[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by ssjr0498

2 rossi's on a single bike in formals and ID's hanging from their necks, came at full speed onto the Bannerghatta main road while exiting from the Meenakshi mall road.

Have seen educated folks, working in IT do these things, so its not that the one's doing this are uneducated. It's just their sick state of mind!

1. What is a ‘Rossi’? (See below pic in a lighter vein. - A plant? An animal? A vegetable?)
2. The concept of ‘Educated’ is not to be confused with ‘Literate’. More often than not, the two are mutually exclusive. Rather like Common Sense, which, truth be told, is truly Uncommon in the general scheme of things.

[anjan_c2007]

Feel extremely sad and sorry to read about your shocking ordeal with such goons. After such incidents happen lots of corrective measures are suggested.

But my no. 1. thumb rule is to please avoid to be outside during unearthly hours, unless it is an unavoidable emergency. 10 to 11 p.m. should be a decent time to be back at our place of stay whether home or hotel or hostel and so on. This is because we still have traffic on the roads and many people are awake during then. Time management is important.

Next quoting from your post, I would put it as parochialism not racism at all. There are parochially minded people all around but when such negativity and ill intentioned thoughts manifest through mutual conversations or in public places its simply deplorable and condemnable.

I feel DISGUSTED by the internal racism in India. It has been nearly 12 hours since the incident happened and I still feel nauseous.

They have mentally and morally harmed you all but not much physically. Lastly, please have the courage to stand up, stand tall and not fall due to such encounters with outlaws. You need to be resilient.

[VaibhaoT]

Really sorry for your ordeal.

We shifted to BLR around 20 months back. We were in Pune for more than 10 years before this. It was a really hard decision for me and my family to move out of Pune. Our heart still belongs there.

Somehow we could never connect to Bangalore. There is no doubt that it is a best place to be in India for a "Software Engineer". Schools here are better than Pune. But quality of life has been degraded for us. Apart from this, we are really scared to venture out post 10 PM. I used to think that outskirts area like Sarjapur Road is a problem. But looking at OP's ordeal, I am not sure if my family is safe in city as well post 10 PM.

I am personally trying her to learn Kannada, but its not because I am afraid of the local goons. Its out of my interest to learn new language.
IMHO, whole language situation is created by political outfits and the local goons. We have Kannadiga maids, who may not have spoken Hindi most of her life. But she attempts her best to make conversation as much as possible in Hindi. A person who is working hard to support their family, Kannada is not an subject of contention.

[PreludeSH]

Originally Posted by VaibhaoT

Really sorry for your ordeal.

We shifted to BLR around 20 months back. We were in Pune for more than 10 years before this. It was a really hard decision for me and my family to move out of Pune. Our heart still belongs there.

Somehow we could never connect to Bangalore. There is no doubt that it is a best place to be in India for a "Software Engineer". Schools here are better than Pune. But quality of life has been degraded for us. Apart from this, we are really scared to venture out post 10 PM. I used to think that outskirts area like Sarjapur Road is a problem. But looking at OP's ordeal, I am not sure if my family is safe in city as well post 10 PM.

I am personally trying her to learn Kannada, but its not because I am afraid of the local goons. Its out of my interest to learn new language.
IMHO, whole language situation is created by political outfits and the local goons. We have Kannadiga maids, who may not have spoken Hindi most of her life. But she attempts her best to make conversation as much as possible in Hindi. A person who is working hard to support their family, Kannada is not an subject of contention.

Please stay in Bengaluru, we love everyone

On another note, not sure where you live but with advent of Metro you can try to live in more local parts of the city. It will also feel like a new place which I hope you will love.

Two of my friends from Andhra have moved to Kanakapura road. They didn't like the vibe of Whitefield where they lived for 10 years and loved the South (west of Bannerghatta) and West parts.

[Neil Roy]

Originally Posted by that_sedate_guy

...At this my friend got enraged and shouted. BAD MOVE, I know but she couldn't contain herself. The goons got pissed off and caused a huge ruckus all the while shouting that we are Tamil people and we do not belong in Karnataka...
It took two hours of neighbors trying to pacify the drunkards for them to leave us alone. We were tired, scared for our safety and extremely drained emotionally. We had no one there, we were outsiders who had been singled out just for having a TN registered number plate. I've had people misbehave after seeing my number plate but this was on a different level....

As your handle suggests, you are a sedate guy. Nothing is going to change that. But, where do you draw the line at being sedate? Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can't hurt me is true only till such time that it is words. They have assaulted you, insulted the women who were with you, disturbed the peace and quiet of your neighbors and caused damage to your vehicle. So I repeat my question, where do you draw the line at being sedate?
No one goes around looking for conflicts, but should be prepared if the need arises. All you need is a good criminal advocate who can draft the various IPC sections for your complaint and the guts to stand up for yourself and see how these bullies run. For all the offences they have committed in 2 hours, you can make their lives miserable for 2 years, if not more. You have the power. Use it.

