[Nimz]

Hi team bhpians. Just back from TDing the Palio Stiles 1.1 and 1.6 and the Swift.

Fiat had a TD car with the odo knocked off on both 1.1 and 1.6. (Manipal motors had the stile 1.6 for TD). They cited some vague re-registration issues as the reason. MUL's Sagar auto;s Swift Zxi had the odo runnng and seemingly no issues with re-registration. WHy is not Fiat transparent?

Well.. regarding the TD, notring down my impressions. Am not an expert driver and have not driven many cars to give a "correct unbiased" review.

- Stile 1.1 - stopped the TD halfway. THere was no pickup atleast not even the minimum what I expected. The car did kinda feel it liked to be pulled when I was in the third gear and at higher revs.

- Stile 1.6 - good pickup. My friend who knows cars refused to hand over the car to me during the TD. He said it was really nice to drive. I too found it good. But I felt I was "more in control" and therefore "easier" (the words in quotes are more my impressions rather than the terminology which ought to be used). I dont know why.

It could be the seating which I felt to be different. The Stile I felt was a little lower and laid back

I again felt the retro was a little more "solider" and "compacter" than the stile. The Stile felt "refined" compared to the retro and I kind of felt cocooned from the road. so maybe I did not feel the road and the drive like I did in the retro which gave me a little more confidence. Therefore I would say the retro handled better than the stile.
Would be glad if fellow bhpians could corroborate or correct me so that I improve with subsequent TDs.

Swift Zxi - the TD is MUL was a different experience altogether. You had a sales rep exclusive to you. While in both Manipal and Concorde. They were between 2-3 customers and you could see their attention wavering. Also they never came on the TD and assigned some one else. Both in INdica and Manipal I had the sales rep for Indica accompanying me who didnt know much about the FIat. In MUL the sales girl and another male rep accompanied us. The Sales gal was pat on clearing our queries about the car during the TD.
First impression about the Swift - I felt the steering was smaller than the Palios. Felt "sportier" than the 1.6 Stile SPort

Second impression - gear knob. Felt good again and shifting gears went "click click click" I guess you would describe it as "slotty" or "notchy". Was more fun shifting gears in the swift. First thought that struck me was the gear shifting in the F50 in NFS 2 !!! (they could be miles apart but that was the first thought that struck me whne I shifted gears in the Swift).
(A query to team-bhpians: Is the gear shifting feel similiar in all MUL cars say the Alto, Esteem, Wagon R?)

Pick up was between the 1.6 and the 1.1. Decent enough. Car felt quite stable. At low revs I felt the Stile 1.6 to be more responsive. The Swift felt better in the higher revs. Felt more "in control" than the Stile 1.6 and almost same as the retro.

And looking at purely a driving impression (A.S.S / pricing / maintenance not being considered) I felt the Retro followed by the Swift and then the Stile 1.6. MUL has only 5K discounts and a 1.5 month waiting period for a red Vxi. So time enough to wait for the Spark's TD.

@radek - would really appreciate your impressions of the Spark.

And also any ideas bhpians on the lead time for the Spark.

Nimz

[goldie_malhotra]

Hey nimz - its really good that you went over and had a TD of the cars yourself.

The Swift is definitely more fun to drive - maybe not as much as the Palio 1.6, but good nevertheless. And the pre-sales response can give you an indication of what the after-sales is going to be like in both MUL and Fiat/Tata.

PS - gearshift of Alto/Wagon-R/Estilo is nowhere near the swifts, the Esteem's is a bit decent though.

[Nimz]

thanks GOldie...

Originally Posted by goldie_malhotra

PS - gearshift of Alto/Wagon-R/Estilo is nowhere near the swifts, the Esteem's is a bit decent though.

And thanks again for the above info..

Nimz

[GeekSrik]

for tata never go to manipal. always go to prerana. manipal sucks big time. their attention always wavers. hmm .... so nimz why not TD the spark at sundaram on kasturba road too, maybe they have one there.

[Nimz]

Originally Posted by GeekSrik

for tata never go to manipal. always go to prerana. manipal sucks big time. their attention always wavers. hmm .... so nimz why not TD the spark at sundaram on kasturba road too, maybe they have one there.

@GeekSrik, had the same experience in Concorde too.. the Fiat sales guy was toooo busy and we had to sit around..lie down in the boot of the Marina and other time pass till we pushed the receptionist that we would leave.. then he arranged for another guy to accompany us who had never driven a Fiat before and was the Indica guy. Also the odo was off!! MUL was better..

Reg the Spark they have one for display not TD. It seems the TD would happen after the launch in Blore which is extimated to be on 8th June. So have to wait before I decide on a car.

Would like some feedback on differences I felt between the retro and Stile sport 1.6. Any comments??

Nimz

[kamy450]

Originally Posted by Nimz

Hi team bhpians. Just back from TDing the Palio Stiles 1.1 and 1.6 and the Swift.

And also any ideas bhpians on the lead time for the Spark.

Nimz

during my last conversation with Sales rep at sundaram bangalore spark is ready in stock and can be delivered in a day's time. however suggest you to please check with them.

