The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

am1m · 27th September 2018, 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by am1m

It would be great if our legal system had something like community service for such offenses,

I was wrong, it looks like we do have something similar after all:

https://www.thebetterindia.com/30231...-in-hyderabad/

https://www.hindustantimes.com/delhi...5EY2f0V5K.html

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...w/65158124.cms

Rocketscience · 27th September 2018, 17:23

It really is a tricky one.
On one hand everyone who is saying the culprits must be punished are logically correct, fair also.
Then those saying that if it were other way around also have a valid point.
Thing is that doing something good, or positive like forgiving someone or moving on, is not logical but someone has to do it to spread the positivity, to bring the balance to the world that despite the other person being wrong or even if they had hurt you had they gotten the chance, you still don't want to take a revenge and don't want to destroy their life (if it is in your hands).
At the end it is what you believe in your heart, one may argue that the ethics, what is right or wrong are all made by us and forgiving or forgetting doesn't make you a better person, this gets deep and they are not wrong either.
Hence the tricky situation.
At the end its doing what feels right to you, you can't control what other person does or feels.
On similar and less intense occasions, once a guy broke our car's rear bumper, someone broke my Honda City's tail light, there have been more than a couple of cases like these with us and my dad chose to not say anything to the offender, i do the same maybe since this is what i have learnt and seen since i was a child, so this feels right to me too.
I do get out and give them a piece of mind though, i might shout at them and then teach them how they are supposed to drive, then i'll just get inside and drive off, end of story for me.

am1m · 27th September 2018, 17:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rocketscience

...is not logical but someone has to do it to spread the positivity

Well said!

Once while returning home by bike, I managed to lightly hit the rear end of a rather expensive car. (Bangaloreans today will be surprised to know it was once possible to go fast enough on the Whitefield road to actually run into something

but it was 2002 (I think), that road was almost empty post-7pm and the Shogun's brakes were really bad by modern bike standards!) The accident was totally my fault, I was going fast and I did not brake well enough. A middle-aged gentleman got out of the car and I thought I was going to get it from him. But I could see he really made an effort to control himself seeing that I was much younger than he was and he asked me 'Are you all right?' , 'Please ride carefully.' I apologized and went on. I always think of that gentleman whenever something like that happens and I'm a bit more forgiving about the light scrapes and brushes that inevitably happen on our roads.

Note: I'm not saying that the incident we're discussing on this thread should be treated the same way. That depends on the OP entirely. Obviously it is a much more serious incident. Just sharing an experience of how a good act can go forward.

ashwinprakas · 27th September 2018, 19:22

I don't know what the right choice here is or for a matter of fact care much what happens to the parties at fault, sorry, but for whatever its worth its the truth.

But what I do know is that in this pathetic excuse for a society we have going on here in India, is in dire need of better men, which is why I hope that you would come out the better man in this scenario, irrespective of what your decision may be.

Drive Safe,
A.P.

landcruiser123 · 27th September 2018, 19:59

I think these guys shouldn't be let off. They are a menace and a risk to the society. Drunken driving, high speed driving, riding triples and without helmet is a terrible crime.
You might have been protected by your car today- someone on another two-wheeler may not be as lucky as you.

I think the kindness you can offer is not to ask them anything to repair your car. Let law enforcement have its way- if they go to jail, there maybe a few others (their friends/relatives) who will not indulge in this kind of irresponsible acts.

DrAakash · 27th September 2018, 20:05

Tough choice.. Maybe not.
Had your car been rammed by someone more affluent, would you have given it this much thought? They might also have been under the influence of drugs or alcohol, might have their whole life ahead of them as well.. But its somehow easier on the conscience isn't it?
Everyone loves to sympathize with the poor, even myself, considering that nobody is poor by choice, it is not like they're all slackers, most of them work harder than most of us here ever have or ever will. But the fact remains that a majority of the antisocial elements hail from this strata of the society, howsoever harsh it may sound. And that's a conscious choice, mind you.
I might be sounding like the repulsive thakur saab from old Hindi movies, but laws have to apply equally to everyone in the society. Just cuz someone is rich, they shouldn't be allowed to buy off the whole judicial system, just as if someone isn't well off, doesn't afford them my sympathy for an incident like this especially considering the drugs situation, they made their choice already.
Heavens forbid, but what if it had been a larger vehicle conning at you head on? I don't need to list out the possible outcomes, neither do i wish that for anyone.
Please do not let this slide, you'd redeem yourself as an individual, but this will set up a dangerous precedent for the boys, that you could do wrong and get away with it.
I'm not asking you to file a serious complaint or have their distraught parents pay for their antics, but at least make it sure that the guys are taught a lesson that they won't forget anyone soon.
Apologies for hurting anyone's sentiments if i have, wasn't intentional, I'm just blunt sometimes.

