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Old 7th June 2021, 09:51   #1
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Default Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

Balamurali drops in this unique query via our share page!

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Hi Team-BHP,

I have been following this forum for more than a decade now and it has always influenced my purchase decisions. I really appreciate the quality content and technical narrative by members.

I was recently searching for an unusual topic throughout the web i.e. Removing the AMT module from my car. Reason = purchase was made pre-covid. Now that the situation has changed and expected daily travel in traffic has reduced greatly, I would like to get back to the joy of shifting an MT. Rather than buying a manual car, removal of the AMT module should be possible (in theory) according to me. Since this is a unique topic without much content available online, would suggest to open a thread for experts to answer.

Regards,

Balamurali
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Old 7th June 2021, 10:49   #2
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Balamurali drops in this unique query via our share page!
It would be good if he mentions specifically which car does he have. Because not all AMTs are exactly the same.

Some manufacturers build AMTs as a simple add-on on a basic Manual Transmission (MT) gearbox. Whereas some AMT systems are more advanced, with the automation and sensors built in into various components and the whole system is designed from scratch as an AMT. Here, it may not be that easy to revert back to MT.

Here is a good article that mentions (with good details) how to convert a Manual Transmission (MT) to AMT: https://x-engineer.org/automotive-en...smissions-amt/

This article mentions the exact changes in the two system. This could be used as guide to understand the exact differences between your AMT and an MT, and check if if is possible to revert the steps mentioned here.

However, given the complexity of this process, I do not think it would be worth it. I would not recommend this at all. Thankfully, most AMTs have a manual shift button. Best is to use that. That way, you use the AMT only as an electronically actuated clutch system. But retain the shift logic in your hand. I think that is the best way to drive an AMT. The biggest drawbacks of existing AMTs are the terrible shift logics. If you take that in your hand, and let the electronically actuated clutch remain as it is, you may get the best of the both worlds. I would suggest try this for a few months and see if you like it, before deciding on something more drastic.

Last edited by Dr.AD : 7th June 2021 at 10:53.
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Old 7th June 2021, 13:03   #3
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

Technicalities apart, I would say a strong NO to this conversion if reduced traffic due to covid is the sole reason. There is no doubt that a time will come when traffic will go back to pre COVID times - may be in a couple of years. What will the OP do then?

Apart from unknown places where the conversion can go wrong, It will also result in warranty being null & void. This can be good as an experimental project, but definitely not recommended on a daily driver/only car of the family.

Its best to drive in manual mode of AMT, as suggested by Dr AD!

Last edited by AkMar : 7th June 2021 at 13:12.
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Old 7th June 2021, 13:25   #4
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

What would the owner do if traffic increases after lockdown is removed and traffic becomes normal after, say, 12 months from now?

It is not tires that we are speaking here, that you want to change very often, based on the type of roads that we drive, like for off-roading, different tires and for smooth highway roads, different tires. Changing AMT into manual gears is not advisable for the reasons mentioned or for any other reasons. The transmission system will be very complex and lot of mechatronics(mechanical changes and electronic changes including ecu and programming) will be impacted if you choose to go for change. And I will also like to highlight that no local mechanic or dealership will be competent to take up the job and give you factory finish to the car. They will also do lot of experiments and spoil the reliability of your car. In Summary, you will be wasting your money and scrapping the car, in my honest personal opinion.

I suggest to continue enjoying the AMT benefits without even thinking twice. You have made a right choice by having Automatic transmission car and it is ideal for city driving and long drives. So, if traffic is less, use it to your advantage and drive the automatic transmission car at right speed as per road conditions.

Last edited by gkveda : 7th June 2021 at 13:32.
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Old 7th June 2021, 13:32   #5
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

Traffic will definitely go back to pre-covid levels at some point in the next couple of years. So making such a drastic change in my opinion would not advisable. Removing the module is one part, also need to consider the feasibility and effort in retrofitting a clutch assembly again.

My suggestion to him: All AMT's have a manual mode. Drive full time in the manual mode in the lean traffic times and switch back to AT once traffic builds up.

Unrelated to the specific need, would be interesting to hear experts comments on whether it is even doable.
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Old 7th June 2021, 13:35   #6
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

I too will suggest not to tinker with the OE setup.

