[deehunk]

Adani's Cash Mundan may become the opposition party's trump card in the upcoming polls in Karnataka. His ill-gotten wealth reminds me of these lines from Basavanna's vachana, translated for non-Kannada members,

ಪಾಪಿಯ ಧನ ಪ್ರಾಯಶ್ಚಿತ್ತಕ್ಕಲ್ಲದೆ, ಸತ್ಪಾತ್ರಕ್ಕೆ ಸಲ್ಲದಯ್ಯ!
ನಾಯ ಹಾಲು ನಾಯಿಗಲ್ಲದೆ, ಪಂಚಾಮೃತಕ್ಕೆ ಸಲ್ಲದಯ್ಯ!

A sinner's wealth is not for good cause but for remorse!
A dog's milk is not a nectar for sweet but for its puppies!

Quoting @deetee, can SEBI temporarily freeze transactions of Adani shares till a thorough investigation is carried out to protect the genuine investors?

[Shreyans_Jain]

Originally Posted by deehunk

His ill-gotten wealth reminds me of these lines from Basavanna's vachana,

ಪಾಪಿಯ ಧನ ಪ್ರಾಯಶ್ಚಿತ್ತಕ್ಕಲ್ಲದೆ, ಸತ್ಪಾತ್ರಕ್ಕೆ ಸಲ್ಲದಯ್ಯ!
ನಾಯ ಹಾಲು ನಾಯಿಗಲ್ಲದೆ, ಪಂಚಾಮೃತಕ್ಕೆ ಸಲ್ಲದಯ್ಯ!

Pls translate for us non Kannada speakers.

[deetee]

Originally Posted by volkman10

Indian market regulator examining Adani share rout: Reuters


Link

To me, it appears that SEBI is investigating 'how' the stock crashed suddenly and not 'how' the stock rose meteorically (irony is, meteors fall from the sky). If SEBI has to protect investor's interests, shouldn't they tighten and fix the loop holes exploited during inflation of the stock?

[TSIched'Out]

So after today's lower circuits, the FPO stands canceled. Money will be returned to the investors.
https://www.bseindia.com/xml-data/co...2194e81edc.pdf

[deetee]

Originally Posted by TSIched'Out

So after today's lower circuits, the FPO stands canceled. Money will be returned to the investors.
https://www.bseindia.com/xml-data/co...2194e81edc.pdf

This is interesting. So all those HNI and other institutional investors get their money back ( I suspect they knew this all the way). But any retail investor who might have bought at discounted price from secondary market is left bleeding. I wonder if this is beginning of an end to this saga.

I had a similar experience with Anil Ambani 's Reliance about Ten years ago. So, never got tempted to touch Adani stocks , once bitten twice shy.

[GutsyGibbon]

Genuinely curious - request experts to chime in.

If Adani is holding on to its share including its holdings through shell entities, why is it crashing so much with so little float? I assume people like LIC are also holding on, then who is selling? It cant all be retail, can it? If Adani is dumping the stock, it would show up as insider sale, wouldn’t it? What about the sale done by shell entities?

[deetee]

Originally Posted by GutsyGibbon

Genuinely curious - request experts to chime in.

If Adani is holding on to its share including its holdings through shell entities, why is it crashing so much with so little float? I assume people like LIC are also holding on, then who is selling? It cant all be retail, can it? If Adani is dumping the stock, it would show up as insider sale, wouldn’t it? What about the sale done by shell entities?

Stock Price can fall if buyers are not interested to pay more but sellers are eager to wash hands off. So, the fall may not be because promoters are selling, it could be because retail is eagerly selling but there is not enough buying . Today about 1.35 crore stock changed hands. It is almost same as yesterday, yet stock fell 30%, that shows lack of demand and heavy supply.

Originally Posted by deehunk

Quoting @deetee, can SEBI temporarily freeze transactions of Adani shares till a thorough investigation is carried out to protect the genuine investors?

