clubs and once you solve the past question papers you will become more confident in taking the exam.

2 Section I Part B - Radio Regulations (I assume), I don't expect too much problems for someone like me because in my area of work , I do have to be familiar with going through various regulations and I also have an interest in aviation communications. But is there any good study material for Part B of the exam as well as Part A ?

This is definitely your interest area. Part B are mostly from ITU regulations and there is lot of materials available online, but again, once you see the past question papers, you get the idea of what to expect.

3 Morse Code- If I decide to go for the exam, I might as well as attempt for the General License . Are there any practice websites where I can learn Morse?

It is a good idea to appear for General License also along with Restricted. Make sure to apply for both and pay separate fees.

For the exam point of view, Morse code receive/send speeds are very reasonable, and can be learnt with regular practice. There are web based and Apps available to aid the learning. Noted ones are www.lcwo.net, G4FON Koch Method software for PC and similar ones for Android/IOS. However most of the online tools are for practical morse speeds which are 20-30 WPM and there is a considerable difference in the learning methods compared to the exam oriented speed(8 WPM). In slower speeds the mind tends to map the individual dots/dashes to the letters but in higher speeds, its mind copying, i.e. you copy the entire word at a time. I suggest using a Koch method software in PC or Android and set the speed to 10WPM. After learning to receive 100% of all the letters/numbers/figures learn the sending part. So, start learning morse straight away, while waiting for the theory learnings and exams.

4 I am Kochi based and likely to be in the state for some time. I believe WPC Trivandrum conducts the exam in Kerala. How frequently do they do so THESE DAYS? I do not want to start preparing and then wait an year or so for the actual exam. I understand there is no fixed schedule and it is each WPC's convenience.

The Trivandrum WPC conducts the exam very rarely, if I am not wrong, no exams were conducted for the past one year, though there were many applicants. On a positive note, that means an exam may be around the corner. Another option is to appear at Bangalore/Mangalore and it is easier to get along with a club at these locations. I will PM you the contacts for clubs in Kochi and Bangalore.

5 Have the actual exam shifted to online mode ? I saw in an earlier post here the applications are now online but how about the exams itself ? Is it online mode or Pen and Pencil Type ?

Exam is still pen and paper, in an exam hall.

6 And regarding actual exams.... are these (Part I - A and B) Multiple Choice or Short Answer types or do you have to write descriptive answers with drawing circuit diagrams etc. for Part 1 Section A ?

Everything is objective - multiple choice questions.

Apologies for the innumerable questions. I first came across a HAM when I was a college student. He is no more now (VU2-BUD) and he sparked off an interest which has refused to die down. So I am now seriously thinking of finally going for it now that it looks like I have some time on my hands.

Welcome to the hobby! You are a long time SWL (Shortwave listener), an acronym identifying someone interested the hobby and waiting for the license. Yes, the tech was more appealing in the olden days and nowadays, it is very difficult to get youngsters attracted to the hobby.

[TKMCE]

Thanks a lot Bejoy.

Very very helpful pointers.

Deciding to have a go at it come what may.

[Jaguar]

Originally Posted by Jaguar

If you don't want to go through the hassle of getting licenses, get CB Radios. They are not very popular and not cheap like the walkie-talkies available on Amazon, but are the only legal option.

446 Mhz (UHF) up to .2W power is license-free, but you won't easily get radios for this.

Finally came across some license-free walkie-talkies from a brand called Brutforce. As per the spec the radios operate in 446-446.2 Mhz frequency range and therefore are legal to use in India. Here is the amazon link to the product https://www.amazon.in/Brutforce-Lice.../dp/B08531NHZ9

[arun_sharon]

recently purchased few radios (6 pairs) for group drives. These are from a company called alinco and cost sub 5K per pair . they are small radios and work for aprox 500 mts when on highways. At home it is being used by kids for chitchat among the same residential community. These are pmr 446 walkie talkies and does not need licences.
The drawbacks : Limited range, Non replicable battery, Limited tx power
Pros: Extremely small and potable, easy to carry around, Normal micro usb charger. easy to program & use 1 day battery backup on standby .

[Sushil Pingua]

Hello everyone,

I am absolutely new to this wireless walkie talkie thing and i do not know much about licensing. I've come to know through google search that 446 mhz is license free walkie talkie and i would not be bothered by authorities if I use the 446 mhz walkie-talkie(?).

I have selected the Motorola T82 and the Kenwood PKT-23E, both of which are available on Amazon. Which of the two should I go for?
I intend to use these license free walkie talkie during safari drives in big National Parks/ Tiger Reserves and in remote forest/hill areas during vacation drives. I am aware of it's effective working radius of max 2 kms.

Kindly guide on the pros and cons of using the two walkie talkie sets above.

