SUVs safer than sedans? Edit: evironmental impact discussions too

freewheelburnin · 24th August 2009, 13:45

FYI santro ground clearance is 164 mm and Ford Ikon dura torque has 167 mm.
Wheelbase of Santro is 2380
Wheelbase of Ford Ikon is 2486
A simple trigonometric calculation can prove that Santro can clear an obstacle more easily owing to shorter wheel base and slightly more stiffer suspension.So ford ikon not scraping would be a myth

freewheelburnin · 24th August 2009, 13:49

For some people it is o.k if a car scrapes the bottom,but i feel really bad when my brand new car scrapes.
Regarding the verna, i have clearly mentioned that I was not racing against it.I was going at a comfortable hundred.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath

Well, first of all, thank you for understanding the idea of this post. SUVs being unjustified for city and good roads was the point a few of us were trying to drive home.
Coming to bad roads, depends how bad the road is, but if it cannot be called a road, then you have no option but to go for an MUV/SUV.

And the race between you and the Verna, I would refrain from commenting on it for the sake of road safety and bruising egos.

Sawyer · 24th August 2009, 16:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by KITE RUNNER

Sawyer, we may be still in the 'jungle mind set', there is still a lot of hope left. A change is slowly happening. Highly appreciating your 'straight from the heart' discussions.

. If there was no hope, I would not be writing. And I would not be living in the country, having turned down chances to leave, because it is still my favorite place to live in the world. At least for those of us fortunate to have selected the parents we did, that gave us the foundations that so many Indians do not get in life. What can we do to reinforce and accelerate the change is what all of this is about.

n.devdath · 24th August 2009, 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by freewheelburnin

FYI santro ground clearance is 164 mm and Ford Ikon dura torque has 167 mm.
Wheelbase of Santro is 2380
Wheelbase of Ford Ikon is 2486
A simple trigonometric calculation can prove that Santro can clear an obstacle more easily owing to shorter wheel base and slightly more stiffer suspension.So ford ikon not scraping would be a myth

A car clearing an obstacle is not the trignometric formula alone. That comes into effect when you take into consideration the approach and departure angles and the ramp breakover angle.

Ground clearance is the shortest distance between a flat, level surface, and any part of a vehicle other than those parts designed to contact the ground.
GC also changes depending on the amount of GC a car would lose when loaded and this differs from car to car.

Anyway, we are diverting from the topic of the thread here and I feel it is appropriate to take up this discussion elsewhere if you feel it is required.
This thread aims at making people understand that SUVs are unwarranted for in use only in the city and other similar issues which lead to a rat race of people buying SUVs to dominate over other road users and endanger others lives.

Sawyer · 24th August 2009, 16:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath

This thread aims at making people understand that SUVs are unwarranted for in use only in the city and other similar issues which lead to a rat race of people buying SUVs to dominate over other road users and endanger others lives.

Devdath - not quite! It is our aim to convey this message via our posts - some people will not agree that this thread aims to do that

suman · 24th August 2009, 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by amitoj

Although the recent posts seem to have nothing to do with the title.

I couldn't agree with you more on this.....I left this thread a few pages back, came back today to see if it had changed over the weekend. No such luck

....so I'm out of here again.

Sawyer · 24th August 2009, 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by suman

I couldn't agree with you more on this.....I left this thread a few pages back, came back today to see if it had changed over the weekend. No such luck

....so I'm out of here again.

- Why? More the merrier!! Actually the recent posts are still true to the thread title I see in the right corner. SUVs safer than sedans is all it says - who to is left open - so it could be to other cars? Pedestrians? Environment?

freewheelburnin · 24th August 2009, 17:18

Devnath please check out this article...
How do you calculate breakover angle? - YotaTech Forums
So lesser the wheelbase better will be the angle....Anyways I am not gonna divert this post any further which seems to have offroaded away from the original intention...

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath

A car clearing an obstacle is not the trignometric formula alone. That comes into effect when you take into consideration the approach and departure angles and the ramp breakover angle.

Ground clearance is the shortest distance between a flat, level surface, and any part of a vehicle other than those parts designed to contact the ground.
GC also changes depending on the amount of GC a car would lose when loaded and this differs from car to car.

Anyway, we are diverting from the topic of the thread here and I feel it is appropriate to take up this discussion elsewhere if you feel it is required.
This thread aims at making people understand that SUVs are unwarranted for in use only in the city and other similar issues which lead to a rat race of people buying SUVs to dominate over other road users and endanger others lives.

