BMW tyre change+upsize

Sahil · 14th March 2009, 02:49

Finally the time's approaching to replace the run-flats on the 5 series !

Have decided to upsize from 225/50R17 to 245/45R17.Since comfort is as important as performance this upsize gives best of both worlds, as feeding the upsize values in the tyre calculator showed no real change in sidewall size, hence comfort wont be hampered.
The reason I decided to upsize even though the car handles very well is because she needs wider rubber to pin the torque on to the tarmac better. Peeping into the OBC showed that the rear brake pads are due for replacement in 4500kms while the front ones have 8000kms left. Hence my traction control has been working overtime as even when I floor her half way down from standstill I get some tail wagging due to the torque belted out.

My choice in the required size are limited. Please vote on the options.
Pros & Cons listed below for all tyres available in 245/45R17:

Michelin PP2:

Pro: Good grip & comfort. Bhpian favourite.
Cons: Several sidewall problem reported.
Price: 12.8k

Michelin Primacy HP:

Pro: Comfortable with decent grip. Tried and tested as they now come standard on the E-class.
Cons: Not as good as PP2s. Older model.
Price:similar to above
Review: Michelin Primacy HP reviews - tyre reviews, ratings and road tests for all car, bike and trackday performance tyres

Spoke with Michelin India western region head, he suggested PP2s and informed that my required size had just been launched. But he refused to give any compensation or replacement on sidewall issues.

Yoko Advan V103

Pros: Grip levels are better reported than PP2s.
Cons: Bad thread life.
Review: Yokohama ADVAN Sport reviews - tyre reviews, ratings and road tests for all car, bike and trackday performance tyres
Price:12.5k

Spoke with Yokohama's India head, must say they were very prompt and helpful. Was willing to compensate for sidewall issues if no damage on outer wall, benifit of doubt given to customer.

Dunlop Direzza DZ101

Pros: Good overall performer. Cheaper. Saifee suggested this would have lesser sidewall issues.
Cons: Slightly lower on wet grip.Not tried and tested in on are roads much? Not too sure on warranty policy.
Review:Dunlop Direzza DZ101
Price: 10k

Driving pattern: 60% city 40% highway. Shuttle btwn Mumbai and Pune 2-3 times a month rest within Mumbai.

Fun fact: Check out the rating of my current run flats: Dunlop SP Sport 01 DSST

iraghava · 14th March 2009, 03:43

AFAIK, no warranty on the Dunlop's since they are grey market. Unless of course, Saifee is willing to give you a personal guarantee.

Nikhilb2008 · 14th March 2009, 09:19

Please dont go for Dunlops. As Ishan already mentioned, you will not get warranty. Plus, they are all grey market stuff. Quality is suspect.

Go with either PP2s or Advans. I personally have a soft corner for Advans, but the PP2s are also superb tyres. You shouldnt have any problems with those.

About the sidewall bulges, if you take care, then it shouldnt happen(mostly). It is just that PP2s are slightly soft and so, even a small crash into a pothole can lead to a bulge.

absynthguzzler · 14th March 2009, 11:00

"The reason I decided to upsize even though the car handles very well is because she needs wider rubber to pin the torque on to the tarmac better"

This post may not add value to what's being discussed , but does a BMW need upsizing for comfort and handling and what not?.

I understand about choosing the tyre type but i thought that premium cars do not scrooge on having wrong sized feet. Guess i assumed wrong.

Sahil · 14th March 2009, 11:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by absynthguzzler

"The reason I decided to upsize even though the car handles very well is because she needs wider rubber to pin the torque on to the tarmac better"

This post may not add value to what's being discussed , but does a BMW need upsizing for comfort and handling and what not?.

I understand about choosing the tyre type but i thought that premium cars do not scrooge on having wrong sized feet. Guess i assumed wrong.

Like I said, the car handles brilliantly as is. BMW keeps the rubber size same on all normal variants whereas the sport package/highline ones have wider rubber. For instance a 523i has 225 tyres and so does a 525d/530d which have a looot more torque.Since my driving style is on the aggressive side I find my traction control kickin in very often, but under normal driving conditions there are no complaints.

