Missing on Fiat Adventure

gemithomas · 15th June 2007, 11:22

not sure typeO, the service centre guys told me this. not sure of the brand.

What do you guys think about the logic of the engine missing when the fan comes on? Its did not seem that convincing to me. anyways will check if the missing happens when the fan comes on.

My brother is in town and has taken my adventure

so i am now with the ford fusion. will check it out as soon as i am back wih my beast

.

Jaggu · 15th June 2007, 11:24

logic is aok and yes can happen, only thing is how to rectify it? as you said alternator rating and then also see if ecu has anything to fiddle with to adjust the voltage drop

.anshuman · 15th June 2007, 11:29

The most likely cause of missing is faulty spark plug cables,i had a similar problem i got the car scanned it did not work out,changed the whole set of cables at hyundai A.S.S chandigarh and it was fine.

Zappo · 15th June 2007, 14:13

Gemi... the engine skips a beat just because a fan comes on?! Uhuh... does not sound very convincing to me buddy. What is the rating of this fan? Lights dimming can be understood. But engine missing due to a fan coming on is sounding like a crappy logic to me. If that had been the case you would have seen this phenomenon everytime the fan came on at the particular RPM. Or else, even if you have an equal or higher rating power consuming device (say an amp) that you switched on at that RPM. This of course with the assumption that your engine is not just particularly averse to that poor fan alone.

Its got to be something else altogether. In all this while did you check the fuel lines at least ones? You sure its not a case of momentary airlock that is happening? A minor bubble once in a while maybe? Frankly speaking it has to be some trivial thing. Anything major would have come out with overwhelming symptoms by now IMO. It would not have been playing this hide and seek game with you.

P.S. : @.anshuman, your diagnosis would have been ok if this missing the beat would have been happening erratically once in a while. In this case it occurs only at a limited rev-range, that too not all the time. That is why I think its something very verrry trivial.

Jaggu · 15th June 2007, 15:00

low rpm, less voltage in the system, fan kicks in (it does take some good amount of power), system is drained out of power to give juice to engine. q

uite possible but shouldnt happen in a normal car, if its a flaw fiat will have something to resolve it.

i dont think air bubble in fuel line will cause this in EFI engines, with high pressure fuel pump and fuel injection

gemithomas · 18th June 2007, 10:07

talking about air bubble, i just thought about the fact that i have never been able to fill my tank. FIAT says 51 litres but i have never been able to put in more than 41 litres. And there seems to be a lot of air in the tank with the auto cut off kicking in every now and then.

Once i was out of town and had to fill my tank from a pump in an slightly interior place. That was the only time i felt tank was really full. The needle stayed at the full position for some time before it started falling (normally if i fill the tank the needle falls back to 3/4th by the time i cover around 50km.) But guess what, this time i ran about 200km and went to a pump in the city and he could not put in ever 1 litre!!!! the Auto cut off was coming on and i could see petrol up at the brim.!!!! So i think there should be some good amount of air getting into the tank But not sure what to do about this,

jobish · 29th January 2009, 22:02

I had a similar missing problem in my Palio. RF motors Cochin diagnosed a problem with the ignition coil. Changed the coil and is working fine. (cost around Rs.2500)

Regards
Jobish

gemithomas · 30th January 2009, 09:41

congrats. I tried changing the ignition coil but could not solve the problem. Dont understnad why different units going wrong give the same symptoms.

gemithomas · 26th April 2009, 11:09

Off late i have been experencing a mileage drop. THe last time i did a highway trip i got back and F.E of only around 9. THis is almost the same F.E that i am getting in City. Earlier i easily used to get around 13-15 on highways that too speeds around 100km/hr. THis time i maintained aroud 60-80 km/hr.

Some observations on behaviour.
- Clutch is really hard.
- The car jerks once in a while. There is no real pattern for this. While accelerating, the car just jerks for 3-4 times and then its normal. THis mostly happens when i am accelerating and taking a right turn together. Once in a while it happens on straight road acceleration also.
- Not sure if this is pshycological but i feel the car does not attain higher speeds (above 80) as easily as it used to. Earlier reaching 100 would take no time but now for anything above 80 i have to really try.

Any one has had simmilar experience? What could this be. Is there a problem?

planet_rocker · 27th April 2009, 11:20

this could be because of the heat. what speeds to you reach @ 2000rpm in each gear? my GTX's FE has dropped drastically as well - i got around 8.08kpl (50% AC).

check the fuel pump, air filter and the fuel filter.

vipul_singh · 27th April 2009, 23:50

@gemi: the problem could even be sticking rear brake shoe (due to a faulty wheel cylinder). Get that checked. If they clutch is hard, there is a strong possibility that it has worn out. That could cause the mileage drop.

