[swift_guy]

Originally Posted by abhinav.s

If you plan on buying used, and keep it for 5 years, look no further than the Japanese bikes. If you are buying new, then you can look at the TVS & Bajaj in the mix. They will certainly last the 8 years that you want out of them. ... ...If you don't like it after the ride no issues but don't dismiss it just yet.

Originally Posted by sam_sant2005

The dealer says atleast 3-4 months it will take to launch. And even if it launches there will be a waiting period it seems. Initial demand for RTR 200 seems to be high.

TVS Dealer here has no idea about RTR200 arrival. I have no problem with it as such, would be opting for the lowest variant (carb, non ABS, cheaper tyres) which is expected to come close to 1 Lac on road.

I also read many reviews and most of them were positive. I want to make sure that the model performs upto the hype/expectations, and NOT end up like Gixxer (which was praised everywhere except the sales chart).

Originally Posted by sam_sant2005

I am not sure if this assumption is right. As far as I know there are lot of takers for these bikes, the only reason because they are costly bikes, so there are people who are looking to buy them second hand. NS200 though I am not sure, but definitely I believe r15 and Duke 200 will have some buyers.

In NCR, majority of NS200, R15 and Dukes are bought for their power. Duke 200 is the first choice for a person looking to enter into stunting. I had finalised an R15 v2 which looked very well on inspection report (of Quikr) but changed my mind when I saw Facebook profile of the owner loaded with wheelies, stoppies, burnout and top speed videos. It had clocked less than 5k kms, and top speed video was showing less than 500 kms.

Owners rip these bikes even in the initial kms and this reflects after the engine has gone through 15-20k kms. Discover, Splendour and other commuters like Stunner, Unicorn, etc. sell very well.

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

Stay away from commuter bikes like the Unicorn if you love riding. They are simply boring to ride... ... ...Fuel injection is far more reliable having a bike start easily on a cold day 7-8 years down the line is going to be a boon.

Thanks for the useful post. I agree with most of your points. Actually FI options are limited, and I am not against FI at all. Just that my budget is limited and I would prefer a carb counterpart over FI for its simplicity and price.

Originally Posted by Trojan

My suggestion would be to go for the... ... ...the bike, the maintenance is not high

Cheers and all the best!
Trojan

Thanks Trojan but I have decided to stay away from RE for now. I don't think I would be able to enjoy the bike due to my physique. It would be good only for bragging among friends. I will consider it definitely during my next 2 wheeler purchase, if it happens with my own money.

[Rohitj92]

Buddy, i was in the same situation as yours when i got my first bike, 6years ago. I wanted the Karizma back then, but my parents bought me a Unicorn. Trust me mate, although i got a Duke 390 2 weeks ago, i still ride my Unicorn everyday. The bike is as reliable as it was when new. Not a single issue except for regular service. I felt i was lucky to have the Unicorn as my first bike. Its a complete no nonsense commuter bike. Just fill it, shut it and forget it types. Dont even think of going for the RE as your first bike, trust me, you'll feel it wasnt worth it.

[govindremesh]

Originally Posted by swift_guy

Thanks Trojan but I have decided to stay away from RE for now. I don't think I would be able to enjoy the bike due to my physique. It would be good only for bragging among friends. I will consider it definitely during my next 2 wheeler purchase, if it happens with my own money.

Hi Swift Guy!

I was in a similar situation with the only difference being that I was paying for the bike. (Family had a trusty Activa during my college days and my parents refused to buy me a more powerful vehicle)

It was October 2013, I too had the same options as you had (FZ, Apache RTR ABS, R15 (with stretched budget) , Honda Unicorn, Hero Hunk, Suzuki GS150R and then, RE Thunderbird 350-with a 40K "donation" from parents )

I tested every bike listed above and heres how it went:

RE 'bird- Too mature for a 23 year old

Hero Hunk- The best dealer in the city (Kochi) gave me a brand new bike from the stockyard for test ride. Good bye Hero.

TVS Apache 180 ABS- "Saar, No ABS saar..why you need ABS?" *Bye Bye*

Yamaha FZ/R15- I had a good friend who owned one in my college days. Tried it many times but it was uncomfortable for my 6 foot and bulky body. Same for R15 as it would pain my wrists after a 5 KM ride.

