Octy vRS Achilles Heels

shuvd · 18th February 2009, 18:16

This thread is giving me nightmares! But, its very helpful. Thanks Ajmat Sir.

All said and done, the vRS and the TPi easily kick the collective you know what of the Civic and the Corolla (performance wise)

.

@ Honda fans: I have a Civic and I know what I'm talking about.

ImmortalZ · 18th February 2009, 19:36

I know what you're talking about. Nearly 30 BHP more makes a big difference. That and the whole turbo experience

But, I can turbo my Civic at the cost of a typical TPi's three years of maintenance. And that is after I've subtracted my own

. And it'll probably be still more reliable.

navpreet318 · 18th February 2009, 19:42

Ajmat.thanks for this thread.I'm a happier man now and i'm no longer looking to getting this car any more.I for one couldn't have lived with this kind of a car especially with the amount of maintenance it wants.

i just couldn't have liked it at all.Its a personal opinion though.there are people who can live with it for the performance it offers.

I'm in love with the japanese reliability and low maintenance costs.

Just saw the above posts.Well the performance deficite is there in case of the civic.But after driving a RS here in doon and mussoorie I've felt its just not made for either my style of driving or there aren't roads for it.The power offered by the civic is actually quite suffice for me.and in case i want more there's the remap from zakie.Turbo is not the route i'd be willing to take after al i've heard about it.

ssjr0498 · 18th February 2009, 19:50

Dada, ki joke!!!

I just cant stop laughing

. Sure sure!! why not!!

Guess by performance you meant phull jomidari ishtyle big apetite and bhaari bharkam presence on the road!!

Yeah! totally agree!! On those lines,definitely the skoda's rule!! A head turner for sure!!

But avoid taking the zamidar sahab onto the real fields!! The track and the drag strip!! Cuz there the zamidar's might loose their color..

Shrey

*Once again,really sorry for going OT.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuvd

This thread is giving me nightmares! But, its very helpful. Thanks Ajmat Sir.

All said and done, the vRS and the TPi easily kick the collective you know what of the Civic and the Corolla (performance wise)

.

@ Honda fans: I have a Civic and I know what I'm talking about.

ajmat · 18th February 2009, 21:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssjr0498

But avoid taking the zamidar sahab onto the real fields!! The track and the drag strip!! Cuz there the zamidar's might loose their color..

*Once again,really sorry for going OT.

I really don't know your experience with the RS but a Vtec ain't all that hot on track. It has limitations on corners and brake distribution is very front biased. The skoda is less tactile and can sustain higher speeds.

Yes, reliability is an issue but the objective of this thread is to ensure that you go in eyes wide open. All though I curse my experience, I do enjoy the cars capabilities.

HAFI · 18th February 2009, 22:08

One OT : when does the turbo get activated in RS.Is it at a particular RPM or at a particular speed?.

I don't hear the whoosh whoosh at times even though how much i floor the accelerator?

ac 427 · 18th February 2009, 22:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajmat

I really don't know your experience with the RS but a Vtec ain't all that hot on track. It has limitations on corners and brake distribution is very front biased. The skoda is less tactile and can sustain higher speeds.

Yes, reliability is an issue but the objective of this thread is to ensure that you go in eyes wide open. All though I curse my experience, I do enjoy the cars capabilities.

Now thats honest. Even after mentioning such negatives, you are calling a spade a spade. this is what makes this forum great. Unadulterated pure point of view.

great going ajmat.

cheers,
AC

flipsyde · 18th February 2009, 22:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajmat

I really don't know your experience with the RS but a Vtec ain't all that hot on track. It has limitations on corners and brake distribution is very front biased. The skoda is less tactile and can sustain higher speeds.

Yes, reliability is an issue but the objective of this thread is to ensure that you go in eyes wide open. All though I curse my experience, I do enjoy the cars capabilities.