@Tyre lord & his sidekick

: I'm not too keen on the Dunlops myself. I would have gone for the PP2s but it's tendency of bulging it's sidewalls is my only concern. Have any of you heard personal reviews on the Yoko V103s? All the reviews report very poor thread life, it would fall into the Goodyear eagle F1 category! I actually am more keen on the Yoko's after speaking to their sales manager. Most reviews put the yoko's grip level at par with Michelin PS2s that are better than PP2s.

iraghava · 14th March 2009, 12:50

The Advan Sport aka V103 is actually a competitor to the PS2, not the PP2 which is a grade lower. And as for reviews, I remember that Scooby had last year got 245/40 R18's for his E280 CDI, let me ping him for his views on the tyres. Last I remembered, he was very happy with them but his usage is limited so on treadwear he might not have a very definite opinion.

scooby05 · 16th March 2009, 16:03

On my E280cdi, With the Advans My traction control came on the same way as with the NCT5's!! Even though broader rubber. The ride did get a little harsher since i went upsize. The tire noise levels were also a little higher.
So to some it up, I didnt find any marked improvement in handling/grip, when i shifted from NCT5 to Advans.
Sahil, I used the advans for 3000kms, and then reverted to the goodyears set. So would not be able to really advise or comment. Sorry brother.
Enjoy the current size, and Please do buy tires with high comfort ratings. look up tirerack reviews. primacy are soft and comfortable, am using them on my Cabrio.

navpreet318 · 16th March 2009, 16:11

I don't own these high end luxury cars but i'd like to just give in my 2 cents.the price we pay for the discomfort by upsizing our wheels is too much.In India i'd only recommend that we use stock sized rubber with more comfort settings.Its not everyday that we drive in spirited way and we spend 99% of the time inside the car so we can't even drool over our alloys.

I've said this in relation with the upsize of my civic's wheels to 17" and now i'm using the stock 15" alloys and absolutely loving the comfort.

scooby05 · 16th March 2009, 16:25

The sportier the tire the harsher the ride. Please correct me on this, since this has been my experience. Sportier here means tread design, rubber compostion, side wall height etc. If one wants a Good grip as well as comfortable ride surely the compound will be soft so one has to forego life.

Sahil · 16th March 2009, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by navpreet318

I don't own these high end luxury cars but i'd like to just give in my 2 cents.the price we pay for the discomfort by upsizing our wheels is too much.In India i'd only recommend that we use stock sized rubber with more comfort settings.Its not everyday that we drive in spirited way and we spend 99% of the time inside the car so we can't even drool over our alloys.

I've said this in relation with the upsize of my civic's wheels to 17" and now i'm using the stock 15" alloys and absolutely loving the comfort.

Navpreet, please read my first post. I am not upsizing the rims, just the width and also maintaing the same sidewall size so there is no question of hampering the ride quality here. If anything, I am looking forward to a large improvement in comfort after switching to tubeless from RFTs!

navpreet318 · 16th March 2009, 22:49

Oh yes just read a your post properly now.

Yes a friend has a 525d here and he's changed his tires to Tubeless from the RFTs.and he says its on par and infact better than the mercs.he's changed to some goodyear he tells me which are super silent.

Sahil · 16th March 2009, 22:58

Would be good to know which Tyres and in what size he has, if possible.

m4ugr8 · 16th March 2009, 23:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by navpreet318

I don't own these high end luxury cars but i'd like to just give in my 2 cents.the price we pay for the discomfort by upsizing our wheels is too much.In India i'd only recommend that we use stock sized rubber with more comfort settings.Its not everyday that we drive in spirited way and we spend 99% of the time inside the car so we can't even drool over our alloys.

I've said this in relation with the upsize of my civic's wheels to 17" and now i'm using the stock 15" alloys and absolutely loving the comfort.

The Buyer for those 17" White Rims is ready here.

Dont disgrace them by comparing to stock 15" alloys.

navpreet318 · 17th March 2009, 00:14

Yaar manan its not about the design,its about the comfort of the tires.and looks like i'll have to lock the garage or else you're really gonna steal them.Lol.

