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Old 20th July 2021, 06:19   #1381
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

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Originally Posted by iTNerd View Post
So this light single-engine fifth-generation fighter 'checkmate' appears to be have been unveiled today - some few pictures from the events (according to this twitter feed - https://twitter.com/qretaxyeta/statu...54832532328448)
Once the video leaked of it in the presentation hall, it seemed to answer a fair few of the already intense debates that had developed in a short time span.

That intake certainly is interesting. It seems to be a half way house between the under chin and ventral approaches. I don't think any of the images I've seen have shown the characteristic bump for a DSI (diverter less supersonic intake). I'm sure how they deal with the boundary layer issues and the degree to which the S ducting conceals the engine fan blades will be of very high interest.

The wings do when viewed side on, definitely have a bit of the YF-23 to my eyes in that they're truncated deltas almost.

There's some classic Sukhoi features in the ubiquitous IRST module on the front, the rearward sliding canopy. However questions remain as to what the blocky sections are on the tail (they're most noticeable front on). By this time tomorrow, I'll fully expecting to see little left to the imagination, especially as to whether this is a static model or an honest to god demonstrator. The latter would be quite a surprise imo. Then there's the question of programme funding which I think everyone is keen to hear.

I will say this, a lot of Russian jets are lookers, the Su-57 certainly has some handsome profiles, but this just doesn't have that immediate appeal to it.

Last edited by ads11 : 20th July 2021 at 06:22.
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Old 20th July 2021, 07:17   #1382
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

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Originally Posted by skanchan95 View Post
A319 AWACS taking shape or PHOTOSHOP? ex-Air India A319 VT-SCO.
My brother saw this post and checked on FR24 on whereabouts of VT-SCO. The last movement is on 30th March 2021 where the aircraft has moved from the parking bay at T3 to the Air India avionics area. As per him, the aircraft might have got painted but can't be sure about the paint scheme.

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-img20210719wa0023__01.jpg

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Old 20th July 2021, 11:36   #1383
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

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Yeah, I can't quite put my finger on it but I feel the same way. I'm not quite certain when looking at the image if it's been touched up in any way or not.
Well, a few of us burnt our fingers by guessing that the livery on the IAF VIP 777, when it was undergoing flight tests in the US, was photoshopped. But I would still stick my neck out and say this is fake.

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Originally Posted by ads11 View Post
I will say though that, otherwise it seems to have the standard IAF grey. Do they normally label testbeds so prominently along the sides?
The Embraer ERJ-145 AWACS when undergoing flight & integration tests by DRDO & IAF, never had had an DRDO or any other text/flag/logo painted on the aircraft. So, It is another Red Flag.

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Originally Posted by BoneCollector View Post
My brother saw this post and checked on FR24 on whereabouts of VT-SCO. The last movement is on 30th March 2021 where the aircraft has moved from the parking bay at T3 to the Air India avionics area. As per him, the aircraft might have got painted but can't be sure about the paint scheme.
Doesn't DRDO do all flight & integration testing out of Bangalore?

As you rightly stated, Planefinder.net too states that aircraft in question(VT-SCO) last flew on 30/03/21
Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-planefinder.jpg

& Airfleets says it has been stored since 03/2021
Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-airfleets.jpg

Here is the current status of AI's A319 fleet. Most of them haven't flown for a while, a flew have left the fleet and 11 of the 24 A319s seem "active":

SCA - Scrapped in 12/20
SCB - last flew on 19/07/21 as AI3744 (Agartala-Calcutta)
SCC - last flew on 19/07/21 as AI712 (Aizwal-Calcutta)
SCD - flew back to lessor in 2014
SCE - flew back to lessor in 2014
SCF - flew today as AI713 (Calcutta-Imphal)
SCG - last flew on 19/07/21 as AI754 (Silchar-Calcutta)
SCH - last flew on 19/07/21 as AI441 (New Delhi-Aurangabad-Mumbai)
SCI - last flew on 22/11/19 as AI706 (Dibrugarh-Calcutta)
SCJ - last flew on 19/07/21 as AI656 (Rajkot-Mumbai)
SCK - last flew on 15/12/19 as AI772 (Bangalore-Calcutta)
SCL - last flew on 23/08/20 as AI706 (Dibrugarh-Calcutta)
SCM - last flew on 12/10/20 as AI702 (New Delhi-Calcutta)
SCN - last flew on 05/11/20 as AI710 (Dimapur-Calcutta)
SCO - Parked since 03/2021
SCP - flew today as AI743 (Calcutta-Agartala)
SCQ - flew today as AI812 (Lucknow-New Delhi)
SCR - flew today as AI762 (New Delhi-Calcutta)
SCS - flew today as AI821 (New Delhi-Jammu-Srinagar)
SCT - last flew on 12/11/18 as AI812 (Lucknow-New Delhi)
SCU - last flew on 22/12/18 as AI656 (Rajkot-Mumbai)
SCV - last flew on 15/07/21 as AI812 (Lucknow-New Delhi)
SCW - last flew on 17/05/19 as AI710 (Dimapur-Calcutta)
SCX - last flew on 12/11/18 as AI229 (Dhaka-Calcutta)