If same sentiment continues or worsens tomorrow, even deeper sellout may happen. So, I would not be surprised if SEBI steps in and freeze trading in these stocks.

[Lord-Lannister]

While trying to respect our board’s decorum on political discourse, I must say “daal mei kuch kala hai”.

It’s such a chaos of war, that now I’m wondering if retail buyers were looked out for (post FPO cancellation) or were they always meant to be the bag holders? I say this, as based on TOI

Support from high networth investors ensured India’s biggest follow-on public offering (FPO), the Rs 20,000-crore Adani Enterprises’ (AEL) issue, achieved full subscription on the last day of bidding. However, there was a tepid response from retail investors and employees.

It’s poetically like watching the Hindenburg airship take flight, and merely moments later.. well you know. How many of these “posters/commenters” will be back I reckon?

[rx100]

Originally Posted by deetee

If same sentiment continues or worsens tomorrow, even deeper sellout may happen. So, I would not be surprised if SEBI steps in and freeze trading in these stocks.

I don’t recall it ever happened, why would SEBI intervene to freeze trading? If the allegations turned true during their investigation, what happens to retail investors then? At least now the retailers have the option to exit as long as a greater fool there to buy.

Remember Vakrangee, PC Jewelers, Yes bank, Unitech, all gone down the drain and there were no interventions by SEBI.

[Theyota]

Originally Posted by how_you_doing

If virtue signaling had been an Olympic sport, we Indians would always have at least 1 guaranteed gold.

1. South Korea gave all its resources to Samsung and a few other companies as they wanted to build a war economy. This is why they moved from a developing to a developed country in just one generation.

2. China provided all the protection to their companies. Their navy goes with their shipping vessels to protect them.

3. US companies bribe their government in the name of lobbying.

We have already gone through this sermon by few other posters in this thread. No one here is denying that govt support is necessary for large conglomerates especially in infra business. All we are saying is no one should support people who try to swindle investors, banks, etc or run a ponzi scheme. There are million other ways govts can support. I think all folks who have cast doubts about Adani in this thread will be happy to be proven wrong down the lane.

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by how_you_doing

If virtue signaling had been an Olympic sport, we Indians would always have at least 1 guaranteed gold.

....

Adani will be fine. The social justice warriors who become overnight experts in farm laws, the army, and now auditing will find something new in the next few weeks.

Replace "corportation" with "person"

This is what your post says effectively

I see so many Indians hating people in jail for commiting crimes. How can our country progress when we put our own citizens in jail? We should abolish police and jails and judiciary. All these social justice warriors putting people in jail, our own citizens and fellow Indians who could have made India a superpower but now they sit in jail, and and that too for something as trivial as breaking the law!

If absurd arguments were an olympic sport, this thread would get the gold

If a fraud was committed, a corporation should get the same stick as a person who comes to your house and steals the LED TV get. Yes, corporations in the past have gotten away with crimes, both in India and west. But then people also have gotten away with crimes. There are many unsolved murders in the west.
by your logic, we should stop arresting everyone for breaking the law.

Lastly.. Remember its okay to have a fetish, or true love, or junoon for anyone. Even Adani. But you should not start insulting others if they say negative things about what you love. Provide counter arguments. For example Adani can go to US court and sue for libel, and actually get back the market cap it lost. They could effectively completely bankrupt hidenburg for libel.
And to cap it all up, all we have is an allegation and supporting documents. I am looking for a rebuttal to those supporting documents, can't find any. Maybe you have some?

[driver52001]

To my understanding, he's refunding back his own money to offshore accounts. Otherwise it would have got stuck in India in the form of equity, which in reality is 25% below the subscription price. What a mess

[100Kmphormore]

Why does this sound surprising? Inflated valuations and to keep up some hanky panky would have been done, not to forget the goodwill by bureaucrats. Not going to invest a single paisa in Indian companies until they have a strong board. Thank goodness this guy didn’t pull a Mallya.