McLaren Rulez · 24th August 2009, 18:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sawyer

- Why? More the merrier!! Actually the recent posts are still true to the thread title I see in the right corner. SUVs safer than sedans is all it says - who to is left open - so it could be to other cars? Pedestrians? Environment?

Actually we really need to create a seperate thread and bring those environment related posts into that. Now which mod is jobless enough to sift through this mess?

SS-Traveller · 24th August 2009, 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by suman

I left this thread a few pages back, came back today to see if it had changed over the weekend. No such luck

....so I'm out of here again.

Hey Suman, welcome back! You see, the title of this thread raises all sorts of controversies: "SUVs safer than sedans?"

Flip the sentence, remove the question mark, and no one would argue: "Sedans safer than SUVs." This is a statement that bears no argument.

You are the best judge, being both a sedan and SUV driver. How many times have you killed yourself in either?

MileCruncher · 24th August 2009, 20:22

I think one cannot force people from buying what they want and can afford. After all we are in the world's largest democracy. But having said that, people need to be educated regarding the purpose for each type of vehicle. I bought a SUV because I like travelling into places which hardly have roads. I drive it in city as well because it works cheaper to run.

If I had enough money to buy different vehicles based on different things, like 800 for groceries, an estate for picnics to places which have good roads and so on, would have done so. But then I'm not endowed with extra cash, hence I use my SUV in the city as well and drive well within its limits.

Cheers

Sawyer · 24th August 2009, 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez

Actually we really need to create a seperate thread and bring those environment related posts into that. Now which mod is jobless enough to sift through this mess?

If I was in that thankless job, I would expand the title a bit and let the mess be

KITE RUNNER · 24th August 2009, 21:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by MileCruncher

I think one cannot force people from buying what they want and can afford. After all we are in the world's largest democracy. But having said that, people need to be educated regarding the purpose for each type of vehicle. I bought a SUV because I like travelling into places which hardly have roads. I drive it in city as well because it works cheaper to run.

If I had enough money to buy different vehicles based on different things, like 800 for groceries, an estate for picnics to places which have good roads and so on, would have done so. But then I'm not endowed with extra cash, hence I use my SUV in the city as well and drive well within its limits.

Cheers

Yes, you are right that a person can buy any vehicle if he has got money. Same time, we humans need to be sensible and sensitive.Unfortunately, many a times we forget that our freedom may be a nuisance to others.

SUVs' may be safe for the occupants, do they offer same safety and convenience to other road users who have the same level of freedom?

Money is not a license to waste natural resources and deny others their valid rights.

MileCruncher · 24th August 2009, 21:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by KITE RUNNER

Yes, you are right that a person can buy any vehicle if he has got money. Same time, we humans need to be sensible and sensitive.Unfortunately, many a times we forget that our freedom may be a nuisance to others.

SUVs' may be safe for the occupants, do they offer same safety and convenience to other road users who have the same level of freedom?

Money is not a license to waste natural resources and deny others their valid rights.

thats why i wrote that people need to be educated.

reignofchaos · 24th August 2009, 21:37

Depends on what SUV is being compared to what Sedan. Is a scorpio safer than say a corolla or civic? Absolutely no!

However is a CRV/Outlander/Captiva safer than a Civic/Corolla? Probably yes.

24th August 2009, 13:45	#106
freewheelburnin BHPian Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: bangalore Posts: 277 Thanked: 33 Times View My Garage	FYI santro ground clearance is 164 mm and Ford Ikon dura torque has 167 mm. Wheelbase of Santro is 2380 Wheelbase of Ford Ikon is 2486 A simple trigonometric calculation can prove that Santro can clear an obstacle more easily owing to shorter wheel base and slightly more stiffer suspension.So ford ikon not scraping would be a myth
	() Thanks

24th August 2009, 20:22	#116
MileCruncher Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Mumbai Posts: 4,128 Thanked: 458 Times View My Garage	I think one cannot force people from buying what they want and can afford. After all we are in the world's largest democracy. But having said that, people need to be educated regarding the purpose for each type of vehicle. I bought a SUV because I like travelling into places which hardly have roads. I drive it in city as well because it works cheaper to run. If I had enough money to buy different vehicles based on different things, like 800 for groceries, an estate for picnics to places which have good roads and so on, would have done so. But then I'm not endowed with extra cash, hence I use my SUV in the city as well and drive well within its limits. Cheers
	() Thanks

24th August 2009, 21:37	#120
reignofchaos Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,463 Thanked: 1,987 Times View My Garage	Depends on what SUV is being compared to what Sedan. Is a scorpio safer than say a corolla or civic? Absolutely no! However is a CRV/Outlander/Captiva safer than a Civic/Corolla? Probably yes.
	() Thanks

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