Sahil · 2nd April 2009, 16:21

Going with Scooby's advice for the time being. Getting a new 520d this weekend and switching over to Michelin Pilot Primacy HP in exchange of the runflats. Have stuck to the stock size for the 520d.

Will test the tyres on the new car before I decide on what to get for the 525d.
At the moment I'm loving the burnouts on the car on my late drives, it's pure bliss to feel the torque tatoo the tarmac with DTC off! There is still a decent amount of grip left on the runflats but thanks to this burn out addiction, they will be shaved bald soon.

View Poll Results: YOUR PICK?
MICHELIN PP2	9	50.00%
MICHELIN PRIMACY HP	4	22.22%
YOKO ADVAN V103	5	27.78%
DUNLOP DIREZZA DZ101	0	0%
Voters: 18. You may not vote on this poll

14th March 2009, 02:49	#1
Sahil Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 6,354 Thanked: 8,002 Times	BMW tyre change+upsize Finally the time's approaching to replace the run-flats on the 5 series ! Have decided to upsize from 225/50R17 to 245/45R17.Since comfort is as important as performance this upsize gives best of both worlds, as feeding the upsize values in the tyre calculator showed no real change in sidewall size, hence comfort wont be hampered. The reason I decided to upsize even though the car handles very well is because she needs wider rubber to pin the torque on to the tarmac better. Peeping into the OBC showed that the rear brake pads are due for replacement in 4500kms while the front ones have 8000kms left. Hence my traction control has been working overtime as even when I floor her half way down from standstill I get some tail wagging due to the torque belted out. My choice in the required size are limited. Please vote on the options. Pros & Cons listed below for all tyres available in 245/45R17: Michelin PP2: Pro: Good grip & comfort. Bhpian favourite. Cons: Several sidewall problem reported. Price: 12.8k Michelin Primacy HP: Pro: Comfortable with decent grip. Tried and tested as they now come standard on the E-class. Cons: Not as good as PP2s. Older model. Price:similar to above Review: Michelin Primacy HP reviews - tyre reviews, ratings and road tests for all car, bike and trackday performance tyres Spoke with Michelin India western region head, he suggested PP2s and informed that my required size had just been launched. But he refused to give any compensation or replacement on sidewall issues. Yoko Advan V103 Pros: Grip levels are better reported than PP2s. Cons: Bad thread life. Review: Yokohama ADVAN Sport reviews - tyre reviews, ratings and road tests for all car, bike and trackday performance tyres Price:12.5k Spoke with Yokohama's India head, must say they were very prompt and helpful. Was willing to compensate for sidewall issues if no damage on outer wall, benifit of doubt given to customer. Dunlop Direzza DZ101 Pros: Good overall performer. Cheaper. Saifee suggested this would have lesser sidewall issues. Cons: Slightly lower on wet grip.Not tried and tested in on are roads much? Not too sure on warranty policy. Review:Dunlop Direzza DZ101 Price: 10k Driving pattern: 60% city 40% highway. Shuttle btwn Mumbai and Pune 2-3 times a month rest within Mumbai. Fun fact: Check out the rating of my current run flats: Dunlop SP Sport 01 DSST Last edited by Sahil : 14th March 2009 at 03:01.
	() Thanks

14th March 2009, 03:43	#2
iraghava Senior - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bhaiyyaland Posts: 7,997 Thanked: 281 Times View My Garage	AFAIK, no warranty on the Dunlop's since they are grey market. Unless of course, Saifee is willing to give you a personal guarantee.
	() Thanks

14th March 2009, 09:19	#3
Nikhilb2008 Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 5,195 Thanked: 10,177 Times	Please dont go for Dunlops. As Ishan already mentioned, you will not get warranty. Plus, they are all grey market stuff. Quality is suspect. Go with either PP2s or Advans. I personally have a soft corner for Advans, but the PP2s are also superb tyres. You shouldnt have any problems with those. About the sidewall bulges, if you take care, then it shouldnt happen(mostly). It is just that PP2s are slightly soft and so, even a small crash into a pothole can lead to a bulge.
	() Thanks