[deepak.prahlad]

The news is heavy, and my heart goes out to everyone affected by this unfortunate situation. It's undeniable that social media platforms, like Facebook, Instagram, and WhatsApp, can fuel negativity and contribute to the division we see in society.

The solution for this kind of issues is to be a Roman when you are in Rome, though it is not easy.

[gpadki]

Sorry to hear this story, this is horrible. Hope you all recover from this incident soon. There are some bad elements in society all over the world like this and it cannot be generalized for the entire city. Infact 2 months ago, my colleague and her friends were in Pondicherry and they had terrible experience from localites as well as some police since they did not know Tamil! But we know Pondicherry has been a tourist place and millions go there.

While anyone can visit and live in any state, i think it is also necessary to respect the natives and the language. I have personally seen people getting into a bakery and speaking in their native to the shopkeeper who doesnt even know that language. I guess it's only in Bangalore that all this works, not in other states. So, i guess that respect is give and take wherever we go and live.

[Samurai]

Bangalore is the only city where when two locals meet, they try Hindi or English first. Whenever some delivery person, or handyman calls me, they always try Hindi first. That's that courtesy a typical Bangalorean gives to any stranger. Even the police do this.

But in this thread Bangalore is represented by drunk rowdies. Apparently, they are the typical Bangalorians now.

[RaghavEvoX]

My experience with Bangalore has changed recently in the last few years.
I have many relatives in Bangalore and have been travelling Chennai - Bangalore from the 90s.
And at least for the last 15 years have travelled to many beautiful parts of Karnataka - Coorg, Shimoga, Mysore, Thala Cauvery, Agumbe, Nagarhole, Hubli, etc. everything in TN registered bike and Car and have never faced any issue.
But a few years back, I was doing a course in IIMB and had to travel Chennai- Bangalore almost for all weekends for a year.
I was in a signal very near the the famous Silk board junction and one of the guy crossing the road (Looked like a decently educated / Marketing executive) saw my car number plate and out of nowhere hit my car's bonnet strongly with a bag which left a big dent.
It all happened all of a sudden that before I could process what just happened, he had left.
After this incident, I never took my car to Bangalore. Started travelling in Train.

I feel most of Karnataka, especially the locals in the rural places are really nice people.
But there are actually 2 problems
- Many locals in and around Bangalore/Mysore could not compete with people who are coming from outside and they think because of these outsiders the real estate and general cost of living has shot to the roof. So these guys vent out their anger time and again at innocent people, because they think these people are the root cause of their problems.
- In a way people from other states who have settled in Bangalore also are a reason for it. It's understandable if someone moved here 2-3 years back, it might be difficult to pick Kannada. But I know at least some 30-40 people who are living in Bangalore for more than 10 years and don't know a line of Kannada other than 'Kannada Gottilla'. So they are equally responsible for the problem.

When will Bengaluru become Bangalore again !!
Only when People who have settled here think the city as their own & embrace the local culture and language.
Just eating Mysore masala dosa will not make you a localite !!

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Bangalore is the only city where when two locals meet, they try Hindi or English first. Whenever some delivery person, or handyman calls me, they always try Hindi first. That's that courtesy a typical Bangalorean gives to any stranger. Even the police do this.

But in this thread Bangalore is represented by drunk rowdies. Apparently, they are the typical Bangalorians now.

Living in this city for 2 decades and more now, and having been a regular visitor/ guest here since the 1970’s, as I’ve said before, all this bad stuff seems to be happening only on the outer areas and the rabbit warren of ‘halli’s’ located just outside the urban centres.

The place in which I presently live, was at the ‘end of the world’ as we knew it, in the 1990’s. Cold. Full of trees and grasslands and huge waterbodies. The small lakes here had coracles and people used to fish in them. On the fringes of this area, there were some dwellings. And then the great Emperors of the BDA made this gigantic layout. It was all mud roads and trees and water and nature when I first turned up here in the early 2000’s. And it was as lonely as hell. Only me, my staff and my three dogs for company and the three dogs sure as heck deterred any potential rascals. Now the place is totally unrecognisable in the extreme.

I remember based on all the local history and geography I have read and having seen this area full of farms and palm trees and castor plantations in the 1990’s, the Challaghatta area itself was a lake bed and a water course which would eventually find its way into Bellandur Lake (which in the 1940’s was a Seaplane Testing Facility) and thereon the run off would go to Varthur lake and beyond. Then in the 1970’s the then Great Lords of Government decided to lease part of the land to the KGA for a Golf course.

And all was dormant and peaceful in the 1980’s. And suddenly in the 1990’s and 2000’s the Challaghatta area along with Yemalur and all, became prime residential property. All those areas are packed with private layouts and private builder led apartment complexes and millions of rent-creating, higgledy-piggledy, jerry-built constructions and PG’s etc. And all of these are in or at the edge of, or abut the said ‘Halli’s’.

