[Chetan_Rao]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

This is alarming isn't it?

I come from a small state - Goa. As a kid we had friends from most states in India. South Indians, North Indians. We never knew who from whom. Neither did our parents ever tell us the difference. My fathers family itself is a part of displaced people who were asked to leave their state by the Invaders. Eventually coming back to the home-state after 1961. During the period they were sheltered in a neighboring states of Karnataka and Maharashtra. Their culture and mannerisms respected.

We have a history of Atithi Devo Bhavo.

So what went wrong? And why?

Some of the reasoning provided in your post does make sense. But a vibrant and educated city as this standing a mute witness to such incidents is certainly something I cant understand.

I understand kannada but I don't talk though - more due to the fact that I believe unless you are fluent you might disrespect the language itself while trying to talk. I even didn't go forward with my sons school admission to a particular school because they didn't teach kannada. I want my son to learn the language of where he is based.

I am not sure about other states, having traveled well but mostly as a tourist I never really got a semblance of any difference. From spending the night in the verandah of a postman's small house in the middle of UP to being put up by a family in Mangalore, I had a broken down bike. I never believed we would today see such behavior.

Hoping the general sentiment changes.

One word. paranoia.

We've become so paranoid, that we take the 'better safe than sorry' approach to everything, often leading to disastrous consequences.

[ego4evr]

I have littel or no sympathy for auto guys specially in bangalore , they are the most heartless and ruthless guys that i know off .

About 2 years back one auto guy knocked off my right side mirror the complete assembley was ripped off , i chased the auto guy and i forced him to pay me , he was like saar i have children , i have a wife and what not , i could have let go off him , but just because he was an auto guy i did not .... as i dont care about them.

They just dont care for anybody on the street .

Regards
Abhishek

[black12rr]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

Killing someone is not easy. Self defense is more of getting away from a situation to a safer place. Not escalating matters.

If one is not sure about his abilities/skills - run. There is no ego here, you will leave to see another day. Injuries hurt.

Let me ask you , if some attacks you with iron rod on the head . You would like to die or kill the other person and you live ?

[PatienceWins]

I am not surpised, just another day for an auto driver in Bangalore!!

[Chetan_Rao]

Originally Posted by black12rr

Let me ask you , if some attacks you with iron rod on the head . You would like to die or kill the other person and you live ?

Let me ask you, if you have a choice between a 'run if you want to live' or 'stay to kill or/and get killed' situation, what would you do?

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by black12rr

Let me ask you , if some attacks you with iron rod on the head . You would like to die or kill the other person and you live ?

If an iron rod hits me on the head I am done for.

What I do before it strikes my head is more important.

But frankly even if i have titanium family jewels, I would not fight the Auto guys in Bangalore. They are low level filth. I can never get myself tangled with them what with the political and police scene in this state.

If he does follow me home then within my 4 walls I will make sure he is at least maimed for life. If not killed.

Out in the open on a street here where no one will help you because you are non-resident, I would run as fast as I can. My fear is due to the lack of empathy shown by my fellow men and not due to the my cowardice. But frankly I have stood up whenever a situation has confronted me and I cant bear to be a mute witness.

[black12rr]

Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao

Let me ask you, if you have a choice between a 'run if you want to live' or 'stay to kill or/and get killed' situation, what would you do?

So would you leave your family and things (car or bike )there itself and runaway ?

you will be killed or hacked to death ,even if you run . What will you do ? .I would fight back if I have no other option .

Originally Posted by Spitfire

Out in the open on a street here where no one will help you because you are non-resident, I would run as fast as I can. My fear is due to the lack of empathy shown by my fellow men and not due to the my cowardice.

I agree no point showing you fight skills in open to run away and live again .But what will you do if you have family along with you ?

[shankar.balan]

He who fights and runs away, will live to fight another day.
Demosthenes: 338 BC.

I guess the world was just about as wicked then as it is today. Humans are really the issue I think. Intolerance etc are the same - the difference is only in the degree of variance in intensity from then until now.

[PatienceWins]

Do not get physical with auto guys in bangalore, even if you are better than Bruce Lee. They are part of a big force backed by political parties and not scared of police. The other guy may be having a low life with nothing to loose.

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by black12rr

But what will you do if you have family along with you ?

Run with the family of course. Run here necessarily doesn't mean on foot.

Even a cornered animal fights back. So would I in a similar situation. The onus is on me not to get in one.

[Chetan_Rao]

Originally Posted by black12rr

So would you leave your family and things (car or bike )there itself and runaway ?

you will be killed or hacked to death ,even if you run . What will you do ? .I would fight back if I have no other option .

