[RavSam]

Originally Posted by nik_kapur

Whats sad to know is that this car will fail like all other FIATs and thats a shame.

Well, according to this website: IAB
http://indianautosblog.com/2014/10/f...ampaign=buffer

Fiat Avventura gets over 500 bookings, 15k enquiries

It's too early to say that it will be a failure.
Limited Success? May or may not be.

[CliffHanger]

Originally Posted by nik_kapur

Whats sad to know is that this car will fail like all other FIATs and thats a shame. (fact: FIAT has attempted a zillion times in our market, herd mentality people just don't want to buy them)

Incorrect. Punto, launched way back in mid 2009, has gotten into around 750 homes last month. Compare this with Ford New Fiesta, Honda Brio, Tata Aria, Nissan Sunny, Renault Pulse, etc.

[nik_kapur]

Originally Posted by CliffHanger

Incorrect. Punto, launched way back in mid 2009, has gotten into around 750 homes last month. Compare this with Ford New Fiesta, Honda Brio, Tata Aria, Nissan Sunny, Renault Pulse, etc.

Sir it found 750 homes and its the new face lifted one that did find those homes. All cars sell for a few months after launch after which is the real test !
Also 750 cars in the hatchback market is a joke in India ! I don't think sales of less than 5000 units/month is good enough. The cars you have named are market duds i agree.

[msdivy]

Whats sad to know is that this car will fail like all other FIATs and thats a shame.

Very interesting comment and Fiat India marketing team must see this.

I feel current Punto design & style (seen first in 2005) is being by innumerable additions, deletions, facelifts & extensions. Fiat must launch next generation at the earliest.

What is with sub-4m cross? Fiat already has a better design - they must take Fiat Adventure (last sold in 2006), add diesel mill, new interiors and we have super looking hot crossover.

PS: Could somebody calculate the price difference between 3.99m cross & 4.01m cross? Is it that substantial that marketing insists on that?

[Rubbertramps]

Originally Posted by nik_kapur

Sir it found 750 homes and its the new face lifted one that did find those homes. All cars sell for a few months after launch after which is the real test !
Also 750 cars in the hatchback market is a joke in India ! I don't think sales of less than 5000 units/month is good enough. The cars you have named are market duds i agree.

I am sure there is another thread to discuss the car maker's failed attempts and suggestions. This thread is about Avventura and its better to focus on the same. And i think you made your point loud and clear. !

[CliffHanger]

Originally Posted by nik_kapur

Sir it found 750 homes and its the new face lifted one that did find those homes. All cars sell for a few months after launch after which is the real test !
Also 750 cars in the hatchback market is a joke in India ! I don't think sales of less than 5000 units/month is good enough. The cars you have named are market duds i agree.

The point I'm trying to make is people have not shunned Fiat entirely and neither they are worshiping any brand blindly. If a product is not good, people have neglected it, irrespective of the manufacturer.

Most of the manufacturers are running their businesses through one or two products, be it Ford, Renault, Skoda, Nissan, etc.

The market is changing rapidly, the compact SUV was the only segment in the affordable category that was untapped. With the launch of Ecosport, Duster, etc, even that space is getting fast filled with options.

With the initial Euphoria dying in the compact SUV segment and with growing options, those manufacturers will have to start facing the heat very soon.

The road ahead is very clear for all the second tier manufacturers, whatever segment they operate they need to:

- Offer cutting edge product
- Price very competitively
- Offer excellent design and space
- Offer excellent sales and service support

It will not matter anymore whether it is Fiat or Ford or Skoda or Renault, if the products are not competitive, they are not going to sell.

That said, the market is still very receptive to refreshing products in mundane segments. A lot of potential lies there, manufacturers like Fiat can think of bringing in the Chrysler 300, Viaggio, etc. These attempts will not boost the sales figures to tens of thousands, but will slowly build the brand to get a hold. That said, again it will never be easy, every product can spike growth in either ways.