Simple! Buy a Civic borrow/rent a vRS!! Even if you head to the track every weekend I think it would end up cheaper than buying a vRS and maintaining it. Are you really telling me the vRS is worth all the pain and the heartache you go thru owning it?

I really don't get it.... Maybe I never will!

v1p3r · 18th February 2009, 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssjr0498

But avoid taking the zamidar sahab onto the real fields!! The track and the drag strip!! Cuz there the zamidar's might loose their color..

I don't know what a zamidar is, but I'm given to believe that the RS is faster around the MMSC race track than the Civic. In fact, NK does a full lap in the RS in 2:15.30 and in the Civic in 2:17.95. To my eyes, that appears to be a whole 2.65 seconds slower.

Oddly, the Civic has a higher top speed -- 140.8 kmph -- as compared to the RS -- 141.3 kmph. The corner entry speeds for the Civic are also higher, while the corner exit speeds are higher for the RS. To the layman's eye, this would infer that the RS is actually a better handling car through the corners than the Civic.

Also, for the last 2 years, an RS has placed on the podium in the Indian Open category at SR. Last year, it came 3rd, after 2 Zens. The year before, it won. No Civic has come close.

The RS is overpriced, badly built, and does nothing well without a turbo. But the fact that it comes stock with a forged steel crankshaft and connecting rods, and a 20v head, means that you can build it to in excess of 350 whp without changing the internals. The stock crank is known to hold 500 whp.

Of course, this is of little solace when your fuel pump goes bust on your morning commute.

Ravveendrra · 19th February 2009, 00:33

If I wanted to be stingy, potter around town and be environment friendly - I would buy a Reva. (Everything else be damned.)

If I wanted extra range but wanted a cheap car that was frugal on fuel and maintainance cost - I would buy a sub 1 litre entry level hatch. (Comfort, security, longevity etc. be damned.)

If I wanted a hot hatch - I would buy a Paio 1.6. (Economy be damned.)

If I wanted a soft ride, economy and a modicum of speed in the mid to large size - I would buy a Toyota, Honda, or a Nissan.

If I wanted to flaunt wealth and travel in absolute luxury - I would buy a Rolls Royce, a S class or a 7 Series. (The rest of the world be damned.)

There is always a trade off: between performance and cost, between handling and comfort and so on and so forth. If there was not, why would automobile engineers agonise over square, over-square or under-square cylinders?

The RS is a good handler and is a scorcher. Fun to drive. The trade off is the fuel and maintainance cost. One cannot have everything, it is like trying to keep your cake and eat it too.

Personally: I like a firm ride and the consequent handling. I like a car that can eat up the miles with nonchalance. I like my cars to have firm (slightly hard) seats. I prefer a long distance runner to a sprinter. I like a car that is built like a tank (I do think that cars should leave the pound shedding to the women!). I like a car to have huge amounts of road grip. I like a car that the rural Indian roads (if one can call them that) cannot break easily. Finally, I prefer conservatively styled cars to radical designs (according to me,Chris Bangle is public enemy no.1).

I think I found what I wanted in the Skoda.

Thanks for this thread Ajmat. It helped me to identify some problem areas to watch out for in my own Skoda (though an oil burner). Yes, I know Skoda repairs are expensive but the car suit my style of driving and needs. I have also observed that Skodas hide their age pretty well and I do not like changing my cars often. I am therefore prepared to bear the cost. If I was not, I would not have bought a Skoda.

Cheers,

ssjr0498 · 19th February 2009, 11:47

Not arguing anymore neither denying anything.. what you say might be possible.

Take a look at the entire package that you get and then try and weigh in all the pros and cons analyze the situations. You will get what I intend to say.

I have done upwards of 78,000kms and haven't even had to change a nut on my car, the only thing which has conked is my O2 sensor.. which would cost me around 4k.

All that after some ripping sessions on sat/sun nights, 1 drag event (where I beat a peted RS hands down

)and daily redlining the car on my way to office.

Anyway, I am looking forward for a track day.. Hope it happens soon, looking fwd to see your RS in action on the track day!

