[nanduchitnis]

Looking at these pictures of smashed cars by Ladakh Taxi Union Mafia adds another dimension to Ladakh travels.

Are we in WAR ZONE like Iraq?

Now the Taxi Mafia wants ban on all pvt cars besides Zoom cars.

Boycott Ladakh.

[SunnyBoi]

Originally Posted by Dry Ice

Update: A local responds to the reports floating around on the internet.

I'm not sure if its the same person but found another account by a local :

https://www.facebook.com/nubra.valle...11878032403567

Posting below for folks who dont have access to facebook:

THANKS FOR TAKING OUT ‪#‎LADAKH‬ FROM YOUR ITINERARY !!!
.................................................. .................................................. ......
Dear Domestic (Indian) Tourist,
Greeting from Ladakh!!!
Don't get carried away so easily by some post on various social media over the last few days. Don't be so quick in judging. Many of you must have got so disappointed after going through the blogs written by ‪#‎TEAMBHP‬,‪#‎Zoomcars‬, ‪#‎Drivewithoutborder‬ etc, and you must have felt " what the heck is wrong with peace loving Ladakhis?" and all of you must have jumped to conclusion. So did i.
But did anyone care to know the story on other side. Why such unwanted events occurred at first place?? What prompt those taxi drivers to take such a stance which could be disastrous to themselves? and then finally why did all the civil societies supported them?? Do you think all Ladakhi has gone crazy at same time?? strange enough .... Isn't it??
Yes, nothing can justify violence. But the unfortunate event which happened with zoomcars convoy was the result of their careless behaviour and reckless driving on that particular day on that particular spot which ignites the one whole big issue which the administration never care to resolve...
let me tell you about the events which occurred on that fateful day. All the vehicles was standing peacefully in queue on the road before a check post. When suddenly some fortuner car drove passed recklessly through some space left on either side and in the process one local driver got hit and sustained fracture to his right leg. So, whole gang of local taxi drivers gather around it. then some argument started between local guys and zoomcar drivers...Now, instead of apologising, one of the FORTUNER DRIVER yelled at everyone that " TUM GOKHEY LOG MUJHE NAHIN JANTA" and he claimed to have connection with some big shots and all.... And then everything turn into ugly and there was a fight for the survival of fittest.
Although, i m strongly against Violence as a mean for the solution of any unresolved dispute but i support the move taken by the Taxi union and others to ban Non Local Vehicles to drive around Ladakh. I support it because :
1. Most of them drive off road for thrill with no respect for fragile ecology.
2.Some of them found chasing wild animals.
3. Driving into the water bodies like Pangong lake, local water streams etc
4.Driving through the sand dunes
5. Camping in private properties without permission.
6.Dumping garbages ( bear bottles , wrappers) .
7. Driving through village fields etc etc.
Above all, certain outside travel agents companies hired their private vehicles for commercial purpose and bypass various rules and regulation laid down for commercial vehicle. Now, banning for out side vehicles will seriously effect the business of those companies. Therefore they are running amuck on social media.
Some of you have taken the initiatives to file PIL against the taxi union of Ladakh. I do appreciate your effort. You will get as many likes and shares as possible because we know that its just a goodwill stunt to get more business. Please be sincere and fight for justice in reality not on facebook. Because our country need more people like u.
Let us assume that court pass the ruling aginst taxi union. Do you think it gonna work?? Ladakh is a small community and we all know each other in person. things can get worse and soon it will be an ego war. Those non Local driver will rather feel more unsafe...
Some people have written that local police and administration is also supporting them because most of them owns taxi as well. If they have supported those so called '"Mafia" would have gone frenzy.
Yes, certainly those events will have some negative impact on tourism business in Ladakh. But still i support it although i own guest house. Because i don't want following kind of tourist :
1. Tourist who has no respect for local values
2.Tourist who has no respect our environment,
3. Tourist who comes for thrills with no idea about way people live in.
4. Tourist who think money can buy anything.
5.Tourist who think they can do anything because India is a democratic country.
6. Tourist who think local are alive because of them.
if we continue to have such kind of tourist, beauty and charms of Ladakh will disappear. Serenity will be lost in oblivion. Yes, some of you have rightly mentioned that " LADAKH WILL SOON BECOME A MANALI" .
Lesser the no of tourist better it is for Ladakh. Please, if you feel unsafe in Ladakh then you will never feel safe anywhere in India.
Thanks for taking out ladakh from your itinerary ....
Truly Ladakhspa.

[Dry Ice]

Originally Posted by SunnyBoi

I'm not sure if its the same person but found another account by a local :

https://www.facebook.com/nubra.valle...11878032403567

Posting below for folks who dont have access to facebook:

They can try to justify the actions as much as they want. The passed resolution is for everyone to see. They can try and project themselves as 'peace loving' as possible but their actions indicate otherwise. Ladakh has lost the charm it had earlier.

I wish the MHA reinstates the permit rule and caps the number of tourists at 100 a month - driven to and from Leh in HPTDC/JKTDC buses. Will solve a multitude of issues including the environmental concerns.