Early birds such as Maruti and Hyundai started off with the revolution in Indian Auto industry and they took advantage of it and became market leaders. For all other manufacturers, it will always be a tough fight to stay in contention.

Going forward, technology will become a major game-changer. So, the fight should be there. Those who stay in forefront of technology developments will drive the market.

[PVPal]

Prices for Mumbai are now online (possibly for other cities too).



Off topic, the new Linea's website lists a 1.4 FIRE petrol priced at 7.23 lakhs Mumbai. I was under the impression that only the T-jet petrol is available.

[S.MJet]

Something seems to be wrong in price gap between Diesel & Petrol, Active & Dynamic variants.

Active petrol is Rs 93K cheaper than Active Diesel, whereas in Dynamic this difference is Rs 62K.

This should have been other way round considering 1.3 Dynamic has ABS which in not available in 1.4 FIRE Dynamic model.

[PVPal]

Originally Posted by S.MJet

Something seems to be wrong in price gap between Diesel & Petrol, Active & Dynamic variants.

Active petrol is Rs 93K cheaper than Active Diesel, whereas in Dynamic this difference is Rs 62K.

This should have been other way round considering 1.3 Dynamic has ABS which in not available in 1.4 FIRE Dynamic model.

I checked. Similar difference in New Delhi prices. The price difference between Dynamic and Active petrol variant is much higher than in the case of diesel.

I think its a marketing gimmick. Prices start at 5.99 lakhs; but few people buy that variant.

[Tushar]

Fiat has done a great job at making a stand out product, but redeeming novelty features like the spare wheel case lack practicality. The interior space isn't great and the "urban performance" isn't enthralling, so while the styling will drive people into showrooms, living with the car will need some getting used to.

[Blue Bird]

Firstly a great review by Cazy driver (Thanks a ton)

I am quite happy with the styling and looks and road presence , finally even my wifey is happy

Some queries:

The avventura top end is at 8.47 lacs .

Two other cars which come to my mind are Volkswagen Polo GT TDi and Ford Ecosport

While the GT is way ahead in terms of performance. Ride quality and Handling is totally Fiats dept , the ecosport is not far behind either and as an overall package it seems ahead (unsure)!!

I had been on the look out for the new Linea and personally I just wanted the Linea (was planning for the Tjet- Dynamic) I was waiting for the Avventura too to hit the market.

Now the Avventura seems just like the car that I had been waiting for (minus the Tjet )

To be frank I like the GTs Performance The Fiats ride quality and handling, The ford's accessories and gizmos plus looks.

Now I am scared That if I pick up the Avventura I wont be able to zip drive through the city (Feeling totally confused, hate the idea of being left behind at red lights!) , I have six months - should i wait for Fiat to put the Tjet in the Avventura? or a GT Tdi would be a viable option?

request for all of your expert opinions,

regards,
BB

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by Blue Bird

Feeling totally confused, hate the idea of being left behind at red lights!) , I have six months - should i wait for Fiat to put the Tjet in the Avventura? or a GT Tdi would be a viable option?

You should take long test drives of these cars. The new 1.5 GT is said to be a lot tamer than the old one as per the few reviews that have come out. I'm yet to drive it but was not too impressed by the extremely linear nature of the 90hp Polo. However, the GT should be the performance champion when it comes to the figures.

Coming to the Avventura- FIAT is a lazy company and could take their own sweet time getting the TJet to our market, IF at all they decide to launch it. The 1.3 90hp diesel is not so underpowered to be left behind at traffic lights. Infact, the tuning in the Avventura is the best FIAT has delivered so far for this engine. Motorbeam has put up the comparison timings against the Ecosport diesel and it's the Avventura that's actually ahead till 60kmph, although the Ford is about a second faster to reach 100 kmph.

Only you can decide which suits your requirements best. I suggest you take your wife along and go TD all these cars. No point waiting for the TJet now unless they make a solid announcement.

