[thirdmainroad]

Hello all,

This is for everyone's information that things like this happen even in branded showrooms. This is also to ask for your advise - if you were in my place, what would you do?


To summarise, in about Feb 2019, when my WRV was a few months old, I went to 3M Thiruvanmiyur and paid Rs 29,000 to get Cr70 film installed on all windows and front and rear wind shield. I have gone to this shop multiple times before for various services, including ceramic coating, PPF, mats, etc etc. I am a "known" customer to them.

The WRV already had a cheap 3000 Rs sunfilm installed on the windows, and the advisors told me to install CR 70 on top of that film, which I agreed to.

They installed the Film, and showed me 3m water marks on all the windows and I drove away.

A few months later, the film installed on my driver window peeled and I went back to the center to get it fixed. They readily agreed to change the film under warranty and this time I stayed back. After the film was done I noticed the technician wiping away something below the 3M water marks. Upon inspection, I found that he was wiping away "SP50" marker under "3M" on the film. When I asked why they were installing SP50 instead of CR 70, they gave me a few different different reasons, saying that its the same cost, and that on windows its always SP 50. I had already spent 2/3 hours at the shop, had to leave and I took their word for it but still asked them why they were wiping away the water mark, and they said that's how it was done.

I always had a nagging doubt but just didn't have the time to follow up. Now having checked, I have come to know there is a HUGE difference between SP50 and CR 70.

These guys have wilfully committed fraud with the sole intention to cheat me.

When I went back, they initially denied it and said I was confused and made a mistake. I insisted on them taking the car to any lab to check at which they scratched their heads, said some confusion has happened, but they will replace the film to avoid any of this confusion.

I have, like I said, got PPF from them, ceramic coating, lots of polishing work... how are we to know any of their wok is genuine?

What would you do in my situation??


Below is my letter to 3M:

Hello,

I am a loyal customer of 3M, and have been getting services done in the 3M auto shop in Thiruvanmiyur, Chennai, 600041.

I paid Rs 28,900 to get CR70 sun film installed on all windows, rear and front windshield for my Honda WRV. Please note that there was already a cheaper Sun film installed on my Door windows, and I was advised by uniformed 3M advisors to get the CR 70 to be installed on top of the existing sun film. This was done. When I checked the glasses, there was 3M water mark on the film, but no indication of what it was, ie CR 70 or SP 50 or what ever.

A few months later, the sun film installed by your technicians on one of my door windows peeled off, so I went back to the center to get it fixed under warranty, which they readily obliged to do. This time, I went back to pick the car up a little earlier, and noticed your uniformed technicians rubbing away the category of film of the watermark on the film, leaving just the 3M mark. Upon inspection, I saw that the film was SP50 and they were rubbing that away. When I asked them what this was about, they said SP50 is the same cost as CR 70, and this is what they do rub off the SP 50 mark as no body wants to see it. Being a loyal customer and having huge respect for 3M, I accepted what they said, and took delivery of the car.

Upon checking later, I came to know that SP50 is a much cheaper variant of Sunfilm. I have paid for and been invoiced for Cr 70 on all windows and windshield front and back. And your technicians under the sole purpose to commit fraud and cheat me, have installed SP 50.

I have gone to this service center many times, and have purchased many top end services, including ceramic coating for Rs 20,000/- I go to this shop because it is a branded 3M center. Now that I have caught them how am I to know that they have done anything that was actually paid for or used genuine 3 M products instead of cheap products?


I will bring my car and invoice to any laboratory you specify within reasonable distance of my residence such that you can check for yourself. I have seen with my own eyes your 3M unformed technicians rubbing off the "SP50" marker.

You have committed wilful fraud to cheat a loyal, high paying customer. Please let me know as a brand, how will you set this right to stop me from going to the consumer court and also using my connections to take this to the news papers and other online news and social media?

Chandan Seetharam

[RaceHorse]

Thank you for bringing this topic. I got cheated just like you. I got installed CR-70 film on all windows and front windshield of my Verna.