Suzuki GS150R- Excellent bike, almost made me write the cheque, but the dealer attitude put me off. It was too much of a smooth commuter and didn't excite me was another reason.

Honda Unicorn- Booked it with a heavy heart... but it was not to be!

The Unicorn came as too commuterish for me (though the purpose was to commute to office). Many of my friends brought it and it was popular among the IT crowd.

So, what did I pick? -Honda CB-Trigger in Pearl Sienna Red!

The bike is now out of production and is notoriously famous for its engine vibrations. Further, me on the lightweight bike looks like "An elephant on an ant" as one of my friends remarked! But the Trigger ticked all the boxes on my checklist. It had a rear disc brake with a fat tyre, was a Honda so would never fail, service costs under check, mileage never an issue and finally- wonderful acceleration! This Honda surged forward with a gusto that was missing on other 150cc and the deal was sealed.

The bike, though not perfect, has been a constant companion and has never disappointed me (well, except for the vibey engine. But rev it hard and the vibes disappear!)

Long story short- Test ride each bike and then ask your heart. Go for the one which your heart says.PS: If you ask me I'd ask you to take Hornet or Gixxer, whatever appeals to you.

Hope this helps! Let us all know of what you buy eventually.

[Gansan]

Originally Posted by govindremesh

Suzuki GS150R- Excellent bike, almost made me write the cheque, but the dealer attitude put me off. It was too much of a smooth commuter and didn't excite me was another reason.

But you are forgetting one important attribute of the bike. It is an excellent long distance tourer, at the prices we are talking about, for a single rider. Even better than the RE 350 classic, according to a friend who owns both. The 15 litre fuel tank, the sixth gear and the riding stance take the credit for that.

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by amit_purohit20

between RTR 160 FI or RTR 160 Carb, I would choose for Carb because of its better pickup and its cheap, reliable and easy to maintain.

TVS like Bajaj Pulsar 220 FI didn't get a very good FI for their bikes in 2007 (?) hence a carb in their case had advantages.

The P-220 FI had far more crisper throttle delivery and personally liked the experience better despite the carb having more power & cheaper.

There are simply no issues with any Jap having an FI. R15 came in '09 and I don't think any issue is reported, Ninja & CBR 250R too came up shortly, few friends have done over 100K and no issues at all.

Originally Posted by amit_purohit20

2) RTR200 ( No liquid cooling so higher reliability

Could you please explain as to how an air cooled bike is more reliable than a liquid cooled one?

[kaushik51094]

Let me pour in my thoughts(another college going kid ) -

1. Please don't get the unicorn. My friend has one and we tease him almost everytime we see him with the bike (as an uncle). Moreover after 2-3 rides, it started to feel boring for me. OTOH, another friend of mine has an apache RTR160 (old one) and it makes me grin every time i twist the throttle. The only place where it disappoints are the vibrations. Just too much (Hope the new RTR series takes care of them)

2. Do check out the Bajaj V. It looks kinda good IMO somewhat like a cross between a cruiser and a commuter. I haven't had a ride in it so can't comment on handling, ride and stuff like that. Just an opinion based on looks.

3. I personally loved the looks of Gixxer SF - just like a mini hayabusa and i'd get it over the FZ and fazer

4. If you are considering the electra, why not look at the continental GT? It looks cool IMO

There, i've helped in making your decision even tougher Do TR every bike thoroughly and get the one that suits you the best. There's no single bike that fits all!

[Thebat]

Well I want to go against the tide here and say that Re would be the perfect choice. I too moved from a Honda Dio to a classic 350 after my dad flatly refused to get me a duke or an 200 ns for what was pathetic build quality to him. I was very apprehensive and scared and didn't even take a test drive as I dint want to be humiliated in front of the showroom guys. But after the bike came and once I rode her all fears vanished, the royal feel you get from an RE is unmatchable. Mine is giving an FE of 45 and the service costs so far has been a total of 14,000 in for 4 years which includes some part replacements after an accident (where the bike saved my life) . Plus you get the added advantage of getting recognized in your college which I am sure no other bike you have mentioned will do. And don't worry about parking ease, a few days practice is all you need. I would say close your eyes and go for the Electra, it will last you a lifetime.

[ecenandu]

Originally Posted by Sheel

The P-220 FI had far more crisper throttle delivery and personally liked the experience better despite the carb having more power & cheaper.

