[BlackPearl]

Originally Posted by Avigo71

Samwagon, does this mean that all fix flanges will have that humming vibration at 80-100 kmph ? So when I ask "is fixed flange a faulty system" , my question is not aimed at its performance in off-roading, it's asking whether it's always going to be "faulty" at highway cruising speeds.

My Bolero has a fixed flange and I do not get any humming sound or maybe the DI clatter is so much that I cannot hear it.

[desertfox]

To start with Dhabhar Bhai, I need to :

Shift the rear license plate on the rear bumper
Get rid of the running sidebards and use a tubular one available at Bibras in Gurgaon.
Order fabrication of bash plates and skid plates for protectiong radiator bottom, chamber sump, gear box bottom, fuel tank and low hanging catylitic convertor.

My nephew took one of the Thars to Karol Bagh auto street and got a set of alloy wheels of a brand called GT fitted. The newer of the two Thars.

Device options for proper bolted recovery hooks / eyelets not these OE pajama ka nara type welded ones currently from the factory

I have sent him to buy two central consoles from Bimbra today.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by desertfox

I need to:

1. Shift the rear license plate on the rear bumper.
2. Get rid of the running sidebards and use a tubular ones.
3. Order fabrication of bash plates and skid plates for protectiong radiator bottom, chamber sump, gear box bottom, fuel tank and low hanging catylitic convertor.
4. My nephew took one of the Thars to Karol Bagh auto street and got a set of alloy wheels of a brand called GT fitted. The newer of the two Thars.
5. Device options for proper bolted recovery hooks / eyelets not these OE pajama ka nara type welded ones currently from the factory.

Dear Shahidbhai - my replies are as follows:

1. The rear bumpers are fitted to meet regulatory requirements. Please use army CJ3B spring steel bumperettes, they will accentuate and enhance the JEEP looks!
2. OK, it is a matter of personal choice. I will use nothing there in my vehicle!
3. For the fuel tank, please buy one additional Bolero fuel tank protection plate and use two of them instead of one. I did the same thing for AKC / EXAMM! Now there is no drain plug also, it is very easy to fit two plates. You need not do anything to protect the radiator, it is above the chassis cross member. For sump, please do same as for fuel tank. For transfer case only, you may need to fabricate a separate part. For hard core off-roading, production exhaust system routing will not work. Please see the South Africa event photographs for details. So simple yaar! .
4. OK, it is a matter of personal choice. I will use production wheels only in my vehicle, so as not to deviate the scrub radius.
5. These parts are fitted to meet regulatory requirements. Please determine the section modulus very carefully, otherwise they will break when you need them the most (during winching etc). I don't mind even if they break, they must not affect the chassis.

Dear all - please read my comments on point no 3 above very carefully. Please do not go overboard on such things, although you will be tempted by various agencies (including your thoughts) to do so. If you think calmly, you will get simple solutions for most of your requirements. See the solution for the fuel tank shield, it is so simple, but somebody must think in a simple way naa? .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[desertfox]

SIr,
What about the Mahindra Scorpio's alloy wheels that are offered from dealerships, I have the same in my scorpio as well - will this also deviate the scrub radius ?

I am OK with the steel rims supplied as O/E and now that I have 5 x spares available with me.

I am not in a hurry will carry out all this gradually.

One question comes to mind Dhabhar Bhai,

When a lifestyle vehicle like Thar was being designed why did you lift off the outdated MM540/550 rib and make the soft top so difficult to dismantle ?

Today there are private players who fabricate Wrangler like tubes with polythrene cladding and make such nice soft tops for a mere Rs. 19,000.

It is so difficult to remove and reinstall the soft top. I am sure there would be many obliging vendors for you in Pune / Nasik who would have delivered to you a simpler hard top.

All these rods, side plates, central plates, bolts had to go away.

What stopped you from doing this ? You did undertake a canopy material improvement project and an FRP sheet in the front roof section for better A/C insulation.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by desertfox

1. What about the Mahindra Scorpio's alloy wheels that are offered from dealerships, I have the same in my scorpio as well - will this also deviate the scrub radius?

2. When a lifestyle vehicle like Thar was being designed why did you lift off the outdated MM540/550 rib and make the soft top so difficult to dismantle?
Today there are private players who fabricate Wrangler like tubes with polythrene cladding and make such nice soft tops for a mere Rs.19,000. It is so difficult to remove and reinstall the soft top. I am sure there would be many obliging vendors for you in Pune / Nasik who would have delivered to you a simpler hard top. All these rods, side plates, central plates, bolts had to go away. What stopped you from doing this? You did undertake a canopy material improvement project and an FRP sheet in the front roof section for better A/C insulation.