Because color of my car is black, I felt at least this film can give some respite from car getting heated inside when parked under sun.

Also the main reason for installing this was to prevent high beam distortion from oncoming vehicles.

But within a month I noticed the film installed never had the same effect as the one demoed in the 3M showroom.
There is no change noticed from light glare of oncoming vehicles when compared to my other car without film.

More over there is not much difference in the heat effect under sun. My friend and I bought exact same spec Verna in black color.
He didn't installed any films. When parked in our office parking lot under sun, both car felt same levels of heat inside.

I literally felt short changed by this 3M guys. It is always better to be present at the time of installation and observe what they are actually installing.
This seems to be a big scam across cities in 3M showrooms.

[Artyom]

Originally Posted by thirdmainroad

Hello all,


I have, like I said, got PPF from them, ceramic coating, lots of polishing work... how are we to know any of their wok is genuine?

What would you do in my situation??

Can you take your vehicle to any other 3M outlet and ask them to inspect if the services you got and the products being used are genuine. Ideally, if they are honest they should give you clue weather you have been robbed or not.There is a possibility that it could only have been the sun film where they goofed up.

Alternatively, you can also check with other professional detailers who are not from 3M but apply the same products. For Example, PPF is something which I hear can be applied by anyone with a skillset. Maybe that's true with other products as well. These folks will be transparent in telling you the truth as they can make a difference between a fake ane genuine product.

[SideView]

Really sad state of affairs, for each and everything if one doesnt keep an eye we get shortchanged. ( Sometimes keeping a lookout doesnt help either due to lack of expertise)

What is our beautiful country turning into? Such posts make me sad.

[tud]

Originally Posted by thirdmainroad

When I went back, they initially denied it and said I was confused and made a mistake. I insisted on them taking the car to any lab to check at which they scratched their heads, said some confusion has happened, but they will replace the film to avoid any of this confusion.

Now that they readily agreed to replace the film, and not challenge your complaint makes it clear who is at wrong.

I suggest you spend 2-3 hours at the 3M Thiruvanmiyur outlet and oversee the peeling of old film and installation of the new film. Also get yourself a 5 years warranty card signed and sealed from the date of the new installation.

I really don't understand this concept of pasting a film over another film. The whole purpose of using a 3M film is defeated.

[thirdmainroad]

Originally Posted by tud

Now that they readily agreed to replace the film, and not challenge your complaint makes it clear who is at wrong.

I suggest you spend 2-3 hours at the 3M Thiruvanmiyur outlet and oversee the peeling of old film and installation of the new film. Also get yourself a 5 years warranty card signed and sealed from the date of the new installation.

I really don't understand this concept of pasting a film over another film. The whole purpose of using a 3M film is defeated.

Yes, they knew they were in the wrong. When I calmly told them that I am willing to go to any external lab, and I cannot stand being cheated and that I would spend even two lakhs to prove my case, the immediately offered to redo all windows and the rear windshield.

I sometimes cannot afford to spend half a day or so at a showroom and that's why I thought it best to go for branded showrooms, thinking they won't cheat there, but boy was I wrong!

And I think they suggested leaving the old film on only to make it easier for them to cheat me, and I fell easy prey.

Originally Posted by Artyom

Alternatively, you can also check with other professional detailers who are not from 3M but apply the same products. For Example, PPF is something which I hear can be applied by anyone with a skillset. Maybe that's true with other products as well. These folks will be transparent in telling you the truth as they can make a difference between a fake ane genuine product.

I've been searching for great audio in my car(s) for years now, and finally landed on Speedfreaks in Annanagar in Chennai. He really did wonders to my car as far as Audio is concerned and I've written about him in another post here on Team BHP (Car Audio Installation : Speedfreaks (Anna Nagar, Chennai)).