There are simply no issues with any Jap having an FI. R15 came in '09 and I don't think any issue is reported, Ninja & CBR 250R too came up shortly, few friends have done over 100K and no issues at all.

You are totally correct.

The main problem with Apache and Pulsar 220 was they both had FI sourced from Continental, which had little experience with bike fuel injection system. I believe they took a ECU for car and then modified it to suit the bike. I'm saying this because of the size of the ECU and it had two connectors, one for the sensors and one set for the actuators which is an overkill for a bike.

Where as on the other hand, the Japs, Honda and Yamaha are supplied by Keihin and Mikuni respectively which got tons of experience in motorbike fuel injection system and that shows.

The throttle body for the Pulsar and Apache is a joke when compared to that of an R15 or the CBR's. The carburettor manufacturing experience reflects on the design by the Japs.

The biggest advantage of FI over the carb, I believe, is the consistency in performance over all the weather conditions. Be it the cold start, throttle response and the like.

[swift_guy]

Thanks guys for the healthy discussion on this thread. Not sure if I ended up being sorted or more confused after going through all the posts.

I did not consider the Bajaj V, because all the magic of commuter + cruiser look at 70k vanished the moment the bike was started. It sounded exactly like the 100cc Discover. A rumbling deep note would have been better.

I will visit RE showroom in the afternoon and decide after a ride if the Bullet is good for me or not. The decision is turning out to be more difficult than I had thought. Do let me know if my requirements need to be more precise.

[purohitanuj]

I don't follow bikes but still I will share what I think. What I see is an opportunity to spend 1 lac rupee. Now this can be done for a performance bike or a safer (ABS) bike but you can't get a performance bike with ABS in this bracket (my assumption).

Spending parents-sponsored 1 lac rupee is not an issue if you go for a saner/practical decision; however if you go for a meaner, powerful bike which will risk your life, is not a good decision in my books.

Anyway the choice is yours, and please use it wisely. Whatever bike you get, make sure it's safe(r) and you enjoy it, which does not necessarily mean more BHP.
Cheers!

[pavanmadhini]

Having driven the new Apache 200, I strongly suggest you wait for it and go for it. It more than satisfies all your requirements, and will beat your expectations.
The new engine is almost butter smooth, and after riding it, my Duke felt so much cruder and unrefined with all it's vibrations.

(If budget permits, I also suggest you go for the ABS version.)

[KSTejaswi]

Dear swift_guy,

Here's my 2 cents:

When you mentioned a budget of 1L, I'm assuming you hadn't included the cost of safety gear in that. I'd STRONGLY urge you to first set aside at least 20~25k for

1) ECE-R rated helmet (perhaps LS2) & balaclava - 4~5k
2) Armoured jacket (Cramster?) - 7~8k
3) Padded+Armoured gloves - 1.5~2k
4) Kneepads - 1.5~2k
5) Riding boots - anywhere between 5k to 15k

I work for a major 2W OEM, and I've seen & experienced this : the quality of your gear (and your proper usage) basically decides whether you live or die. Even if it hurts you, let me say this - it is probably better for one to get killed in an accident than to become a vegetable and cause pain EVERYDAY to one's family.

Now, coming to the bikes themselves & thinking of the budget as 75~80k :

1. Hero Karizma R : There's no doubt regarding the reliability of the new engine. However, the old version is definitely a MUCH better idea. If you must pick one up, please check up on the owner's antics first. Also, please note, Hero spares aren't as easily available as they used to be. Especially for 150cc & above.

2. Hornet is immense fun to ride (I personally rate it better than the FZ), but if you don't like the looks, forget it.

3. Yamaha FZ16v1 is a lot of fun, but you've listed your own reasons for not wanting to go for it.

4. TVS Apache is a great bike, especially the new 200. Their engines are noisier & the vibrations are higher, but if you don't ride over 50kms a day, it may not matter too much. Do note, however, that street mechanics seem to have an opinion that beyond 5 years, the reliability drops. I've also heard that unless treated with care, 5 years is about the time when you should start looking for a replacement. 8 may be pushing it...

5. For anything longer than 3 years, simply ignore Bajaj. While there are cases where pulsars have worked very well even after 7-8 years, it is more the exception than the norm.

