[alpha1]

So is anyone following the new VW ad series boasting about the German engineering?
What a silly advertisement!
I just can't get why only the German vehicles have issues with the fuel quality, when countless other vehicles also fill the same fuel from the same petrol pumps.

[blacksport]

Originally Posted by humyum

Maruti does not need any kind of promotion, not from fan boys

Of course, they don't need any promotion, but that does not deter the faithfuls from trying to gather masses under their fold. The urge to convert people to their own way of thinking has existed ever since man started living in societies. There is nothing wrong in my opinion. But when tragedy strikes somebody, like when somebody's house is felled by a storm, what do you call a person who goes to the victim with his holy book and says, "next time, pray to my god"?

[saket77]

Originally Posted by blacksport

But when tragedy strikes somebody, like when somebody's house is felled by a storm, what do you call a person who goes to the victim with his holy book and says, "next time, pray to my god"?

No, just build a better house.

Gaurav has been trying to get his problem fixed for a long time but the incompetency of the manufacturer is such that they are not able to diagnose the problems in their own produce. In your previous post, you wrote that 'let him get his car fixed'. So, how is he supposed to get it fixed when the manufacturer itself has no idea about how to fix it? There is not much he can do when the maker of the car itself cannot pinpoint the problematic part.

The best one can do is to spread awareness about such practices of manufacturers with the masses so that the average joe does not suffer everytime due to such manufacturers. There is nothing wrong in comparing the services with other brands who offer much superior support even for much cheaper vehicles they sell. I cannot see a reason why some manufacturers cannot extend this support to their customers while they pay through their nose for it. And again, I cannot understand why people should not criticize them. To enable them go scot free?

And, if some people still want to buy their cars from such manufacturers, they are free to decide; it's their money. Most of the people (at least in this forum) who buy cars from such manufacturers are aware of the horror stories and the failure rate of these cars, so they are willing to take this calculated risk: nobody stops them (& cannot). Just that the decision made should be a well informed one.

Edit: And since a lot of comparison has been drawn w.r.t. Maruti, then kudos to them for giving first grade service since then when there was no real competition in the market, when they could have simply overlooked the service aspect as there was no seller except them with a total monopoly of the market.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by saket77

Edit: And since a lot of comparison has been drawn w.r.t. Maruti, then kudos to them for giving first grade service since then when there was no real competition in the market, when they could have simply overlooked the service aspect as there was no seller except them with a total monopoly of the market.

I don't know how many '++' should I give for this post!

Maruti in its initial days could have taken a lot advantage and looted the customers and give mediocre service as there no was no 'real' competition ever. Later stages, Hyundai emerged and did give jitters to Maruti so both are now neck-to-neck on this issue. Hats off to both companies and should be a learning lesson for VW and Skoda particularly.

Anurag.

[blacksport]

Originally Posted by saket77

No, just build a better house.

Gaurav has been trying to get his problem fixed for a long time but the incompetency of the manufacturer is such that they are not able to diagnose the problems in their own produce.

It happens with all brands. Our first car was a Maruti when there were not many choices around. It used to break down every few days, often on the middle of the road, because of a capacitor inside the distributor going kaput. The service centers would replace the capacitor, say everything is OK and send us away. Eventually, we started stocking the capacitors in the car. The dealers were not ready to look into the root cause. And then after the warranty was up, they diagnosed that there is a fault with the distributor and changed it out-of-warranty. Of course we had to pay for it.

Does the above mean that all Marutis are bad? It happens with every brand. Bad dealers exist everywhere.

Now, if Gaurav deserves a better brand, and a Japanese one, there are better ones than Maruti. Honda and Mitsubishi have better cars than the run-of-the-mill Marutis. Why don't we see Honda/Maruti evangelists trying to convert him?

[gaurav_chopra04]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

That's gonna take a while; after all, VW have premium & sturdy build!

I hope we are not in the car when the nuts fall apart

Originally Posted by Dry Ice

Have tweeted this link and shared on FB as well. The least we can do is to make sure they lose at least a 100 cars owing to this one.

Thank you for all your effort and help. Really Appreciated!

PS: Sell the junk and save some of the head/heartache. I know it won't be a financially prudent decision but what the heck! Peace of mind is important as well.
Good luck GC!

Thanks, I completely agree with you on peace of mind. For now the car is being used as third car. We are not even thinking about this car now, it stays till it drives, goes as soon as it stops!