After spending sometime there I've really come to trust them. They do all manner of mods and accessories, including PPF, Sun Film, etc., etc. and they such great jobs of them all. Last week, we went to get my girlfriends Ignis sun film done there. She was on a budget, and Karthik of Speedfreaks suggested we get Lumar Steel Series films done for all windows and windshields, and it cost us about Rs 7000 only and its just as good as the "Cr 70" on my WRV.

When I took my car after and told Karthik that I had a doubt about the film, he used a light meter and wasn't satisfied with the results on the windows and rear. The windows were proving to be a bit difficult to assess because of the old film on them. When I went back to 3m and said "Lets go to a lab or bring out a light meter - they immediatly said "no sir, if you ahve a doubt we will change, why all that?" leaving me absolutely sure they had cheated me.

i am really thankful that after long last I've found a mod shop that I can completely trust and who I know for sure aren't just after my money but want to provide the best service.

Originally Posted by RaceHorse

I literally felt short changed by this 3M guys. It is always better to be present at the time of installation and observe what they are actually installing.
This seems to be a big scam across cities in 3M showrooms.

If you are not happy with results, then they have in all probability cheated you as well, me feels! I would strongly recommend you getting the film tested at an independent garage like how I did in Speedfreaks. I would suggest against going to another 3M showroom, for I think all of them might be up to the same mischief and will cover each others tracks.

I wonder if 3M is going to respond to my complaint or they are also in league with their franchises?!

I've left the car today at 3m and they have just called me saying that they have replaced the film. Will update on how it is.

What a sad state of affairs, indeed!

[RaceHorse]

Originally Posted by thirdmainroad

If you are not happy with results, then they have in all probability cheated you as well, me feels! I would strongly recommend you getting the film tested at an independent garage like how I did in Speedfreaks. I would suggest against going to another 3M showroom, for I think all of them might be up to the same mischief and will cover each others tracks.

This is the first bad experience with 3M for me. Earlier their service was always good whenever I visited them.
I got PPF installed on 3 of my cars. Also took Paint Sealant annual service from them and under body protection.
All those experiences were good without any hiccup. This is the first time I feel they did shoddy job.

[GTO]

Thanks a ton for sharing! In a country with turtle-slow legal systems, publicity is the only way to correct such shams. We will be publishing this on our news section, and add it to hot threads this week for maximum impact . That will surely spread the word and also bring the matter to the notice of 3M management. Publicity is what will lead to 3M putting in corrective measures to stop this from happening again.

Still, very saddened to hear that one pays a stiff price to one of the world's best brands, only to get swindled like this .

BHPians, please share this thread on social media.

[2000rpm]

Wow, thats a lot of money for a window film! Did you check the price of UV cut glasses or something before you installed these, must be close to what you paid.

Also, its better to tint the rear windshield with darker material and rear windows with slightly stronger film and keep the front two windows and windshield as is, this prevents enough heat out without getting into trouble with the cops.

[blackwasp]

Originally Posted by thirdmainroad

These guys have wilfully committed fraud with the sole intention to cheat me.

When I went back, they initially denied it and said I was confused and made a mistake. I insisted on them taking the car to any lab to check at which they scratched their heads, said some confusion has happened, but they will replace the film to avoid any of this confusion.

I think this is one of the best resolutions that you could have got. The shop itself admitted to it and is willing to replace the films.

I have stopped going to any 3M store except where I know the owners (one is 25 km away) and even then to just buy their products like shampoo, Nomad mats etc, which I get it installed myself / get a friend to help me out.

While the brand 3M itself is solid, many of its franchises are poorly run. This could be due to 2 reasons -
1. Undue expectations / targets set by the company on dealers which leads to cost cutting measures
2. Shop staff / owners trying to make a quick buck

But, at no cost should they cheat a customer. Be upfront about it and let the customer decide what product he wants and charge appropriately.

Further, when a 3M shop closes, the customers with AMC are left in the lurch. The company will not make any provisions to continue the rest of the services at another outlet. So, infcact, other than the branding, there is nothing special about it.