Ragavsr · 27th September 2018, 20:29

A useless bunch of laws and non existent law enforcement.

Filing a complaint or even the cops asking whether to file an FIR or a case doesn't mean they are going to file one.

A few years back, my car was rear ended by a cab at a signal at such high speed that my car hit the car in front. The cops refused to file an FIR saying that they will file one only if there is injury or death. I assume the cab guy paid off the cops.

This shameful practice of offering money or taking it needs to stop. Why the heck does 3rd party insurance exist in India?

In my case I had to repair using my own money as my car had only 3rd party insurance.
Why do the idiotic courts go on mandating 3rd party insurance if
1. No claim is allowed to be made without an FIR
2. If I am to settle or pay money if I am at fault

I understand in this particular case, insurance of the biker is out of question, as he was drunk.

AKTRACK · 27th September 2018, 22:12

Few points -

- They are never going to do a regular job, so stop worrying about how it will affect their job prospects. They will most probably do sundry things which a police case won't affect. Most likely they will keep having brushes with the law in their lifetimes.
- Not punishing them does not ensure that they heave learned a lesson. As irresponsible as they seem, they are probably going to laugh it off.
- You are probably doing good to others by letting law take its own course.
- There is a difference between being poor and looking poor. They seem to just look poor. I am sure they will able to arrange the money for you and the cops when it really gets rough for them.
- We 'good hearted' people have to let go of the 'chalta hai' attitude. 'Chalta hai' as in letting go of others mistakes. That is not how it works. I have usually seen that others mistakes that I let go off usually bearing a cost, are treated as opportunities by others. Had it been the other way round, you could only image what trouble they would have brought upon you.
- You are not taking revenge. Your heart is in the right place.
- Cover/Protect yourself up. Don't get too involved like meeting them, their families here and there to settle things up.

MaheshY1 · 28th September 2018, 00:08

I say let them have it today so that something more serious doesn't happen tomorrow.

Profiling aside, such people tend to have a strong bond with their buddies who may try to harm you sometime in the future. So, consider it a punishment well-deserved.

If they're capable of learning, then they might spread the word and not only refrain from breaking the rules in future but also encourage people in their circle to stay on the safe side of the law. In this case, you can say that the punishment will only bring out the good in them and in the society.

PS: People reading this are free to judge me. But, I'd request you to keep your judgment to yourself even if you're not offended by my words. Staying on point will also help the fellow BHPian make an informed decision and cut the clutter.

sudeepg · 28th September 2018, 07:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by autobahnjpr

Needless to say they are from poor strata of society and not well off. The owners father is paralyzed and mother is the only bread winner. Typical case of youth gone awry and getting influenced by movies and other stuff.

My damage is only the damage to the car. I would like to punish them and make them feel sorry for what they were doing but taking a human view do not want to send them to jail as any case against them will be a life long blot on their life. Their families are sorry but are unable to pay for damages. Police is all ready to book them under offences and send them to jail.

Should I take a hard view and let them suffer for their misdeed and spoil their life with a police case which will make it difficult for them to get a job, a passport and stop many avenues in life or should I take a lenient view considering that there is no injury and there is only damage to the car and let them leave for their karma to act out itself. I am in a dilemma. What would you do if you were in this situation?

They are from poor strata of the society - with a bike, alcohol, drugs and money for all sorts of time pass? I doubt. In my opinion if you do not do the right thing of letting them have the law take its course, they will only learn that they can get away with it. Then, they will commit the crime again and another innocent soul may be injured seriously. Right now, the damage is to your car only. And, while it is a nice gesture to let them not pay for your car's damages, have their insurance pay for the damages using third party claim. You will need an FIR for this. That way, they will learn a thing or two about auto insurance and how it matters and affects them. It's a nice lesson to teach them and you shouldn't let go this matter for the key reasons I noted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

I think these guys shouldn't be let off. They are a menace and a risk to the society. Drunken driving, high speed driving, riding triples and without helmet is a terrible crime.
You might have been protected by your car today- someone on another two-wheeler may not be as lucky as you.

