[GTO]

Someone I know is facing this dilemma and asked me for advice. I was earlier in the education industry, but my expertise was only in USA / UK schools and that too, I left the industry a decade back. Hence, thought of asking this question on the best platform I know for life in India .

Please advise on the pros & cons of ISB vs IIM. Brilliant girl, has 3-years experience at a major FMCG firm, wants to get an MBA not just for career opportunities but also the value of education + skillset. Long term plans not clear. Might continue in corporate world, might get into entrepreneurship. No budget issues.

We have a lot of talented young blood on Team-BHP, so I'm certain your answers will help hundreds of other BHPians too .

Thanks in advance!

[RJK]

Good problem to have!
From my understanding the 4 IIM’s (ABCL) have a solid rep but seems like ISB Hyderabad is consulting companies darling, if that’s a career path, looking ahead.
Alternatively, if budget not a concern, why not get international exposure, INSEAD or the likes?

[Dieseltuned]

This is dilemma faced by many and there is no correct answer. It depends on a few factors ::

1. What course / specialization you are looking at ?
2. What type of course part time / online / Full time ?
3. The person must be clear while spending huge sums of money plus years of your life, If entreprenurship is the end goal than there is a better institute called "Entreprenuership development Institute".

From acquiruing skill sets perspective, both provide almost equal opportunities, however the brand pull of IIM will always be higher + the alumni is more stronger in the IIMs.

Also explore international options like INSEAD, LSE, etc. Ofcourse the budget for these would north of 30 lakhs.

[Hayek]

As someone said, which IIM? I would rate IIM A B and C (or B A and C) as clearly better than ISB in terms of brand value or quality of placements. ISB has an advantage of being a one year course (you save one year of income loss), and is arguably easier to get into - so it is a good alternative if you don’t make the top 3 IIMs. I would probably rate L below ISB - but others could disagree.

[jkrishnakj]

If it’s IIM A or IIM B, I’ll choose either of those ahead of ISB.

Ofcourse, there are other variables around course of interest, aspirations post the BSchool and other personal factors.

Having visited these places for interviews, I can, from my personal experience rate the IIM A and B slightly ahead of ISB. If it’s not the A or B, then, the ISB Hyderabad is where I will go.

[ninjatalli]

Depends on multiple factors and this is a highly subjective question if you ask me.
Still here's a view

1. Which IIM and which ISB
- A, B, C are the pick of the lot. L, K and I are decent options (in that order) but not the same league.
- ISB Hyderabad is the only one I'd pick if I had to make the decision for myself.
- A, B, C, ISB-Hyd, <XLRI>, L, <FMS, SP Jain>, K, I, other ISB options, other (/new) IIM options is the order I'd recommend.

2. Which specialization is she interested?
- The above order goes for a toss depending on her choice.
- For example if HR, then XLRI over anything. TISS would be the next choice.
- If Marketing, I believe A & B are really the best of the lot.
- If Finance, A & C are good (might be wrong on that). And so on.
- Not all colleges are great on providing entrepreneurship options. She should check with different college alumni folks to get the latest/current views

3. Full time vs part time courses
- Any day the full time on-campus courses are the one to go. Part time/correspondence/ 1 year (other than the main 1-year @ISB) courses are not really worth the money keeping in mind the goals you have listed.

4. Play of the volume game
- This is a dated/10 year old view but I remember back in 2009 a close friend of mine in ISB-Hyd had a huge concern with how she'll turn out keeping in mind the hundreds of batchmates she had at ISB. IIMs on the other hand had around 100 - 200 students per year
- All colleges have increased their intakes but still ISB plays in the volume game on a higher scale. Whether she might fall in top 10% or bottom 40%, it makes a difference which college she picks up.

[sv97]

I would say it completely depends on the outcome after 2 years or 1 year (in case of executive MBA and ISB) basically the job you land from the campus and the alumni network. I know someone from ISB who was unplaced from campus same might be the case with IIM's as well.

Talking about companies or rather brands as we call them in MBA colleges are common to these top institutes mostly except for a few which are specific to each campus.

The advantages top IIM's (ABC) have over ISB are:

• Multiple offers are capped(don't know the exact number for each but for IIM C it is a maximum of 2 offers per candidate )
• Slightly better brand value in the Indian context
• Better alumni network due to being established earlier(not sure about this since the batch size of ISB is pretty large so maybe they could have played catch up on this)
• Lower initial investment
• Lesser competition due to smaller batch size

Advantages of ISB over top IIM's

• Better brand value at the global level
• Top professors and professionals from around the globe taking lectures
• Better campus

These are some of the pros of each I am aware of.