Originally Posted by srishiva

The engine makes the rackety sound that all are familiar. The SA asked me to update the ECU which might solve the issue else fuel injectors have to be replaced costing 42K. There is no problem as such but its disconcerting to hear such things about a German quality car.

Get it changed if the car is under warranty, I am sure you now know what happens when the warranty expires..

Originally Posted by S_U_N

@Gaurav: Somehow I don't remember seeing this thread earlier. Not sure why.

When we have reliable machines, we try and stay away from any negativity..

I would suggest you get a second opinion about the car from a trusted workshop outside dealing with German cars.

This car from now will be going to my regular mechanic. It will no longer see VW service station and to be very honest, it doesnt need to. I trust my mechanic, he can fix almost everything on four wheels! This car doesnt have anything special that our cars dont have, its just unreliable, thats it! So, any mechanic with good knowledge/experience about cars can fix it! And yes, if it cant be fixed - it can definitely be sold!

Originally Posted by nakul0888

After all of this you will still see/read motoring magazines/shows praising these germans of their build quality and often speaking rubbish about them being built to last forever. Would be nice to take a printout of all the Team BHP German car issues threads and shove them down their throats to finally make these idiots stop!

Most motoring magazines get their revenues from OEMs and few key suppliers. They have no other option but to praise the car and cannot afford to write negative reviews about car/OEMs. 99% magazines tone down the negative aspect of the car and market the positive aspect of the car in their reviews.

But all that aside what I want to ask you is why you didn't consider taking VW to the court since it is obvious as daylight that this a lemon and hence needs to be replaced with a new car or at-least a new engine.

There is no point, none of us have time for going to court. Even if they give me a new car, or a new engine, it will still be VW Product. And we dont have any ego problem with VW. Because, if its about Anakh (A much more powerful punjabi word for EGO), then we can go to any extent to fight for our rights!

What if your Polo goes wrong again tomorrow? Are you again going to pay the bill?

As I said earlier, this car will be going to my mechanic in future. And, I'd rather pay him than paying the service center, because, he can definitely identify problems much more quickly than the VW mechanics. And then I will be paying him only a portion of what I am suppose to pay to VW.

Originally Posted by blacksport

Now, if Gaurav deserves a better brand, and a Japanese one, there are better ones than Maruti. Honda and Mitsubishi have better cars than the run-of-the-mill Marutis. Why don't we see Honda/Maruti evangelists trying to convert him?

Thats because my personal car is a Mitsubishi Cedia and we also have a Honda Civic at Home. No one can convert me into Japanese, or German, or British, or Italian, or American customer.

Let me put it this way, I will always have a Mitsubishi (japanese) in my garage and I want to own a BMW (German) in near future despite this tiff with VW (German Again).

So please Chill.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by gaurav_chopra04

This car from now will be going to my regular mechanic. It will no longer see VW service station

Great decision GC! On the technology front the Polo you own is simple minus the gadetary to confuse mechanics.

Shame on VW.

Originally Posted by gaurav_chopra04

And yes, if it cant be fixed - it can definitely be sold!

If you permit, I want to rephrase this statement:

And yes, if it can be fixed - it can definitely be sold!

Sell it off on OLX or Quickr.

Anurag.

[humyum]

Originally Posted by blacksport

Of course, they don't need any promotion, but that does not deter the faithfuls from trying to gather masses under their fold. The urge to convert people to their own way of thinking has existed ever since man started living in societies. There is nothing wrong in my opinion. But when tragedy strikes somebody, like when somebody's house is felled by a storm, what do you call a person who goes to the victim with his holy book and says, "next time, pray to my god"?

To compare the service practices of one manufacturer who sells 50 times more cars than VW does is called conversationalist mentality ? I just stated the manufacturing standards of a company which in spite of selling so many more cars than VW can keep all its customers happy.

Its called spreading awareness, so that whoever reads a thread like this on teambhp, instantly knows what he is getting himself into.

What difference from the monetary point of view does it make to me if a fellow human buys a Maruti or a Scania, but as a humanist, I would not want someone spending their hard earned money to have a mental torture with service stations because of the wrong choice he made while going for a VW/Skoda. Pointing that out is all I am doing, you are free to make your own conclusions

Originally Posted by saket77

Edit: And since a lot of comparison has been drawn w.r.t. Maruti, then kudos to them for giving first grade service since then when there was no real competition in the market, when they could have simply overlooked the service aspect as there was no seller except them with a total monopoly of the market.

