[Madhav Nayak]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

A point I've noted:- All ABSs are not created equal. Whether by design (optimising different parameters) or otherwise I would not know. But the fact that maybe the one I'm riding on has not been sufficiently tested, put on as a marketing tick the box option, or forced to by government regulations, will always be at the back of my mind.

Anyway, with shills and trolls abounding, a topic well worth avoiding.

Regards
Sutripta

I agree with the bolded part, but the rest of your response has left me rather curious. I wonder if you would humor me with a little more on the same?

[Sutripta]

^^^
Mums the word. As I said,

a topic well worth avoiding.

Regards
Sutripta

[IshaanIan]

Originally Posted by Madhav Nayak

I agree with the bolded part, but the rest of your response has left me rather curious. I wonder if you would humor me with a little more on the same?

I guess what he meant was that they simply don't offer outright braking performance. Even I believe that these ABS systems in small bikes are simply not optimized properly enough. I own an RC390 (old model not the new one but I have been using sintered brake pads) and switching the ABS off makes a HUGE difference in terms of braking feel, initial bite, and progression. The steel braided lines really have a chance to shine through only once the ABS is turned off. I feel like that is because it is poorly calibrated. No doubt in panic braking situations and in the wet it can prove to be a lifesaver for even the most experienced riders out there especially given our unpredictable indian road and traffic conditions, but the fact that with ABS turned on, my bike feels like it is robbed of initial bite and braking feel and also the ABS seems to engage way too early under hard braking, kind of bums me out. I really wish more effort was put into optimizing and calibrating abs systems on these small bikes.

[Madhav Nayak]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

I guess what he meant was that they simply don't offer outright braking performance. Even I believe that these ABS systems in small bikes are simply not optimized properly enough. I own an RC390 (old model not the new one but I have been using sintered brake pads) and switching the ABS off makes a HUGE difference in terms of braking feel, initial bite, and progression. The steel braided lines really have a chance to shine through only once the ABS is turned off. I feel like that is because it is poorly calibrated. No doubt in panic braking situations and in the wet it can prove to be a lifesaver for even the most experienced riders out there especially given our unpredictable indian road and traffic conditions, but the fact that with ABS turned on, my bike feels like it is robbed of initial bite and braking feel and also the ABS seems to engage way too early under hard braking, kind of bums me out. I really wish more effort was put into optimizing and calibrating abs systems on these small bikes.

Rightly said. Once a photographer told me that he was miffed at the camera giants because they spend a lot of money on making the auto mode for beginners/amateurs to use, which ultimately drives the prices up almost sky high. I guess this is a similar case.

[sriramv.iyer]

Originally Posted by Madhav Nayak

Rightly said. Once a photographer told me that he was miffed at the camera giants because they spend a lot of money on making the auto mode for beginners/amateurs to use, which ultimately drives the prices up almost sky high. I guess this is a similar case.

I have told this elsewhere in other threads, and I won't hesitate to repeat.

This is wrong analogy.

When the wheel locks, there is no human who can apply brake and release multiple times within a second. It is not a question of skill. It is humanely impossible to do what an ABS does.

While quality of ABS implementations will vary (just like brake quality), one cannot underestimate the importance of ABS in automobiles.

[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by Sheel

How serious you are? It makes peak torque at 7,000 revs, but irrespective of that, it will kick any 150cc Motorcycle at similar revs.

I belive you've got the wrong variant. The variant with the horizontal motor peaks out at 4k rpm, this is torque we're talking about, not peak power.

Precisely why the entire world is moving to fuel injection. And it is just so easy to adjust your carburetor equipped motorcycle high up in the mountains.

True about running like crap on the mountains but the keyword is that it would still run. With carbs it's either you run or you limp, but with FI's it's either you run or you don't and that is considering limp mode.

P.S. Thought I support carbs I'm not a fan of CV's anything cable operated is the way to go, you can run it thought out the length and breadth of the country with the only hassle being a cable snap if by chance it does snap.

[Madhav Nayak]

Originally Posted by sriramv.iyer

I have told this elsewhere in other threads, and I won't hesitate to repeat.

This is wrong analogy.

When the wheel locks, there is no human who can apply brake and release multiple times within a second. It is not a question of skill. It is humanely impossible to do what an ABS does.

While quality of ABS implementations will vary (just like brake quality), one cannot underestimate the importance of ABS in automobiles.

Forgive me, if it sounded like I was undermining the importance of ABS in a vehicle. I wasn't. This discussion was purely on the lack of attention to ABS on these smaller vehicles that make them hard to live with. No doubt ABS is a very important safety feature, one of the best available for two wheelers, no less. Even though I call the ABS on the RTR crappy, I have been saved by the crappy ABS from rear ending a couple of idiot car drivers. I would never dream of pulling out the ABS fuse on my CBR unless I were in a controlled environment like a race track.

