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Old 20th July 2014, 23:58   #136
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The Indian market is suffering in trends if "cheaper" cars from ALL makers. Not cost wise but quality, performance and looks wise. Fuel efficiency and fuel efficiency is all that is in the books of manufacturers and customers.

Better quality vehicle is exported to foreign land and we get cheaper vehicles even after production happening in India. More features in the same car exists in foreign but we get bare bones.

No standards in safety and no monitor / rules for adequate safety in a car sold. No governance, just selling.

Kia or Mazda coming to India won't change our future but the government and customers need a attitude revamp to have things on track.

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Old 21st July 2014, 00:04   #137
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

I should say the Indian cars are missing out on features,we pay more for almost all the cars in the market but we get less.
In the price bracket of 20L-30L we have no performance cars all we have in that range are tall SUVs and premium D segment cars and low end models of luxury cars.
For all the petrol-heads who dream of owning a 4WD or RWD performance saloon or hatch have to pay more than 50L

We need cars like the Evo 10(not with a price tag of 60L),
Subaru Impereza Wrx sti,
Vw Golf,Golf GTi
Audi A4 2.0tsi with quattro,
Audi A3 with Quattro,
Manual Transmission petrol BMWs,
Performance versions of hatches like polo Gti(1.4tsi-180ps) fiesta st(1.6 ecoboost),abarth punto,Fabia Rs
Skoda Octavia with 2.0tsi(220ps)

All these cars mentioned should be available 10L<35L


Last edited by kn09 : 21st July 2014 at 00:28.
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Old 21st July 2014, 05:11   #138
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

First of all our market cannot be compared with any other, whether if its a matter of pride or shame i don't know, the relatively late opening of the market has had its effect. Where else in the world do you see Suzuki and Hyundai leading the sales chart?

A reason that i can attribute to the lack of choice is our diesel craze that allows Skodas/VWs to reign and Germans being the only luxury options when we could have had the Lexuses and Acuras of the world and even the VFM Genesis. But then brand snobbery...

Another thing that may have to do with the taxes and all is the pricing.
For all of us whining about car prices being high ,did an amateur comparo between the prices in India and the prices in Saudi Arabia(nil taxes, everything from Chinese to Mercs to Cadillacs are sold there).ex showroom.

Under 12 lakhs
IndiaFor us Indians we have a wide range of options under 12 lakhs. Actually this is where we are spoilt for options. From the 2 lakhs Nano to 12 lakhs Xuv500 we have a wide variety of models, body styles and engines.

Saudi ArabiaBut whereas in Saudi Arabia the starting price of cars is around 8 lakhs. Sure, we can get a bunch of Indian made hatches(i10, Figo, Beat) and Chinese make hatches for around 5 lakhs, but the vast majority of the popular cars (Toyota Yaris, Verna/Accent) starts from 8 lakhs and the choice of cars in this range is relatively few.

Sure , ours are built to cost, decontented , probably unsafe death trap cars etcetra but given 8 lakhs we have a choice of buying hatches,sedans, small MPVs, full blown MUVs, decades old tech jeeps and pick up trucks.

Over 12 lakhs
IndiaLuxury car territory in India, but lets look at the choices. Sure, we get the top end versions of every car, but most of them are surely over priced, thanks to the import content in them and the taxes.
Other than a bunch of SUVs and sedans, the higher the prices go the more European it becomes and then it ends in the Holy German trio.

Another interesting thing that i noticed that even after localising or assembling in India, the prices of the cars remain the same as it was when imported as CBU. Take in case of the Camry or the German compact executive class.
Also the different classes of cars are separated by 10lakhs minimum. Over lapping of models in the same stable is unheard of, not surprising cause we get the high mid/top end versions only.

Saudi Arabia - Now this is where the choices start. For example in the range of 12-25 lakhs one can buy the whole range of Toyota vehicles from the Corolla to the giant Sequoia, barring the mighty Landcruiser. Add two lakhs and you can get the base variant of the LC for 27 lakhs.

