[ACM]

https://auto.ndtv.com/news/harley-da...-range-1902078

I guess this scheme is aimed recovering lost ground.

Make sense.

100% of Ex-showroom price refunded for street family upto 12 months and 75% between 13-24 months.

I guess that is enough time to discover the street is too small and desire an upgrade.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by ACM

I guess that is enough time to discover the street is too small and desire an upgrade.

Softail range starts at around 15L. Quite a significant upgrade for an average Street customer.

Makes sense for Harley though - trying to convert all their Street customers to Softail. The former sells about 20 times that of the latter - which could mean that many owners upgrade to other brands (Specially sports and adventure tourers) instead.

[GTO]

Harley-Davidson Inc. HOG -0.20% is facing a particularly tough competitor for new riders: its own used motorcycles.

Three used Harleys are sold in the U.S. for every new one. A decade ago, it was the other way around. New motorcycle sales in the U.S. are down by half from a 2006 peak, while used sales are up 13%.

Milwaukee-based Harley in 2018 is heading for its fourth straight year of declining sales as the company’s core older customers scale back purchases while younger riders fail to pick up the slack. A glut of used Harley-Davidsons has emerged after years of strong sales growth and production volumes, and offers a variety of choices for those unwilling to splurge on pricey new models.

Source & Full Article

[nkghai]

Quote this statement by Trump on one news channel .

"He alleged that India puts "tremendously high tariffs" on American products and raked up the issue of Harley Davidson motorcycles. "When we send Harley Davidson motorcycle, and other things to India, they charge us very, very high tariffs. I have spoken to Prime Minister (Narendra) Modi and he is going to reduce them substantially," he said."

Will they or will they not ??


Link https://www.news18.com/news/india/ta...p-1895113.html

[GTO]

An amazing long-form article on Jalopnik - How Harley-Davidson's All-In Bet on Its Past Crippled Its Future

An hour before midnight on New Year’s Eve in 1985, a bunch of Harley executives sat in a room at a bank with two stacks of papers, one for bankruptcy and another for recapitalization, if their last gasp ask for fresh investment came in. They had given themselves until midnight to get new money or go bankrupt, and time was running out.

Many of the executives had, four years earlier, personally invested $1 million or more—while borrowing tens of millions more on top of that—to buy the company from the conglomerate AMF for $80 million and take it private. AMF itself had acquired the motorcycle manufacturer for $14 million in 1969 (about $100 million today) with a plan to expand production and squeeze out maximum profits. But a decade of labor trouble, declining build quality, and the dominance of Japanese motorcycles—Honda, in particular—had, by 1981, left Harley in dire straits.

It was kind of a miracle that Harley had lasted that long to begin with and, indeed, had almost done so by default. Such was the impact of 1969's Easy Rider that, without it, the company might not have existed much longer after, since, historically, motorcycle companies in the United States came and went at the ferocious whims of the marketplace. Consider that, after Indian closed its doors in 1958, Harley was the only American motorcycle manufacturer left, having succeeded where hundreds of competitors had tried and failed.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by GTO

An amazing long-form article on Jalopnik -

Very interesting, thanks for sharing. I am no expert on bikes at all. In fact I know next to nothing when it comes to bikes Having owned only one motorbike for less than four years. However, I always liked HD as a brand. Interesting heritage, interesting brand with lots of ups and down. Nice, interesting bikes to look at. I don't have any affinity with all these new bikes on the market. Essentially they look like props from the next Star wars movie. And I detest how they sound. Awfull. My wife loathes bikes, but she always likes the sound of a HD (or a RE Bullet of course, )

For years HD has been steadily loosing customers. The one that remain are hard core HD type who will probably take their HD into their grave. But of course that is part of the problem. HD owners are getting on a bit and, literally, are dying out! Nothing in the current HD portfolio appears to be attractive to current generations of bikers.

I hope HD finds a way to re-invent itself. Which, most likely, will be something akin to a miracle, admittedly.

They are/will not be the first iconic brand that disappears after decades of being around. Nor the last. But I can't help wondering why the management did not act more prudent earlier. Plenty of iconic brands in the car / bike space that have keeled over. Plenty that have survived similar trends as HD has been experiencing

Jeroen

[mail4ajo]

If HD needs new riders, then it has to appeal to new riders which means young people. I chuckled when a HD dealer gave away striders to schools. They need more work than that.

And at a time when young people who dont even care to drive or even get a driving license, its a tough scene for the company. In the US, the small capacity Harley's are a dud. Its the big cruisers that sell even today. The small ones are usually tucked away in a corner.

And the events dont appeal to younger folks. I went to the recent local HD demo. Not even a single smaller bike to try. Even the mid size soft-tails were given lesser preference.

Hope the e-bike changes some of that.

[alphadog]

It will be interesting to see how things pan out in the near future for the company.
The company until now has been projecting its image of being a rebellious, mean muscle metal and leather sort of vehicle, with focus on freedom, and hanging on desperately to its legend and legacy. Now, they have come out with a relatively tame electric version, in a desperate attempt to resurrect its dying fortunes. It will be interesting to see how the existing Harley fans respond to this and if it will indeed manage to find new takers.

Although most of the riders are middle aged and over, there will always be a younger crowd, who are still enamoured by the legend of the HD. But, these numbers are dwindling Even in India, the new younger riders are mostly going for the street 750. The bigger bikes are not great handlers in our traffic conditions, they aren't practical, and people buying them are the well heeled middle aged and above die hard fans of the brand.