[sithon]

Originally Posted by Nimz

@GeekSrik, had the same experience in Concorde too.. the Fiat sales guy was toooo busy and we had to sit around..lie down in the boot of the Marina and other time pass till we pushed the receptionist that we would leave.. then he arranged for another guy to accompany us who had never driven a Fiat before and was the Indica guy. Also the odo was off!! MUL was better..

Reg the Spark they have one for display not TD. It seems the TD would happen after the launch in Blore which is extimated to be on 8th June. So have to wait before I decide on a car.

Would like some feedback on differences I felt between the retro and Stile sport 1.6. Any comments??

Nimz

hey Nimz, i got an ok reception at concorde. prerana at sarjapur road was quite better but they dont have any TD cars in stock (they bring their TD cars from their other showroom, since after the recent rains started, they cant store their cars in their basement garage ... )

I didnt get my 1.6 stile TD ride from concorde today (Sunday - apparently concorde hasnt gotten the 1.6 stile TD car).

As for differences between retro and the 1.6 stile,

a) according to concorde, the 1.6 retro has different seats ( i sat on 1.6 retro and then the 1.1 stile and i felt the sets on 1.6 retro were better or more comfy. Did you feel this too?
b) The turning radius is better in the stile 1.1 and is lesser than the retro. so that is one big point for me for going for 1.6 stile. i wonder if you noticed this too.

i did do a TD of the swift Vxi today and since space is a concern for me, i think i 'm leaning even more towards the palio. somehow the feel of the swift steering for me was a little toy like while the palio gave me a "in-control" feeling. and oh yes - the suspensions are a lil (if not a whole lot) better than the palio.
i need to check out the palio 1.6 stile in the same route and speed it up and also on the same stones and pits (!) and ditches on good indian roads we have here in bangy.

btw, if the choice is fiat, i plan to actually take the TD and drop in to the service station too (concorde guys said "sure we can take you there sir" to my query if this could be done).
if possible i will also check out prerana motors fiat service station at old madras road too , before deciding.
all this - since i have been reading a lil in the PUG and want to see for myself if the trend is any better now that the shifting of the plant to pune is done and there are no no complaining customers (who're not in the forum probably) in these show rooms too (need to surely see if any such 2 month repairs for some existing customers are there in bangalore too )

[radek]

Originally Posted by Nimz

@radek - would really appreciate your impressions of the Spark.
Nimz

Well, I am also newbie here with experience of only one car, so it is my impression rather than expert comment.

Spark is certainly not part of same class as Palio 1.6 and Swift. It has 1L engine which is smaller compared to Palio Sport and Swift. But what is surprising is, it is quite responsive. I took Spark for TD on highway (Katraj - Dehu road). I had no problem in taking it to 90KM/Hr speed. I could not drive faster than that, but I felt there is enough power left to take it to 120+. I heard GM car has problems with Gear shifts, but I had no problem with Spark. I tried some sudden accelerations at 4th and 5th gears, I could get the expected response though not as good as Swift. Engine was very smooth. While at idle, engine was super silent. If your daily routine is City or combination of City and Highway, Spark will be perfect fit. I am not sure how it will be on express highway long travels.

Spark again has limited interior space compared to bigger hatches, but It should be good for 4 adults. Boot space is also limited. In terms of interiors, it takes top slot compared to Swift and UVA (not sure about Palio 1.6 interiors). 1.0 LS that comes with AC,PS and front power windows is good value for money. 4.11 for ind. registration at Pune (4.36 for company), it costs lot less than others car in your list (and my list). It is costlier than Stile 1.1, but worth it. Someone here said ACI has rated Santro marginally better than Spark. But for me, Santro is not there in my list (honest reason is, every other person has it). Bottom line is you can't go wrong with this car.

[markiv]

I am also a first time car buyer and went for Palio 1.6 sports (retro) in oct'06. Inspite of poor A.S.S, I simply love the car!! its rightly said that there are "no palio drivers, only lovers"

But if ease of maintenance is your priority, then probably you should keep away from it. Swift fits the bill, though its too common now (at least in Delhi)

And I just couldnt believe my luck when I got the shiny new Formula Red Palio 1.6 for a way too cool 4.3L on-road back then!! Fully-loaded complete with rear spoiler, rear defogger, and alloys!!! what more can you ask for!! (perhaps better A.S.S )

I took a TD of both Palio 1.6 and Swift before buying, and Swift though fun to drive, appeared toyish to me. The steering too lacked the "feel"

btw its me whose car is in workshop for last 2 months, pending repairs

but if you ask me now which car I would go for if I had to go back, it would still be Palio 1.6

Having said that, you should not be influenced by others including me, after all its your hard earned money thats going into the purchase.

Personally I feel that Spark looks a bit girlish. U-VA is good, really like its design overall, roomy too!
Swift would be my next choice if not Palio 1.6.

[Nimz]

@sithon - COncorde did not have TD car of Stile so went to Manipal. They had one but there was some talk it was a customer's car but they gave it for TD with the odo off.

I somehow liked the Retro over the Stile in terms of seating. Yes I did feel a difference and if you felt it too.. thats great.


