[vinya_jag]

Originally Posted by BhaskarGoswami

4. Today during my drive back from work, a new issue cropped up. The car was crawling at very slow speed in bumper to bumper evening traffic. All of a sudden, the car went DEAD. Literally. The engine was off, headlights went off, ICE was off, and the car did not respond any ignition input from the key. It behaved as if there was no battery in the car. After about 3 minutes, the car came back to life. The lights turned on, speedometer console tuned on, and the car responded to ignition. I drove off from the traffic and inspected the battery connections. All well and good. To me it felt like the car software restarted in the middle of the road.

This reminded me of our Figo that we had. (Still on my profile Pic). It was a petrol Figo which had run about 60K, before we sold it off, for an upgrade.
We had faced this exact issue thrice in those 5 years of ownership. At once, the Electronics would go dead, Engine shut off, steering would lose its power assist (Hydraulic assist it was), Breaks would go hard, and then, stop and restart, the car would behave perfectly fine.

I faced it twice, and my wife had faced it once. We were scared, but since it was not a common occurrence, we had ignored it. At the service station, when we told the advisor, I remember, he only had giggled.

Luckily, all the three times, it happened at very low crawling speeds, and recovered with just the ignition OFF/ON.

[arjab]

Originally Posted by BhaskarGoswami

Here is the update after visiting Hyundai workshop yesterday:

Regarding the AMT issue: There went a lot of trial and error troubleshooting for the AMT issue. The manager contacted some technical expert from HQ over phone and was personally looking after the matter. The biggest problem was that it is not reproduce-able.

Dear Bhaskar,
Can you please ask your service station personnel to run your car on a substitute new battery and check the performance? AMT's are very sensitive to voltage drops and even a minor drop in voltage will lead to all sorts of complications as the actuators do not get sufficient voltage to "work". And the Hyundai AMT unit is an electrically operated unit.
Request your service station to check your car's "cranking voltage" with a simple multimeter, not the static voltage. The cranking voltage should not drop below 11-11.1volts.
If the voltage drops below 11v, you need to change your battery, (which is highly possible because I assume your vehicle was practically unused during the lockdown period right? And Lead-Acid battery's self discharge is much higher compared to any other battery chemistry)

[Maverick Avi]

While I was on the lookout for small auto hatch Nios AMT really impressed me in all aspects. The only reason I opted for Wagon R 1.2 AMT was that Hyundai's AMT was relatively new and going by the nature of this technology they need time to sort initial teething issues. Maruti faced the same challenge with Celerio but their new AMT cars are comparably more reliable.

Good that you have 4 yrs warranty. The 2nd service center also seems more inclined to solve your issue. Hope you get a diagnosis and a permanent fix.

[BoJack]

A friend of mine also experienced many problems with the amt gearbox in his santro and told us not to buy one when we were in the market for a small automatic hatchback. So we went and bought a Tata tiago instead.

[rudhraas]

Originally Posted by BhaskarGoswami

This is my first post in team-bhp. I own a Santro AMT Sportz (MY 2019), and I think that I should share my horror story with you guys.

Hi ,
I have the same 2019 Hyundai Santro Sportz AMT. Currently odo is around 21300 KMs . It is my primary car to drive for work and to use on weekends.
I would like to mention that I have never had any issues with AMT or otherwise. I stay in Mumbai and I have taken my Santro AMT on small trips such as Pune and Mahabaleshwar , on medium length trips like to SHIRDI and on long trips(850+ KMs) to Bhopal (my hometown, last diwali!).
My daily drive to work is around 50 kms to and fro from my office and I visit Site office (Dusty approach roads!!) minimum once a week which is around 50 kms one side and never had any issue with AMT. I drive the AMT on a daily basis in Mumbai's Bumper to Bumper traffic.
I am giving all this information because I believe the problem is not with AMT gearbox. AMT may not be responding because either it is not getting constant voltage required or some sensor is faulty. My guess is you check and replace your brake sensor since proper working of brake sensor is directly related with AMT getting engaged from N to D . (Even in normal driving conditions,AMT wont switch to D if brake sensor doesnt give a signal that brake pedal is pressed).
Hope it helps.

I have had a wonderful experience with my Santro AMT and hoping the same for you in future.

[BhaskarG]

Originally Posted by arjab

If the voltage drops below 11v, you need to change your battery, (which is highly possible because I assume your vehicle was practically unused during the lockdown period right? And Lead-Acid battery's self discharge is much higher compared to any other battery chemistry)

Originally Posted by rudhraas

I am giving all this information because I believe the problem is not with AMT gearbox. AMT may not be responding because either it is not getting constant voltage required or some sensor is faulty.

Thank you!!

Rightly pointed out. I think both the issues (gearbox and power failure) are connected, because Hyundai is using electric actuators and interrupted battery output may affect the actuators. The only problem for me is that the service centre guys were unable to diagnose the issue properly. I let us hope that the issue does not re-occur.