The dwellers and owners of apartments or homes in these private builder complexes are mostly IT related executives and professional folks and most of these are from elsewhere - labelled as ‘Immigrants’ and ‘Outsiders’ if you will. Coming here in search of employment and to make a ‘living’ , some of them have made good and become upwardly mobile- buying cars and so forth. They form the working-professional- middle-class and considering their origins and ethnicity, have become the perfect ‘soft targets’ for extortion and bullying by the bad local rowdies and hooligans. Attributed in part to the widening economic rift between ‘Haves vs Have-Nots’ as written in multiple places.

There is another thread on Bangalore traffic and its woes. And in that thread also, multiple instances of Xenophobic tendencies are mentioned. Almost as though it is the immigrants who are by themselves, solely responsible for the traffic chaos that we live amidst.

These are all plain truths. Yes they may be absolutely unpalatable to some, but we cannot wish them away just like that. There is really no point getting all hurt and sensitive and ‘put-upon’ and upset at these facts. It is most definitely a serious Law and Order breakdown here in this city as exemplified by multiple instances of this kind.

The greatest tragedy of it all is that the government who collect taxes and levies from all common tax paying folk, are simply unable to provide the basic safety, security, policing, infrastructure, roads, street lighting and peace in return. The government and its representatives are simply apathetic. Therein lies the rub.

Is it wrong for the ‘outsiders’ OR ‘immigrants’ along with the locals and insiders, to expect this much at least, in return for the taxes they pay at every turn, with every breath they take; without having to also pay even more by way of having to swallow and digest Xenophobia, physical danger, bias, linguistic chauvinism, nazism and rampant parochialism? Decidedly NOT!

I think it is time that people like us took a stand of solidarity and tried to make the change we want to see, in our micro cosmic worlds, so as to create a ground swell of positivity from the grass roots rather than just treat the symptom and not the cause - by applying soothing salve to the festering wound of this problem without treating the root cause and thus perpetuate this fear ridden unhappy circumstance.

[am1m]

Originally Posted by RaghavEvoX

So they are equally responsible for the problem.

So not knowing the local language is a crime, a reason to get hit on the road and have your family abused by a bunch of drunk criminals?

I realize you didn't mean it that way, especially since you were also on the receiving end of such parochialism. But in the context of the thread we are posting on, someone has shared their traumatic experience, that they went through for no fault of their own. Blaming people for things like that just because they don't know the local language is wrong, isn't it?

Does violent crime not occur to people who speak Kannada in Bangalore? I've been at the receiving end of enough road rage. I was born here, lived here for over 40 years, speak Kannada. For those getting nostalgic about Bangalore being a safe haven in the 80s or 90s, I've seen enough men yell at my mom while she used to drive back then (she gave back good as well!) and I've seen enough auto drivers fight on the road with minimal traffic too. They haven't changed as a species.

It's criminal activity. Plain and simple. Considerations about language, which place you live, how late you were out, with whom, doing what, etc. simply don't come into it. It's bad enough that the cops don't deal with it. But when we start blaming the victims, or worse, as victims start blaming ourselves, that just compounds it.

[Raghu M]

I am seeing a no. of videos these days in which people from North India are stopped and made to apologize for not learning Kannada. All this in areas that are heart of Bangalore. I am not generalizing but there is a huge uptick in such incidents. Won't be long before the city loses it's investment potential to such idiots. The govt. has to take some really strict action as I see a huge fan following for such videos with common comments such as - leave Karnataka if you can't speak Kannada, why do you come to our place and not respect our language. This to me is dangerous.

[RaghavEvoX]

Originally Posted by am1m

So not knowing the local language is a crime, a reason to get hit on the road and have your family abused by a bunch of drunk criminals?

I realize you didn't mean it that way, especially since you were also on the receiving end of such parochialism. But in the context of the thread we are posting on, someone has shared their traumatic experience, that they went through for no fault of their own. Blaming people for things like that just because they don't know the local language is wrong, isn't it?

Sorry if my statement was perceived that way.
Not knowing the local language is not a crime.
What I meant was for the people who have settled in Bangalore for a long time and still they think it is absolutely fine not learning Kannada and on top of it, expecting the locals to learn Hindi or other language as the main problem.

I completely empathize with their traumatic experience as I had also been through it once. My point was only to highlight why people behave that way.

[am1m]

Originally Posted by RaghavEvoX

My point was only to highlight why people behave that way.

No sir, criminals behave that way because they are criminals.

They see an opportunity to take advantage of people and because the system is ineffective at policing such incidents. Not because they perceive any slight to state or state language honour.

By allowing for such things as "that's why these things happen", we do our bit to rationalize/excuse such behavior. And one day we might be at the receiving end too.

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by am1m

No sir, criminals behave that way because they are criminals.

They see an opportunity to take advantage of people and because the system is ineffective at policing such incidents. Not because they perceive any slight to state or state language honour.

By allowing for such things as "that's why these things happen", we do our bit to rationalize/excuse such behavior. And one day we might be at the receiving end too.

This is so apt in the present context that I simply had to post it;

This is Pastor Martin Niemoller’s lament about the silence of German intellectuals and clergy — including, by his own admission, Niemöller himself—following the Nazis' rise to power and subsequent incremental purging of their chosen targets, group after group.

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist

Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist

Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist

Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew

Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me