Last edited by skanchan95 : 20th July 2021 at 11:49.
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Old 22nd July 2021, 14:52   #1384
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

I suppose I have to eat my words again. The Ex-AI A319 VT-SCO in Grey livery, being tested by DRDO is real.

Pic credits: Gaurav Shetty, Twitter
Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-20210722_145028.jpg

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-20210722_145024.jpg

Last edited by skanchan95 : 22nd July 2021 at 14:56.
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Old 22nd July 2021, 16:10   #1385
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

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Originally Posted by skanchan95 View Post
A319 AWACS taking shape or PHOTOSHOP? ex-Air India A319 VT-SCO.

I know the DRDO AWACS will be based on a A320 platform but still the colours and markings look a little odd. The lighting just feels artificial.

Attachment 2180960

Attachment 2180961
Finally it can be said that this image is not a Photoshop. VT-SCO was clicked by Praneeth Franklin in Grey color. And it's been named "Anusandhan" meaning Research. Logo says it's with DRDO now.

Link

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-screenshot_20210722160720.jpg

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Last edited by BoneCollector : 22nd July 2021 at 16:15.
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Old 22nd July 2021, 16:35   #1386
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

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Originally Posted by skanchan95 View Post
Here is the current status of AI's A319 fleet. Most of them haven't flown for a while, a flew have left the fleet and 11 of the 24 A319s seem "active":
Interesting how so many of the A320's listed here fly the Calcutta route. Any particular reason for that other than it being the right sized plane for those routes in and out of CCU?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoneCollector View Post
Finally it can be said that this image is not a Photoshop. VT-SCO was clicked by Praneeth Franklin in Grey color. And it's been named "Anusandhan" meaning Research. Logo says it's with DRDO now.
I like the christening - is it normal for individual aircraft in the IAF fleet to be bestowed names?

Good to see then that it's real. Quite odd though initially seeing the military grey scheme on an airframe I'm just too used to seeing in civilian airliner liveries.
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Old 28th July 2021, 18:46   #1387
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

Interesting development this one - single engine stealth fighter Su-75
https://www.flightglobal.com/defence...144693.article

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When was the last time Russia made a single engine fighter aircraft?

Last edited by SmartCat : 28th July 2021 at 18:53.
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Old 28th July 2021, 19:54   #1388
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When was the last time Russia made a single engine fighter aircraft?
They haven't basically since the Soviet era and even then in the final years of the USSR, the RuAF was increasingly leaning towards twin engine platforms. Moreover they started to lean towards heavier twin engine platforms, which pretty much have all but killed off Mikoyan, the design bureau whose specialisation was light fighters.

It's certainly interesting from an enthusiast perspective but the cold hard reality is that this is entirely a private effort from UAC, and without an export customer buying in rather heavily for this programme, it won't get off the ground. RuAF has little interest in single engine fighters and neither do they have the budget - they only keep the Su-57 in low rate production to ensure the line is running and a high profile programme isn't left to gather dust.

The $20-30million flyaway cost is spectacularly optimistic, as is the 2027 operational timeframe. And let's not forget that this model is built around an engine that's hugely behind on its developmental goals. There are quite a few rather real stumbling blocks for this jet. There's no denying though that there definitely is a market for a relatively cheap modern fighter offering some of the key features of 5th gen models like partial spectrum LO or sensor fusion. The fact the FC-31 is increasingly being seen again on Chinese social media means that programme might quietly be getting some steam. Russia has no choice but to field something if they aren't to cede the light fighter export market entirely for the future, so in that sense I get where they're coming from with this programme. And kudos to them for really making the most of the marketing and building up hype around the announcement, they almost followed the product reveal playbook of a phone release (the way in which they were drumming up interest).