6. The Gixxer is reliable. But, the Hornet is more fun. And the old Karizma is certainly much tougher while being smoother. On the other hand, if you like the looks & will mostly ride in the city, nothing very major against it either.

7. RE - not a great idea since your parents are paying for it. Poor folks will feel that they're paying for it every few months. RE bikes are not exactly reliable, that's a word that translates to "Toyota" in the car world, and perhaps the Japanese bike makers. You really need to devote time & energy, no amount of affection actually gets things done. Time, effort & money do. In this case, the money is not yours. Do think about it.

Another point I'd like to make here is - you seem like an intelligent & mature guy. Why not first learn the basics well, improve your skills and be ready to upgrade when your paycheck arrives? Usually, that's when you get to do pretty much anything you want (nice long trips, track days, trail rides, maybe even racing as a hobby) - would pay to invest time & effort now, and reap the benefits then.

To sum up, if I were in your place, my choice would be a 2nd hand Karizma ZMR (the FI actually returns about 3-4 kmpl more in real life, a crisper throttle response + rear disc : great training & loads of fun) - a nicely treated bike, even if used for 30-40k kms, should be available for around INR 50k - great VFM. Prefer late 2012 / early 2013 variants, but not the updated one.

2nd option : 2nd hand R15v2

3rd option : (in case you can afford) CB Hornet

All the very best, and please, RIDE SAFE (means : with gear, at ALL times. If the distance is too short to warrant gear in your thinking, it only means that you can walk / cycle). I think you'll agree there's absolutely no need to add to the road casualty numbers in India.

Happy riding!

[swift_guy]

Originally Posted by KSTejaswi

Dear swift_guy,

Here's my 2 cents:
...
All the very best, and please, RIDE SAFE (means : with gear, at ALL times. If the distance is too short to warrant gear in your thinking, it only means that you can walk / cycle). I think you'll agree there's absolutely no need to add to the road casualty numbers in India.

Happy riding!

Thanks for your concern, my friend. I am a very safety-conscious guy, much to the annoyance of my friends and family members. Already have a Studds helmet and cheap online gear (jacket, gloves) which I use even on my gearless scoots everytime, be it for a 100 km trip or for a shop 100m away. I will use this 1 Lac budget for the bike and keep on getting better gear in phases as time passes by. Don't worry.

I still have an option open for used bikes. Karizma R (ZMR is more prone to issues due to FI, I am okay with 35 kmpl from a 200+ cc mill), CBR150R and R15 v2 are on top of my list. Just that I need to find a passionate caring biker to close the deal.

- - - - - - - - - -

Went to the RE showroom in the afternoon. Sadly all bikes were for delivery and a test ride was not possible (or offered). Checked out the Classic and Standard seating positions, and it turns out that Classic is better suited for small/short riders. I met an old friend there who had came in to enquire about a body cover (he has a Standard 350). I did a 2 km round on his bike and concluded that it was not the one for me. It lacked the acceleration I was looking for, braking was not upto the mark (maybe as Std 350 had drum brakes at front also) and U-Turns were a big PITA because of the weight. And the worst part - wait for it - was that my friend had to kick start the bike for me.

It wasn't smooth, or refined, or fast, or agile. It felt sturdy, it felt strong, it felt good. I understood that REs are for the feel of riding, I felt proud as if I was representing my country. Everything felt basic, from the switchgear to the ergonomics, and that special feeling of riding a 1 Lac Rupee bike was missing (which I would have got in an R15 definitely). After that quick ride, I was sure that I was not ready for the Bullet at this stage. Maybe I need more muscle, more patience and more experience. Ruled out.

I understood what I was looking for. Riding position or comfort was not my priority. I wanted a decent looking, fast (and not lightning quick) and revv happy engine. I noticed that I enjoyed shifting through gears. I needed a bike that would be stable in the straights and not scare me when handling traffic (B2B traffic, sudden stops) and turns. I wanted a tech-loaded bike, which gave me some bragging rights among friends. At the same time, I wanted it to be reliable and durable, which would age very well, and would ask for periodic maintenance along with some care.

I decided that I would check out all available options and test those which feel good. Since I was in the prime area of showrooms in Faridabad, I decided to check out maximum options till the evening. Bajaj, TVS, Hero, Suzuki, RE and Yamaha - all of them were on the same road, hardly 1-1.5 km distance.