Also there is heavy overlap of models. For example the Corolla starts from 9lakhs to 12.5 lakhs, whereas the Camry starts from 12.4lakhs to 17lakhs. But we have to bear in mind that unlike the models here, the Corollas and Camrys sold abroad include bare basic versions for fleet sales.
And to be fair the Camry we get here is the Toyota Aurion Grande sold in Saudi minus the V6 engine.

But all things said, we are getting a really good deal, cause if not for the import taxes all the cars are actually well priced. Just look at the recently launched Honda Jazz in Malaysia. 13-16lakhs !!!!!

So am i happy with the lack of choice of RWD cars, affordable sports car, pickups and SUVs. - NO

But do i want the imports restrictions to be lifted? - NAH. I would rather have a home grown industry and see everything from the Nano to the S class being assembled here than opening up the market to unrestricted imports.

p.s. Would give anything to see the 86 being sold here, but alas it would end up a 50lakh toy here if at all its launched. And i don't think except for us enthusiasts any one else cares about RWD as long as they get an extra 2km/l .
And TKM should look at the prospect of selling the GXR variant of the Landcruiser in here. Even with the import taxes it would be in par with the GLs,Q7s in pricing. See the thing fly off the shelf

Last edited by DicKy : 21st July 2014 at 05:24.
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Old 21st July 2014, 06:31   #139
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

My little take on the subject.
India is a complex market (as many multinationals in many areas have found out to their own dismay) with its own set of peculiarities (read attitudes in this case). It is also a country which is struggling to break out economically. Vast sections of people can only look at a four wheeler and sigh. Of the car buying segment, a large majority is in the bottom fringe area ie between the 2 wheeler/4 wheeler territory. The puchasing power being not too great, they tend to settle for small hatchbacks, built to a cost with FE being uppermost in their minds. And possibly unlike mature markets or even other BRIC nations, the pecentage of more affluent sections are smaller (I do not have ready statistics though - just my inference).
Given all of the above, car makers have a different approach to this market and we see more of value for money, built to a cost offerings rather than cars for enthusiasts. And some car makers will hesitate to enter. I see this continuing for a while at least, till the market matures further.
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Old 21st July 2014, 08:32   #140
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

Indian market is missing on cars that have little demand in India. Such cars as hot hatchbacks or 7 seater SUVs won't sell more than a few hundred numbers per month. For most players, these numbers make no sense financially, unless they are also ready to sell cars in the budget segment.

Most manufacturers do have cars in the budget segment. But the only problem is, these cars are so well built (safe) that pricing them on par with the competition is not financially viable.

Hopefully, Indian government brings out strict safety norms soon, and that opens up the market to these wonderful cars.
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Old 21st July 2014, 09:01   #141
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

India is missing on good reliable drivers car in 12-20 lakh category. All the action is happening under 12 lakhs. What Indians need is a car under 15 lakhs:

1. Which is a diesel car with DSG
2. Looks like Honda City and has the space
3. Engine/Gearbox combo like Polo DSG TSi
4. Handling like new Ford Fiesta
5. Maintenance like Honda/Toyota
6. NVH Like new Ford Fiesta
7. Quality audio with subwoofer

If a manufacturer can give this package under 15 lakhs than they sure have a winner.
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Old 21st July 2014, 09:07   #142
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Re: Cars we wish manufacturers would launch in India

Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
I'd love to see VW bring the Scirocco and sell it here, and the Golf as well.
The VW Golf and Scirocco sits very low to the ground. GC is a great problem, and trust me, if it is going to hit a speed breaker hard then you burst the oil sump for sure. So is the GT86/BRZ.

Now a days I try one tire at a time trick
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Old 21st July 2014, 09:41   #143
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

What I find surprising is that smaller markets like Malaysia get infinitely more variety even at crazy prices that promote local mfg just like India. e.g Jazz starts here at 72800 MYR or about 14.xx lakh for comparison. So many brands sell here! But not in India like u said - I don't have an answer!
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Old 21st July 2014, 11:25   #144
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

Only those companies with strong will to enter indian market enter it. Because, they already knew that they are entering the HELL. Top reasons for this being.
- Corruption
There is no direct way to start a company. You need to go through direct and indirect routes and get all approvals. Even after having an approval, there is no guarantee that you have crossed the river. You might again end up at point 0, where you have started initially.