[sonic_boom]

Originally Posted by prkiran

Pardon my ignorance, is similar nonsense happening in Goa as well? Was planning a drive to Goa later this year and this line is a bit of a shocker.

Just last week there was a chakka jam against new permits for self drive vehicles by taxi drivers across Goa. Things have cooled down now and I'm currently driving a self-drive here.

[Chetan_Rao]

That Facebook post is full of veiled threats and sarcastic 'you think you can actually do something to us?' jibes.

And he/she wants us to believe we've got it all wrong and they're all peace-loving lambs. The man/woman could do with an English lesson, for starters. Idiot.

[scopriobharath]

Originally Posted by SunnyBoi

I'm not sure if its the same person but found another account by a local :

https://www.facebook.com/nubra.valle...11878032403567

Posting below for folks who dont have access to facebook:

Simple Question - Even if the fortuner owner had made some lewd comments, what prevented the so called Friendly local Ladhaki taximen union drivers to hand him over to the police. Why did they take law into thier own hands. Police can raise an FIR and also seize the vehicle. Even assuming the person made insulting comments, showing revenge by damaging a convoy of vehicles is definetly not a demonstration of friendly behavior.

Even if the person is well connected, the same cop would be hestitant not to file an FIR, when there are 100s of local taximen at the police station's door.

[wanderer4x4]

Originally Posted by SunnyBoi

I'm not sure if its the same person but found another account by a local :

https://www.facebook.com/nubra.valle...11878032403567

Posting below for folks who dont have access to facebook:

The way this saviour of the world environment, upholder of Ladakhi culture writes, it's nothing but threats and insults to the Indian traveller. And I think the tone in which he mentions Tbhp along with others, our Tbhp stickered cars would be as much of a stone throwing target as would be a Zoomcar.

Amid such hostility, who'd enjoy a holiday? And he says he is a guest house owner and is concerned with the environmental degradation. Can his good self kindly answer why have they set up all those Raja, Rancho, 3 idiots, 6 fools and what not guest houses right on Pangong? These have been set up by the god fearing environmentalists like him only and not by the self driving domestic indian tourists, isn't?

Huh, it's as if only the non cab hiring tourists are the ones hell bent on destroying the environment and the local cab hiring tourists are the great ecologists under the guidance of the great mafia. The hooligans are now trying to give a cultural / environmental twist to this sordid saga. Just impertinent.

[humyum]

I don't understand,why is he collectively saying that all tourists do X Y Z and destroy Ladakh because some people did it ? Why should everyone be put in the same basket?

My man the Ladakhi thinks that with this one incident, all car rentals should be banned and all tourists too. Every city, tourist destination or country has its fair share of miscreants, there is a system of law, fine and justice to tackle there, not a blanket ban, what's the point of India getting independence then ?

The 'Ban everything in Ladakh' and allow only taxi guy to function looks more like a case for local taxis rather than a point of view.

And if he thinks Ladakh is his private property, he can pick it up, pack it in his bag and take it wherever u wants, but until it's in India, anyone can go anyhow in Ladakh and no one can stop them.

PS: How many people drown their jeeps in Pangong Lake every year ?, I am sure you can count them on a single hand.

[Lalvaz]

There's usually two sides to a story. We hear one side and react. Perhaps some truth is there in each version. The Taxi unions are definitely wrong in restricting entry of cars from other parts of India, while I'm sure some of the tourists that go there definitely indulge in rowdy behaviour. Not just in India but many foreign destinations hate indian tourists as well. Surely there is some need for introspection on the part of our tourists, which includes our 4 wheeled wanderers. Leh Ladakh is a wonderful place and the people there are usually extremely friendly, hardworking and honest. It will be a royal shame if tempers do not cool down on both sides and better sense prevails.

[bullrun87]

Lots of threats made to the tourist in the "ladakhi response". I don't feel it makes sense to go on a holiday where you spend all your time fearing for your life and property. Even if the Fortuner driver was rash and unruly, with ladakh being a "close knit community", I am sure the taxi unions know all the cops and could have handed over the supposedly errant driver to the police.
Why do they think all tourists are the same? The thing about tourism is that you don't get to decide what sort of guy you get. Hosts are supposed to be welcoming to all and disputes are to be handled as per the law and not like savages. It is not just the tourists who pollute, I have seen ladakhi locals do it too. When I was in pangong-tso I saw cops eating beside the water and polluting it by throwing all sort of stuff into it. That truly made me angry.
As long as ladakh is represented on an indian map we should be free to travel there in any way we choose. This is a democratic country and people here have rights. This is something the ladakh mafia needs to understand.
On a lighter note, since we have caused so much headache to the taxi mafia, the next item on the ban list will surely be cars bearing team-bhp stickers.

[pamiboy]

The only way to deal this it hit it where it hurts. Avoid the area like a plague. Until it is deemed safe. The unionism shown by taxi mafia cannot be covered by "concern for local fragile ecosystem". The unions need to realize that they themselves are the threat to the ecosystem. I'm glad that there's one place off my travel list now.