Cheers
Shrey

Quote:

Originally Posted by v1p3r

I don't know what a zamidar is, but I'm given to believe that the RS is faster around the MMSC race track than the Civic. In fact, NK does a full lap in the RS in 2:15.30 and in the Civic in 2:17.95. To my eyes, that appears to be a whole 2.65 seconds slower.

Oddly, the Civic has a higher top speed -- 140.8 kmph -- as compared to the RS -- 141.3 kmph. The corner entry speeds for the Civic are also higher, while the corner exit speeds are higher for the RS. To the layman's eye, this would infer that the RS is actually a better handling car through the corners than the Civic.

Also, for the last 2 years, an RS has placed on the podium in the Indian Open category at SR. Last year, it came 3rd, after 2 Zens. The year before, it won. No Civic has come close.

The RS is overpriced, badly built, and does nothing well without a turbo. But the fact that it comes stock with a forged steel crankshaft and connecting rods, and a 20v head, means that you can build it to in excess of 350 whp without changing the internals. The stock crank is known to hold 500 whp.

Of course, this is of little solace when your fuel pump goes bust on your morning commute.

Ardy · 19th February 2009, 12:09

@Ravveendrra: Very well put together. One of the most sensible posts on this thread on the trade-off of requirements.

My vRS has done about 17K on odo and I must say I have had no issues so far. The total expense on servicing has been 10K for 2 regular servicing. Other than that my vRS has not visited the service center.

And my Octavia 1.9 Tdi has clocked 52K on odo in little over 3 year and is rock solid. The only incidental cost has been the replacement of the inter-cooler last month thanks to low clearance and she being driven by a driver.

rchimni · 19th February 2009, 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ardy

@Ravveendrra: Very well put together. One of the most sensible posts on this thread on the trade-off of requirements.

My vRS has done about 17K on odo and I must say I have had no issues so far. The total expense on servicing has been 10K for 2 regular servicing. Other than that my vRS has not visited the service center.

And my Octavia 1.9 Tdi has clocked 52K on odo in little over 3 year and is rock solid. The only incidental cost has been the replacement of the inter-cooler last month thanks to low clearance and she being driven by a driver.

Can say the same for my car , apart from the two fans which were replaced under warranty , my spend has been on regular service charges in the 32 k I have covered so far ..

Bomi · 19th February 2009, 13:53

38K Kms done on my RS and enjoying it thoroughly. Only routine services and once a throttle body cleaning/alignment done so far. I thought the timing belt needs to be changed at 50K MILES (80K Kms) in the petrol engines.

v1p3r · 20th February 2009, 02:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssjr0498

Anyway, I am looking forward for a track day.. Hope it happens soon, looking fwd to see your RS in action on the track day!

Mad or what? I'm not risking blowing something up on this white elephant. I think I'm gonna buy a nice Honda to thrash about.

18th February 2009, 18:16	#46
shuvd Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Calcutta Posts: 1,081 Thanked: 7 Times View My Garage	This thread is giving me nightmares! But, its very helpful. Thanks Ajmat Sir. All said and done, the vRS and the TPi easily kick the collective you know what of the Civic and the Corolla (performance wise). @ Honda fans: I have a Civic and I know what I'm talking about.
	() Thanks

18th February 2009, 19:36	#47
ImmortalZ Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,179 Thanked: 488 Times View My Garage	I know what you're talking about. Nearly 30 BHP more makes a big difference. That and the whole turbo experience But, I can turbo my Civic at the cost of a typical TPi's three years of maintenance. And that is after I've subtracted my own . And it'll probably be still more reliable.
	() Thanks

