[zenx]

Oops, let's avoid this becoming a battleground, please. Intent is to create and keep going some data points for future buyers.

[amitk26]

Irrelevant please post your driving experience and comparison report elsewhere on a new thread or may be on an existing Scorpio vs Tavera vs gamma vs Rhino vs Pajero vs Sukhoi SU 30 MKI kind of thread , lets keep it clean solely for owners feedback.
My observations may be quite contrary to yours but that is not the point of this thread

Originally Posted by HIGHNOON

Drove my friend's V.T.T. last weekend at my lonavala cottage which has a not so hot access way in the best of condition. Safari could directly get down across some fields to reach without grounding anywhere. More than adequate grunt. Offcourse rainy days and slushy black soil could be another matter altogether.
Ergonomy is fine. Steering felt quite vague though and turning radius is shocking !!! Very difficult to turn without some planning on the old mumbai pune highway at the waksai junction.
Another thing i noticed is that the clutch feels extremely rough, course while being depressed. His truck has done only 10 k and is well maintained. Is this thing common to all safaris or was a problem with this one?
I remember not noticing this thing with scorpio.
otherwise all well. I would not put my money on this one for sure. Didnt feel refined at all.
During pickup too which is quite good considering its a heavy diesel truck, there is a course edge to the engine note or feel. Have driven a NA turbo scorpio and also the mhawk one. Dont particualrly remember noticing that rough edge....
Another thing is its a 5 seater and anybody having delusions of it being a spacious 7 seater ll be sorely disappointed. The 5 sit very well way better than the scorpio but the scorpio jump sits could sit a 6 footer like me at the expense of not so spacious middle row. The safari one may only sit a couple of small ones.

[lazy]

Dear friends

Though there is merit in letting only safari owners vote on this poll, there is a flipside to it too esp. if one considers the intent of the OP.
Letting only owners vote biases the poll results. IIRC it’s called Selection Bias in statistics.

Most T-BHP safari owners have made the purchase decision after knowing about its mannerisms, problems, TASS, resale, etc. So it’s quite likely that issues that may be major for XYZ may be minor for safari-owner. This quite skews the poll results.

I am following this thread with much interest. I had almost booked the 2.2 last Sep, however had then recently joined a start-up and the recession hit us bad. So.... However, it'll still good to know more about the vehicle one's interested in.

I, however, don’t know how to avoid people from slandering the 2.2 based on their uncle's aunt’s brother's sister's close friend's boss's neighbour's relative's cook's tailor's experiences

My suggestion, let everyone vote, but must give their exp. with the vehicle. Readers can well judge the merit of baseless comments.

[zenx]

Originally Posted by lazy

Though there is merit in letting only safari owners vote on this poll, there is a flipside to it too esp. if one considers the intent of the OP.
Letting only owners vote biases the poll results. IIRC it’s called Selection Bias in statistics.

Quite true. To avoid this, had tried making the choices as objective as possible, with a description and examples of what each kind of problem means. Hopefully, people will not pull wool over their own eyes! The reason for restricting it to Safari Dicor 2.2 users was to see how many of them, specifically, have faced none/minor/major/persistent issues - and let that form a data point for future buyers. Ideally, its not about perceptions and judgments of how the vehicle drives, whether TASC is any good, people's take on Tata's QC processes and the like - numerous other threads provide space for that

Of course, still notice a couple of voters who do not seem to own any kind of Safari, leave alone the 2.2VTTs. Hopefully, in a larger sample, these numbers will be small and spread across the options.

[adc]

Originally Posted by zenx

Quite true. To avoid this, had tried making the choices as objective as possible, with a description and examples of what each kind of problem means. Hopefully, people will not pull wool over their own eyes! The reason for restricting it to Safari Dicor 2.2 users was to see how many of them, specifically, have faced none/minor/major/persistent issues - and let that form a data point for future buyers. Ideally, its not about perceptions and judgments of how the vehicle drives, whether TASC is any good, people's take on Tata's QC processes and the like - numerous other threads provide space for that

Dont think any 2.2 owners or even for other respective car owners will not be objective and not report if anything they see amiss - naturally by itself it is not feasible or compatible with the way this tbhp site has evolved. Whatever be their ride, members do report the problem if things are going wrong.

Saw this thread and voted for without issues and back it up with all my service details till now in the LTOR thread. Though, even now, I do attach the tag - TILL NOW - because for me to pass on the final verdict that this is one success product it has to go past 50 k with no major issues. Still very okay as of now with the product VTT.

Suprisingly, whenever I have talked with the service persons, and this being in 3 states, they in fact say that the 2.2 is giving much less major problems than 3.0 used to give, of course the 3.0 went through major editions in between its life span - and last edition was very much improved.