Beyond this, there could be problem with sensors. Sensors on the Palio 1.6 engine may be catagorized into:

A) TDC, timing, and intake air temperature/pressure sensors. I would not expect that any of these has completely failed, since the effect of one of these failing would have been more dramatic, but their characteristics could be out of line.

B) Lambda sensor, Knock sensor, Coolant temperature sensor - vehicle operation can continue even with these not working, but the fuel injection phase and duration would be suboptimal

I have the nominal specifications for each of these sensors, but not the know-how on the test procedures.

gemithomas · 28th April 2009, 12:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by planet_rocker

this could be because of the heat. what speeds to you reach @ 2000rpm in each gear? my GTX's FE has dropped drastically as well - i got around 8.08kpl (50% AC).

check the fuel pump, air filter and the fuel filter.

at 2K rpm.
IN 3rd gear i reach around 40km/hr , in 4th i reach around 55-60 km.hr and 5th i reach close to 75-80 kmhr. 1st gear i think i reaches 20km/hr and 2nd around 30km/hr. Is this normal

HAve checked and cleaned air filter. Its not that dirty

Quote:

Originally Posted by vipul_singh

@gemi: the problem could even be sticking rear brake shoe (due to a faulty wheel cylinder). Get that checked. If they clutch is hard, there is a strong possibility that it has worn out. That could cause the mileage drop.

Beyond this, there could be problem with sensors. Sensors on the Palio 1.6 engine may be catagorized into:

A) TDC, timing, and intake air temperature/pressure sensors. I would not expect that any of these has completely failed, since the effect of one of these failing would have been more dramatic, but their characteristics could be out of line.

B) Lambda sensor, Knock sensor, Coolant temperature sensor - vehicle operation can continue even with these not working, but the fuel injection phase and duration would be suboptimal

I have the nominal specifications for each of these sensors, but not the know-how on the test procedures.

WOuld check for stuck brakes. Is there a way to know if the lambda sensor is working perfectly?

Guna · 28th April 2009, 12:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by gemithomas

Some observations on behaviour.
- Clutch is really hard.
- The car jerks once in a while.

Earlier reaching 100 would take no time but now for anything above 80 i have to really try.

Any one has had simmilar experience? What could this be. Is there a problem?

Could be a case of worn out clutch?

clevermax · 28th April 2009, 12:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guna

Could be a case of worn out clutch?

Could be.. Gemi did you try the second gear plus parking brake test, to see if your clutch is alright?

planet_rocker · 28th April 2009, 12:58

@ Gemi - Lamba sensor - milege drop, rpm dancing /sticking.
Rear Brake jam - lift each of the rear wheels and see if they are revolving free.

the 2K rpm speeds are ok - i also get the same speeds.

i changed my GTX's TDC sensor when the following happened:
Technical: Palio 1.6 - stalling problem - The FIAT Forum

15th June 2007, 11:22	#31
gemithomas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,366 Thanked: 143 Times View My Garage	not sure typeO, the service centre guys told me this. not sure of the brand. What do you guys think about the logic of the engine missing when the fan comes on? Its did not seem that convincing to me. anyways will check if the missing happens when the fan comes on. My brother is in town and has taken my adventure so i am now with the ford fusion. will check it out as soon as i am back wih my beast .
	() Thanks

15th June 2007, 11:24	#32
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,912 Times	logic is aok and yes can happen, only thing is how to rectify it? as you said alternator rating and then also see if ecu has anything to fiddle with to adjust the voltage drop
	() Thanks

15th June 2007, 11:29	#33
.anshuman Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Good-Gaon Posts: 7,763 Thanked: 11,064 Times View My Garage	The most likely cause of missing is faulty spark plug cables,i had a similar problem i got the car scanned it did not work out,changed the whole set of cables at hyundai A.S.S chandigarh and it was fine.
	() Thanks

15th June 2007, 14:13	#34
Zappo Team-BHP Support Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 5,922 Thanked: 2,699 Times	Gemi... the engine skips a beat just because a fan comes on?! Uhuh... does not sound very convincing to me buddy. What is the rating of this fan? Lights dimming can be understood. But engine missing due to a fan coming on is sounding like a crappy logic to me. If that had been the case you would have seen this phenomenon everytime the fan came on at the particular RPM. Or else, even if you have an equal or higher rating power consuming device (say an amp) that you switched on at that RPM. This of course with the assumption that your engine is not just particularly averse to that poor fan alone. Its got to be something else altogether. In all this while did you check the fuel lines at least ones? You sure its not a case of momentary airlock that is happening? A minor bubble once in a while maybe? Frankly speaking it has to be some trivial thing. Anything major would have come out with overwhelming symptoms by now IMO. It would not have been playing this hide and seek game with you. P.S. : @.anshuman, your diagnosis would have been ok if this missing the beat would have been happening erratically once in a while. In this case it occurs only at a limited rev-range, that too not all the time. That is why I think its something very verrry trivial. Last edited by Zappo : 15th June 2007 at 14:19.
	() Thanks

