How to Buy and live with a Superbike in India

black12rr · 9th July 2007, 12:18

counter steer is basics ? ,if you are telling this to a mature rider agreed , but any one whose doing it for the first time or novice , they should just forget this for the time being.Have you tried countersteer on our roads?
how about leaning into the curve , braking and downshift to be done before entering the curve and little pressure on the outside foot peg you will find the tyres dig more into the tarmac. should we be talking these ?

Can you tell us how to countersteer here ?

I thinkwe are going OT , we should have a separate thread for "how to ride " ?

Steeroid · 9th July 2007, 12:22

Just saw this thread - dont know how I missed it

.

Great work there, Rtech. Lots of useful stuff.

I agree with black12rr - things like counter-steer shouldnt be talked about. There are some things that come to you with experience, or if you go to a riding school. If a novice tries some of these things based on what he or she reads, they can hurt themselves real bad.

Counter-steer comes with instinct, once you've ridden long enough. So do some other techniques - you either get it with instinct, or you're taught by older riders in the pack, or you go to a riding school once you get your SBK. The last is not an option in India, so we have to stick to 1 and 2.

Rtech · 9th July 2007, 12:31

Quote:

counter steer is basics ? .......Have you tried countersteer on our roads?

Read my post on counter-steering again. It's not a case of someone deciding that he is going to counter-steer today. Each and every rider does this. Basic laws of gyroscopic and centrifugal force dictate that this is needed to maneuver a bike once above a certain speed. It's simply a case of understanding what is happening.

Their are a thousand articles that explain it in far more detail that I have, and it would only be beneficial if people read them and learn. Here's a start: Countersteering - wiki

Quote:

how above leaning into the curve , braking and downshift to be done before entering the curve and little pressure on the outside foor peg you will find the tyres dig more into the tarmac. should we be taking these ?

Again, on a superbike, you will need to lean into a curve if you plan on maintaining even the lowest of speed limits on public roads. By not talking about it or making it out to be some sort of super advanced theory, you are simply planting fear into the mind of the novice rider.

These are things that should actually come automatically. Just by riding and getting a feel of when and where the bike is most comfortable. We then perfect it by learning exactly what goes into this and once we understand, we know where we have to improve ourselves.

Also, this article is about buying and living with a superbike. I would hope that a person about to purchase an expensive, powerful and very fast motorcycle would indeed know a bit about riding. If not, then maybe what's posted here will make the person want to learn more.

Rtech · 9th July 2007, 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gerardfdz

Great Article Robin!- written with "ears of experience!
Getting set to hit the big ones!!!

What about ISI!

Gerard, I was hoping to have you contributing here in full force. Afterall, you do have far more years & ears of experience than I do!

About ISI, well, ok...if nothing better is available

whitesquall · 9th July 2007, 14:48

Hi Rtech and Veyron1,

This is one quality post which is going to help millions of people, hats-off to you two. . . . Can't wait to get my hands on to YAMAHA when it reaches India . .

Gerardfdz · 9th July 2007, 15:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rtech

Gerard, I was hoping to have you contributing here in full force. Afterall, you do have far more years & ears of experience than I do!

Sorry - Robin! - While I would love to be active here I still need feel the pulse of things to make more time to contribute here - Presently the chain gang gets most attention!

Gerardfdz · 9th July 2007, 16:15

Quote:

counter steer is basics ? ,if you are telling this to a mature rider agreed , but any one whose doing it for the first time or novice , they should just forget this for the time being Have you tried countersteer on our roads?

firstly -If you have not been counter steering then you have been riding slower than ME!

Secondly

Quote:

they should just forget this for the time being

so when should they learn this?? After they turn Pro! -Or worse still after a few spills!

Quote:

Even the most advanced riders consider they learn something every time they ride. With practice you'll continually improve, but knowing where to begin can be difficult.

Quote:

I thinkwe are going OT , we should have a separate thread for "how to ride " ?

Yes this makes Perfect sense! Then again there's the whole wide world of the internet!

Motorcycle training - positioning and cornering tips

Jaggu · 9th July 2007, 16:17

i missed this out, great work RT.

A small contribution from my side: always carry a good chamois leather or a soft and absorbent cloth in the bag, useful to clean the visor (in and out) as well as the bike tank and seats in rains and those long rides.

Gerardfdz · 9th July 2007, 16:30

Quote:

Can you tell us how to countersteer here (Coastal Karnataka National Highways) ?

