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Old 21st May 2019, 11:51   #16
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

OK color me ignorant but let me ask this:
-China had already banned FB, Whatsapp, Google, a whole lot more Google products, etc. in China so why wasn't there an uproar then? I mean, I know it wasn't 'cos of spying or anything but American products were banned.
Now when Chinese devices are getting banned, quite a many are calling this America's high handedness... Perplexing.


PS: Huawei was already developing a separate OS since 2014 when they first addressed this risk. That's why they built Kirin too. Their only true dependence now is Qualcomm modems, Broadcom chips and Corning glass along with few others. May be they'll develop all this in-house too
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Old 21st May 2019, 11:57   #17
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Quote:
Originally Posted by binand View Post
Many countries have had questions about Huawei's relationship with the Chinese government and the purported backdoors they installed in their products to facilitate snooping. This is an old story that pre-dates Trump.
Excellent compilation. Put away my doubts about this being a recent beef between Trump-China.
I read somewhere that even Vodafone-Idea & Airtel have sought a clarification from Telecom Ministry if they should refrain from Huawei equipment purchases for their 5G network.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Oxy View Post
From what I understand, this Huawei/Honor mess is only US specific. Or should people avoid buying these phones in India now as well? (launch event scheduled at 6:30 PM today).
I replied in Android thread . Avoid Huawei like a plague for the time being. Everyone outside China will be affected. I believe the Updates and access controls are from Alphabet USA and everyone will be subjected to the ban.
China anyways has banned Google products for a while and they have alternatives, which is why they won't feel the effects to a larger extent.
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Old 21st May 2019, 12:17   #18
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

My friend picked up a new P30 (with SmartWatch), and he also works there. The pictures taken with the phone are just brilliant, as is the almost 'telescopic' zoom. Today they got this communication internally - 'Huawei will be able to use the public version of Android and won't be able to access proprietary apps and services from Google'
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Old 21st May 2019, 12:41   #19
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Putting up one more link - an opinion piece:

https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/20/1...usiness-future

Quote:
There’s no positive spin to this situation for Huawei. Trying to sell smartphones without Google’s cooperation in the modern age is a spectrum that goes from bad to disastrous. [...] App-less operating systems simply do not stand a chance against the contemporary iOS-Android duopoly.
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Old 21st May 2019, 12:54   #20
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

For questions about only US is affected, if Google cuts ties with Huawei, then Huawei will not get android updates irrespective of which country they operate from is what I think.

Secondly, this is going to be similar to OnePlus's cynogenmod and oxygen OS however, a little different because the OS that Huawei comes up with will not be an Android version.

Having said these, if Huawei reduces the price of their phone because of this problem, it should be a good time to buy, root and continue using OS. Though many might be skeptical about the security issues that are possible because of rooting, this is an alternative

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 24th May 2019 at 12:12. Reason: typo edited
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Old 21st May 2019, 13:07   #21
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

I have a feeling (just hypothesis) that the US- Huawei is rooted in an incident that happened in November of 2016. No, not the US election result, but 3GPP meeting agreeing on 2 standards for 5g.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polar_...y)#cite_note-9

Quote:
In November 2016 3GPP agreed to adopt Polar codes for the eMBB (Enhanced Mobile Broadband) control channels for the 5G NR (New Radio) interface. At the same meeting 3GPP agreed to use LDPC for the corresponding data channel.[9]
Its a question of IP and patents in the years to come rather than just Google and its OS.
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Old 21st May 2019, 15:12   #22
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oxy View Post
From what I understand, this Huawei/Honor mess is only US specific. Or should people avoid buying these phones in India now as well? The upcoming Honor 20 series looks promising (launch event scheduled at 6:30 PM today).
Well, it was US specific, till Google ruined the show by saying that it wont supply and support Android to Huawei.
Will you buy a phone (in future) with Huawei's own Operating system, while there are other Android phones in the market?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashokrajagopal View Post
I have a feeling (just hypothesis) that the US- Huawei is rooted in an incident that happened in November of 2016. No, not the US election result, but 3GPP meeting agreeing on 2 standards for 5g.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polar_...y)#cite_note-9



Its a question of IP and patents in the years to come rather than just Google and its OS.
Well I think you are on to something there!
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/20/t...-us/index.html

Only three 5G technology vendors exist: Huawei, Nokia, Ericsson
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Old 21st May 2019, 15:36   #23
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
Well, it was US specific, till Google ruined the show by saying that it wont supply and support Android to Huawei.
Will you buy a phone (in future) with Huawei's own Operating system, while there are other Android phones in the market?


