[GeeTee TSI]

Very interesting journey of shortlist and eventual decision. Some of my reflections stem from intrigue and not aimed at picking holes at your decision.
Running cost criterion (2.0TSI) is a bit puzzling considering the budget on hand as stated, the delta due to single digit city drive FEs would have been but small change. I know the Scorpio N punches above its weight and is a fantastic package, but I wonder how one can 'unsee' the in-cabin experience and convenience features of 2 (nigh 3) segments above, especially after alluding to plastic quality in the Hycross.

Really appreciate the objectivity in the decision

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by Driver 33

The budget is flexible, and we have explored SUVs and MUVs ranging from 25 lakhs to 1.4 crores.

BMW X5: main reasons for rejection are inclined rear seats and complicated touch screen which one needs to go

Your analysis is correct. For a proper rear seat, you must get an X7.

a lot of sub menu's to do a simple task which is complicated for someone that is over 50 years old.

They will have newer ones with 8,5, which is different. It's a shame that the dealerships cannot update their demo cars with 8,5, which is an easy fix.

Also didn’t offer blind spot detection and ADAS level 2 for 1,35,00,000/- car.

Well, most of these features are missing on even the higher segment, like an X7.

Mahindra XUV 700: We drove the diesel top end that offers a 2.2L Mhawk engine, which didn't offer the best insulation and the exterior didn't look aesthetically pleasing.

I would not like my son to recommend me a Mahindra . Better avoid. Premium cars are expensive for a reason. You cannot see a value in everything. Flying coach gets you to the same destination in the same time as Business.


I will suggest you check Jeep Grand Cherokee, given the high discounts.

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...ml#post5674295 (The "NEW" Car Price Check Thread - Track Price Changes, Discounts, Offers & Deals)

[Driver 33]

Originally Posted by GeeTee TSI

Running cost criterion (2.0TSI) is a bit puzzling considering the budget on hand as stated, the delta due to single digit city drive FEs would have been but small change. I know the Scorpio N punches above its weight and is a fantastic package, but I wonder how one can 'unsee' the in-cabin experience and convenience features of 2 (nigh 3) segments above, especially after alluding to plastic quality in the Hycross.

Originally Posted by Driver 33

In the 2-litre petrol segment, I first got my hands on the B48 engine, after driving this engine I've seen no other 2-litre petrol engine that is as refined, reliable, and efficient as this one. I am not a fan of VW 2 and 3 litre petrol engines, the main reason would be the reliability and efficiency which is a deal breaker for me. We've already got relatively aged cars to maintain, we wouldn't want something like this in our lineup next.

It's not only about fuel economy nor the running cost, it's about what I get for the price paid and specifications of the engine. Being a 190hp car, that fuel economy and reliability is dissatisfactory. This kind of running cost associated with EA888 gen 3 is understandable if the engine has a peak output of upwards 240bhp.

Coming to the Innova Hycross the plastic quality is deplorable for 38L-40L car. I've noticed Kia Sonet has much better plastic quality compared to the Innova Hycross which costs half the price.

[vicky.bahl]

Surprised that a good discount in December on an Audi Q7 was not on your list. It's pure pleasure at the back, 7 seater, and massive massive space with an extremely powerful mild hybrid engine at sub 1 crore price

[Driver 33]

Update: Cancelled Scorpio N booking due to the following reasons

1) Lack of protection offered:









Scorpio N ANCAP report

2) Noted lot of QC issues from the brand, especially regarding safety:

Scorpio N QC and safety issues

Upper wishbone joint failure (Mahindra Scorpio-N suspension | Upper wishbone joint failure)

Airbags didn't deploy during a fatal crash

Another case of fatal crash, chassis bent and airbags didn't open (My Mahindra ScorpioN crashed into stationary car on bridge | Chassis bent | Need advice)

Owner loses leg due to suspension failure and fatal crash into guiderail (Owner loses leg after Mahindra Scorpio-N crashes into barrier due to *alleged* suspension failure)

Fatal crash in a Scorpio classic, been found out that no airbags have been installed in the vehicle, shows the quality of QC the company is offering (Case registered against Anand Mahindra | Car owner alleges his Scorpio is missing airbags)

3) Final verdict:

I've understood that there's no SUV in the entire market that offers VFM. One needs to pay the overpriced tag and get an SUV as of today in the market.

It's understandable for my family and me to compromise in power, luxury, and comfort due to the higher taxes one needs to pay in the Indian market to get a luxury SUV which loses its VFM naturally. We've understood that we don't need to compromise on safety in getting an SUV.

I like the car but was disappointed in its QC and safety issues, as a European car user for the past 7 years, I've personally noticed that our Indian brands are doing good products for consumers but also noticed that we lack the finesse in our products, I'm looking forward for it to recover in the next coming years and hopefully we can compete strongly in the foreign markets.