One important thing that was common in their saying was that always be careful about the fuel quality, whether premium or normal - this common rail system is quite sensitive to diesel quality and also they emphasized not to open it up at a roadside garage, the whole DICOR system fails if moisture goes inside - if otherwise, the bill will hit you like a thousand sledgehammers.

Of course, still notice a couple of voters who do not seem to own any kind of Safari, leave alone the 2.2VTTs.

You can send a mass PM to all the 70-80 2.2 owners and ask to report, and also can the other non-2.2 owners be taken out from the poll list.

[zenx]

Originally Posted by adc

You can send a mass PM to all the 70-80 2.2 owners and ask to report, and also can the other non-2.2 owners be taken out from the poll list.

Cool! That'll be awesome. How do I do this ?

[tsk1979]

wow 20% of owners have either have had major issues, or are too pained by the vehicle. Its high time Tata wakes up! Normally no more than 5% of users should have such problems.

[amitk26]

Originally Posted by lazy

Though there is merit in letting only safari owners vote on this poll, there is a flipside to it too esp. if one considers the intent of the OP.
Letting only owners vote biases the poll results. IIRC it’s called Selection Bias in statistics.

No problem if Poll was for perception of 2.2 VTT but the poll is about ownership experience , If you look at the poll selection bias exists in other forms as well.
Some one had a perception that Safari is royal pain in neither region and never purchased it and went for another 4 wheeler would you consider
what a pain kind of response objective and based on 1st hand experience.

Another instance one gentleman owns TCIC Safari and all his post states he is extremely happy and does not see a reason why 2.2 VTT Dicor should exist on the earth and then he voted what a pain does it give an objective ownership report ?

Probably we can add another Poll for non owners perception and thier reason for not purchasing for covering them instead of adding them in Ownership experience poll

[Prowler]

Voted for no issues. I have owned a TCIC Safari before this 2.2 VTT Safari and it had been reliable too. I have been driving cars for over 18 years - Amby , Fiat Padmini (most problematic), Omni and Safari. I would go with Safari anyday.

[Su-47]

Fantastic idea to have this poll.

Originally Posted by tsk1979

wow 20% of owners have either have had major issues, or are too pained by the vehicle.

If the 2.2 issues are any representative of 3.0: I wish a similar poll was available 2 years back! I would've saved about 2L that I lost in the buying and selling my 3.0. 20% is too high a number for normal mortals to stake close to a million rupees.

Originally Posted by zenx

* I've heard that thr 3.0 did have a bunch of issues early on.

I too have *heard* that! I bought the 3.0 about 6-months before the 2.2 was launched, so I guess it should've been one of the sorted out ones. But, lets not talk about that here.

Why dont you ask for an additional metric in your poll: number of visits to the service center in the first year of ownership. Whatever be the issue (small or big), it surely consumes your valuable time, and does affect the ownership experience.

[zenx]

Well

* Do remember to discount non-2.2-users who've voted. The %ages change a bit.
* I've heard that thr 3.0 did have a bunch of issues early on. The 2.2 is supposed to have been much better. This is partially to find out

[gowda79]

loving_alaap, tabrez02, xbox360

Eddy, ibm_jennifer, vivek.singh.73

Do they all own a Safari 2.2 VTT ??? i doubt !!!

Jeniffer as a 2.0L i guess and others nope, the vote needs to be removed if so

[zenx]

xbox360 - 2.2 EX 4x4
Eddy - voted on bro's behalf, with a detailed explanation and as stated, hand-on-the-heart proxy

False -ves:
loving_alaap : No Safari in the posts
tabrez02 : had considered - not sure if bought
ibm_jennifer : yes TCIC
vivek.singh : No Safari, from what I could gather from the posts/threads

False +ves:
manojas : no cars stated
shekaran : could not find a Safari in the posts
abbey4u : no Safari either
GSMINC : either a Swift or a Santro
ram.west : dicor (not sure abt 2.2)
ranjit : again, dicor - but 2.2 ?
ScorpMan : could not see a Safari in the nice long list of cars!

Phew. That might help. The %ages sure look slightly better now Of course the numbers are too small. Esp the negatives, to calculate percentages and the like.

[kb100]

Zenx

Very sorry but IMHO, I think this exercise is not going to get you any closer to your answer - if anything you might find yourself in the exact same spot - or marginally more confused.

I doubt if you are going to uncover anything new. Buying a Safari is always going to be a mixed bag - like Anup Mathur said - akin to owning an Enfield. It may not be entirely niggle free but the experience is unbeatable! If you are prepared to accept the initial niggles as a part of the experience, the vehicle will give you years of motoring fun - After all their warranty is unbeatable! I will get mine soon!

[gowda79]

Originally Posted by kb100

Zenx

Very sorry but IMHO, I think this exercise is not going to get you any closer to your answer -

Why does it always prop up in Safari thread ???

No idea guys the Safari is not let alone anywhere, it has got fans in many ways