Thanks and regards.

[bejoy]

Originally Posted by Sushil Pingua

I have selected the Motorola T82 and the Kenwood PKT-23E, both of which are available on Amazon. Which of the two should I go for?
I intend to use these license free walkie talkie during safari drives in big National Parks/ Tiger Reserves and in remote forest/hill areas during vacation drives. I am aware of it's effective working radius of max 2 kms.

Kindly guide on the pros and cons of using the two walkie talkie sets above.

Thanks and regards.

I would choose the Motorola for its replaceable standard AA batteries. Otherwise the features and the range would be similar for both models. Consider the Alinco also posted by Arun and do a cost comparison. All three conform to the WPC requirements and the should come with some documentation for the same.

[Sushil Pingua]

Originally Posted by bejoy

I would choose the Motorola for its replaceable standard AA batteries. Otherwise the features and the range would be similar for both models. Consider the Alinco also posted by Arun and do a cost comparison. All three conform to the WPC requirements and the should come with some documentation for the same.

Thanks for the insight,

I have chosen to go for the Motorola T82 (priced at Rs.13000/pair), had a talk with the seller of amazon and i asked him to provide "Equipment Type Approval (ETA) certificate" which he has agreed to provide me with. Working range (1/2 Km) of Alinco and small-battery backup is good till everything is going fine, once the adventure partner (driving or trekking) begins to veer off the chosen path, then a bit of extended range comes into helpful play to contact and realign with the lost partner. Motorola T82 is expected to give working range of atleast 1 km even in dense forest.

I would like to seek help on how the ETA certificate looks like and what is its format, contents, etc. It is clear that the ETA certificate should comply to the regulations of WPC wing, Department of Telecom.

Regards.

[bejoy]

Originally Posted by Sushil Pingua

I would like to seek help on how the ETA certificate looks like and what is its format, contents, etc. It is clear that the ETA certificate should comply to the regulations of WPC wing, Department of Telecom.

Sending PM. Don't want to post it public and make it easier for counterfeiting

[Sushil Pingua]

Originally Posted by bejoy

Sending PM. Don't want to post it public and make it easier for counterfeiting

Thanks a ton Big Bro Bejoy

I have verified the ETA given by the seller to me and it confirms to the sample you have sent me on PM

Further as per free information available on google search I visited the Official website of Department of Telecom and found two crucial documents, firstly the gazette notification of 2018 which declares 446 MHz UHF Band as licence free in India and secondly a public notice of 2021 issued by the DoT. My understanding of both these documents is that before purchasing any license free walkie talkie in India the purchaser has to make sure that firstly he is purchasing a walkie talkie which has ETA issued in its favour by the DoT and secondly the purchaser should take an assurance in writing from the seller that the walkie talkie confirms to the regulations as laid by the DoT, Govt of India.

In my case the seller of Motorola T82 provided me both the documents of walky talky sold to me i.e., the ETA and assurance in writing. I have placed the order and order is on its way, should reach me by weekend

[Sushil Pingua]

Originally Posted by Sushil Pingua

I have placed the order and order is on its way, should reach me by weekend

Hello BHPians,

Received a pair of Motorola T82 last week along with the seller's statement in writing addressed to me that the radio set motorola t82 is compliant to the rules framed by the DOT. Also received the ETA.

I tested this PMR446 technology of motorola t82 within dense city limits to be of acceptable communicable operation within radius of 1-1.5 kms.

Today morning I tested it's capability by climbing on a hill top (300msl) and was able to communicate with full clarity with the other person standing in the heart of town at a distance of 6 kms (byair distance) from my hilltop. I plan to test another such communication capability of motorola t82 between two hills separated by 20kms (byair distance).

Regards.

[Sushil Pingua]

Originally Posted by Sushil Pingua

I plan to test another such communication capability of motorola t82 between two hills separated by 20kms (byair distance)

Hi BHPians,



Hurray... Radio Voice Transmission over a distance of 20Kms between two hills Successful with absolute voice clarity between my two Motorola T82 PMR446 MHz radio sets.



I was apprehensive about transmission at such a long distance but Motorola has surprised me with its quality, clarity and refined technology.
Truly "paisa-vasool/value for money" radio sets that I've purchased.

I'm using the two M'T82 for the past 9 days and the battery has come down to around 60% (battery meter has three bars and charge remaining today is two bars). It can certainly hold charge continuously for 12-18 hrs after being fully charged. And as Big Bro Bejoy has said earlier, these M'T82 can be used with 3 AA Batteries as well, can be charged with a mobile charger as well as powerbank using micro-usb wires.

It is slim and tough built quality, easy and firm to grasp - just like the Nokia sets with antenna which were launched in 1999 at the advent of mobile communication in India.







Regards and thank you for reading