[Hayek]

I know I have posted about this before. Clearly, it takes two hands to clap. Part of the problem is definitely because the local taxi drivers feel that self drive cars will reduce their income. But there is some merit in the arguments made by Ladakhspa as well. As I mentioned in the earlier thread, driving in Ladakh is extra-ordinarily dangerous. And the locals drive with enormous cooperation, which enables them to stay safe. If self drive tourists (certainly not all of them, but even a material minority) drive dangerously, bringing the driving culture of the plains to Ladakh, that puts others at risk. Similarly, let's not pretend that folks from Bombay or Delhi would never make remarks calling the locals Chinkis or something of that kind - there are enough people who would not even realise they are doing something wrong when they make such remarks. Ladakh is a unique area - at the junction of different cultures, where people live a hard life with very, very little. Shouldn't we be more willing to give them some leeway that we would not give people in more populated parts of India, or think of constructive solutions like putting a cap on the number of self drive cars allowed(if that can be done for Rohtang, it can be done for Ladakh), and creating a strong driving and behaviour code for tourists visiting that place?

[deb1975]

Absolutely right dude. Some of us come from the hilly parts too and we share your concerns especially when some people pelt insanely down hill roads with no idea of how to drive in the hills. The truth is difficult but that does not mean that the truth needs to be buried.

[Dry Ice]

Originally Posted by Lalvaz

There's usually two sides to a story. We hear one side and react. Perhaps some truth is there in each version. The Taxi unions are definitely wrong in restricting entry of cars from other parts of India, while I'm sure some of the tourists that go there definitely indulge in rowdy behaviour. Not just in India but many foreign destinations hate indian tourists as well. Surely there is some need for introspection on the part of our tourists, which includes our 4 wheeled wanderers. Leh Ladakh is a wonderful place and the people there are usually extremely friendly, hardworking and honest. It will be a royal shame if tempers do not cool down on both sides and better sense prevails.

Aren't we mixing 2 different things? If the tourists are polluting the location, isn't it the responsibility of the local administration to make sure it doesn't happen? Hasn't HP restricted the approach to Chandertaal to deter non-serious tourists? Something similar can be done.

I am willing to give them a benefit of doubt. Let's say this was all fabricated stuff (assume), but then what about the several other things they are doing at a rapid pace to make the tourists feel 'unwelcome'? Aren't the resolutions passed by them in public view? The band that they called a few days back, isn't that in public view? They stopping private cars and checking RCs, isn't that info public now? It's the intentions and what they are trying to do that is the problem here. Nothing else.

All these environmental issues and dangerous terrain etc 'excuses' are coming up now because this incident has garnered immense bad publicity which will hamper the tourism in the region. They are in damage control mode.

Originally Posted by Hayek

I know I have posted about this before. Clearly, it takes two hands to clap. Part of the problem is definitely because the local taxi drivers feel that self drive cars will reduce their income. But there is some merit in the arguments made by Ladakhspa as well. As I mentioned in the earlier thread, driving in Ladakh is extra-ordinarily dangerous. And the locals drive with enormous cooperation, which enables them to stay safe. If self drive tourists (certainly not all of them, but even a material minority) drive dangerously, bringing the driving culture of the plains to Ladakh, that puts others at risk. Similarly, let's not pretend that folks from Bombay or Delhi would never make remarks calling the locals Chinkis or something of that kind - there are enough people who would not even realise they are doing something wrong when they make such remarks. Ladakh is a unique area - at the junction of different cultures, where people live a hard life with very, very little. Shouldn't we be more willing to give them some leeway that we would not give people in more populated parts of India, or think of constructive solutions like putting a cap on the number of self drive cars allowed(if that can be done for Rohtang, it can be done for Ladakh), and creating a strong driving and behaviour code for tourists visiting that place?

All this is besides the point. If someone made a racial remark, they had full right to call the police and get the matter escalated. They did not. They threw stones on and smashed windscreens of cars that may have been (or were) carrying elderly, women and children. Is this justified behavior?

More often than not, I have seen the same hill drivers being more reckless than someone from the plains. Since it's not everyday they drive on such routes, they are automatically more alert and cautious. They don't just fancy reaching the destination, they enjoy the route as well. That's why you can see so many pictures taken by people even enroute! The taxis on the other hand are always in a hurry to reach the destination.

[lazy]

I am pretty sure Ladakh is better off without the typical desi tourist.

The typical desi tourist is an arrogant, loud, dirty, insensitive and loathsome creature. Add the affluence to afford SUVs, what you get is a truly despicable lot who has nothing but money.

Of course there are exceptions. But I have travelled extensively in India and somewhat abroad - so I know the typical desi tourist quite well.

I can quote dozens of examples, but since this is TeamBHP let me take a driving example. In the hills, locals drive super patiently, some stop and wait even 100-200 mtrs before a narrow point to let the other vehicle pass. And how to tourists drive ? If you say that you haven't noticed anything wrong, then my friend, you are part of the problem.

The tone of this TeamBHP thread is completely hostile - lets teach them as lesson, lets boycott them, who do they think they are, they are threatening us etc.
Cant we comprehend why a peaceful and friendly population would suddenly behave so aggressively?
They have been saying no to self-drive rentals, yet desis think "what will these poor villagers do...I have connections and money....."

cheers