[samyakmodi]

I have my most serious doubts whether Fiat would plonk the T-Jet motor in the avventura as the T-Jet itself has been a market dud in our "kitna deti hai?" market.

Love the way the Avventura looks - but not sure how practical an upgrade it would be over my 90hp punto.
problems I have been facing with the service centre's inability to diagnose any problem is driving me up the walls - though still love the car the same way i did the first time i saw it.

on a different note - they definitely should come up with the projector headlamps and DRL in the top end variant - or maybe provide it as their official after market accessory.

they definitely should have re engineered the car's design if they really wanted to make an impact on the market as now it just looks like a slightly taller version of the punto evo where as they could have marketed it as a different product altogether.

with the increased space in the boot because of the spare wheel gone out - they could have increased the rear seat's legroom - as that is a major issue with the punto. I am 6+ and I know my car is best suited for at the most 3 people on board. had they improved the rear seat legroom even marginally i would have definitely upgraded to it - but i am now looking in the market for a better alternative. :(

[Blue Bird]

Originally Posted by Tushar

Fiat has done a great job at making a stand out product, but redeeming novelty features like the spare wheel case lack practicality. The interior space isn't great and the "urban performance" isn't enthralling, so while the styling will drive people into showrooms, living with the car will need some getting used to.

The interior space is as it used to be in the punto , afterall its not a SUV but just a cross(but I do agree to your point that they could have done something more about this) , as far as the urban performance is concerned Crazy driver has already mentioned that the 1.3 has been tuned to its best so i guess the performance would be slightly different (hoping!!)

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

You should take long test drives of these cars. The new 1.5 GT is said to be a lot tamer than the old one as per the few reviews that have come out. I'm yet to drive it but was not too impressed by the extremely linear nature of the 90hp Polo. However, the GT should be the performance champion when it comes to the figures.

Coming to the Avventura- FIAT is a lazy company and could take their own sweet time getting the TJet to our market, IF at all they decide to launch it. The 1.3 90hp diesel is not so underpowered to be left behind at traffic lights. Infact, the tuning in the Avventura is the best FIAT has delivered so far for this engine. Motorbeam has put up the comparison timings against the Ecosport diesel and it's the Avventura that's actually ahead till 60kmph, although the Ford is about a second faster to reach 100 kmph.

Only you can decide which suits your requirements best. I suggest you take your wife along and go TD all these cars. No point waiting for the TJet now unless they make a solid announcement.

Thanks again for the valuable input , I will be going abroad for 6 months, I wish Fiat comes out of hibernation and plonks the tjet into the avventura by then,
I had taken a loong TD of the Linea Tjet on all kinds of patches and when we came out of the car my friend named it the "Linea Thar" and SA said he had only read out to customers what the car could do till that day, had never seen anyone take it to such extremities !! - sorry for deviating.
(wil post the full version on the Linea thread!!)

So finally I love the Tjet motor and the Fiat build , now the Avventura is soo gorgeous too so my dear Fiat you have 6 months to put the tjet in there!!

However I will be taking a detailed TD of the 1.3 too as and when I get the opportunity , thanks once again!

[rattanw]

A great review. IMO the avventura looks like a compromise of sorts. It also clearly shows that Fiat have not yet given up hopes in the Indian market. Yet I believe that this car can become a comeback chance for Fiat provided they keep it interesting with more engine choices, variants and regular facelifts over the next few years and not rest with this one itself. Fiat also does need to invest significantly in their supply chain and service centers presence to offer buyers some peace of mind. Of course this cannot happen in a day or two, however the earnest efforts in that direction need to start ASAP.

Slightly off topic, it's interesting to see trail / terrain gauges (Digital compass, inclinometer and tilt meter) as standard. I always wanted to get a similar equipment for my car, just have no idea where to source it from. A quick Google search returned many links but none in India sadly. Any ideas, anyone.