That being said, the ABS we get on our bikes leaves a lot to be expected. It is NOT for enthusiasts and definitely will not benefit experienced riders. You have rightly said that it's humanely impossible to pump the brakes like the ABS software does, but it is not impossible to use the brakes to prevent wheel locking - the ability to do so depends on one's presence of mind in a panic-worthy situation and his skill. Once the wheels are past the "locked" line, ABS is undoubtedly invaluable. The way ABS functions right now, us riders are robbed of the ability to prevent wheel locking with ABS doing most of the work. That's my gripe with ABS available on "small" bikes.

It's not that the manufacturers can't do something about it, it's just that the costs would be driven up and, unfortunately, in a market like ours, that's tantamount to no sales. I hope this makes my stance on the issue a little clearer.

[tejus.s]

Fellow enthusiasts, I know we digressed from the topic a little, but a quick update on the topic. I took delivery of my FZ25 (Warrior White) on 30th August. I will create a separate ownership thread as and when time permits.

Thank you all for your valuable feedback. Mods, please help close this thread or make appropriate edits so that fellow BHPians are not mislead. Thank you.

[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by tejus.s

Fellow enthusiasts, I know we digressed from the topic a little, but a quick update on the topic. I took delivery of my FZ25 (Warrior White) on 30th August. I will create a separate ownership thread as and when time permits.

Thank you all for your valuable feedback. Mods, please help close this thread or make appropriate edits so that fellow BHPians are not mislead. Thank you.

Congratulations on the purchase. Don't bother much about the run in, cause ideally the same would get over within the first 50kms of riding. An early oil change would give you peace of mind as well.

Rather than trying to keep the speed/rpm limited, I'd suggest you do the same only for the first 50~150kms and then ride as you normally do.

[bharath14]

Originally Posted by tejus.s

Fellow enthusiasts, I know we digressed from the topic a little, but a quick update on the topic. I took delivery of my FZ25 (Warrior White) on 30th August. I will create a separate ownership thread as and when time permits.

Thank you all for your valuable feedback. Mods, please help close this thread or make appropriate edits so that fellow BHPians are not mislead. Thank you.

Congratulations! I got one recently for local errands and I am happy with my choice. Regarding tyre pressure, the manual says 29 psi front & rear, but the showroom guy's recommendation was different. What's the tyre pressure that you are maintaining? Thanks

[IshaanIan]

Originally Posted by bharath14

Congratulations! I got one recently for local errands and I am happy with my choice. Regarding tyre pressure, the manual says 29 psi front & rear, but the showroom guy's recommendation was different. What's the tyre pressure that you are maintaining? Thanks

With bikes it's usually a LOT easier to accurately gauge how much tire pressure you need. It depends on your weight really. The manufacturer's recommended tire pressures ought to be on the left side of the swing-arm on a metal sticker. Manufacturer recommendations usually keep in mind that the average weight of a male rider is anywhere between 75-85 kilos. So if you fit exactly in that range then you can use the recommended tire pressures if not experiment a bit to see which gives you most confidence. Ideally you want something that settles into corners and bends quickly (if tire pressure is too low the bike takes time to settle into a lean) yet doesn't get too bouncy (if tire pressure is too high).

[tejus.s]

Originally Posted by bharath14

Congratulations! I got one recently for local errands and I am happy with my choice. Regarding tyre pressure, the manual says 29 psi front & rear, but the showroom guy's recommendation was different. What's the tyre pressure that you are maintaining? Thanks

Thanks Bharath, as quoted below by Ishaan, it really is subjective and the staff at petrol pumps usually fail to oblige since they are checking many vehicles at once. Better practice would be to visit a store nearby and try out a few combinations before deciding for yourself.

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

Manufacturer recommendations usually keep in mind that the average weight of a male rider is anywhere between 75-85 kilos. So if you fit exactly in that range then you can use the recommended tire pressures if not experiment a bit to see which gives you most confidence. Ideally you want something that settles into corners and bends quickly (if tire pressure is too low the bike takes time to settle into a lean) yet doesn't get too bouncy (if tire pressure is too high).

[Sheel]

Rode the carb RTR 200 for a short while. I don't know why it felt sluggish and there were vibes as I tried to be close to the red-line, I simply didn't like this. It for sure is not as smooth as a Yamaha.

This instantly brought back memories when the RTR 160 was just launched in 2007 (?) and I used to ride it [it was a friend's] and this would rev beyond the redline to 12,000 revs.

[deepakpk]

Hello All,

I'm also bit confused between picking RTR 200 and FZ25, please advise.

Little background about previous ride, I've been using a classic 350 for about 5 years and I used to tour on that. In recent times, I was not happy with the maintenance issues and I suddenly decided to sell it and now its sold.

Now, I am looking for a ride between RTR 200 and FZ25. My usage, city commutes during the weekends, not much though, probably around 30-60kms a week and touring once in a while. Did test drive RTR 200, liked it and yet to TD FZ25. But, both ain't having abs option and some how I don't find it torquey, may he it's because I've been using a classic, I don't know. Kindly advise and help me out. Thank you

[fireblade007]

Does the Rtr 200 carb have better fuel efficiency than FZ25?