14th March 2009, 11:00	#4
absynthguzzler BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: hyderabad Posts: 651 Thanked: 245 Times	"The reason I decided to upsize even though the car handles very well is because she needs wider rubber to pin the torque on to the tarmac better" This post may not add value to what's being discussed , but does a BMW need upsizing for comfort and handling and what not?. I understand about choosing the tyre type but i thought that premium cars do not scrooge on having wrong sized feet. Guess i assumed wrong.
	() Thanks

14th March 2009, 12:50	#6
iraghava Senior - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bhaiyyaland Posts: 7,997 Thanked: 281 Times View My Garage	The Advan Sport aka V103 is actually a competitor to the PS2, not the PP2 which is a grade lower. And as for reviews, I remember that Scooby had last year got 245/40 R18's for his E280 CDI, let me ping him for his views on the tyres. Last I remembered, he was very happy with them but his usage is limited so on treadwear he might not have a very definite opinion.
	() Thanks

16th March 2009, 16:03	#7
scooby05 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai Posts: 1,146 Thanked: 194 Times	On my E280cdi, With the Advans My traction control came on the same way as with the NCT5's!! Even though broader rubber. The ride did get a little harsher since i went upsize. The tire noise levels were also a little higher. So to some it up, I didnt find any marked improvement in handling/grip, when i shifted from NCT5 to Advans. Sahil, I used the advans for 3000kms, and then reverted to the goodyears set. So would not be able to really advise or comment. Sorry brother. Enjoy the current size, and Please do buy tires with high comfort ratings. look up tirerack reviews. primacy are soft and comfortable, am using them on my Cabrio.
	() Thanks

16th March 2009, 16:11	#8
navpreet318 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dehradun Posts: 2,292 Thanked: 3,229 Times	I don't own these high end luxury cars but i'd like to just give in my 2 cents.the price we pay for the discomfort by upsizing our wheels is too much.In India i'd only recommend that we use stock sized rubber with more comfort settings.Its not everyday that we drive in spirited way and we spend 99% of the time inside the car so we can't even drool over our alloys. I've said this in relation with the upsize of my civic's wheels to 17" and now i'm using the stock 15" alloys and absolutely loving the comfort. Last edited by navpreet318 : 16th March 2009 at 16:13.
	() Thanks

16th March 2009, 16:25	#9
scooby05 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai Posts: 1,146 Thanked: 194 Times	The sportier the tire the harsher the ride. Please correct me on this, since this has been my experience. Sportier here means tread design, rubber compostion, side wall height etc. If one wants a Good grip as well as comfortable ride surely the compound will be soft so one has to forego life.
	() Thanks

16th March 2009, 22:49	#11
navpreet318 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dehradun Posts: 2,292 Thanked: 3,229 Times	Oh yes just read a your post properly now. Yes a friend has a 525d here and he's changed his tires to Tubeless from the RFTs.and he says its on par and infact better than the mercs.he's changed to some goodyear he tells me which are super silent.
	() Thanks

16th March 2009, 22:58	#12
Sahil Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 6,354 Thanked: 8,002 Times	Would be good to know which Tyres and in what size he has, if possible.
	() Thanks

17th March 2009, 00:14	#14
navpreet318 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dehradun Posts: 2,292 Thanked: 3,229 Times	Yaar manan its not about the design,its about the comfort of the tires.and looks like i'll have to lock the garage or else you're really gonna steal them.Lol.
	() Thanks

2nd April 2009, 16:21	#15
Sahil Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 6,354 Thanked: 8,002 Times	Going with Scooby's advice for the time being. Getting a new 520d this weekend and switching over to Michelin Pilot Primacy HP in exchange of the runflats. Have stuck to the stock size for the 520d. Will test the tyres on the new car before I decide on what to get for the 525d. At the moment I'm loving the burnouts on the car on my late drives, it's pure bliss to feel the torque tatoo the tarmac with DTC off! There is still a decent amount of grip left on the runflats but thanks to this burn out addiction, they will be shaved bald soon. Last edited by Sahil : 2nd April 2009 at 16:23.
	() Thanks