1. Most situations escalate to the point of violence because either party refuses to back down. In that moment, ego becomes bigger than survival for a lot of people. 9/10 fights start with a verbal exchange, and it's upto the parties involved how it goes from there. If things get violent, both sides are to blame.

2. If I'm with family, my first and only motivation would be to get them to safety. If it comes down to arguing with an idiot or protecting my family, it's a no-brainer what to choose. I wouldn't mind if somebody vandalizes my vehicle as long as I can ensure my family's safety. Vehicles come and go, family doesn't.

3. Even if you manage to maim or kill the other guy, what next? Do you just expect the law to take you word when you say 'I killed him because I felt threatened'? Killing in self-defence is a big grey area, as one has to prove that there was enough threat to one's life to justify the fatal retaliation. In most cases, there isn't enough evidence/witnesses, and you'll end up spending your life you-know-where.

4. As for your point about the futility of running, I agree it's useless to run once things have got to the point where you feel threatened enough to run for your life. An honest piece of advice. Don't get into/start a fight if you're not sure you can survive it. I agree with Spitfire, the onus is on us to not let the situation escalate into a life-threatening one.

[flyingkolors]

Originally Posted by benbsb29

If you have a complaint copy registered with the police as well as hospital bills to prove your case, please send the details to Bangalore Mirror newspaper along with the registration number of the auto. You could see some action. However, your friend should be ready for the publicity.

Thats a good idea. Only problem here is that my friend is a very calm going and likes to keep a low profile. Moreover, he's under impression that he should not have shouted at the auto guy and is feeling sorry for it.

Originally Posted by mjothi

very bad & sad incident.

But its surprising to hear that he got this treatment just because he spoke in hindi. Something else should have provoked the auto guy, or the auto guy should have been drunk.

Either case, this is terrible. Seems guys alone in car are more prone to all such stunts. Seems car pool is a must in Bangalore, if you leave office late.

Thats exactly my point. Infact, I've seen that the tolerance levels for other state people (or read who cannot speak Kannada) is very low. No offense to meant to anyone, but thats sadly the state of affairs.

Originally Posted by ghodlur

Things are getting worse day by day in the metros. Today its the rick guy, tomorrow it may be the two wheeler guy and god knows next.

Hard to believe - the road rage is slowly taking over. All I can say is hope you friend has a fast recovery and leaves thos nasty memories behind and moves on. BTW what was the total damage to the vehicle.

The car is still lying our apartment. The bill should be close to 30k, if not more.

Originally Posted by Lukeskywalker

Sad to hear about the incident, I would suggest you contact the DCP of your area if the police personnel at the local police station are trying to drag their feet.

People are getting more and more impatient everyday, yesterday afternoon, he just squeezed his way bumping and brushing against vehicles and looked very triumphant that he managed to get ahead of me by a few metres.

Yes, we plan to meet the next higher level authority in that PS. If not justice for us, but at least for the larger group.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

What this has to do with Hindi ? No wonder, my friend did not accept a good opportunity in Bangalore because he was feeling insecure.

If a person has a weapon with him like stick or anything, he must know how to use the same else things can get even worse.

May be the auto guy thought that he was being offended and the of course the general hatred towards the outsiders.

Defend himself? But how? Take another rod and start fighting with a low level auto guy in the middle of the road? I mean, if we just step into that situation, the instant reaction would be to jump out of the car to see whats happening. Those few seconds matter alot.

Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao

If the guy had retaliated, I bet every auto driver in the vicinity would've jumped in to defend their comrade-in-arms.

As much as their mob-mentality may be disturbing, they at least defend their own guy if he's in trouble. More than what we can say for ourselves.

We just look the other way and pretend to be Gandhi's 3 monkeys.

You just hit the nail on the head.

Originally Posted by amitoj

Your friend got down from the car to talk to an auto driver who has gone berserk with a steel rod in his hand? BIG mistake.
It is better to let your car take a beating instead of you, however much it may hurt your feelings.
Saw the news today morning about a rowdy/corporater who was hacked down in Banashankari? Guess what was his occupation when he entered crime. Autorickshaw driver.

I agree sir. But isnt it our instant reaction to come out to see what's happening with the guy and to your dear car?

[SDP]

Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao

1. Most situations escalate to the point of violence because either party refuses to back down. In that moment, ego becomes bigger than survival for a lot of people. 9/10 fights start with a verbal exchange, and it's upto the parties involved how it goes from there. If things get violent, both sides are to blame.

2. If I'm with family, my first and only motivation would be to get them to safety. If it comes down to arguing with an idiot or protecting my family, it's a no-brainer what to choose. I wouldn't mind if somebody vandalizes my vehicle as long as I can ensure my family's safety. Vehicles come and go, family doesn't.