You can find a lot of independent guys (detailing, film installers etc.) who use original 3M stuff and charge a fraction of the store prices. My suggestion to all is to approach these chaps, and not the brand stores.

[iamswift]

Originally Posted by RaceHorse

there is not much difference in the heat effect under sun. My friend and I bought exact same spec Verna in black color.
He didn't installed any films. When parked in our office parking lot under sun, both car felt same levels of heat inside.

This may be something to do with the product itself I suppose. I had my doubts on CR70.
The demo behind the focus light was just for few seconds; CR70 probably has effects for few seconds to minutes (or may be few hours - no data here) compared to direct glass; however over time the heat eventually passes through. This is my theory.
Some experiments required on this front.

[RahuKetu]

Very bad of 3M to cheat a loyal customer like you who has given them so much business. Somehow, I personally avoid to do cosmetic changes in my car such as ceramic coating etc. because I somehow feel that these necessities are created just to extract money from us. I did under body rust protection coating to my car by 3M in 2010 when I bought new car. They kept insisting me to do ceramic coating and many other things in my car. I have not seen any car breakdown due to lack of anti rust coating till date.

I can co-relate them like going to beauty parlor for a hair cut and end up doing facials, hair massage & body massage which were really not required and you always know that he is ripping you by almost 50% of the genuine costs.

[thirdmainroad]

Update: No doubt left that I was cheated for a year and 3 months!!

They “reinstalled” the film yesterday on windows and rear. Invoice for that alone is almost 17,000 without tax. I got the car in the evening, and there was no doubt that it was a different film then what had been previously installed. I checked the box this time and took pictures (was skeptical thinking that they could always put another film in a 3 M box) and also told them multiple times that though I was being calm this time, I wouldn’t be if they cheated me again and that I would most definitely be checking the film outside and will also be taking the car post lockdown to the 3M headquarters in Bangalore. As soon as I got the car, I noticed the film had the slightly bluish tinge that my front windshield had, that CR series is supposed to have.

And today, I did a extensive check. Drove upto to Muttukadu and back twice. My temperature gauge touched 39 C and also left the car parked under the sun. Without doubt, the film is different and the heat is much less in the car.

I went for the expensive film in the first place treating it as an investment, reasoning that heat reduction is one of the most important things especially in the area that I am prone to drive in. I did research on 3Ms CR series before and choose it as I thought it was one of the best films for auto and also because I trust 3M and respect their products. I most certainly did not expect to be cheated in a store I had visited many times before and had a good relationship with.

At the end of the day, I am miffed that I was cheated for a year + but have taken some solace in the fact that it has been rectified and that I could spot it out. I am 10000% sure I am not the only one they have done this to and many others have fallen prey to this.

No reply from 3M yet, who I have written in a complaint.

Please do share this post and make it as visible as you can, and I urge everyone who has gotten expensive films for their cars to check if you have got what you have paid for.

With the laser thermometers that are around with the covid-19 situation, it’s now easy to get at least a first level check of the heat reduction of the film.

[Sk8r]

Coming from Chennai I was curious about the " Google Rating " of this place and was surprised to find it highly rated ( 4.4 )

That makes me wonder how many average car buyers would've been cheated ??

[thirdmainroad]

Originally Posted by Sk8r

Coming from Chennai I was curious about the " Google Rating " of this place and was surprised to find it highly rated ( 4.4 )

That makes me wonder how many average car buyers would've been cheated ??

Indeed! And even I would have left a good rating! I was after all driving around happily over a year and 30,000 km + thinking I had what I had paid for.

After driving around most of today, the new film has made a big difference for sure and I am happy that I made the investment. Though of course very miffed that I did not know any better all this time!

Admins, thank you for having a write up about this on the news section.

Could you please also post it on the official Facebook handle? I am very sure I am not the only one who has been short changed like this and this needs to reach as many people as possible, and I am sure many cases like this will follow.

No contact from 3M yet. I doubt they will reply to my email. Looks like they are in league with their franchises.