Sums everything up.

Originally Posted by blacksport

It happens with all brands. Our first car was a Maruti when there were not many choices around. It used to break down every few days, often on the middle of the road, because of a capacitor inside the distributor going kaput. The service centers would replace the capacitor, say everything is OK and send us away. Eventually, we started stocking the capacitors in the car. The dealers were not ready to look into the root cause. And then after the warranty was up, they diagnosed that there is a fault with the distributor and changed it out-of-warranty. Of course we had to pay for it.

Does the above mean that all Marutis are bad? It happens with every brand. Bad dealers exist everywhere.

Now, if Gaurav deserves a better brand, and a Japanese one, there are better ones than Maruti. Honda and Mitsubishi have better cars than the run-of-the-mill Marutis. Why don't we see Honda/Maruti evangelists trying to convert him?

Owned a Maruti 800 for 10 years and a lakh + kilometers. In the 9th year of the car with it being 98 thousand kilometers on the odo, the brakes of the car felt weak, gave it to Spectra Ghatkopar West complaining the same. He replaced the brake pads and gave me back the car saying 'All good'. I test drove it and the brakes felt exactly the same as they did when I gave him the car.

Called the Maruti Customer care helpline the same day, got a feedback call the next day with an appointment fixed by Maruti Delhi themselves at Ravi Automobiles Ghatkopar East which is also a Maruti Authorized service station to get my car looked at again.

Every component in the brake opened and checked. Rear brake drums had adjusting nuts to move the brake calipers towards the drums as the calipers wear out, they were faulty and hence replaced, brake fluid had lot of air in them, replaced. brake discs had worn out beyond their service limit, they were replaced. All of this gave me a bill of 4.5 thousand that time, with labour, vat bla bla. You know what Maruti did ? Just for the trouble I faced at Spectra, waived off the entire Bill at Ravi Automobiles and made Spectra send me free service coupon as compensation.

All this for a 9 year old, touching a lakh km, puny little Maruti 800.

Maruti won a customer for my entire 7 lives.

This is called SERVICE and this is how a customer is treated.

I am sure GC would have loved it if VW really put their hearts and mind in making sure his car was upto the mark everytime he got it to them with some problems.

[saket77]

Originally Posted by humyum

This is called SERVICE and this is how a customer is treated.

Just a verbal complaint to regional Maruti office at my place about a wrong windshield fitted in my car after the initial verbal spat with Maruti ASC which refused to owe up its mistake (a tempered glass instead of laminated one). Just brought this to the notice of Maruti and the dealer & the insurance surveyor, both called me up within an hour, took my car to the same ASC and laminated windshield was fixed. Not a single question asked after that. The expression on the face of the ASC owner was enough to show that he was skinned by Maruti.

So, the fact in nutshell is that the service dealerships may be out to make a quick buck and may try a trick under its sleeve on you, but at least there is a responsible 'parent' watching it. You just bring things to their notice and if found that something unjustified/ unethical has been done, they make corrections immediately. That's what wins the trust.

Regarding Honda, they are ultimate reliable machines. I have not owned a Honda car as yet, but my next car will be a Honda (or if Maruti brings a good replacement to the good old SX4). Then I can provide details of their service standards. But be assured, be it Honda, Maruti or VW, I have the heart to call a spade a spade, based on the actual service received and not on past reputation or being one of Japanese or European origin.

And dear Blacksport, if you have visited the motorbikes section, then you will notice that I have been equivocal of Honda's poor service of 2 wheelers on multiple occasions. And surely Honda 2 wheelers is the same Japanese manufacturer which has a good reputation of 4 wheeler service standards. Plus I own a Honda bike too, hence both your concerns of promoting a brand I have plus having soft corner for Japanese manufacturers are addressed, as neither is the case.

Also, I heaped on praises on the same VW when it made airbags mandatory on all its cars after many cars including theirs fared badly in crash tests. That was a very respectable move. & if VW acts responsibly in this case too, I will be the first one to shower them with as many praises they deserve.

[tbppjpr]

Originally Posted by humyum

To compare the service practices of one manufacturer who sells 50 times more cars than VW ...
....
....
....

All this for a 9 year old, touching a lakh km, puny little Maruti 800.

Maruti won a customer for my entire 7 lives.

This is called SERVICE and this is how a customer is treated.

You contact the company and the service station gets scared to loose out reputation, also because there is competition between many service stations of the same company at same place which is non-existent in case of dealerships of companies selling cars in little numbers.