[arjab]

Originally Posted by BhaskarGoswami

The only problem for me is that the service centre guys were unable to diagnose the issue properly. I let us hope that the issue does not re-occur.

Service centre will not be able to. Visit a good battery reseller. Tell them to check up your car's battery and also the cranking voltage drop. They'll do it. If it is 11.4v or
below give your battery for a bench charge. If that doesn't work, replace your battery.
Best regards,

[BhaskarG]

Update: I have completed 4500 kms after visiting the last Hyundai Service Centre, and the issue has not re-occurred. Seems like the issue is solved for good.

My genuine thanks to the Oja Hyundai team! I have found a good service centre after all.

[varkey]

Something similar happened to my sister's Santro Sportz AMT (same 2019 model) as well.

1. Intermittent loss of power, the vehicle doesn't respond to throttle input.
2. Vehicle broke down and refused to start, had to call RSA.
3. At times its as though the vehicle restarts with all the lights in the instrument cluster lit up and then goes off, similar to how it happens when the vehicle is started for the first time.
4. Showed a battery discharge warning in the ICE display same as the warning that pops up if you operate the ICE with the engine switched off.

The car was taken to the Popular Hyundai ASC, Kottayam service centre numerous times for this issue. First time they said, the scan didn't show any errors, if it repeats bring the car back. After a week or so, again the same issue and this time they cleaned some connector. Next day same issue, this time they replaced the connector and while driving back, stopped at a shop and car refused to start. They said the alternator is working well, not seeing any major issues. Then they took it back to the ASC, said they would be doing a more thorough scan and will be co-ordinating with Hyundai engineers, kept the car for two days and finally told that its due to a bad battery. Apparently the AMT is heavily dependent on the battery even while the car is running. If the battery is not able to handle the surge or voltage drops, it affects the AMT it seems. The battery was only 3 years old, vehicle was purchased in early 2019.

They replaced the battery and assured it would be fixed. As the battery warranty had expired, had to pay Rs 4380 for it. Although it took a while to diagnose, Popular Hyundai picked and dropped the vehicle each time, all work was done free of charge except for the material cost for the new battery.

[BhaskarG]

Originally Posted by varkey

Something similar happened to my sister's Santro Sportz AMT (same 2019 model) as well.
<snip>
Apparently the AMT is heavily dependent on the battery even while the car is running. If the battery is not able to handle the surge or voltage drops, it affects the AMT it seems.

You are absolutely correct. I too found out that later.

The Hyundai's AMT unit is electrically actuated, against Tata and Maruti's hydraulic units. So the shifts are super fast. Now there is a downside to this. Whenever the shifts happens, it requires a good amount of power. And hence the battery needs to be in charged condition. What I found out is that whenever you drain out the batteries (like using the ICE without the engine running, keeping the lights on etc) there is a small probability of this (incomplete shifts) happening. It automatically corrects itself when batteries are sufficiently charged, that is, after keeping the engine on for sometime. This explains why this problem gets corrected after trying for 10 minutes or so. Service centre technicians were initially puzzled, but later they found that issue was with the battery only.

I even put this to test. Keep your headlights on, and try to shift from D to R and back to D. You will observe that your headlights will dim when the shift happens. (Maybe not if battery is brand new). So, my take home gyan from this incident is that if you drive AMT with electric actuators, DO NOT drain your battery. Simple.

Hope this helps all other owners out there. This is just a simple precaution that we need to take. Even if it happens, just we need to keep the engine on, and let the battery charge a bit.

[rudhraas]

SEPT 2022 UPDATE:-

So, after 3.5 years of smooth running , my Santro Sportz AMT have started to face the issue of not shifting from N to D.
Few points to note are:-

1. The issue only happens "initially", when after starting ignition I have to shift from N to D mode.
2. It has happened twice till now, and both the times I have been either parked or waiting at a red light with the engine shut off to save fuel and with ICE and AC Blower on which probably drained the battery.
3. As I already had an idea that issue is with the battery voltage, the third time it happened , I was mentally prepared, and as soon as gearbox refused to shift from N to D, I switched off the blower and ICE to stop anything guzzling my battery and revved the engine 6-8 times till 4-4.5 k , after that the shift started happening normally.
4. Once the car is running and Battery voltage is restored, the shifts etc never gives any kind of problem.
5. If you face such an issue, it is my advice to not keep on shutting the ignition on and off in hopes to get a shift from N to D, it further drains your battery and shift will take longer.
6. As a precursor to the shift issue, from about 2 months before I started noticing that when I start my car first time in the morning, the clutch had slight hesitation in creeping forward for a first couple of seconds and a slight jerk is felt. I think this is probably related to battery voltage and can be considered a sign that battery is not in a good condition.
7. The "hesitant creep" issue mentioned in point no. 6 happened after a couple of months of moving to a new city where in the daily car running is very less i.e. about 2 -2.5kms total since my office is very close to my residence. So I am guessing, due to low running, the battery doesn't get enough time to charge.