I will say what was interesting were some of the models Mikoyan had on display, one of which was a twin engine deck based fighter that looked rather akin to mockups of the Indian TEDBF programme. It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if Mikoyan recognised that they probably should do something given India has quite a recognised need for naval fighters.
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Old 28th July 2021, 20:58   #1389
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

No. 101 Sqdn "Falcons" officially re-raised with the formal induction of Rafales in the squadron at AFS Hasimara, West Bengal. This is the IAF's 2nd Rafale squadron after No. 17 Sqdn "Golden Arrows" based in AFS Ambala.

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-20210728_205534.jpg

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-20210728_205528.jpg

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-20210728_205525.jpg

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-20210728_205523.jpg

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-20210728_205520.jpg

Both Squadrons were Type 96 MiG-21M squadrons before being numberplated.
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Old 30th July 2021, 15:56   #1390
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

I was reading on the trainer aircrafts of the IAF and have some questions may be noob ones.
1. The IAF uses aircraft like Pilatus, HJT 16 and Hawks, in the current situation of dwindling squadrons and the threats we face from our good neighbours bith on western and eastern fronts, will it not be good to reposition some of these trainer aircrafts on active squadron duty ? I understand that they might be too slow and susceptible to enemy fire but wanted to know more on this.
2. Has IAF or any other air force ever used their trainer aircrafts on active squadron duty ? Do these trainer aircrafts have pods to carry ammunitions or can additional pods be added if at all a need arises to use these trainer aircrafts on active duty ?

Last edited by Dieseltuned : 30th July 2021 at 15:56. Reason: Grammar check
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Old 30th July 2021, 16:12   #1391
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

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will it not be good to reposition some of these trainer aircrafts on active squadron duty ? Do these trainer aircrafts have pods to carry ammunitions or can additional pods be added if at all a need arises to use these trainer aircrafts on active duty ?
HAL is working on combat version of BAE Hawk (called Hawk-i), with focus on air-to-ground attack roles. They are pitching it to the Army and Air Force. No confirmed orders yet.

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-whatsappimage20190223at11.28.19am.jpg

In a first, Hawk-i aircraft fires smart anti-airfield weapon off Odisha coast
https://www.hindustantimes.com/india...232574089.html
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Old 30th July 2021, 16:49   #1392
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Originally Posted by Dieseltuned View Post
I was reading on the trainer aircrafts of the IAF and have some questions may be noob ones.
1. The IAF uses aircraft like Pilatus, HJT 16 and Hawks, in the current situation of dwindling squadrons and the threats we face from our good neighbours bith on western and eastern fronts, will it not be good to reposition some of these trainer aircrafts on active squadron duty ? I understand that they might be too slow and susceptible to enemy fire but wanted to know more on this.
2. Has IAF or any other air force ever used their trainer aircrafts on active squadron duty ? Do these trainer aircrafts have pods to carry ammunitions or can additional pods be added if at all a need arises to use these trainer aircrafts on active duty ?
Thing is, like SmartCat mentions, these trainer aircraft when it comes to being weaponised are useful in air to ground missions against shall we say more permissive air space environments and not much more. Not only are they a lot slower but if you think about it, being trainer aircraft they're not really designed from the onset with much of a sensor suite to speak of. In today's network centric warfare, you're not only looking at a need for the platform to integrate with your own air defence network, you'd also need a lot of said sensors for much of the weapons (particularly stand off range munitions). Then there's the small matter of whether the wings were designed for the loading of multiple underwing stations in the first place - they might not necessarily be able to take much of a meaningful loadout. Even if you had say a Hawk with underwing pylons loaded out with munitions, it won't be much use even in the quick reaction role, because it'll entirely be dependent on ground assets for vectoring towards any threat. It's interesting then that the only example that springs to mind of a combined trainer aircraft plus light combat platform is the Yak-130. (Feel free to mention any other examples, this was the only one that I could think of atm).

To my mind then, I can only envision them being used say in Libya or Syria, lower scale conflicts shall we say in terms of the kit fielded by the belligerents. Sling some dumb bombs on the trainer and go bomb some technicals (think Hilux with a 50-cal or a MANPAD mounted). For India though, against peer state adversaries, unfortunately training aircraft won't pass muster. I can't see it being any use beyond say domestic CAP missions, say against Maoists and is there really that much of a use there that would require a manned fixed wing platform when that mission can be executed by a fixed wing drone (Reaper type) that has the ability to stay on station for far far longer than any training aircraft could hope to? I think the answer is no. V.Narayan and others feel free to interject but I'm sure the Army and Air Force use much simpler platforms to prosecute these sort of missions.
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Old 30th July 2021, 18:28   #1393
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It's interesting then that the only example that springs to mind of a combined trainer aircraft plus light combat platform is the Yak-130. (Feel free to mention any other examples, this was the only one that I could think of atm).
The most successful trainer to combat aircraft conversion has been the Embraer Super Tucano. It has actually seen combat in air-to-ground attack roles in many countries
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrae...4_Super_Tucano