Indeed! If we let them go scot free now, they will only become a menace to the society rather than getting better.

I'd file the FIR and have their insurance pay out damages to your car. If they don't have insurance, then it's another offense for which they will have to pay penalty or goto jail. I'd let them have both. A lesson learnt in life is always good and it will also become a good example for others who surround them.

I'd be lenient to only those where there is sufficient reasons to believe that they unknowingly made an error and caused the accident.

GrammarNazi · 28th September 2018, 08:37

For their mother (& her situation), let it go. But settle it in a way to ensure the dues are paid especially if selling the bike is required (it'll knock some conscience into their head).

Not all sections of society who have money have had the privilege to know how to choose right from wrong.

IMO Laws are meant for hardened criminals, not these idiots.

vamsi2390 · 28th September 2018, 08:41

As some one already pointed out what if it wasn't your car and some pregnant or lady with a kid on a scooter ?

If someone looks or is poor , the law is different for them ?
Let them get through and learn some lessons on being responsible.
Clearly their parents or their 'apparent' poor condition isn't teaching them any grounding lessons. Let the police and law teach them and save someone else not being a victim due to some 'rich or Poor's but irresponsible tom, dick and Harry .

And remembe, lesson to one tennager isnt a lesson to one but his whole friend circle and more.

Turbohead · 28th September 2018, 08:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by autobahnjpr

The offending party consisted of 3 youths, 18-20 years old, without helmet, riding on high speed and under the influence of alcohol and drugs. The impact was such that the front portion of the bike got damaged seriously. They all fell down but lucking there were no injuries. The boy who was driving fled while the owner of the bike and the other remained. It was 9 pm in the night.

Should I take a hard view and let them suffer for their misdeed and spoil their life with a police case which will make it difficult for them to get a job, a passport and stop many avenues in life or should I take a lenient view considering that there is no injury and there is only damage to the car and let them leave for their karma to act out itself. I am in a dilemma. What would you do if you were in this situation?

If you truly wish them good will, it would be better to take action against them and teach them an invaluable lesson! Driving under the influence of alcohol and drugs and having no regard for the law is a serious liability issue for which they alone are responsible. Letting them go free will give them more confidence to commit such acts!

Once burned, twice shy!

WorkingGuru · 28th September 2018, 08:59

They'll get back to the antics if you don't press charges. Sets a very bad precedent to their peers too. Leave it to our lenient judiciary to condone them or show mercy.

All too often I've witnessed this section of society deliberately do all kinds of nonsense and then claim entitlement to mercy simply on the grounds of being poor/uneducated.

Meet them at their trade and see how they'll try to maliciously cheat you left right & center - viz how they have the willingness to spend in lakhs to buy a 200cc bike & use it like this while being high on alcohol/drugs.

You were luckily in a car, what if it was a pregnant lady on a 2 wheeler. The guy who fled an accident site has NO conscience. Sympathy for such people is foolishness.

atulsian · 28th September 2018, 10:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by WorkingGuru

Meet them at their trade and see how they'll try to maliciously cheat you left right & center - viz how they have the willingness to spend in lakhs to buy a 200cc bike & use it like this while being high on alcohol/drugs.

You were luckily in a car, what if it was a pregnant lady on a 2 wheeler. The guy who fled an accident site has NO conscience. Sympathy for such people is foolishness.

Very well said! I would have not shown mercy for these people who drunk and ride. I often see big cars being blamed for no mistake and these so called poor bikers get away saying it was your mistake. Don't leave them. They wouldn't have left you if it was you at fault. It is difficult to decide between being human or being logical. In your situation be Logical and let the police decide or if you think it is too much for them to go to jail, make them pay every single penny to get your vehicle back to its original position. Don't claim insurance and show them how costly it is to get a car repaired. If they have the money to purchase a 200cc bike, then they can afford to pay for the repairs. They will learn their lesson.