TVS Showroom was nearby (owned by same person who has RE showroom), so I checked out Apache RTR180. The seating position was good. Switchgear quality was acceptable and all of the features I wanted were present, plus the overall design was also good. The size/dimensions of the bike were spot-on for a person of my size. I decided that I had to consider this for sure. 200 4V had not arrived yet at the dealer. Price was 82k on road for single disc 160, and the sales person said that the matte blue edition was also available at some premium. Took the brochure and off I went. One more thing was that the staff had no clue about the 180 ABS, later they said they can try to arrange one after I told them that the official website has shown ABS variant for 180.

Bajaj showroom was very busy, with the showstoppers being the V15 and Avenger 150. People even ignored the flashy KTM 390s parked at the entrance. I enquired about the Pulsar AS150 (90k on road), Pulsar 150 (80k on road) and Pulsar 180 (85k on road). Pulsar 220F felt overpriced at close to a Lac. Seat height on AS150 was a problem as I was not able to keep both my feet flat on the ground (as I did on Apache). I didn't like the tall front visor and handle bar mounted ORVMs either. The overall tall profile was more suited to a naked than a faired motorcycle. Instrument cluster was yummy! Next I sat on the Pulsar 150. Basic/old looking design but still sharp and a worthy competitor to Apache. Switchgear quality was better than I had expected. I decided to consider Bajaj bikes also. Salesperson was very rude, didn't knew a thing about Pulsars (said that he was hearing about NS150 for the first time), handed me the price list and went away. TVS staff was more friendly.

Next in the line was Hero. Earlier decided to skip it as 2014 Karizma twins weren't impressive but went in to enquire about old version stocks. Sadly none were available. Salesperson promised "big" discounts on Karizma R with cash on table. I left as I was not in a mood to get 2014 Karizmas.

I searched a lot but could not find the Suzuki dealership. Heck!

Visited Yamaha and checked Yamaha FZ and Fazer. Fazer v2.0 was overpriced at 97k on road. FZ v1.0 was VFM at 84k on road. Dimensions were good enough for me but seating position was less-dedicated than Apache. Essential features were present but v1.0 lacked the premium/fresh feel of the v2.0. Fazer v2.0 felt like it had unnecessary weight by the fairing. FZ looked original and more complete. I was very impressed by Yamaha quality on all the bikes. And as expected, I froze when I saw the blue R15 (1.35 Lac) on display. Wished that I could have her and went straight to home to hide the brochures and price lists!

As I am typing this, I have fallen in love with the way the Black RTR 180 looks but Yamaha FZ v1.0 looks better built and is a no non-sense bike. Still unsure about Bajaj as there are mixed opinions about their quality and long term use, though the products are VFM and tried + tested. I will visit Suzuki for Gixxer as and when time permits and will update.

[Urban_Nomad]

Originally Posted by swift_guy

Hello folks. I am in the market for a 2 wheeler with a budget of Rs. 1 Lac tops. Have a look at my situation and give your suggestions and views on the bikes I have considered

My opinion - get a PROPER bike. A used duke 200 should do nicely!!!!!

Fun, fast, frugal! The holy trinity

[fireblade007]

I would suggest you to go for a Bajaj AS 200. It is 1.1 laks onroad in Kerala. It has 23 bhp and 18 Nm torque on tap.It is the cheapest bike with liquid cooling.More power for the money you spend. I have a cousin who has clocked 30000 kms on the Pulsar 200 NS. He has no issues with the bike. Pulsar AS 200 is the NS with a semi fairing and projector lamps. The reliability of the bike depends on how you drive it and how you do the oil changes and services at the optimal intervals. The manufacturer might prescribe 3000 to 10000 kms drain intervals for engine oil. But I would suggest a 2000 drain intervals with mineral oil. I own a 11 year old unicorn which has done about 90000 kms.I rebuild it's engine at about 47000 kms. It cost me 8000 RS in 2009 for that rebuild. I had followed the manufacturer prescribed services for the bike. The oil changes where done at 3000 kms to 4000 kms as per the manual. So I don't exactly believe that Japanese engines are more reliable. May be I would have got better engine life from unicorn if I had followed a 2000 kms engine oil drain interval.