I'm open to suggestions from our fellow BHPians and I would like to read more suggestions.

[Driver 33]

Originally Posted by vicky.bahl

Surprised that a good discount in December on an Audi Q7 was not on your list. It's pure pleasure at the back, 7 seater, and massive massive space with an extremely powerful mild hybrid engine at sub 1 crore price

I recently test drove the Q7, and while it was amazing to drive, the running costs for daily city and highway commuting were considerably high. Subsequently, I also had the opportunity to test drive the Q5. I was impressed by its practicality, and the available discounts made it an attractive option.

One notable aspect was the EA888 longitudinally mounted engine featured in the Q5, coupled with the quattro technology. It exhibited a higher level of refinement and provided better fuel efficiency compared to the Tiguan and Kodiaq. The Q5's engine, complemented by the quattro technology, stood out for its balance of performance and fuel efficiency.

[vikeva027]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

We were in the same boat and bought Tiguan for site visits, long trips, etc.
Have been super happy - so much so that dad uses it every opportunity he gets despite having a Lexus ES as his daily along with a driver.

I have heard/read a lot about Tiguan's DSG gearbox issues. What are your thoughts about it? I am too kind of considering a pre-owned diesel 2019/2020 model.

[lamborghini]

Originally Posted by vikeva027

I have heard/read a lot about Tiguan's DSG gearbox issues. What are your thoughts about it? I am too kind of considering a pre-owned diesel 2019/2020 model.

I haven't come across any major issues pertaining to the DQ500 gearbox on the TDi Tiguan. Could you please point me if I've missed any thread?

[vikeva027]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

I haven't come across any major issues pertaining to the DQ500 gearbox on the TDi Tiguan. Could you please point me if I've missed any thread?

Here are a few. I can park some money to get it fixed twice in a lifetime (100K Kms) but reading a few of the comments also points out that the parts take forever to come and the car has to be in the service centre for weeks.

• https://www.team-bhp.com/news/my-tig...ability-fix-it
• https://www.team-bhp.com/news/frustr...ill-not-solved
• https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...-pleasure.html (VW-Skoda DSG problems galore! But what else to buy in the 20 - 40L segment for driving pleasure?)
• https://www.mytiguan.com/threads/dsg-gearboxes.1475/
• https://www.quora.com/Why-does-the-D...ability-issues

[lamborghini]

Originally Posted by vikeva027

• https://www.team-bhp.com/news/my-tig...ability-fix-it
• https://www.team-bhp.com/news/frustr...ill-not-solved
• https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...-pleasure.html (VW-Skoda DSG problems galore! But what else to buy in the 20 - 40L segment for driving pleasure?)
• https://www.mytiguan.com/threads/dsg-gearboxes.1475/
• https://www.quora.com/Why-does-the-D...ability-issues

Most of these are pertaining to the DSG gearboxes used on the TSi VAG cars - items 1&2 are the same car - Tiguan All Space TSi (DQ381?) belonging to BHPian Dhruv; item 3 is asking for opinions - OP being an owner of the Superb 1.8TSi which came with the super unreliable DQ200 (Found on 1.2TSi, 1.5TSi, 1.8TSi engines); fourth link is for Canada - not sure which spec but it will mostly be a petrol model since USA/Canada love petrols + the query is a general one asking why not dsg equipped tiguan; and fifth link is a general one and a lot of flak is by DQ200 guys.

We should keep in mind that Skoda/VAG has come under flak for the DSG reviews - but also because they were one of the first companies to give mass market a DSG option in a world of CVT/TC.
Now as it becomes more mainstream - you will hear of DSG issues arising in every company including Ford, Hyundai, etc.
Dry clutch DSG like on the DQ200 (and other manufacturers sold in India from Jeep to Hyundai) are notorious for overheating and giving up. Hyundai/Kia supposedly silently removed the DSG overheat indicator on their models which was plaguing many owners in their early days.
If it helps, even CVT have come under flak globally with Nissan/Honda being at the receiving end.
Hence when buying any car it is crucial to do research on the engine/gearbox options as well as that is what can impact perceived reliability along with electrical gremlins.

Coming to the Tiguan TDi - the wet clutch DQ500 so far seems to be a fairly reliable. Failure is of course possible with everything mechanical - there has been a case of the mightly Innova TC gearbox failing at a cost of Rs. 4L to repair IIRC! - and the DQ500 seems to be doing fairly well and with proper care and routine maintenance should last a long time similar to the DQ250 (used on FWD VAG cars with 2.0TDi engines - Laura, Superb, etc.).
Plus also with the advent of these DSGs & rise in autos in general - we are seeing some small independents coming into the game who specialize and focus on such gearboxes so hopefully quality repair could become a possibility over replacement soon!