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Countries operating the Super Tucano:

Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force-screenshot_4.jpg

Last edited by SmartCat : 30th July 2021 at 18:33.
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Old 30th July 2021, 19:04   #1394
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The most successful trainer to combat aircraft conversion has been the Embraer Super Tucano. It has actually seen combat in air-to-ground attack roles in many countries
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrae...4_Super_Tucano

Attachment 2185924

Countries operating the Super Tucano:

Attachment 2185925
Ah the Super Tucano, good shout! Handy little aircraft that. But again, you need only look at where and how it's used. Take the high profile fight the jet fighter brass of the USAF have waged for the last 4 or 5 years to refuse to induct it, or something similar, to utilise in the sort of CAP missions in Afghanistan as opposed to an exponentially more expensive F-16, let alone an F-35A.. I think what Dieseltuned was after was essentially if our jet trainers could be pressed into service for the sort of quick reaction missions that the Mig-21s conducts for eg. Plainly then, the answer is no. Because again, while highly effective at the niche it operates in, the whole point of the Super Tucano is to target militias (like the Taliban or FARC) or drug groups, targets without any sophisticated air defences beyond maybe some MANPADS. On either border, the IAF won't face that, and thus I don't see any utility when it comes to the conversion.

Besides, pretty sure for the sort of air to ground missions the Super Tucano would conduct, the IAF would likely utilise it's rotary wing assets, seeing as they're already there and can more of less conduct those missions.
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Old 31st July 2021, 08:54   #1395
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Default Re: Combat Aircraft of the Indian Air Force

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Originally Posted by Dieseltuned View Post
I was reading on the trainer aircrafts of the IAF and have some questions may be noob ones.
1. The IAF uses aircraft like Pilatus, HJT 16 and Hawks, in the current situation of dwindling squadrons and the threats we face from our good neighbours on western and eastern fronts, will it not be good to reposition some of these trainer aircrafts on active squadron duty ? I understand that they might be too slow and susceptible to enemy fire but wanted to know more on this.
2. Has IAF or any other air force ever used their trainer aircrafts on active squadron duty ? Do these trainer aircrafts have pods to carry ammunitions or can additional pods be added if at all a need arises to use these trainer aircrafts on active duty ?
For times of war the Hawk is equipped almost ready to go to serve as a light ground attack aircraft in regions where we have significant air superiority. It would in that case be flown by the instructors of the training academy. The Hawk can/would also be used to fly defensive CAP missions over vulnerable cities in the rear thus releasing more capable machines for the frontline. So the short answer is yes in war it would be deployed. I don't know if the Pilatus PC-7 Mk II we use are weapon fitted or not. Most likely not. Given that we face two nuclear armed and very aggressive enemies sending the Pilatus will be willful murder. The Hawk 100 from which our Hawk Mk 132 is derived is equipped to carry 4 IR guided AAMs. Which AAM we have integrated I don't know.

In 1971 the 2-seat Hawker Hunters that were used for advanced weapons training were re-deployed to the frontline. During peace time it makes no sense to deploy trainers to the frontline. They are far more useful being used to train the incoming stream of pilots. Hope this helps.

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Originally Posted by SmartCat View Post
HAL is working on combat version of BAE Hawk (called Hawk-i), with focus on air-to-ground attack roles. They are pitching it to the Army and Air Force. No confirmed orders yet.
Sounds very sensible. A lower cost, lesser time to develop{hopefully} option of adding to our numbers. Every combat aircraft does not need to be a Rafale or a Su-30MKI. There are enough roles for cheaper, less capable {only a relative term} machines. Being smaller it may have some advantages flying low and slow in the mountain regions. Maybe.

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Originally Posted by ads11 View Post
I can't see it being any use beyond say domestic CAP missions, say against Maoists and is there really that much of a use there that would require a manned fixed wing platform when that mission can be executed by a fixed wing drone (Reaper type) that has the ability to stay on station for far far longer than any training aircraft could hope to?
Against Maoists a drone is a better option - less aggressive optically, can be deployed by the CRPF. We should never use the IAF against our own citizens. Maoists are against Govt corruption & mineral exploitation, destruction of habitat etc.

Last edited by V.Narayan : 31st July 2021 at 09:04.
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