Hope this helps in helping her make the right choice.
All the best to her.

[FlashMustang]

I'm assuming the query is for the full-time program at these institutes.

I would group the institutes in this sequence.
IIMs A, B, and C
ISB
IIMs L, I, and K (I've been to one of these, so the following points are based on my observations - others' opinions might vary)
Rest of the newer IIMs

ISB is definitely a costlier option compared to the IIMs.
The one year duration of the program could be a pro as well as a con.

In my humble opinion, ISB's one year program might be more suited to someone with at least five years of experience and is looking to stay in the career path that one was in prior to the management education, and is looking for rapid career advancement in the same career path/field. If one wishes to switch paths, the two year programs at the IIMs offer sufficient time to maximize the work done in the desired field one wishes to switch to over the course of two years (as explained in my penultimate paragraph of this post).

From my experience being at one of these institutes, these institutes create a competitive atmosphere and help develop the skills and the capabilities to manage extreme time pressures, juggle and complete multiple goals simultaneously, push and challenge oneself to the limits to discover newer but expanded limits of performance which we are ourselves unaware that we could achieve. The subject matter itself is a secondary outcome.
The degree to which these limits get pushed and tested varies based on the groupings I have indicated.

Despite the institutes, the difference ultimately comes down to what one makes of the time at the institute that one goes to.

If she has a specific outcome or career path or industry in mind, it would be best for her to associate herself with the specific interest clubs at the institute, take on additional projects, complete additional online courses, and showcase a track record of results in the area that she wishes to pursue post her graduation. For example, if she wishes to pursue a career in marketing, it would be ideal for her to be a part of the marketing club, take up and complete marketing projects, compete and try to be a finalist in one of the many marketing case challenges conducted by companies, complete additional online courses in marketing, and so on. Similarly, if she wishes to pursue a career in finance, do similar activities in finance and complete CFA certifications.

Hope this helps. Cheers and all the best to her.

[tanayr]

I'm from C, my two cents:

First we'll talk about placements (the be-all and end-all for Indian schools)

1. Brand recognition is a subjective topic so we'll leave it at that
2. All IIMs have large batch sizes now post implementation of quotas, but not as large as the ~800 ish that ISB Hyd + Mohali combined have (remember, placements of both campuses are done as ONE batch)
3. Recruiters come to IIMs, select the top 50-60% of the batch and leave, they prefer to go to to other campuses than to hire the bottom half of the batch at higher ranked ones (for obvious reasons)
4. Freshers are king at IIMs, anyone with IT workex is worst-off. Since the candidate is not in either of the above two categories, we're going to assume that placements will be similar

Next, we'll talk about ROI

1. ~25 lakhs for ABC over two years vs ~32 lakhs for ISB over 1 year (check actual costs, I have outdated info)
2. Opportunity cost of one year saved at ISB, one starts earning earlier
3. As we already assumed similar placements, I'd say this one is a tie as well

Lastly, we'll talk about academics and entrepreneurship

1. ISB has a much more modern curriculum and better faculty
2. IIMs have the same stone age curriculum and laser-like focus on memorization and rote learning
3. I'd say ISB has a better environment for entrepreneurship, the IIMs are more like finishing schools for IIT and other college toppers meant to polish them for a corporate job

Net-net: If the candidate wants a regular corporate job, go anywhere. If the focus is more towards entrepreneurship, go to ISB (easier to get in, too)

Just keep in mind that after 3-4 years the b-school brand does not carry much weight, the work experience matters more.

[BackInTheFold]

Originally Posted by RJK

Good problem to have!
From my understanding the 4 IIM’s (ABCL) have a solid rep but seems like ISB Hyderabad is consulting companies darling, if that’s a career path, looking ahead.
Alternatively, if budget not a concern, why not get international exposure, INSEAD or the likes?

I think that one should be really keen on working internationally in order to get the most value out of an INSEAD MBA. Same goes for other business schools abroad.

Another near-term aspect to consider for international MBA's is that travel restrictions and lockdowns might disrupt in-person classes this year. Given that interacting with classmates and peers is a big part of business education, virtual sessions might leave you feeling short changed.

Also, my understanding is that the candidate is evaluating options she already has in hand. I'm not sure if it would be feasible for her to start another application process now.

Disclaimer: I'm not discouraging applications to international schools. Far from it - I'm an INSEAD alum who loved the experience and would highly recommend it for the right reasons.