I feel the companies like VW are being dominated/threatened by the small number of dealerships. Look at the service/labor charges of the services provided at the VW dealerships, they are exorbitant. That whole money goes in the pockets of the dealership.

Most of the cities have only single service station of VAG, see the fate of those customers, they are left with option of banging their heads with single dealership/workshop. Existing service stations are overcrowded. Dealers don't hire competitive technicians just to save money despite of charging exorbitant money for the services.

Okay, no problem, charge as much as you want but atleast look at the standards of the services you are providing. If the standard is also as high as the money you charge then its justified but unfortunately thats not the case in real, rather sometimes service standards are poorer then good roadside garages.

We have seen some good examples also about service standards of the VW but consistency is not there through out the country. There are also examples when fed up customer approached company and issues got resolved so it also can't be said that company doesn't care about better service standards.

Looking at the current state of service standards in VAG India, I strongly feel that best thing can only be to open COCO (company owned company operated) service stations in atleast all capitals of all states. So that customers fed up with private dealers atleast have some hope of getting issues resolved before going with the last option like having fights.

Don't forget the Polo is the only car which has passed India oriented crash test just because company cared about the results and immediately equipped the Polo's base model with the airbags which was the only shortcoming to pass the test. Now others will follow what VW did.

Seeing at this airbag installation example, company looks eager to adapt what looks unconventional to retain their reputation then why not the unconventional service stations? Maybe that opens up gates for the new era in the Indian automobile scene. We say Maruti is best but there are problems with Maruti's services also. If such COCO start coming then that will be good for end customers, be it of any company.

I don't say the all changes can be done overnight but if company atleast seriously thinks about opening the COCO service stations then thats the only good reward to the VAG customers can be in return of threads like this.

[diffsoft]

A quick glance at the Volkswagen India twitter handle has the following tweet @ 2 per day

"@volkswagenindia: @xxx We regret to learn of your experience with us. Please get in touch at 1800 209 0909 or at customer.care@volkswagen.co.in."

Enjoy the engineering while suffering our service. Das Auto. Makes me feel they should stop saying Das Auto, because it defames Mr Das and his auto.

Cheers,

[srs_shetty87]

Things like these do happen to all the brands.
But the point is, why does it happen so often for the VAG group cars which has less than 2% market share in new sales.
Doesn't this ring a bell?
It's not that their products are not good, just that the company has adopted a policy of shut ears to complaints.
If the dealership or the company was open to accepting complaints people would not resort to the social media and the likes of Maruti and Hyundai know this very well and though they too, do have problems, it never gets blown to this stage.

[raghav135]

Gaurav, hope that issues with your polo is a think of the past.

Started test-driving for my next car, and Vento TSI was one of my favorites. After reading this, I must say I am not brave enough to venture into buying one.

[gasolean]

Hi Team BHP,

Reading through this post made my blood boil, and i could not help but post a reply. This is my first post on this forum, and I would like to thank everybody for this opportunity.

I am glad to have dodged the VW bullet a few months back. I was looking for a used car and a 2010 polo 1.2 for 3.4L seemed like a good deal. I test drove a couple of hatches and found the polo to be the best. Nearly paid the amount when I was warned against VW by my father. I dropped the plan immediately. A month later I picked up an 08 fiesta zxi 1.6, for 2.5L, and boy am I a happy customer.

Nevertheless, I hate to be negative on my first post, but noticed that everybody seems to be favoring selling the car. Will the car be sold after informing prospective buyers about the known issues? I doubt anybody other than scrap dealers would be willing to buy. If the deal is closed by keeping the poor second owner in the dark, how are we better than VW? How can we criticize VW with a a straight face and the next moment, do something equally unethical?

I would never knowingly sell a lemon to anyone. I would rather suffer financial loss.

Cheers!
Debdatta Basu

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by gasolean

If the deal is closed by keeping the poor second owner in the dark, how are we better than VW? How can we criticize VW with a a straight face and the next moment, do something equally unethical?

I would never knowingly sell a lemon to anyone. I would rather suffer financial loss.

We are giving Gaurav two options:

a) Repair the car and check it thoroughly. IF NO problems repeat sell the car after the new owner knows

or

b) Repair the car and check it thoroughly. IF NO problems repeat keep the car for himself.

Keeping the new owner in dark just save some thousands is cheap mentality and I know we Team-BHPians wont do such tricks.

Anurag.