[deepaktpatil]

Originally Posted by ramki067

Hi guys,

Wanted to know my salary package is good or not!!!
5.8 years of exp. in a product company and not changed the company since 4.7 years. Having a package of 8.xx L/A. Is this OK?

If its a product company you should get atleast 1.7X of your total experience. These figures vary based on the brand of the company, domain and programming area. I feel that there is good ground for you to get a higher salary and I think this is quiet possible at your experience level as of now. Test the waters to see if you get some solid role outside (salary will follow and shouldnt be the only criteria for change).

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by rohanjf

Can we take it the other way round too? That is, can we term those to earn less despite being capable of earning more elsewhere as ethical? At least, they are loyal :-D

No, you can't take it other way. That is like saying all cows have 4 legs, so everything that has 4 legs is a cow. People might earn less for various reasons. This article is merely saying people who say they have ethics earn less than those who say they don't. Those of you who have studied statistical analysis know what this means, and how these numbers are crunched.

Originally Posted by sidkun

This article looks typically like one of those wherein the authors of the paper HAVE to come up with SOME headline making title in order to get people to publish and read it.

It is a Harvard Business Review article, I guess we can give it lot more credibility than TOI article. I see no reason to doubt the study.

[apachelongbow]

Originally Posted by Samurai

You are contemplating all these roles for a single guy?

Only in a very small company one would get glorified title with little experience. Yours truly used to be Chief Programmer at a company with only 1 year experience.

^^Not correct: Before I left IT I was in Infosys for about 4 years. I joined Infy after 6 yrs of work exp as a project manager and left as a engagement manager. Been out of IT from 2008 onwards.
So very much possible for a top notch company to give you PM designation with 6+ yrs wrk exp.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

^^Not correct: Before I left IT I was in Infosys for about 4 years. I joined Infy after 6 yrs of work exp as a project manager and left as a engagement manager. Been out of IT from 2008 onwards.
So very much possible for a top notch company to give you PM designation with 6+ yrs wrk exp.

I think you should read the context of my post. Your reply has no connection to my post.

[apachelongbow]

Originally Posted by Samurai

I think you should read the context of my post. Your reply has no connection to my post.

You are right, I should have quoted the post above you, instead of yours.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by amitoj

Oh yeah i remember this video. Our senior management was proudly showing this video around until i pointed out what the narrator says at 5:01. "Pay people enough to take the issue of money off the table". Whatever comes in the video after that assumes that the quoted part is taken care of. Now, the issue of money is never off the table. THAT is always on the table. Anywhere around the world. That makes the rest of the video more theoretical than practical.

That is because you haven't seen that practice in person. This is a reality in my company.

While hiring you have to pick people who are motivated by things other than money. If you hire a person who is driven mainly by money, then this is not achievable. In my company, salary is low in the initial couple years. That filters out people who are motivated mainly by money.

[amitoj]

Originally Posted by Samurai

That is because you haven't seen that practice in person. This is a reality in my company.

While hiring you have to pick people who are motivated by things other than money. If you hire a person who is driven mainly by money, then this is not achievable. In my company, salary is low in the initial couple years. That filters out people who are motivated mainly by money.

You have the advantage of operating from a place that does not have as many employment opportunities as other major cities like Bangalore, Hyderabad or Chennai. Yes people can always move to big cities but it still remains a hindrance.

Money is always the prime requirement of any individual, which is acknowledged even by the video that you have posted. Non monetary motivation will not make 100 Rupee per kilo onions affordable for anyone!

[thoma]

Originally Posted by Samurai

In my company, salary is low in the initial couple years. That filters out people who are motivated mainly by money.

Please excuse me for quoting out of the main context, but wanted to share that I had many colleagues who waited till they got a good rise after the initial years to switch company, even though they got a good exposure by then, more because the next pay will be mostly based on the current CTC they get.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by amitoj

You have the advantage of operating from a place that does not have as many employment opportunities as other major cities like Bangalore, Hyderabad or Chennai. Yes people can always move to big cities but it still remains a hindrance.