27th September 2018, 17:23	#47
Rocketscience BHPian Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Gurgaon Posts: 509 Thanked: 1,379 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car It really is a tricky one. On one hand everyone who is saying the culprits must be punished are logically correct, fair also. Then those saying that if it were other way around also have a valid point. Thing is that doing something good, or positive like forgiving someone or moving on, is not logical but someone has to do it to spread the positivity, to bring the balance to the world that despite the other person being wrong or even if they had hurt you had they gotten the chance, you still don't want to take a revenge and don't want to destroy their life (if it is in your hands). At the end it is what you believe in your heart, one may argue that the ethics, what is right or wrong are all made by us and forgiving or forgetting doesn't make you a better person, this gets deep and they are not wrong either. Hence the tricky situation. At the end its doing what feels right to you, you can't control what other person does or feels. On similar and less intense occasions, once a guy broke our car's rear bumper, someone broke my Honda City's tail light, there have been more than a couple of cases like these with us and my dad chose to not say anything to the offender, i do the same maybe since this is what i have learnt and seen since i was a child, so this feels right to me too. I do get out and give them a piece of mind though, i might shout at them and then teach them how they are supposed to drive, then i'll just get inside and drive off, end of story for me.
	(1) Thanks

27th September 2018, 19:22	#49
ashwinprakas BANNED Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Kollam Posts: 2,018 Thanked: 6,636 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car I don't know what the right choice here is or for a matter of fact care much what happens to the parties at fault, sorry, but for whatever its worth its the truth. But what I do know is that in this pathetic excuse for a society we have going on here in India, is in dire need of better men, which is why I hope that you would come out the better man in this scenario, irrespective of what your decision may be. Drive Safe, A.P.
	(4) Thanks

27th September 2018, 19:59	#50
landcruiser123 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Chicagoland Posts: 2,986 Thanked: 6,859 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car I think these guys shouldn't be let off. They are a menace and a risk to the society. Drunken driving, high speed driving, riding triples and without helmet is a terrible crime. You might have been protected by your car today- someone on another two-wheeler may not be as lucky as you. I think the kindness you can offer is not to ask them anything to repair your car. Let law enforcement have its way- if they go to jail, there maybe a few others (their friends/relatives) who will not indulge in this kind of irresponsible acts.
	() Thanks

27th September 2018, 20:05	#51
DrAakash BHPian Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: Rohtak Posts: 80 Thanked: 118 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car Tough choice.. Maybe not. Had your car been rammed by someone more affluent, would you have given it this much thought? They might also have been under the influence of drugs or alcohol, might have their whole life ahead of them as well.. But its somehow easier on the conscience isn't it? Everyone loves to sympathize with the poor, even myself, considering that nobody is poor by choice, it is not like they're all slackers, most of them work harder than most of us here ever have or ever will. But the fact remains that a majority of the antisocial elements hail from this strata of the society, howsoever harsh it may sound. And that's a conscious choice, mind you. I might be sounding like the repulsive thakur saab from old Hindi movies, but laws have to apply equally to everyone in the society. Just cuz someone is rich, they shouldn't be allowed to buy off the whole judicial system, just as if someone isn't well off, doesn't afford them my sympathy for an incident like this especially considering the drugs situation, they made their choice already. Heavens forbid, but what if it had been a larger vehicle conning at you head on? I don't need to list out the possible outcomes, neither do i wish that for anyone. Please do not let this slide, you'd redeem yourself as an individual, but this will set up a dangerous precedent for the boys, that you could do wrong and get away with it. I'm not asking you to file a serious complaint or have their distraught parents pay for their antics, but at least make it sure that the guys are taught a lesson that they won't forget anyone soon. Apologies for hurting anyone's sentiments if i have, wasn't intentional, I'm just blunt sometimes.
	(2) Thanks

