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Old 20th January 2014, 17:20   #16
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

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Originally Posted by Maverick1977 View Post
I am quite surprised to read every one's comments here. We might be a miniscule power hungry community but remember that one of the most important thing that has made Maruti what it is today is Mileage.
That is correct, but when they introduce a new product, its better exhibited in its best form and later produced in a practical form. Hence, they could have done the detuning part once the car with the engine rolled out of the production line. That will get a product more attention than giving a dull image in the beginning and later improving specs. When they speak about a new product I think its fair to expect to see the engines real capablities. When Tata took on the 25kmpl mileage campaign, did it really be a hit? No. Taxi market still prefers the TDi version which is easier to troubleshoot.
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Old 20th January 2014, 17:21   #17
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

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Originally Posted by TheARUN View Post
First things first, I am extremely happy that Tata is putting up a fight and not lying down and dying like Premier or Hindustan Motors. This is not a giant leap for Tata motors, I see it more like a small step in the right direction. Just competing with the Koreans and Japanese who are masters of small petrols is applaudable, hope Tata get everything right this time. I think they went for the specs based on low cost of production and longevity, i.e ability to match Bharat V, VII etc pollution norms
Agree with your post. However, at times, Tata looks like trying too desperately and the major problem is that they rarely get things right at the first shot. This does not do any good to buyer's confidence in Tata products when you confuse the buyer with 10-12 identical products.

The way PAL & HM died a slow but sure death was disgusting to say the least. No innovation and selling the same model & overall product for almost 3-4 decades. Even they did not pay heed when Maruti came threatening on their doors. They just continued with the same old product. Was handed over the punishment soon. Tata is a group too big and with too many resources to go down like them and is really determined to make the amends. Just that they are not able to get the pulse right for some reason or the other.

Last edited by saket77 : 20th January 2014 at 17:36.
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Old 20th January 2014, 17:32   #18
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

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Originally Posted by audioholic View Post
[/b]

I expected three digit figures for the max power. Quite disappointing.
Guys, there's a catch before we all end up disappointing. This turbocharged unit has no word of whether it has VVT or not! If its a combination of VVT, Turbocharger and Direct injection - bam! anyone is bound to think of a 3-digit power spec. This one comes with PFI too I guess. So this 85PS out of a turbo-kitted petrol is just like a 1.2 of a Swift or the previous Jazz that had its VVT in doing its job similarly churning out ~87-90 PS. So IMO, give or take, they've landed up in a spec that is on par with its competitors. Although, trading off turbocharger for VVT, I believe this engine would take a car a little more miles than its competitors considering a turbocharger would begin its action at around 2k RPM, more charge of COMPRESSED air than a corresponding VVT would.

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Originally Posted by RavenAvi View Post
Hats off to Tata for being the pioneer in launching India's first ever in-house developed turbocharged petrol engine, in the form of the 1.2 Liter Revotron.
Am sorry, I was not aware of this So where were the previous Tata petrols engineered if it wasn't in-house?

Last edited by vvijay : 20th January 2014 at 17:35.
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Old 20th January 2014, 17:34   #19
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

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Originally Posted by Ph03nix View Post
...However this block does not seem all that impressive. Honda makes more power out of a NA 1.2 engine. So does maruti if I am not wrong.

The number of torque's does seem to be slightly higher than a NA engine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioholic View Post
....The 1.2K series pulls out equal power even if its naturally aspirated. And the Jazz had a 90bhp 1.2 if I am not wrong. I am sure it was >85bhp at least. So does hyundai, in their NA 1.2...
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Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
85PS from a turbo petrol 1.2 is disappointing!

85 PS is almost what maruti manages with the 1.2L K series engine and lower than Honda's 1.2L engine in Amaze, Brio and Jazz.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gemi_kk View Post
...Generating 85 PS from 1.2 Turbo charged petrol motor is nothing. The N/A swift engine 1.2K produces 90 bhp i think...
How much more would you want for a Vista anyway!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nilesh5417 View Post
Is 85PS really the max Tata will produce from this engine? What will prevent it from running this engine in various states of tuning with higher-lower power? I expect multiple states of tune later if not today.
I for one, will be more than happy if this unit proves an extremely reliable for atleast 1.5L kms. And I believe TATA wants to test the waters with the Vista before introducing in the newer generation vehicles. I say it's a smart move. Vista anyway doesn't have a great reputation and even if this engine proves to be bad, they would NOT lose anything.

But the question is, how many are going to buy this engine in Vista for a real life sampling before TATA understands and irons out the issues before using in the Falcon 4!

Last edited by swiftnfurious : 20th January 2014 at 17:45.
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Old 20th January 2014, 17:39   #20
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

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Originally Posted by vvijay View Post
Am sorry, I was not aware of this So where were the previous Tata petrols engineered if it wasn't in-house?

I see he has specified first ever in-house developed turbocharged petrol engine.
Hope this clears the air.
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Old 20th January 2014, 17:58   #21
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

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Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
How much more would you want for a Vista anyway!