18th February 2009, 19:42	#48
navpreet318 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dehradun Posts: 2,264 Thanked: 2,983 Times	Ajmat.thanks for this thread.I'm a happier man now and i'm no longer looking to getting this car any more.I for one couldn't have lived with this kind of a car especially with the amount of maintenance it wants. i just couldn't have liked it at all.Its a personal opinion though.there are people who can live with it for the performance it offers. I'm in love with the japanese reliability and low maintenance costs. Just saw the above posts.Well the performance deficite is there in case of the civic.But after driving a RS here in doon and mussoorie I've felt its just not made for either my style of driving or there aren't roads for it.The power offered by the civic is actually quite suffice for me.and in case i want more there's the remap from zakie.Turbo is not the route i'd be willing to take after al i've heard about it. Last edited by navpreet318 : 18th February 2009 at 19:51.
	() Thanks

18th February 2009, 22:08	#51
HAFI BANNED Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: cochin Posts: 296 Thanked: 0 Times	One OT : when does the turbo get activated in RS.Is it at a particular RPM or at a particular speed?. I don't hear the whoosh whoosh at times even though how much i floor the accelerator?
	() Thanks

19th February 2009, 00:33	#55
Ravveendrra Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 1,391 Thanked: 446 Times View My Garage	Perspective If I wanted to be stingy, potter around town and be environment friendly - I would buy a Reva. (Everything else be damned.) If I wanted extra range but wanted a cheap car that was frugal on fuel and maintainance cost - I would buy a sub 1 litre entry level hatch. (Comfort, security, longevity etc. be damned.) If I wanted a hot hatch - I would buy a Paio 1.6. (Economy be damned.) If I wanted a soft ride, economy and a modicum of speed in the mid to large size - I would buy a Toyota, Honda, or a Nissan. If I wanted to flaunt wealth and travel in absolute luxury - I would buy a Rolls Royce, a S class or a 7 Series. (The rest of the world be damned.) There is always a trade off: between performance and cost, between handling and comfort and so on and so forth. If there was not, why would automobile engineers agonise over square, over-square or under-square cylinders? The RS is a good handler and is a scorcher. Fun to drive. The trade off is the fuel and maintainance cost. One cannot have everything, it is like trying to keep your cake and eat it too. Personally: I like a firm ride and the consequent handling. I like a car that can eat up the miles with nonchalance. I like my cars to have firm (slightly hard) seats. I prefer a long distance runner to a sprinter. I like a car that is built like a tank (I do think that cars should leave the pound shedding to the women!). I like a car to have huge amounts of road grip. I like a car that the rural Indian roads (if one can call them that) cannot break easily. Finally, I prefer conservatively styled cars to radical designs (according to me,Chris Bangle is public enemy no.1). I think I found what I wanted in the Skoda. Thanks for this thread Ajmat. It helped me to identify some problem areas to watch out for in my own Skoda (though an oil burner). Yes, I know Skoda repairs are expensive but the car suit my style of driving and needs. I have also observed that Skodas hide their age pretty well and I do not like changing my cars often. I am therefore prepared to bear the cost. If I was not, I would not have bought a Skoda. Cheers,
	(1) Thanks

19th February 2009, 12:09	#57
Ardy BHPian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 614 Thanked: 87 Times View My Garage	@Ravveendrra: Very well put together. One of the most sensible posts on this thread on the trade-off of requirements. My vRS has done about 17K on odo and I must say I have had no issues so far. The total expense on servicing has been 10K for 2 regular servicing. Other than that my vRS has not visited the service center. And my Octavia 1.9 Tdi has clocked 52K on odo in little over 3 year and is rock solid. The only incidental cost has been the replacement of the inter-cooler last month thanks to low clearance and she being driven by a driver. Last edited by Technocrat : 19th February 2009 at 12:32. Reason: Please avoid quoting an entire long post especially if its on same page, thanks
	() Thanks

19th February 2009, 13:53	#59
Bomi BHPian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Mumbai Posts: 284 Thanked: 77 Times	38K Kms done on my RS and enjoying it thoroughly. Only routine services and once a throttle body cleaning/alignment done so far. I thought the timing belt needs to be changed at 50K MILES (80K Kms) in the petrol engines.
	() Thanks