I for one bought my Harley, for the aspirational value of owning the legendary brand I had put up posters of as a kid, for the great sound track, and for the HOG camaraderie. Now, that I have this in the kitty. I don't feel like upgrading to another Harley. I will most likely go for a more refined, practical and one that is packed with more features.
I can imagine, there might be more people who think like me. That and the lack of new takers might be the problem for Harley, in the near future.

Hope it manages to do what RE has done.

Cheerio!

[Nithesh_M]

A few years ago I asked a motorcycle journalist who was attending a motorcycle show in the US to ask Mr.Eric Buell why he wouldn't consider building entry level bikes for youngsters to start riding on so they could associate themselves with his brand for the future. Its what Honda did in America with the 250s and 500s. Inexpensive yet reliable Japanese bikes, long service intervals, low service costs are what led to the downfall of most Italian(you could say EU in general) and American motorcycle companies when the Japanese ships landed at their shores. Anyway Mr.EB's reply to him was that he doesn't think the entry level motorcycle market is profitable in his view which is understandable since he'd have to sell a few thousand units of a 300cc bike at $4k as opposed to say selling a 100 1000cc bike at $15k. He probably would have to setup an assembly line to sell so many small bikes which is extra investment from his side. Keep in mind this was years ago before the current 400cc bikes arrived in the US market.

I was surprised he would say that considering he wanted people to buy his motorcycles that costed as much as its Japanese rivals at the time for far less gadgetry. The problem is, the lack of service networks and the high pricing put most buyers off considering they could get a cbr or an r1 for the same money without having to worry about service networks.

Harley which ditched EBR a few years ago now finds itself in its former partner's shoes. The Harley audience up until a few years ago were folks in their 40s and 50s with a savings account big enough to afford, service and run these HDs across the country without any worry. Problem for Harley is that the specific generation of population they targeted have reached the end of the road and newer generation with not so big bank accounts, educational loans etc would rather pay for an inexpensive Japanese motorcycle regardless of sports/cruiser/naked/adv/tourer segments

It still bugs me to this day that Mr. EB would say something like that.
Consider the fact that most kids today who start on these 300cc bikes or even the 125cc bikes in EU usually upgrade to the higher displacement 600/650 or 1000cc bikes from the same brand. That's how brand loyalty is created in the young minds.
And as much as i dislike RE for its build quality and service headaches, even Mr.Lal is smart enough to realize he cannot keep selling the outdated 350s and 500s forever and has branched out to Cafe racers and 650 twins today.

If you don't invest in the future generation, how do you expect the future generation to invest in you?

[Krishnan83]

Harley Davidson posted dismal fourth quarter results today; world wide sales has dipped 6.7% -- this is alarming as the trade war is going to be intense going forward...Except for Canada, rest of the regions has seen severe de-growth

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Harley Davidson declares shutdown of Kansas plant after sales fall -

Harley Davidson announced on January 29, 2018, that their shipments for 2018 fell to a new six-year low. The motorcycle manufacturer announced that they would be closing their plant in Kansas City, Missouri, to consolidate manufacturing. The company’s stock hit a 52-week low following the announcement but rebounded steadily on Wednesday.

Read the full article here - https://usaherald.com/harley-davidso...as-city-plant/

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

Harley Davidson declares shutdown of Kansas plant after sales fall -

Such a shame, it was a nice land mark. We used to take visitors on a tour through this plant when we lived in Kansas City.

One of their managers helped me out to get a good understanding of the union situation in the USA.

Jeroen

[isldhn]

I for one am saddened by this news article. I mean, we all have grown up hearing and seeing the HD brand. It is for some like a ‘Fiat Punto’ or a Mitsu Pajero or a Maruti Jipsy or a RE or Tata Safari. I hope you get the drift. Sometimes its about character and I feel that is more important than being soul less like any brand which does not have a recall value.
I sincerly hope that Tata Jlr or Volvo Geely happens to HD and this brand ressurrects and gains its lost ground.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Reviving the thread after almost a year.

Trump is back with his strong opinion against the 50% CBU tax India charges on imported Harley Davidson motorcycles -

https://www.thehindubusinessline.com...le27799149.ece

“So, when Harley sends over there, they have 100 per cent tax. When they (India) send in — they make a tremendous number of motorcycles — when they send them in, no tax. I called him. I said it’s unacceptable”

“He (Modi) reduced it by 50 per cent with one phone call. I said it’s still unacceptable because it’s 50 per cent versus nothing. It’s still unacceptable. And they’re working on it”

“The United States is hopeful that, with the election over, Prime Minister Modi will have a freer hand to pursue some of the tough economic reforms that will help create a more business-friendly environment and encourage new foreign investment”

[Rob UK]

The USA & EU are locked into a tariff battle at present. The EU has slapped tariffs on Harley-Davidson & Indian up to 31% in response to tariffs on metals, Trump is retaliating by hitting EU imports to the US on 500-700cc bikes shortly which may seem odd, but avoids hurting overseas HD manufacture if they want to ship to the US.

It's all pretty ridiculous, but India could get caught up in it with stuff like the Bajaj/Triumph deal & the Enfield twins if he intends on making a point.

Harley are going really heavy on UK marketing at present & it is not stopping all sales by any means, the Street & Sportster ranges are competitive on price. A friend of mine just bought a new Lowrider, but it is everything Evo powered looking pricey. A basic Street Glide is now getting on for 20% more than BMW's K1600b bagger and costs more than the fully loaded Honda Goldwing, which is 20% less than a fully loaded Ultra Glide. The BMW & Honda are both 6 cylinder bikes that are better in every way. If you want a big sexy twin cylinder tourer, a Moto Guzzi California is nearly 15% cheaper than the Road King Classic in Europe now.