But the question is, how many are going to buy this engine in Vista for a real life sampling before TATA understands and irons out the issues before using in the Falcon 4!


As usual, they will start with the 85ps version. Then try to introduce a 'sport' version with 100bhp on tap. But looking at the mere number of petrol Tata cars sold, will this really have an effect? When the mileage figures for the diesel itself didnt help much, we have to wait and watch what the petrol can do.
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Old 20th January 2014, 18:05   #22
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

Congratulataions TATA. Now its time to package this engine with a car which is not resembling any of your indi series

1.2 ltr turbo charged and 85bhp sounds bit less for my calculations. Swift K12 engine with VVT develops similar power without the need for turbo charger.


Plus the turbo charger means that there is even more lag before the 1.7K RPM isnt it ?

Somehow this may not go well inside those heavy TATA cars !! But a good move by Indian auto maker. Proud of you
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Old 20th January 2014, 18:06   #23
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

Official Specs sheet:

Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine-slide1638.jpg


Official Press Release:

Quote:
Tata Motors launches 'REVOTRON' - All New Family of Next Generation Petrol Engines

- Disruptive Petrol Engine Technology to Revolutionize the Auto Industry -


Revolution in Performance
  • Turbocharged Multi-Point Fuel Injected (MPFi) Engine delivering 85 PS @ 5000 RPM and 140 NM @ 1750-3500 RPM
  • Multi-drive mode for better throttle response
  • Advanced catalytic converter reducing toxic emissions

Revolution in Refinement
  • Light weight and powerful
  • Extremely silent engine
  • Drive by wire technology for enhanced drive experience
  • Low friction crank case for minimised NVH
  • Smart Electronic Control Unit for precise control

Revolution in Economy
  • Low weight but high strength for a long lasting engine with Low maintenance
  • 8-Hole fuel injector for efficient combustion
  • Multi-drive mode for maximum fuel efficiency
Tata Motors today announced the launch of the REVOTRON Series, the next - generation Petrol engine family that will power its future models in the passenger vehicle market. The company unveiled the first petrol engine from its REVOTRON series - the Turbocharged Intercooled Multi-point Fuel Injected (MPFi) Petrol Engine, REVOTRON 1.2T.
The REVOTRON Series has been designed based on extensive feedback from car owners, car enthusiasts and expert drivers from across the globe; observing their driving habits followed by extensive testing in gruelling climatic conditions in India as well as in countries like the UK and Korea.
The REVOTRON Series has been developed by Tata Motors with inputs from renowned global players in the area of combustion, boosting, friction and calibration, to deliver class-leading performance. Tata Motors also worked closely with global engine consultant AVL (Austria) and key technology partners like Bosch, Honeywell, Mahle and INA to bring in the latest technology for the new engine series. REVOTRON 1.2T has been tested for global standards along with a testing car by TEnergy of Korea to ensure that the engine performance is best-in-class.
The engine has been manufactured to be light on weight and low on friction, delivering high performance and fuel economy.The REVOTRON series will include 3-and 4-cylinder petrol engines to offer superior performance as well as high fuel efficiency to our customers.

Announcing the launch, Mr. Ranjit Yadav, President, Passenger Vehicle Business Unit said, "With the launch of REVOTRON 1.2T, Tata Motors passenger vehicles business is making a strategic shift towards a more complete portfolio. The name itself, an amalgamation of Revolution and the French word "tronel", meaning "balance", conveys the essence of this engine brand that uses key technological advances to revolutionize and balance great driving maneuverability, without compromising on power or fuel efficiency. We are enhancing our portfolio with the next generation petrol engines - REVOTRON series".

The REVOTRON 1.2T has been engineered to deliver optimum balance of power, performance and fuel economy. Developed using a range of eco-friendly and future-oriented technologies,the next-generation petrol engine incorporates latest know-how like multi-drive modes,allowing the best of economy and driving pleasure. The Advance Engine Management Systems (AMS) provides a digitally precise control for vehicle performance and emissions and offers the design of reciprocating components to ensure the best out of every drop of fuel.
With enhanced customer benefits for the best driving experience, the REVOTRON series is therefore positioned to be a revolution in Performance, Refinement and Economy, the three pillars of the REVOTRON series.
Revolution in Performance - The engine is equipped with a HighBoost Turbo-Charger delivering 85PS @ 5000 RPM & 140 Nm @ 1750-3500 RPM. The modern water-cooled turbo-charger, with its low inertia wheel, provides a faster response for a flat, seamless segment-highest torque density, which is kicked in at the lowest RPM and delivered over a wide range of revolutions, feeding the vehicle with raw power continuously.It’s multi-drive mode,coupled with a superior throttle response, advanced catalytic converter with reduced Toxic Emissions and Smart ECU (Electronic Control Unit) with various innovative strategies, ensure a superlative performance on Indian roads.
Revolution in Refinement - The engine is light-weight and powerful, with a stiffened crankcase that minimizes Noise, Vibration and Harshness (NVH) for a refined output. The engine is refined with tuned intake and exhaust system for improved combustion noise that is further reduced with silent-steel oil pan and lower auxiliary system noise. Enhanced with Smart ECU for precise control, the engine is powered by wire technology for a smooth and responsive drive experience.
Revolution in Economy - The engine comes with another segment-first - a selectable multi-drive mode and uses low viscosity, fuel efficient engine oil. An optimised water-jacket and head gasket, using Computational Fluid Dynamics (CFD) technology,ensures efficient combustion and reduces thermal inertia. In addition, the engine has been incorporated with an 8-hole fuel injector for superior efficiency and assisted by innovative calibration strategies.
http://www.tatamotors.com/media/pres...ses.php?id=919

