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Old 22nd May 2022, 18:08   #16
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
Thank you for responding. Pi4 was my first thought, but then it oly does USB drives, and not SATA. I want SATA.

Cheerd
I thought your original post made speed a non priority. In that case USB, USB3 in particular may not be bad. Also, there may be ways to interface SATA with Pi.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 18:40   #17
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
USB I am afraid is not an option, I want internal and SATA. I do not want to send data over USB to wifi.
USB is way faster than SATA HDD. Read / Write speed of current USB 3 ports is 10 gbps. Latest (thunderbolt 4) is 40 gbps.

SATA HDD is 200 mbps.

A case with internal HDD will be more sturdy for sure, if cost is a priority for CPU / Case etc., USB can be an option without any compromise on speed.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 19:22   #18
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
Thank you for this. I checked it out - there's no info about how many drives I can install inside, how many bays/ports it has etc.
You need to tune up your Google skills. Afaik, it has one ssd and at least 2 sata ports, that's why i recommended it.check the documentation online and YouTube teardowns. This is a fairly well known hp workstation.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 19:47   #19
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Hello,

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt
Re. CPU and PSU, I can make do with an older less powerful cooler-running CPU I suppose? Since I am only using it to serve files?
Quote:
And re. budget, I already have a 4TB and a few 500 GBs and a few 2.5" terabyte drives. All I need is one more 4TB to either use as backup or RAID 1.
If you don't mind sharing, what else do you already have?

Since your initial question was open ended, one had to squeeze everything within that 20k budget. If you can mention the stuff you already have, then it would be easier to redistribute the budget for a better performing setup.

For just NAS duty, even an old multi-core CPU like Core 2 Quad or even Core 2 Duo would be sufficient.

Quote:
And re. the fan, I do not want to turn the fan off etc. - I have no technical expertise in doing such things and managing such things. I just want a fan that will run quieter by itself without my having to tweak anything.
If redistributing the budget allows you to invest in a 3rd Party CPU cooler, then that would allow quieter FAN speed or even full off mode. Entry level Coolers are like Rs. 1k (incl FAN)

It's simple with Modern BIOS, you would only need to set the temp:fan speed graph.

Here is an example with H510 motherboard BIOS with Intel Core i5 11400.

Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)-001.jpg

3rd party CPU Cooler Heat sinks are much better than Intel stock cooler and the FANs are way more efficient so with little bit of tinkering with the temp : (FAN) speed graph in BIOS, you can achieve a really silent system.

Quote:
Would you happen to have purchase links by any chance?
I have just taken the prices from Amazon, but I guess you wanted to buy local. Infact if you can buy local, then do it since you can get around 10-12% lower price over Amazon. At-least that is what I have seen in Kolkata and Delhi local market.

Quote:
I checked it out - there's no info about how many drives I can install inside, how many bays/ports it has etc.
Although a 2nd hand system with 3rd or 4th generation Core i7 feel attractive but modern lowest CPUs are easily matching those performance figures. On top, high end older hardware is way more power hungry over lower end modern hardware. Lastly Indian second hand market is over priced.

Intel 3rd / 4th gen Dell / HP / Lenovo office PCs are sold at almost the same price like a new within warranty lowest end Pentium Gold 10th Gen assembled system. Makes no sense unless you already have the old hardware or get a cheap deal.

Quote:
Boot drive being non-NVME is not a dealbreaker - I am sure a SATA SSD would still be pretty fast, else I can always wait a few seconds
Problem isn't the speed, rather wastage of a SATA Port. Lower end H510 boards have 4 SATA ports. So if budget permits, using a NVMe helps in 2 ways. First, freeing up a SATA Port, secondly, high speed cache (if your software configuration allows).

But you can do that later at any point. That's the beauty of self assembled PCs. Unmatched upgradability.

Thanks.

Last edited by NaXal : 22nd May 2022 at 19:51.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 20:40   #20
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
I want to build a home NAS and I do not want any branded NAS-solutions like Synology etc.
Allow me to offer a counter view.

I too was once very keen on getting a NAS (for data redundancy and faster local file handing). But once I sat down with the hardware and proper NAS-specific drives and compatibility of existing machines (slower ethernet ports or lack of 5g antenna for mobile devices), I realised that it would be a pretty costly affair. A 4tb drive (Seagate IronWolf 4 TB) would cost around 10k per drive. For redundancy, minimum 2 drives would be needed in an appropriate RAID array.

So, 20k at the minimum is gone on the disks alone + another 30-35k on the system - Processor, RAM, enclosure along with a redundant power supply.

I am happily using Microsoft one drive and google drive to back up my files and a 4tb HDD for local use. Gets the job done.

Yes, in case of a failure its cumbersome to get the data (slow speed) but so far its working out for me.