@radek - thanks for your review. Am waiting to try out the "responsive" spark.. yes thats the word I get from all reviews /mags. TG has rated Spark ahead of Santro.. Well have given up on automags. Just take a general clue from them, rely more on feedback from forum members and finally my experience of the TD.

@markiv - I really liked the Retro formula red. Fell in love with it in fact on first sight. But service, then the fear of getting a TD car and the fact the car has been discontinued - all this considering the OTR price to be upwards of 4.6 (in Bangalore) has kept me off.

If I had been quoted 4.3 like you the day I took the test drive and if concorde had not sent an Indica sales guy with me who didnt know a thing about Palios.. I'd be a proud owner by now

@kamy450 - thanks.

Just checked with Sundaram. They promise deliveries within a week at the max depending on the colour and the model. TD car is also in from GM it seems and after registration should be on by Wednesday. And it seems GM is only running Sparks on its lines due to the demand and an endevaour to keep waiting times to the minimum. Dont know how true..

So for me.. its the Spark (subject to good test drive) followed by the Retro1.6 (subject to availablity of a satisfactory non TD car at better prices) followed by the Swift and the UVA (test drive yet to take).

[EatMyDust]

Guys,

If you remember me, I too sail the same boat as Nimz.
Me too, took the TDs for both the Palios, and both the Swifts.
Just wanted to update u, ppl. I got a feedback requesting mail from FIAT. I have a gut feeling these guys are finally taking the A.S.S. complaints seriously. I expect the Tata - FIAT alliance to get better by the day. They HAVE to pull up their socks before they release the Linea and punto.

@Nimz, I'll be taking the spark td too on this weekend. If I dont like it, I'll book the Swift-Petrol. I'm eager to get my wheels asap!
I mention below why I chose on the Swift:
Palio 1.1 : Best looking hatch/ Affordable/ Terribly Underpowered
Palio 1.6 : The best car (by far) in this segment/ Cant afford the fuel :(
SWIFT DIESEL : Great torque/ Bad Waiting period / Out of budget
santros : Very common / Super choice of colors
Estilo : Unappealing looks/ Great Pricing
WagonR : Out dated looks/ CNG option is great
SWIFT Petrol : Toyish/ Cramped? / Affordable / Best choice to have a balance of driving pleasure/ FE
GETZ : Expensive in this segment/ Super choice of colours

Btw, Maruti hiked prices for Swift in bangy. they used to offer 15K cash discount, now its only 5K. Shouldve got my vehicle last month itself.

- EMD

[vinodv001]

SPARK is nothing but a Korean Daewoo MATIZ

Originally Posted by Nimz

Thanks typeonegative, the Spark as per reviews has better acceleration, rollon figures and handling than the Xing or the Wagon R making it more fun and involving to drive. Please correct me if am wrong in thinking thus. Yet to TD the Spark as no TD available in Blore till date. And its my assumption that the Spark would be a simpler car to maintain (correct me if am wrong here again). There have been relatively less complaints of GM's service as compared to Fiat.(Also heard GM is planning to increase service network bye end 2007)

Xing - Hyundai am not too comfortable with Korean makes (might be personal but as an Analyst i have studied a little about the Korean industry). Have also driven a friends new Santro and did not find it much "fun". Wagon R - didnt like its looks and didnt think it was peppy and handled well.
And one more thing, the Palio does not have the blessings of family and friends :-(
Would rely on more experienced advice in making a decision hence my post here in this forum (wonder how i missed this all these years)

[typeOnegative]

Originally Posted by EatMyDust

Palio 1.6 : The best car (by far) in this segment/ Cant afford the fuel :(

Would not argue against the Swift, but is the F.E. for a 1.6 Palio that bad? In any case I think the Swift is the safest buy in this segment.

[EatMyDust]

Originally Posted by typeOnegative

Would not argue against the Swift, but is the F.E. for a 1.6 Palio that bad? In any case I think the Swift is the safest buy in this segment.

From what i've read in the auto mags and understood in the forum: the diff between swift petrol and 1.6 should be about 3kmpl (city) - And mind u all - this is *my opinion* (i'm not an owner; this is an unbiased opinion, dont want any fiat argument to be started again)

besides i feel, affording FE is a very personal judgement, similar to one liking the looks of car/ and others may not like the looks. whatsay ppl?

[typeOnegative]

Originally Posted by EatMyDust

From what i've read in the auto mags and understood in the forum: the diff between swift petrol and 1.6 should be about 3kmpl (city) - And mind u all - this is *my opinion* (i'm not an owner; this is an unbiased opinion, dont want any fiat argument to be started again)

besides i feel, affording FE is a very personal judgement, similar to one liking the looks of car/ and others may not like the looks. whatsay ppl?

No, no Fiat argument.

Yes, an affordable F.E. is an extremely personal decision. I was not aware of the 3kmpl difference. I have heard 11-12 kmpl in city for the Swift. My Petra gives me 10-11 kmpl in city with intermittent A/C usage. It could be because I drive on the EEH on my way to the city. So the Palio should be better. Of course, 3 kmpl can be a lot if there is a lot of running. In any case, as I have already said, you are making a sound decision with the Swift.