Just an observation - I could be wrong - dont have my glasses on (-but then age permits us to say what we like!)
Look at the last pic in that post the guys on the Bajaj M50/80 See the lean compared to the arms of the rider -If that is not counter steer - then I back to my Gypsy!!!

Rtech · 9th July 2007, 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12rr

Can you tell us how to countersteer here (Coastal Karnataka National Highways) ?

Answered perfectly by Gerard above! But seriously 12rr, have you even read through that link I posted? Please do so and try and understand what counter-steering really is. You will then understand that it has nothing to do with what you ride. Heck, even the cyclists in the tour-de-france counter-steer. Used this a an example as the Tour has just begun, so you can catch them on TV everyday and observe how they tackle the flowing turns.

varun_patra · 11th July 2007, 02:39

Hi Rtech ... A friend of mine has seen a 2003 R6 for 2400$ in malaysia , Thats around 97000 Indian rupees . If the import duties are 100% on 2nd hand bikes ... bringing the bike down would cost him around 2 lakhs right? How much would he have to spend in the registration after that ? I wanna know what the total cost of the bike would be ?

Import duty - ?
Registration - ?
Frieght charges ( From malaysia to india , An estimate if possible ) - ?
Any other registration formalities ?

What would the total cost be if the bike cost a Lakh Keeping aside the frieght charges ?

revvhed · 11th July 2007, 10:13

it's been said a hundred times before .. i know, but i must say it again .. what a brilliant, well written, quality post .. from someone who obviously knows what he's talking about .. thoroughly enjoyed reading it .. cheers

Rtech · 11th July 2007, 10:54

Varun, the duty calculated on a bike is, I believe, taken on the list price of that bike when it was manufactured. i.e. If the bike in question is a 2003 R6, the customs will calculate the duty based on the price of that bike when new in 2003. They then calculate depreciation on it as per their fixed scale and arrive at the final figure.

Other fee's and levies would also apply which increases the price. Registration varies from state to state and city to city. Plus, being India, i'm sure a bit of chai paani is necessary in order to get things moving or else the bike would remain in the customs warehouse for months.

We do have some importers on the forum, so lets hope they can chip in with their first hand experiences.

Sks_Biker · 11th July 2007, 12:38

@varun_patra: You've got my eyes popping out! 2003 R1 for that low price. I'm guessing its a Thai registered bike illegally sold in Malaysia.

Make sure the papers are in order first.

manson · 11th July 2007, 13:21

Sks, varun is talking about a 03 r6, not r1.

Varun, one cannot bring in a vehicle older than four years unless its being brought down on transfer of residence.

Now coming to the procedure;
say a brand new r1 is valued at 10000 usd, you get 10 percent depreciation for each year, in this case 40 percent, which is calculated on the reducing balance method.
So now, the bike will be valued at 6,500 usd.
On this the custom from what i last heard would charge you 160 percent duty, which would workout to 10,400 usd.
So now the bike has already costed you a whopping 16,900 usd.
To this now you add the shipping expenses, say 1,000 usd (inclusive of your clearing and forwarding charges), road tax, which is 21 percent (3 times 7 percent for imports) of your landed value of 16,900 usd, thjat works out to a little over 3500 usd.
So now your total purchase cost has turned out to be a crazy 21,400 x 40 (exchange rate at best) 8,56,000, and we yet have our chai paani lads waiting for you.

at the same time, i am certain you can find a 03 r1 for 6-6.5 without any haggling around and with similar paperwork, and without doing any running around too.

please note that the above mentioned procedure is for a set of very clean papers, and i could be sorta off on things, so experts please make corrections where applicable.

manson.

9th July 2007, 12:18	#46
black12rr Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Ridin earth now Posts: 1,278 Thanked: 339 Times	counter steer is basics ? ,if you are telling this to a mature rider agreed , but any one whose doing it for the first time or novice , they should just forget this for the time being.Have you tried countersteer on our roads? how about leaning into the curve , braking and downshift to be done before entering the curve and little pressure on the outside foot peg you will find the tyres dig more into the tarmac. should we be talking these ? Can you tell us how to countersteer here ? I thinkwe are going OT , we should have a separate thread for "how to ride " ? Last edited by black12rr : 9th July 2007 at 12:27.
	() Thanks