Here's a link that I was following up when I was considering building a NAS. I think its still relevant today.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 22:00   #21
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
Thank you for responding. Pi4 was my first thought, but then it oly does USB drives, and not SATA. I want SATA.

Cheerd
I can suggest you odroid Hc4 from Hardkernel.

https://ameridroid.com/products/odroid-hc4

It has 2 SATA ports and only USB2.0. Cpu is fast enough to handle your NAS and other stuff like plex or emby ( I would suggest Emby over plex). I recently purchased one of their device odroid N2+ from a distributor in India

https://www.fabtolab.com/hardkernel-...core-processor
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Old 23rd May 2022, 10:07   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayuresh View Post
I thought your original post made speed a non priority. In that case USB, USB3 in particular may not be bad. Also, there may be ways to interface SATA with Pi.
Thank you. I now see where the miscommunication is. I guess I should have been a little more specific - speed of the CPU was what I meant, not speed of data access.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay View Post
USB is way faster than SATA HDD. Read / Write speed of current USB 3 ports is 10 gbps. Latest (thunderbolt 4) is 40 gbps.

SATA HDD is 200 mbps.

*SNIP*
Thank you. I did not know this, I learnt something new today, courtesy you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
You need to tune up your Google skills. Afaik, it has one ssd and at least 2 sata ports, that's why i recommended it.check the documentation online and YouTube teardowns. This is a fairly well known hp workstation.
I guess I certainly do. Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaXal View Post
*SNIP*
If you don't mind sharing, what else do you already have
I just have some drives that have been removed from older machines I used to have, plus a few external drives still in their enclosures, that I thought I would remove and install inside the NAS case.

I also can try dismantling my iMac and using the 2 x 8GB DDR3 RAM modules; and also at the same time see which of the drives (the 3TB HDD or the 128GB SSD) is failing and maybe use the good drive. This is in addition to the drives I already have lying around.

I have nothing else.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NaXal View Post
*SNIP* It's simple with Modern BIOS, you would only need to set the temp:fan speed graph.*SNIP*
My worry is less about the "how" than the "when" and "by how much" etc. I do not have the knowledge to determine if I need to change fan speeds or whether the CPU/whatever is running too hot/ etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaXal View Post
I have just taken the prices from Amazon, but I guess you wanted to buy local.
Oh, I wanted the links just to have the proper names of the items so that i could go to the shops and ask for those exact items, that's all

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaXal View Post
*SNIP* On top, high end older hardware is way more power hungry over lower end modern hardware. *SNIP*
Again, I learnt something new today, thanks to you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaXal View Post
Problem isn't the speed, rather wastage of a SATA Port. *SNIP*
Aha, OK. Thank you.


I am learning so much so fast. Thank you all!

Cheers

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
Allow me to offer a counter view.

*SNIP*

I am happily using Microsoft one drive and google drive to back up my files and a 4tb HDD for local use. Gets the job done.

*SNIP*

Here's a link that I was following up when I was considering building a NAS. I think its still relevant today.
Thank you for the counter view.

As I mentioned earlier while responding to GTO's suggestion, I do not trust anything online because companies do change their policies suddenly and mostly always to the detriment of the user.

Re. the link you posted, yes, I had read this before I posted here. One bit I shall quote from that:

Quote:
Eg, if a hardware RAID controller stores data in a proprietary format on the hard drives I would need the exact same replacement controller to recover that data in case of a controller failure.
This is the reason I wanted to build my own FOSS solution and am reluctant to go with the likes of Synology and solutions like that from other providers.

Thank you and cheers

Last edited by libranof1987 : 24th May 2022 at 13:07. Reason: Merging, as requested
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Old 24th May 2022, 09:45   #23
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

For those who want cheapest and quickest NAS without any hassle of software configuration is USB HDD attached to to the wifi router.
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Old 24th May 2022, 10:55   #24
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

I have been using my own NAS for last 5+ years. From a hardware perspective : I started with an ITX form factor AMD "Kabini" APU which worked well and was also used as my TV streamer. Three years ago I moved the motherboard to a 3.5" NAS enclosure from Ali express and upgraded the motherboard to a Celeron J4125 with 16GB RAM. This gives hotplug support for the RAID array and I would strongly recommend one of the Celeron processors (ASRock J5005 is now available quite cheap) with 4 SATA ports, these CPUs run maximum TDP of 10W so they dont need a fan and run very silent. They also have enough horespower to run docker, am running 8-12 containers mostly home automation,Wifi and network monitoring and Transmission downloaders, the CPU rarely goes above 10%.

Just as important is the software, many people run Proxmox and on top of it some flavor of NAS, this allows easy migration. Your choice may vary based on your end needs like multimedia, home automation or just file storage.
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Old 24th May 2022, 11:00   #25
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Just like a few others have suggested, the most likely option for a reliable, fanless and cheap NAS would be a RPi based system. It is relatively easier to build and troubleshoot with huge amount of content on the web.