27th September 2018, 20:29	#52
Ragavsr BHPian Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Chennai Posts: 469 Thanked: 1,188 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car A useless bunch of laws and non existent law enforcement. Filing a complaint or even the cops asking whether to file an FIR or a case doesn't mean they are going to file one. A few years back, my car was rear ended by a cab at a signal at such high speed that my car hit the car in front. The cops refused to file an FIR saying that they will file one only if there is injury or death. I assume the cab guy paid off the cops. This shameful practice of offering money or taking it needs to stop. Why the heck does 3rd party insurance exist in India? In my case I had to repair using my own money as my car had only 3rd party insurance. Why do the idiotic courts go on mandating 3rd party insurance if 1. No claim is allowed to be made without an FIR 2. If I am to settle or pay money if I am at fault I understand in this particular case, insurance of the biker is out of question, as he was drunk. Last edited by Ragavsr : 27th September 2018 at 20:33.
	(2) Thanks

27th September 2018, 22:12	#53
AKTRACK BHPian Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: New Delhi Posts: 192 Thanked: 237 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car Few points - - They are never going to do a regular job, so stop worrying about how it will affect their job prospects. They will most probably do sundry things which a police case won't affect. Most likely they will keep having brushes with the law in their lifetimes. - Not punishing them does not ensure that they heave learned a lesson. As irresponsible as they seem, they are probably going to laugh it off. - You are probably doing good to others by letting law take its own course. - There is a difference between being poor and looking poor. They seem to just look poor. I am sure they will able to arrange the money for you and the cops when it really gets rough for them. - We 'good hearted' people have to let go of the 'chalta hai' attitude. 'Chalta hai' as in letting go of others mistakes. That is not how it works. I have usually seen that others mistakes that I let go off usually bearing a cost, are treated as opportunities by others. Had it been the other way round, you could only image what trouble they would have brought upon you. - You are not taking revenge. Your heart is in the right place. - Cover/Protect yourself up. Don't get too involved like meeting them, their families here and there to settle things up.
	(3) Thanks

28th September 2018, 00:08	#54
MaheshY1 BANNED Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Tapukara Posts: 452 Thanked: 1,309 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car I say let them have it today so that something more serious doesn't happen tomorrow. Profiling aside, such people tend to have a strong bond with their buddies who may try to harm you sometime in the future. So, consider it a punishment well-deserved. If they're capable of learning, then they might spread the word and not only refrain from breaking the rules in future but also encourage people in their circle to stay on the safe side of the law. In this case, you can say that the punishment will only bring out the good in them and in the society. PS: People reading this are free to judge me. But, I'd request you to keep your judgment to yourself even if you're not offended by my words. Staying on point will also help the fellow BHPian make an informed decision and cut the clutter.
	(1) Thanks

28th September 2018, 08:37	#56
GrammarNazi Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,419 Thanked: 3,490 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car For their mother (& her situation), let it go. But settle it in a way to ensure the dues are paid especially if selling the bike is required (it'll knock some conscience into their head). Not all sections of society who have money have had the privilege to know how to choose right from wrong. IMO Laws are meant for hardened criminals, not these idiots. Last edited by GrammarNazi : 28th September 2018 at 08:38.
	() Thanks

28th September 2018, 08:41	#57
vamsi2390 BHPian Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 165 Thanked: 277 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car As some one already pointed out what if it wasn't your car and some pregnant or lady with a kid on a scooter ? If someone looks or is poor , the law is different for them ? Let them get through and learn some lessons on being responsible. Clearly their parents or their 'apparent' poor condition isn't teaching them any grounding lessons. Let the police and law teach them and save someone else not being a victim due to some 'rich or Poor's but irresponsible tom, dick and Harry . And remembe, lesson to one tennager isnt a lesson to one but his whole friend circle and more.
	() Thanks

28th September 2018, 08:59	#59
WorkingGuru BHPian Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Bangalore Posts: 529 Thanked: 2,213 Times	Re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car They'll get back to the antics if you don't press charges. Sets a very bad precedent to their peers too. Leave it to our lenient judiciary to condone them or show mercy. All too often I've witnessed this section of society deliberately do all kinds of nonsense and then claim entitlement to mercy simply on the grounds of being poor/uneducated. Meet them at their trade and see how they'll try to maliciously cheat you left right & center - viz how they have the willingness to spend in lakhs to buy a 200cc bike & use it like this while being high on alcohol/drugs. You were luckily in a car, what if it was a pregnant lady on a 2 wheeler. The guy who fled an accident site has NO conscience. Sympathy for such people is foolishness. Last edited by WorkingGuru : 28th September 2018 at 09:09.
	(1) Thanks