[sj_koova]

Originally Posted by how_you_doing

Plenty of Indians live in their la la land and suffer from crab mentality where they hope our own to fail. I guess they are hoping to revive bidi/agarbatti industry to make 10 Trillion USD by 2033.

How do you define something as "our own"?
Adani owns more than 70% of stake in his company. A mere 2% is with retail investors and the rest with financial institutions like SBI and LIC (and some FIIs).

Just because Adani's CFO puts up an Indian flag for a video, we can't live in an illusion of we all have become the 3rd richest in the world.

I have several questions

1. How many people Adani group has employed (compare against TCS or SBI)?
2. What is the impact on PSU financial institutions if Adani bubble bursts?
3. How can the market cap double from $100B to $200B in one year when companie's balance sheet and performance is mediocre (mere 1% profit margin with large debt)?
4. What is the meaning of 10 trillion GDP is the per capita income doesn't improve and more and more people are dropped below poverty line every year?
5. What is the impact on environment by Adani group of companies?
6. Have you looked at past 4 years balance sheet and cash flow statements of Adani group of companies. What do you say about their fundamentals?
7. Why does mutual funds and retail investors shy away from Adani group?
8. Adani group is pledging stocks to secure new loans. And he uses the new loan to increase the valuation of stocks. What happens if Adani fails to repay, and the financial institutions want to recover their capital by selling large sum of shares in the market? How do you explain that financial process?


What we need is rational thinking, a lot of research and some knowledge of history helps too.
Whatsapp university will teach how good is 10 trillion economy, but not the reality.
There is a book titled "Business Maharajas" by Gita Parimal. It narrates the true story of Indian business houses and how they influenced the governments and it's policies to start and grow business. But it was very different from what Adani is doing to our PSUs.

Influencing is a skill, but exploiting is a crime!

[how_you_doing]

Originally Posted by Dr.Car

We'll surely become a Trillion dollar economy if we have 10 more Ambani's and Adanis but I'm pretty sure that's not gonna benefit the common man or even the high tax paying individuals in any way! The wealth in this country is just being accumulated in the hands of top 1% people while the others are being fed with the narrative that the country is developing at a fast pace. There hasn't been any real life improvement in the lives of 99% people and the trends look like this going to continue!

This is completely incorrect.

India lifted 415 million out of poverty in 15 years, says UN
140 million pulled out of poverty in India since 2015-16, says UNDP

You don't even need the UN or government to tell you this. Just look around you in Metro cities, Tier 2 cities, and smaller villages and how things have changed in the last 20 years.

Originally Posted by sj_koova

I have several questions


4. What is the meaning of 10 trillion GDP is the per capita income doesn't improve and more and more people are dropped below poverty line every year?

I am not the right guy to answer all of your questions. As I said, I am not a technical guy nor do I follow the stock market or Adani. I am sure plenty of more knowledgeable members can answer your questions, plenty is probably already answered.

I am quoting your Point 4 as it is completely wrong. See the 2 links which I shared at the top. I am quoting part of the article -

The incidence of poverty in the country dropped from 55.1% in 2005-06 to 16.4% in 2019-21, as per the latest Multidimensional Poverty Index (MPI) compiled jointly by the UN Development Programme (UNDP) and Oxford Poverty and Human Development Initiative (OPHI).

Of course, India will remain a developing country for many many decades because it has 1.4 billion people.

India will be the world's third-largest economy by 2028-29 overtaking Japan. Larger economies carry far more weight and they get favorable treatment in the global market. A larger economy will offer far more jobs as demand will be more. You will get a better trade deal. You can export the surplus which will be far more due to the economy of scale. Your circle of social, economic, and political influence will be far more.

Please don't say what is the point of 10T USD economy.

If you are saying the rich are getting richer, It is the government's job to put taxes on the rich and redistribute the wealth which they are doing generously as the poor people vote in India. Wasn't there a thread in the forum where a member said he is actually paying 60% tax on his car?