Everyone prefers to work hard. But not the wrong ways. If i remember correctly, Mazda said that they have no interest in entering indian market. If the Entry to companies is easy, i do not see any point why wouldn't someone start it here?
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Old 21st July 2014, 11:41   #145
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

I cant agree more, the beautiful cars in classical speak are sorely missing on our soil.

There are few curvy n full of fluid options, and some more to be positioned as cheaper (here some, there some) but no real substance to differentiate. I would not look twice at Fluditic Verna with awe anymore now, but it is still different story when comes to SR-V, OHC & Palio S10, although are decade n half old designs. The Etios, Liva, Manza,UVA are more like rubbing salt.

It seems the present day cars this shore are meant for instant glorification (either fashion model perspective or cash register one) and can only be as interesting as that and that much longer.
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Old 21st July 2014, 11:47   #146
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Re: What the Indian Market is missing out on!

Similar to what others have mentioned, the Indian market has a fixed type of car that is associated with the price range.
6 lakhs or under- hatchback: cheap to maintain,reliable
6 to 10-12 lakhs- sedan: good looking,with no.of features
12-20 lakhs- this segment is practically non-existent today with only the XUV and some sedans accumulating numbers for their companies.
20-30 lakhs - SUV: preferably Toyota Fortuner
Above 30 lakhs - German luxury brand,period

There is no place for cars which differ from these virtues, there is no market for cars like Aria(a 4x4 MPV), Yeti(small off-roader) or Sonata,Camry(petrol luxury sedans)
This phenomenon is somewhat changing with the relative success of small MPVs and compact luxury hatches but we still don't have performance hatches like Golf GTI, luxury MPVs like Honda Odyssey or mid-size crossovers like Mazda CX-5. And god forbid a station wagon is introduced, it will be beaten to the hilt from the consumers.
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Old 17th April 2015, 07:53   #147
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Why not this Seat Leon X-Perience as Rebadged Skoda for India?

Read the Jalopnik's review of the Seat Leon X-Perience . All that time, the thought that struck me was - "What a perfect car for India!"

Cars we wish manufacturers would launch in India-1208664470466228111.jpg
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They really should bring it in under the Skoda badge; price it around 18 lakhs and laugh all the way to the bank.

What say, folks?

Last edited by .anshuman : 17th April 2015 at 11:14. Reason: Added image
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Old 17th April 2015, 08:03   #148
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re: Why not this Seat Leon X-Perience as Rebadged Skoda for India?

Originally Posted by sridhu View Post
They really should bring it in under the Skoda badge; price it around 18 lakhs and laugh all the way to the bank.
It may not be possible to sell a car at a lower price and then laugh on the way to a bank. Because a Seat badge or even if badged as a Skoda, it would be difficult to attract a large clientele to make huge profit margins.

Last edited by rajeev k : 17th April 2015 at 08:07.
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Old 17th April 2015, 08:26   #149
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re: Why not this Seat Leon X-Perience as Rebadged Skoda for India?

Bringing in a new car like the Cupra will require quite a bit of investment that may not pay dividends, considering that it's not a mass market car. VAG is currently working on introducing a budget brand. Catch them bringing something like the Cupra wagon that's bound to be 25 lakhs at least, and that is after cutting corners!

Remember the Octavia Combi and how it had bombed badly?
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Old 17th April 2015, 09:17   #150
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re: Why not this Seat Leon X-Perience as Rebadged Skoda for India?

Originally Posted by sridhu View Post
They really should bring it in under the Skoda badge; price it around 18 lakhs and laugh all the way to the bank.

What say, folks?
When they could not laugh all the way to the bank with a brand that was already established (Octavia), I am not so sure if a station wagon at 18 lakhs would help them.

VW and Skoda are a confused lot w.r.t their brand's positioning. Plus, as already pointed out in another thread (power struggle at VW or something, can't recall now), Indian market is hardly a priority for them - from numbers perspective.
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