Last edited by RavenAvi : 20th January 2014 at 18:07.
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Old 20th January 2014, 18:35   #24
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

This does not look bad at all.

1) Its evident from block details that an old block has been used after reinforcements to take higher stress. Nothing wrong in that IMO. It would atleast be a bit more silent I hope.

2) The turbo is mild turbo considering specific output which does not better the NA jap/korean motors. This, IMO, is best use of turbo for our conditions. Not very high stress for components, good torque and mid-range are biggest benefits of mild turbo. The torque will be really helpful and if coupled with well worked out gearing, can be very good MT car.

3) Its 8V SOHC. Old, or may, dated. But the advantages are low maintenance and cheaper maintenance. Even before that, its less components to fail in the first place. Simplicity in this case really helps in the long run.

Either the block is too old and has reached its limit for further enhancing or Tata is playing safe with it first petrol turbo, in any case, the effort is what we can appreciate. The application of turbo is executed in very intelligent way, not outright power but making more useable ( and available ) torque.

Lets hope it gets high rating for reliability and FE along with very controlled NVH.
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Old 20th January 2014, 18:47   #25
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

Good work Tata.

I am sure the present technical specifications are to play safe wherein the output will be available through a larger band and thus the engine is essentially a performer for the city driving conditions and will be equally fuel efficient.

I am sure Tata will bring it in different states of tune in due course for different market segments.

The only thing that I expect from Tata's is to provide good quality product to Indian buyers without much delay. Such engine is need of hour looking at the decreased price gap between petrol and diesel.

Also, the present lineup of petrol engines in Tata stable has nothing to talk about. Quite poor in terms of refinement and performance.

I am very happy that Tata's are fighting back.
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Old 20th January 2014, 18:49   #26
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

They even uploaded a video presenting the new engine :

They're definitely on to something. I feel they could've tuned it to 105PS, but changed it to 85PS with a better torque curve.

Or have they extracted their favorite FE figure from it? Honestly, anything >15 would be great to achieve compared to what Maruti's K-Series delivers.

THANK GOD its a water-cooled turbo charger. It really irritates me when people immediately switch off my Linea mjd as soon as they stop. I'm like "WAIT!!!" but its always too late by then.

Last edited by GrammarNazi : 20th January 2014 at 19:07. Reason: Water cooled turbo
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Old 20th January 2014, 18:52   #27
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

I see that many people are complaining about 85PS being just on par with others (Swift, Brio,Jazz,etc)
However, I feel that the major advantage of this Turbocharged engine is the Torque of 140 NM available across the 1750-3500 RPM range. No other petrol hatch (leaving out Polo GT) such a wide torque spread. To put it in perspective, the New Honda City has a torque rating of 145 NM @ 4600rpm.
I think Tata has gone in for a very conservative tune in the interests of the fuel efficiency rating.


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Old 20th January 2014, 19:03   #28
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

complex engine + tata R&D+ Tata QC + Tata A.S.S = a disaster waiting to happen. I hope this one fares better than the ill fated dicor!
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Old 20th January 2014, 19:09   #29
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Default re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by gemi_kk View Post
i think, this is the same Vista petrol engine slightly modded. Even Vista engine used to produce the same power levels.
Vista petrol engine, Safire is from FIAT. Not TATA's
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Old 20th January 2014, 19:19   #30
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Smile re: Tata Motors introduces 1.2L turbo-petrol Revotron engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
This does not look bad at all.

Its 8V SOHC. Old, or may, dated. But the advantages are low maintenance and cheaper maintenance. Even before that, its less components to fail in the first place. Simplicity in this case really helps in the long run.

Either the block is too old and has reached its limit for further enhancing or Tata is playing safe with it first petrol turbo, in any case, the effort is what we can appreciate. The application of turbo is executed in very intelligent way, not outright power but making more useable ( and available ) torque.

Lets hope it gets high rating for reliability and FE along with very controlled NVH.
I agree with you my friend .we must congratulate Tata motors for the very first Indian made turbo petrol . The SOHC + Turbo design conveys what tata is eyeing . They are looking for those extra kilometer for each drop of fuel yet reliable power plant which is a breeze in the city and peppy enough in the high ways . Kudos Tata

Last edited by justin.das : 20th January 2014 at 19:21.
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