You seem to forget my company was in Bangalore first two years. When I moved to Manipal, every one of the employee moved to Manipal. BTW, I am only counting people who stayed at least two months or more. There are always characters who move within couple weeks after joining. Still, Bangalore is not far. Last year I lost quite few when situation looked bleak due to prolonged recession effect in my industry vertical. They basically lost hope of recovery. But none of them had any trouble attending interviews all over India. Many employers paid air tickets to get them to attend interviews. They all got jumps greater than 70% to even 200% in one case.

Originally Posted by amitoj

Money is always the prime requirement of any individual, which is acknowledged even by the video that you have posted.

Obviously, you have only met that kind. I meet both kind, and avoid the money followers. Since I have never followed the money myself, I am good at identifying my kind.

Originally Posted by thoma

Please excuse me for quoting out of the main context, but wanted to share that I had many colleagues who waited till they got a good rise after the initial years to switch company, even though they got a good exposure by then, more because the next pay will be mostly based on the current CTC they get.

Nothing wrong with that. Anybody who stays with the company for 2+ years does return the investment for the company.

[NetfreakBombay]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Many employers paid air tickets to get them to attend interviews.

I think this is the Industry norm.

Originally Posted by Samurai

They all got jumps greater than 70% to even 200% in one case.

That means they were paid way below market rates

Just curious, will they achieve similar growth (monetary) if they remain in your company for 4 - 5 year?

[amitoj]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Obviously, you have only met that kind. I meet both kind, and avoid the money followers.

LOL. Oh i have met both kinds. The second kinds are usually divorced or unmarried.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay

I think this is the Industry norm.

Tiny companies like mine can't afford it. I don't even pay bus ticket. But then I only hire fresh graduates. Even my senior most staff are freshies I hired in the initial period of the company.

Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay

That means they were paid way below market rates

There is another angle to it. Salaries are based on cost of living. The Manipal cost of living is 70% that of Bangalore. That means 70K in Manipal is same as 1L in Bangalore.

Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay

Just curious, will they achieve similar growth (monetary) if they remain in your company for 4 - 5 year?

Only during profitable years. We give large bonuses during good times, but none during bad times. Bonus is not part of CTC for that reason. Since directors get the maximum bonus, we also suffer the maximum income loss during bad times. I make almost half of somebody at my level during such periods. Pay cuts and salary freeze are first applied to directors. Fortunately we never had to apply these to employees even in the worse period. For us employees come first, not customer. If the employees are happy, they will make customer happy. That is how we think.

During the 1999 dot-com crash, we had severe cash crunch. I was only a year old in the company, and on H1B. If I had been laid off, I had no choice but return to India during that terrible job crisis. Instead, my boss (the owner) fired himself from the company and found another job, so that I can keep my job. Now he is my senior partner. We still have the same company culture.

[Samurai]

Brand recognition and Big money doesn't make people happy either....

http://www.businessinsider.in/Google...w/25188537.cms

[ku69rd]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Bonus is not part of CTC for that reason. Since directors get the maximum bonus, we also suffer the maximum income loss during bad times.

Suppose CTC is an old terminology, guess TCTC is more the trend these days where it is much more transparent. Many people misread the CTC and think that indicated bonus on their offer letters/revised letter is their fundamental right.

TCTC as the name suggests Targetted Cost to Company and any literate person will know what it means. Again my 2 cents.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by ku69rd

TCTC as the name suggests Targetted Cost to Company and any literate person will know what it means. Again my 2 cents.

Thanks for proving both Google and I to be illiterate.

Actually we follow the Payment of Bonus Act (1965) mandated by Indian government, it is part of the labour laws. As a result, employees are entitled to get minimum bonus of 8.33% every year. Usually this helps support staff (electrician, janitor, etc), the engineers often have mandatory bonus as part of CTC. Even I don't get too deep into the laws, I leave it to my accountant. Government also has a maximum bonus limit, which I suppose everybody ignores.