3. Even if you manage to maim or kill the other guy, what next? Do you just expect the law to take you word when you say 'I killed him because I felt threatened'? Killing in self-defence is a big grey area, as one has to prove that there was enough threat to one's life to justify the fatal retaliation. In most cases, there isn't enough evidence/witnesses, and you'll end up spending your life you-know-where.

4. As for your point about the futility of running, I agree it's useless to run once things have got to the point where you feel threatened enough to run for your life. An honest piece of advice. Don't get into/start a fight if you're not sure you can survive it. I agree with Spitfire, the onus is on us to not let the situation escalate into a life-threatening one.

Chetan,
Brillaintly summarized. Let me add to your 3rd point.
If it gets physical, one should act to 'defend' life/limb/property and not get into 'attack' mode. Chosing what 'protection' (don't want to use the word 'weapon') to carry in the car is really important here. In my opinion, one should carry something that is deterrent enough and can cause no long-term damage. That way you get a chance to stop once the situation is under control.
I mean, if you shoot someone or hit somebody on the head with a heavy metal rod, there is a distinct possibility of causing death and such an item of protection should NOT be carried in the first place for city commute. Carry something that would cause pain and not cause a wound.

[sriturl]

Originally Posted by flyingkolors

Thats a good idea. Only problem here is that my friend is a very calm going and likes to keep a low profile. Moreover, he's under impression that he should not have shouted at the auto guy and is feeling sorry for it.

I would advice that you write an email to the Police commissioner, and possibly the ACP/DCP incharge of that area.
Most of the times, the constables who would have answered to you in the PS, I have to say unfortunately are not sensitive enough to understand your concerns. I wouldnt completely blame them, it is the system which is rotten. I would expect that the higher ups would atleast listen to your concern. You have a better chance that you noted down the auto regn number.
An incident without complaining would become a routine.
It is definitely a law and order situation, and Police have the responsibility to stop unlawful incidents. They may treat these as minor things, and the reason why they donot record these incidents is that they need to close the complaint, and it will become another pending item in their reviews, which an SI/Inspector wouldnt do. But they have the responsibility to atleast give the auto driver a sound "treatment" the police way. You can be assured of that if you complaint to some senior officers.
Press will anyway come to know with the help of publicity hungry police men

[amitk26]

Friends I have full sympathy with the person. I faced several such instanced. Two of them were near fist fights one at St. Johns hospital petrol pump where Auto guy took out a thick clubs. I got down from bike and snatched it . Another memoriable one was in front of commissioners office were I had to threaten him to burn alive on road with auto .

I would like to share few points based on my personal experience.
These guys invariably carry a thick stick / rod and threaten you but they will not attack if you do certain things.

These people think that you are outsiders and if they attack you you can not come back with a mob to burn their auto and that's why take liberty to behave in this manner.


1. Please understand no one will come to help or save you in this city you are always on your own. Why only in this city even I have observed people in bbay / mumbai are like this. surprisingly the bad and notorious Delhi is much more helpful in case of street fights.

For you information my first street fight here was with an auto guy bang opposite to commissioners office on infantry road, A traffic policeman kept on watching I pushed the auto wala to side not giving him chance to swing his stick and his comrades that is other auto walas came to help him to diffuse the situation.

2. Do not let the attacker think you are a "soft" software guy.
keep on shouting "tu janta nahi hai kaun hoon main " , You may be nobody but make believe the other guy that you are right hand man of some big builder or some other such guy, Never ever give an impression that you are a laptop carrying softy.
so keep all those company stickers hidden , I don't even keep parking sticker on my vehicle. Instead I have it on a badge which I hide in glove compartment once out of office parking.

Act manacingly and utter threats like " yahin jinda aag laga doonga " even if the sound funny and unreal to you. No autowala will fight back if he thinks that you are really capable of taking out a match stick and throw it in his petrol tank.

3. Learn to utter few gaalis , yes Hindi gaalis , Funny enough but these low lifes pretend to attack outsiders but always do rough talking using gaalis of same language. Even if you do not use these gaalis believe me they are life savers in such scenario. A few MC /BC liberally sprang in your threat talk makes it clear to the other guy that you mean business. They should not think that you are an educated .

4. When the guys brings out the rod , Do not feel threatened at all look in his eyes and come closer then 1/2 foot to his body so that if he swings the rod it wont gather momentum. Cach his rod / hand first and push him.
The key is to take war in his territory.

A lot of auto guys will gather after point 4 but they will now just try to diffuse situation . Remember any prolonged fight where auto is damaged / confiscated in police station is threat to his livelihood.

Do not think you will be beaten up , 95% of auto walas have frail undernourished body which is already weak by overdose of daru , So if you slap him he will actually repent.It is just that you are a "shareef admi" he wants to threaten you.