I have been going out on valid work during the lockdown, and today too I had stepped out a bit. There was a fair amount of traffic for a lockdown period. Like @gkveda and @Rajeevraj have said, traffic will return to normal in due course.
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Old 7th June 2021, 15:37   #7
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

The manual mode in AMT is as fast as pure manual gearbox with an added bonus of automatic downshift if speeds drop below the threshold for a gear. We have a tiago AMT and whenever I am bored or when there are fully loaded and driving in city, I find the manual mode to be relaxing as well as enjoyable
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Old 7th June 2021, 15:46   #8
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

In theory let me pickout the Celerio AMT for example for the ease of explanation.

What the hand does, the servo motors on top of the gearbox linkages do.

What the leg does, servo motors do with the clutch lever on top of the clutch assembly

If both the items are removed, clutch pedal with the clutch wire is added and manual linkages added with the entire shifter mechanism(Shifter is not expensive, I have gone mine changed in the Swift D because of play) it could be possible.

What I am thinking is, is the ECU different for Celerio AMT vs an MT since in the AMT, it needs inputs from a lot of parameters for it to shift, blip, downshift on its own etc, so if these items are removed, there would be a permanent error light that would be on or maybe the ECU won't allow the car to run at all?
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Old 7th June 2021, 16:00   #9
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

A big NO, to this juggard conversion if someone wants to wreck his car.

As Dr.AD has rightly pointed out, use the manual stick, to get your juices rushing.

I own 2 AMT cars and enjoy both the auto and manual stick.
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Old 7th June 2021, 16:11   #10
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

I know a way but it may take some time and effort to get it right. If you are lucky, you may do this conversion for a net no cost to you.

Step 1: List your car for sale

Step 2: Start looking for used cars listed for sale with similar mileage as yours. Ensure you only look for the MT version of the same model car. You may even look for the same color.

Step 3: Negotiate and close the deals.

If you are lucky, your AMT car's selling price could match or exceed your MT car's buying price in places where Auto transmissions are in demand.

Mr. Balamurali has not mentioned his exact car model so I am not sure whether it has a manual mode (Kwid AMT doesn't). So I cannot say if he can use it to replicate the gear shifts like a MT car. If it indeed has that mode, that would be my first suggestion and the above method in this post can be his 2nd choice. Apart from these, swapping MT to an AMT is not a straight forward job and depending on the model, it will call for change of too many parts and might even call for change of ECU. Unless he is willing to spend a significant amount of $$$ as well as time and still be ready to face niggles, I would not recommend it.

Last edited by nagr22 : 7th June 2021 at 16:15.
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Old 8th June 2021, 00:57   #11
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

Borrow a car from relatives or rent one (with precautions) for the fun of driving an MT. Traffic is going to hit peak again in a few months to 2 years.

Even if the OP plans to buy another AT car for the choc-a-bloc city traffic in the near future, I'd advise (against this conversion) buying a used MT car after selling his AMT car. That will ensure far greater reliability.
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Old 8th June 2021, 14:12   #12
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

I think Mr. Balamurali can decide on the pros and cons of doing the swap, and there are many sound reasons given by members on why he should keep his AMT as is and I have nothing further to add.
But just looking at the technical aspects, I think it is feasible.
TBHPian @akmits_bhp did something similar with his Santro AT. I would assume that converting an AMT to MT would be easier than converting an AT to MT. Additionally, someone would have to check if the ECU/TCU has to be reprogrammed or swapped out.

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techn...ic-manual.html (Converted my Santro Automatic to Manual!)
Here is a video about converting a Miata to a manual gearbox:
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Old 9th June 2021, 07:43   #13
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
It would be good if he mentions specifically which car does he have. Because not all AMTs are exactly the same.
Hey man, it's a Maruti Dzire AMT.
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Old 9th June 2021, 08:21   #14
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

There’s a saying in the vernacular which reads:

Once there was a man who was comfortably resting in his home after lunch when he decided to check out a sound from the nearby jungle..
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Old 9th June 2021, 09:01   #15
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Default Re: Possible to remove the AMT module and convert a car back to manual gearbox?

How about conversion from AT to MT in today's ECU laden cars?
Lets talk about my AT 2018 Honda city. What needs to be done to take out that CVT and get a manual transmission?
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