15th June 2007, 15:00	#35
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,912 Times	low rpm, less voltage in the system, fan kicks in (it does take some good amount of power), system is drained out of power to give juice to engine. q uite possible but shouldnt happen in a normal car, if its a flaw fiat will have something to resolve it. i dont think air bubble in fuel line will cause this in EFI engines, with high pressure fuel pump and fuel injection
	() Thanks

18th June 2007, 10:07	#36
gemithomas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,366 Thanked: 143 Times View My Garage	talking about air bubble, i just thought about the fact that i have never been able to fill my tank. FIAT says 51 litres but i have never been able to put in more than 41 litres. And there seems to be a lot of air in the tank with the auto cut off kicking in every now and then. Once i was out of town and had to fill my tank from a pump in an slightly interior place. That was the only time i felt tank was really full. The needle stayed at the full position for some time before it started falling (normally if i fill the tank the needle falls back to 3/4th by the time i cover around 50km.) But guess what, this time i ran about 200km and went to a pump in the city and he could not put in ever 1 litre!!!! the Auto cut off was coming on and i could see petrol up at the brim.!!!! So i think there should be some good amount of air getting into the tank But not sure what to do about this,
	() Thanks

29th January 2009, 22:02	#37
jobish Newbie Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 12 Thanked: 2 Times	I had a similar missing problem in my Palio. RF motors Cochin diagnosed a problem with the ignition coil. Changed the coil and is working fine. (cost around Rs.2500) Regards Jobish
	() Thanks

30th January 2009, 09:41	#38
gemithomas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,366 Thanked: 143 Times View My Garage	congrats. I tried changing the ignition coil but could not solve the problem. Dont understnad why different units going wrong give the same symptoms.
	() Thanks

26th April 2009, 11:09	#39
gemithomas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,366 Thanked: 143 Times View My Garage	Off late i have been experencing a mileage drop. THe last time i did a highway trip i got back and F.E of only around 9. THis is almost the same F.E that i am getting in City. Earlier i easily used to get around 13-15 on highways that too speeds around 100km/hr. THis time i maintained aroud 60-80 km/hr. Some observations on behaviour. - Clutch is really hard. - The car jerks once in a while. There is no real pattern for this. While accelerating, the car just jerks for 3-4 times and then its normal. THis mostly happens when i am accelerating and taking a right turn together. Once in a while it happens on straight road acceleration also. - Not sure if this is pshycological but i feel the car does not attain higher speeds (above 80) as easily as it used to. Earlier reaching 100 would take no time but now for anything above 80 i have to really try. Any one has had simmilar experience? What could this be. Is there a problem?
	() Thanks

27th April 2009, 11:20	#40
planet_rocker Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bong-land Posts: 2,323 Thanked: 426 Times	this could be because of the heat. what speeds to you reach @ 2000rpm in each gear? my GTX's FE has dropped drastically as well - i got around 8.08kpl (50% AC). check the fuel pump, air filter and the fuel filter.
	() Thanks

27th April 2009, 23:50	#41
vipul_singh BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: BLR / Lucknow Posts: 595 Thanked: 833 Times View My Garage	@gemi: the problem could even be sticking rear brake shoe (due to a faulty wheel cylinder). Get that checked. If they clutch is hard, there is a strong possibility that it has worn out. That could cause the mileage drop. Beyond this, there could be problem with sensors. Sensors on the Palio 1.6 engine may be catagorized into: A) TDC, timing, and intake air temperature/pressure sensors. I would not expect that any of these has completely failed, since the effect of one of these failing would have been more dramatic, but their characteristics could be out of line. B) Lambda sensor, Knock sensor, Coolant temperature sensor - vehicle operation can continue even with these not working, but the fuel injection phase and duration would be suboptimal I have the nominal specifications for each of these sensors, but not the know-how on the test procedures.
	() Thanks

28th April 2009, 12:58	#45
planet_rocker Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bong-land Posts: 2,323 Thanked: 426 Times	@ Gemi - Lamba sensor - milege drop, rpm dancing /sticking. Rear Brake jam - lift each of the rear wheels and see if they are revolving free. the 2K rpm speeds are ok - i also get the same speeds. i changed my GTX's TDC sensor when the following happened: Technical: Palio 1.6 - stalling problem - The FIAT Forum
	() Thanks