[2000rpm]

I would only choose IIM A over ISB, and choose ISB over every other IIM! Because, the additional one year is opportunity cost of about 25 lakhs (average salary at these colleges nowadays).

I choose IIM A because the focus it has on entrepreneurship, which none of the IIMs have!

[BackInTheFold]

Originally Posted by tanayr

I'm from C, my two cents:

First we'll talk about placements (the be-all and end-all for Indian schools)

1. Brand recognition is a subjective topic so we'll leave it at that
2. All IIMs have large batch sizes now post implementation of quotas, but not as large as the ~800 ish that ISB Hyd + Mohali combined have (remember, placements of both campuses are done as ONE batch)
3. Recruiters come to IIMs, select the top 50-60% of the batch and leave, they prefer to go to to other campuses than to hire the bottom half of the batch at higher ranked ones (for obvious reasons)
4. Freshers are king at IIMs, anyone with IT workex is worst-off. Since the candidate is not in either of the above two categories, we're going to assume that placements will be similar

Next, we'll talk about ROI

1. ~25 lakhs for ABC over two years vs ~32 lakhs for ISB over 1 year (check actual costs, I have outdated info)
2. Opportunity cost of one year saved at ISB, one starts earning earlier
3. As we already assumed similar placements, I'd say this one is a tie as well

Lastly, we'll talk about academics and entrepreneurship

1. ISB has a much more modern curriculum and better faculty
2. IIMs have the same stone age curriculum and laser-like focus on memorization and rote learning
3. I'd say ISB has a better environment for entrepreneurship, the IIMs are more like finishing schools for IIT and other college toppers meant to polish them for a corporate job

Net-net: If the candidate wants a regular corporate job, go anywhere. If the focus is more towards entrepreneurship, go to ISB (easier to get in, too)

Just keep in mind that after 3-4 years the b-school brand does not carry much weight, the work experience matters more.

I think you have summarised this very well. As a start-up founder, I love recruiting from ISB - there's definitely a flair for entrepreneurship among the alumni.

I'd differ from you on the last point about the school not mattering 3-4 years out though. A big part of your ROI from going to business school is your network, be it your classmates or alumni. While brand might not matter in the first order, the students that it attracts does - both for your learning while at school and in your career beyond it.

[androdev]

I have no experience with MBA side of things so feel free to ignore my ramblings. MBA is all about pedigree and network. Pay whatever you can afford to get into a better school. By being academically brilliant in a lower ranked school, you may land a better job out of campus but in the very long run, you will kick yourself for settling for a lesser school. If you are bright and capable of getting an admission, don't hesitate to ask your parents to sell the house.

Unlike technical education, I feel Indian MBA is not that transferable across geographies (hence the emphasis on brand and network). If I have even a remote possibility of working/living abroad, I will not opt for Indian B-schools. Just looking at the prospects of where India is heading economically/politically and overall dilution of "Indian higher education brand", I would consider hedging if you know what I mean.

Just between ISB and IIM, my sense is that ISB offers a short term boost and IIM is likely to offer much better long term prospects (and student life is more fun). I could be wrong though.

[dark.knight]

IIM A
IIM B
IIM C
FMS
JBIMS
ISB
XLRI
IIM L
IIM I
IIM K
SP Jain
NMIMS
SIBM P
MDI
Great Lakes

Source : Cleared CAT once, attempted twice, been a junior HR recruiter, worked with the biggies, both corporates and BSchools, peer opinions and alumni of one of the top schools as above.

ISB is not an official degree though, the rest are. I'd say if ISB is the aim, just shoot further to INSEAD, NUS etc or to the big leagues in America after more experience.

[BackInTheFold]

Originally Posted by dark.knight

I'd say if ISB is the aim, just shoot further to INSEAD, NUS etc or to the big leagues in America after more experience.

I didn't know about the formal degree nuance earlier. I've also been always confused by the nomenclature of the degrees that IIM's issue.

In any case, I don't think people attach value to the formal degree when they go to these schools. As long as you attend the flagship program (the MBA equivalent), you're good.

I'd like to chip in on your comments on the business schools abroad:

• With all due respect to NUS, I would rate IIM/ISB higher.
• It's a fallacy that one needs more experience to apply to the top global business schools. Its the quality of one's application - education, work experience, how well rounded you are, how you stand out from a similar pool etc. that determines success. You're actually better off applying when you are younger to schools like Stanford GSB and HBS. While the average ages at Wharton and INSEAD are slightly higher, younger achievers constitute a fair share.

These opinions are derived from my experience from applying to the schools above, securing admissions in 3, studying at INSEAD and now being part of the admissions interview panel there.