Check out this experiment: https://www.jeffgeerling.com/blog/20...-nas-sata-raid

It also answers the question, SATA or USB3 (SATA wins!)
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Old 24th May 2022, 11:01   #26
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Its important to use NAS rated drives like Seagate Ironwolf series in your build. Please do not use a normal HDD as they aren't rated to reliably handle read/write requirements of NAS. Be careful in using WesternDigital NAS harddisks. A few years back, they tried to pass-off non-NAS harddisks (SMR technology) under NAS branding (CMR technology). I am not sure about their current lineup.

You need to have software raid configuration like zRaid to handle disk recovery in case of failure.
TrueNAS would be my choice of OS as it is well supported and has lots of 3rd party App support. OpenMediaVault isn't bad either.

If you are going with SFF case, ensure proper air-flow and cooling. Hard-disks become less reliable as they become hot under small casing. Silverstone/Fractal/Lian Li are popular NAS cases available in the market.
I am sure all of the above recommendations won't fit within 20K-30K budget. There will obviously be trade-offs you will need to make to fit your budget.

Welcome to the club of DIY NAS . Please keep us posted on your progress.
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Old 24th May 2022, 11:13   #27
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

I am assuming you will have important files that you want to store in the NAS. Since you don't want to use Google/OneDrive/Dropbox, have you thought of a backup strategy?

1) Are you planning to back it up to a separate drive?
2) How are you planning to automate backing up? Manually backing up the important files periodically will require you to be very disciplined.

Forgive me, but just curious:

What kind of policies are you worried about in using Google/OneDrive or similar? I asked because using these services makes your life a lot simpler, easier, and less stressful. The trade-off you have to make is very much worth it. Unless you are into tinkering and all and enjoy it, then fine, otherwise nothing like the cloud services for backup.
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Old 24th May 2022, 13:34   #28
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
I want to build a home NAS and I do not want any branded NAS-solutions like Synology etc.
I have built a NAS for myself using Raspberry pi 4b & two 2 TB HDD. Fully working to my expectation. I am using Open Media Valut - https://www.openmediavault.org/. Check this out.

Why did I move to this? I had purchased WD Cloud home duo with 2 x 2 TB which is not having a very basic functionality of 'recycle bin' or 'trash' for a NAS. So reused the hard disks for custom built NAS.
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Old 24th May 2022, 13:56   #29
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Many suggestions have been given, so just want to share some of the points based on my experience using NAS

- power consumption is a huge issue for a full fledged PC NAS, a Pi4 with two usb3 SSD fetch 15watt(max) vs A dedicated entry level NAS takes approx. 18Watt(max) vs a low end PC takes at least 60-80Watt. Mind that this usage is continuous. One of the best part of dedicated NAS is efficient hardware and OS.

- I use two NAS, one old entry level 4tb WD MyCloud NAS and another 1TB SSD on a Rpi4 (mainly for backup on the move, but connected to home-network when at home), if foolproof redundancy is not required found entry level dedicated NAS is best balance of easy-to-use vs price vs speed vs space vs power-efficiency.

- Always connect with LAN cable directly from NAS to router/switch (gigabit lan better) than depend on WIFI for this part of connectivity

- I use two levels of backup, for peace of mind (and without active redundancy in NAS), first backed up to NAS, then selected and most important ones manually backed up to Google drive (easy access on cloud when not home).

- Already did a DIY mini-itx PC NAS (atom processor, 4gb ram and 2tb HDD in around 2010), unless the usage have high throughput, it does not make sense of that big hardware (yes bigger than other two options) and power consumption, also it makes sense only when you have a PC lying around used for multiple purpose and not buying everything new. For me I used to use it as HTPC also and sometime for browsing or software tryouts. Later, moved to dedicated devices for better performance and ease of use - a media player as replacement of HTPC function and a dedicated NAS replacing PC NAS.
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Old 24th May 2022, 14:06   #30
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Re: Building a cheap, slow & less powerful Home NAS (network attached storage)

Usually when I upgrade my workstations, I move my older one as a DIY media server for the home theatre/Plex server for my social circle/NAS appliance. Right now, I have an older 8th i3 with 16gigs of RAM and a 30TB redundant array of drives.

I try to be eco-friendly so it's sleeping most of the time. When I do want access, I have a Raspberry Pi Zero W that runs a custom, super tiny web facing app that I can use to remotely wake my server.

Been using the roughly same setup for the past 7 years and I couldn't be happier. Instead of building from scratch, my recommendation is to find hardware that's a gen or so older.

Straight up, a NAS isn't going to saturate your CPU, and even with something like Plex that transcodes in real time, you're not really using all that much computing power. Find older hardware and give it new life.
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