So finally , I am planning to replace my Battery.
Hope the above information is useful.

[VPJ74]

Originally Posted by rudhraas

SEPT 2022 UPDATE:-
So, after 3.5 years of smooth running , my Santro Sportz AMT have started to face the issue of not shifting from N to D.

Thank you for your update.

Besides the battery-driven Shift issue, how has your AMT performed? How is the handling, shifting, predictability of the AMT?

What feedback and assurance have you received from Hyundai reg. This issue?

Regards

[rudhraas]

Originally Posted by VPJ74

Thank you for your update.

Besides the battery-driven Shift issue, how has your AMT performed? How is the handling, shifting, predictability of the AMT?

What feedback and assurance have you received from Hyundai reg. This issue?

Regards

Hi,
Amt has worked quite decently. The battery issue as mentioned cropped up after 3.5 years. Before that amt was as reliable as a manual. Shifting was ok too. I think by their very nature AMTs are quite predictable. After driving for a couple of months or so you can guess what throttle input , will result in what behaviour. And the amt learns quite swiftly too. After reaching about 2000 rpm just lift your foot of the throttle slightly and amt will squeeze in the upshift pretty seamlessly.
And after battery replacement, no problem whatsoever.
Where I feel santro is slightly lacking after a long term stint, is the engine nature. This is a engine which is quite tractable but its best driven with a relaxed pace. It is not an engine which likes to be revved. So you must make sure you get a td and get a feel for the nature of the engine.
Regards.

[BhaskarG]

Engine Overhaul at 58000 kms:

Background: I am driving a 2019 Hyundai Santro. I was among the very first who posted regarding Hyundai's AMT issues (that I faced in my Santro). Many others later reported similar incidents in their Santros, but later we found out (by hit and trial) that it is not a major issue, and can be prevented by not allowing the battery to drain.


Now here is a BIG update:

The engine needs overhauling at 58000 kms within warranty period. It is currently under repair at Oja Hyundai, Guwahati workshop. The issue came to light during the 50000 kms routine service, where I noticed that the engine oil was extremely low. The car had been regularly serviced as per schedule. The SA told me to keep on driving and report any future drop in engine oil levels. After few months, at about 57000 kms, I pulled in again into the workshop on seeing the Low Engine Oil light glow up. On draining, they found less than half a litre of oil remaining.

The service centre replaced the oil, and asked me to come back after 2 months with observations, and also because the workshop was fully occupied at the moment. However, oil levels kept dropping. I brought the car back to the workshop after one month itself, at 58000 kms. I pressed for repair under warranty and and half engine (head) replacement if necessary. Head replacement was ruled out, but I was assured that engine will be properly rebuilt with all necessary parts. The car was handed over to the workshop on 2nd November.

Current status: The warranty approval process took about 7-10 days, post some compression tests. And then it took another 10-11 days for the parts to arrive. Currently, the block is sent to lathe. I am expecting another weeks time till the car is ready.

Courtesy car: I am trying my best not to make it sound like a grumpy complaint, but Oja Hyundai did not even have the courtesy to offer me a courtesy car for the duration. I understand that the dealer/workshop is not obliged to give a courtesy car, but it is also true that my car was down without any fault on my part. This work is being done under warranty, and dealer already knew it would take more than a months time. I finally got a loaner car after 24 days, that too after mailing the matter to HMIL. Thank you, finally.

Reason: The workshop could not identify any reason why this happened at just 50000 kms. They assumed that there may be some defect in the manufacturing itself. Since I am not a technical person, I just hope that the workshop will do a good job.

This may be an isolated incident of this particular car, or maybe not. The same workshop already had another Santro of almost similar mileage which was undergoing engine overhaul, too. It is worth noting that the new generation Santro was launched in late 2018, and my car being of early 2019, was of the very first batches. Considering Covid19 and lockdowns in 2020, I can assume that most Santros are not driven much. As such my Santro with a mileage of 58000 kms maybe one of the high mileage ones. And the information that another one is in the same workshop for the same work, will be disturbing news for many Santro owners, to say the least.


Here are some photos:


Compression tests:






Detaching:






Parts ordered:




Struggle for the courtesy car:




Please note: This post is meant for information only. This post is not intended for defamation of any kind to any party. Also I am not a technical person, and so my words may not be 100% accurate.
Note to the Mods: May move to suitable thread/section, if required.

[BhaskarG]

Update: engine assembled and mounted. I took a small test drive, and I found it to be smooth and without any unwanted sounds. Torque seemed normal. Some vibrations were there, though not excessive.

The workshop has informed that it will take few more days to get approval from Hyundai for handover. Meanwhile, anything that I should watch out for?