Well I think you are on to something there!
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/20/t...-us/index.html

Only three 5G technology vendors exist: Huawei, Nokia, Ericsson
Not really 100% true. Samsung also has network products so do a lot of smaller companies. On the bigger networks side, maybe its true. But given the way 5G operates at higher frequencies and smaller cell size, it will give rise to a lot of companies what with virtualization etc being part of the standard on certain parts of the network.

Also, Huawei has to use other IPs and everyone has to agree to FRAND to license and cross-license.

The above use is not same as 2 standards. Control channels (used for setup of calls, measurements etc) are coded differently compared to the data channels (carries user data). Different channels have different configurations, different needs etc (reliability vs capacity) and it was same in earlier mobile standards. During standardization different vendors try out different things and bring it to the committee which then decide on what to adopt.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US9503126B2/

Last edited by srishiva : 21st May 2019 at 15:55.
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Old 21st May 2019, 16:09   #24
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Now the US has 'temporarily' relaxed some restrictions. So let us wait and see. The game has only started.
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Old 21st May 2019, 16:54   #25
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
Now the US has 'temporarily' relaxed some restrictions. So let us wait and see. The game has only started.
And so has Google:

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/21/goog...ons-eased.html
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Old 21st May 2019, 17:06   #26
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

So I found this online.

Google cuts ties with Huawei-instimage124.jpg
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Old 21st May 2019, 17:51   #27
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Quote:
Originally Posted by ValarMorghulis View Post
-China had already banned FB, Whatsapp, Google, a whole lot more Google products, etc. in China so why wasn't there an uproar then? I mean, I know it wasn't 'cos of spying or anything but American products were banned.

Now when Chinese devices are getting banned, quite a many are calling this America's high handedness... Perplexing.
That's a good observation. I guess people's expectation from Capitalist Govts and Communist Govts are different.
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Old 21st May 2019, 18:17   #28
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Quote:
Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
Not really 100% true. Samsung also has network products so do a lot of smaller companies. On the bigger networks side, maybe its true. But given the way 5G operates at higher frequencies and smaller cell size, it will give rise to a lot of companies what with virtualization etc being part of the standard on certain parts of the network.

Also, Huawei has to use other IPs and everyone has to agree to FRAND to license and cross-license.

The above use is not same as 2 standards. Control channels (used for setup of calls, measurements etc) are coded differently compared to the data channels (carries user data). Different channels have different configurations, different needs etc (reliability vs capacity) and it was same in earlier mobile standards. During standardization different vendors try out different things and bring it to the committee which then decide on what to adopt.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US9503126B2/
I have a question here, just trying to understand. Tracking mobile telephony growth, tracking it in a simplistic way of GSM -> 2G -> 3G -> 4G -> 5G, once data became more important than voice, around the 2G era, up until now, IP and the patents are mostly held by Qualcomm, right ?
Considering Qualcomm's unique business style, they did business in China extensively and in the process Huawei acquired some knowledge, which its continued R&D arrived at today's 3GPP standardization for Huwaei, using their technology. Can this be assumed correct ?

If the above is true, US has to be worried for its players. Huwaei with its market penetration in this hemispere, can easily be the dominant player, without paying or playing along with any IP owner when it comes to this part of 5G, right ?
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Old 21st May 2019, 19:08   #29
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashokrajagopal View Post
Considering Qualcomm's unique business style, they did business in China extensively and in the process Huawei acquired some knowledge, which its continued R&D arrived at today's 3GPP standardization for Huwaei, using their technology. Can this be assumed correct ?
Here is one of the ways in which Huawei acquired their knowledge:

https://www.afr.com/technology/web/s...20140526-iux6a
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Old 21st May 2019, 19:47   #30
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Default Re: Google cuts ties with Huawei

Quote:
Originally Posted by ValarMorghulis View Post
OK color me ignorant but let me ask this:
-China had already banned FB, Whatsapp, Google, a whole lot more Google products, etc. in China so why wasn't there an uproar then? I mean, I know it wasn't 'cos of spying or anything but American products were banned.
Now when Chinese devices are getting banned, quite a many are calling this America's high handedness... Perplexing.


PS: Huawei was already developing a separate OS since 2014 when they first addressed this risk. That's why they built Kirin too. Their only true dependence now is Qualcomm modems, Broadcom chips and Corning glass along with few others. May be they'll develop all this in-house too
because we weren't affected when China banned FB, Google, Whatsapp internally. We were still able to use the phones, install all the apps etc in India or elsewhere outside China. Now, more people are getting affected directly and are irritated that they might not be able to use phones that they shelled out quite a bit for. Worst part - these phones are actually very good.

TBH, if you have followed the subtleties of this whole USA-China trade war and the associated fall-outs, you will see some high-handedness on the US side. And not to forget - how Murica protects its companies - esp Apple.
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