[saildrive]

Guys

Now that some of the F1 enthusiasts out here have figured out that KIMI - the best that I have seen is going to most probably sit out for 2010 season :(

Just wanted to know how many amongst us feel that either one of the above was the best and why?

For sheer driving / racing skills and the care a damn attitude of Kimi is something that I adored him for!

If the mods allow - may the polls begin!!

Cheers

[nitrous]

Seven World Championships to One?
Its not a fair comparison.

[theexperthand]

+2 to nitrous

Originally Posted by nitrous

Seven World Championships to One?
Its not a fair comparison.

Kimi is good -there is no doubt about it, but no, he is not quiet equal to Regenmeister.

[condor]

Square-root of 7, pls

If RB wasnt there doing guard duty for Schumi, Schumi would not have won even half of what he won. Numbers are mis-leading.

Not that Schumi was bad - else he would not have made it to F1.

Senna, all the way.

[kcnetid]

Though I am a very disappointed and a very big Kimi (and Mika) fan, I will have to agree with nitrous on that you can't really compare Kimi and Schumi. I do have a few points to make though. These can be controversial so please reign in your language when you dispute me :-)

1. Kimi did have a good team with McLaren but was somehow dogged with a mech and engine problems. He managed to win only after shifting to Ferrari.
Kimi always beat schumi when he had a good car and there were more than a few times when he was leading and the car broke down. Funnily I remember the same for Ruebens - maybe he was give the 2nd car and the primary to schumi.

2. Other major factors in Schumi wins:
2.1 Ross Brawn and Todd are very big factors in the wins by Schumi. Look at what happened this year.
2.2 Mika chose to retire. There was no way Schumi could have won half as many if Mika continued.
2.3 Poor Ruebens was under 'team orders'. I am surprised his spirit is not crushed by now.
2.4 After Mika and before Renault/Alonso, other cars were not just in the same class in terms of pace or reliability. All the other champs/former champs did not get good rides.
2.5 There were a lot of times when Schumi got away with infractions where other drivers would have been penalised and hence lost places/points.

Not taking anything away from Schumi, my guess is that he *actually* won not more than 2-3 championships on equal terms. The rest were because of the reasons mentioned above. Look at what happened when Renault had a good car or with BrawnGP.

Also despite Kimi's partying image, he has way more class on the track than Schumi, I don't recall one incident of a cheap shot from Kimi while I remember many cases of Schumi's wheel banging or aggressive tactics. I used to like Schumi but sorta lost respect from him after seeing him celebrating wins after Ruebens 'team orders' to fall back and also quite a few incidents of 'aggressive racing'.

All said and done, in another 5 yrs, nobody will remember individual races or even seasons and all that will remain is the record books and Schumi's 7 wins - however justified that is.

[Country Road]

Comparing Schumi with Mikka would be fair and not Shumi with Kimi.

My personal POV, Mikka was a better driver. Yet Schumi became quite a cult figure. He has more fan following. But to me it has always been Mikka.

[myavu]

Originally Posted by kcnetid

Though I am a very disappointed and a very big Kimi (and Mika) fan, I will have to agree with nitrous on that you can't really compare Kimi and Schumi. I do have a few points to make though. These can be controversial so please reign in your language when you dispute me :-)

For me only Shumi... I agree to all the above facts, but the question is why he got all those consideration? Someone to be the most successful need all those something extra. He got it and he utilized it to the fullest.

Cheers!

[gods-envy]

Originally Posted by kcnetid

Though I am a very disappointed and a very big Kimi (and Mika) fan, I will have to agree with nitrous on that you can't really compare Kimi and Schumi. I do have a few points to make though. These can be controversial so please reign in your language when you dispute me :-)

1. Kimi did have a good team with McLaren but was somehow dogged with a mech and engine problems. He managed to win only after shifting to Ferrari.
Kimi always beat schumi when he had a good car and there were more than a few times when he was leading and the car broke down. Funnily I remember the same for Ruebens - maybe he was give the 2nd car and the primary to schumi.

2. Other major factors in Schumi wins:
2.1 Ross Brawn and Todd are very big factors in the wins by Schumi. Look at what happened this year.
2.2 Mika chose to retire. There was no way Schumi could have won half as many if Mika continued.
2.3 Poor Ruebens was under 'team orders'. I am surprised his spirit is not crushed by now.
2.4 After Mika and before Renault/Alonso, other cars were not just in the same class in terms of pace or reliability. All the other champs/former champs did not get good rides.
2.5 There were a lot of times when Schumi got away with infractions where other drivers would have been penalised and hence lost places/points.

Not taking anything away from Schumi, my guess is that he *actually* won not more than 2-3 championships on equal terms. The rest were because of the reasons mentioned above. Look at what happened when Renault had a good car or with BrawnGP.

Also despite Kimi's partying image, he has way more class on the track than Schumi, I don't recall one incident of a cheap shot from Kimi while I remember many cases of Schumi's wheel banging or aggressive tactics. I used to like Schumi but sorta lost respect from him after seeing him celebrating wins after Ruebens 'team orders' to fall back and also quite a few incidents of 'aggressive racing'.

All said and done, in another 5 yrs, nobody will remember individual races or even seasons and all that will remain is the record books and Schumi's 7 wins - however justified that is.

Agree with kcnetid on the points you have mentioned.

I know hardcore Schumi fans would disagree but I think it's Kimi all the way.
Too bad he was boggled down with car reliability issues, but still he is a 100% raw racer.
No controversies, No wheel banging, No stopping in the middle of the race track, nothing..
Pure racing period.

[Dante]

What about two time world championship winner fernando alonso?
What about one time world championship winner lewis hamilton?

I've never liked Kimi.

[Akadian]

I think Ayrton Senna is unmatched till date and if he had not died in the midst of his peak, the record books would have been telling a completely different story. Schumi would have found it much harder to win those first two with Benetton

[shishir_bn]

IMO Schumi and Senna are the greatest. Senna had it all but lost in the final battle. Schumi has it all and did it till the end. The killer instinct and the "Go-GET-IT" attitiude is missing in kimi. The rain matches, the daring to take the opponent in all the cross/hair pin bends ect was easily taken up schumi but not by any one. Yes if Senna would have survived that crash then he would have been the greatet and it would have been an even fight between Schumi and Senna

[SilentEngine]

In modern F1, the end result is a lot dependent on the team/car/rules and relative performance wrt the rivals. So on what basis will you compare Schumi and Kimi? If you go by the numbers, Schumi will always be ahead of every other F1 driver, not just Kimi. What does it prove?

Personally I would pick Kimi over Schumi, because for me how the result was achieved is also important, not just the end result.

[McLaren Rulez]

Wonder how this thread would have gone if this topic had been started before Kimi announced his retirement.

[ksethuram]

Originally Posted by nitrous

Seven World Championships to One?
Its not a fair comparison.

+1.

Yes, i understand both are good and fast drivers, and with all respect to both,
Schumi was cocky, Kimi is not.
Schumi built a team around him, Kimi just used what he had.
Schumi never took sabatical, but Kimi did.
Schumi was a good PR person, Kimi is not...

There are many more.. So no way Kimi is near Schumi.

[dhrishikesh]

My vote will be always for Schumi as he is far ahead in terms of driving quality & also in terms of number of championships.
Schumi is always helpful to his fellow team mates, so he is always ahead of Kimi.