9th July 2007, 12:22	#47
Steeroid Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: N.A Posts: 7,046 Thanked: 2,751 Times	Just saw this thread - dont know how I missed it . Great work there, Rtech. Lots of useful stuff. I agree with black12rr - things like counter-steer shouldnt be talked about. There are some things that come to you with experience, or if you go to a riding school. If a novice tries some of these things based on what he or she reads, they can hurt themselves real bad. Counter-steer comes with instinct, once you've ridden long enough. So do some other techniques - you either get it with instinct, or you're taught by older riders in the pack, or you go to a riding school once you get your SBK. The last is not an option in India, so we have to stick to 1 and 2.
	() Thanks

9th July 2007, 14:48	#50
whitesquall BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Bangalore/Gulbarga Posts: 167 Thanked: 34 Times	Hi Rtech and Veyron1, This is one quality post which is going to help millions of people, hats-off to you two. . . . Can't wait to get my hands on to YAMAHA when it reaches India . .
	() Thanks

9th July 2007, 16:17	#53
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,907 Times	i missed this out, great work RT. A small contribution from my side: always carry a good chamois leather or a soft and absorbent cloth in the bag, useful to clean the visor (in and out) as well as the bike tank and seats in rains and those long rides.
	() Thanks

11th July 2007, 02:39	#56
varun_patra BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: mumbai Posts: 469 Thanked: 5 Times	Hi Rtech ... A friend of mine has seen a 2003 R6 for 2400$ in malaysia , Thats around 97000 Indian rupees . If the import duties are 100% on 2nd hand bikes ... bringing the bike down would cost him around 2 lakhs right? How much would he have to spend in the registration after that ? I wanna know what the total cost of the bike would be ? Import duty - ? Registration - ? Frieght charges ( From malaysia to india , An estimate if possible ) - ? Any other registration formalities ? What would the total cost be if the bike cost a Lakh Keeping aside the frieght charges ?
	() Thanks

11th July 2007, 10:13	#57
revvhed BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Mumbai Posts: 184 Thanked: 30 Times	brilliant .. it's been said a hundred times before .. i know, but i must say it again .. what a brilliant, well written, quality post .. from someone who obviously knows what he's talking about .. thoroughly enjoyed reading it .. cheers
	() Thanks

11th July 2007, 10:54	#58
Rtech Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 5,770 Thanked: 359 Times View My Garage	Varun, the duty calculated on a bike is, I believe, taken on the list price of that bike when it was manufactured. i.e. If the bike in question is a 2003 R6, the customs will calculate the duty based on the price of that bike when new in 2003. They then calculate depreciation on it as per their fixed scale and arrive at the final figure. Other fee's and levies would also apply which increases the price. Registration varies from state to state and city to city. Plus, being India, i'm sure a bit of chai paani is necessary in order to get things moving or else the bike would remain in the customs warehouse for months. We do have some importers on the forum, so lets hope they can chip in with their first hand experiences.
	() Thanks

11th July 2007, 12:38	#59
Sks_Biker BHPian Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bangalore, India Posts: 113 Thanked: 47 Times	@varun_patra: You've got my eyes popping out! 2003 R1 for that low price. I'm guessing its a Thai registered bike illegally sold in Malaysia. Make sure the papers are in order first.
	() Thanks

11th July 2007, 13:21	#60
manson Team-BHP Support Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 3,934 Thanked: 4,169 Times View My Garage	Sks, varun is talking about a 03 r6, not r1. Varun, one cannot bring in a vehicle older than four years unless its being brought down on transfer of residence. Now coming to the procedure; say a brand new r1 is valued at 10000 usd, you get 10 percent depreciation for each year, in this case 40 percent, which is calculated on the reducing balance method. So now, the bike will be valued at 6,500 usd. On this the custom from what i last heard would charge you 160 percent duty, which would workout to 10,400 usd. So now the bike has already costed you a whopping 16,900 usd. To this now you add the shipping expenses, say 1,000 usd (inclusive of your clearing and forwarding charges), road tax, which is 21 percent (3 times 7 percent for imports) of your landed value of 16,900 usd, thjat works out to a little over 3500 usd. So now your total purchase cost has turned out to be a crazy 21,400 x 40 (exchange rate at best) 8,56,000, and we yet have our chai paani lads waiting for you. at the same time, i am certain you can find a 03 r1 for 6-6.5 without any haggling around and with similar paperwork, and without doing any running around too. please note that the above mentioned procedure is for a set of very clean papers, and i could be sorta off on things, so experts please make corrections where applicable. manson. Last edited by manson : 11th July 2007 at 13:32.
	() Thanks