Dear Shahidbhai - as usual, my replies are as follows. Please prepare yourself to be surprised (if you were not already!).

1. Scorpio factory fitted alloy wheels have same offset of +55mm as steel wheels. Therefore, scrub radius is not deviated. You can use these alloy wheels in the Thar but please use corresponding wheel nuts also as per OE part number, as the assembly profile of the wheel / nut interface is straight for alloy wheels and spherical for steel wheels. If you use incorrect nuts, the wheel seat profile will get damaged, you will get wobbling / wandering / high steering effort / in the worst case, the wheel will come out!

2. Yes, I could have merrily done everything that you suggest. I had this alternative. "Everybody" would have been very happy and I would have got lots of accolades, but the vehicle would not have come into production and you would not have been able to buy it from the showroom. So, forget it!

I wonder, how many times I should tell, but as I have infinite patience, I am telling this for the "nth" time. I hope this is the last time:

For getting "M1 category" homologation (white number plate), making the vehicle a 7 seater is a must. Do you know that by law you need 381 mm (15 inches) of seat space per person for homologation? Do you know that headroom is a homologated dimension? Does this not determine canopy boundary dimensions? Full partition between the driver and other occupants is not allowed by law. Soft top is not difficult to dismantle, all you need is a 10mm size socket spanner, a screwdriver and a half hour of peaceful working time. The kind of money garages are charging to do this work, I would not mind taking up this up as an alternate profession (just kidding)!

.

This project was not a flight of fancy. I did what was required to be done to enable this thing to be sold in our country as per law. It's selling out there, putting some of the so-called "mainstream" vehicles behind it in terms of volume!

I wanted the vehicle in production, I got it.
I wanted it to look like JEEP, I got it.
It makes me quietly smile whenever I see it, I got it.
I wanted to see it becoming mainstream, I got it.
I wanted to see it run and turn heads, ruling the road / off-road, I got it.
Achieving these results gives me a feeling of accomplishment, confidence, joy, satisfaction and finally, peace. This feeling is beyond description.

I got what I wanted. Isn't this what life is all about? .

Please accept my best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[desertfox]

Sir,
I understand the hardships you have faced.
I also now understand why the passenger side seat is longer than the driver side rear seat restricting the slide.

Everyone has to buy a Thar first in its showroom element and then work on modifications to suit individual tastes.

How did you manage to pass out the high mounted brake light clause ? Thars dont have one.

[desertfox]

Went off roading in the night on both Saturday Dec 21 and Sunday Dec 22 to the same place near Gurgaon ( about 25 Km from here ).

Terrain was slush, ploughed fields some open jungle glades, some scrub.

Nothing very difficult.

But both nights some scrub, piece of wood or mud particle / small stone entered the front brake disk area of the Thar and started making ugly squeaking noises.

Is there a fault here ?

This should not happen in a purpose designed off road vehicle.

Shall i get the front wheels opened and cleaned up at the ASC.

Problem is they will make it into a half day of painful waiting to do just this much.

[r_nairtvm]

Originally Posted by desertfox

More Canopy pictures from either side
--------------------------------------------------------------------

What is Intrepid Explorer - The name :Twelve years ago in 1999 this was the name conjoured up my Janbaz Ali Khan, an ex British army map reader and the founder of self drive off road events in Dubai, the Gulf News Fun Drives.

There were two Intrepid Explorers, IE 1 was a Landcruiser 80 series owned by Jum and IE 2 was a Landcruiser 90 Series Prado LWB which I had. Jum had arranged for couple of spare wheel covers that we used to sport, marching into the deep deserts on route exploration trips and Marshal run trips for these fun drives or the UAE Desert challenge rally.

Hi Shahid Bhai,

Just stumbled up on your thread. Glad you are putting up gamely with the travails of a jeep ownsership in India

You must be aware that the GNFD is shcduled for 10th Jan 2014. Currently Marshall runs have started. Whether is great with some slight showers over last weekend.

Best Regards & Drive Safe

Ram

[manveet]

Originally Posted by desertfox

Went off roading in the night on both Saturday Dec 21 and Sunday Dec 22 to the same place near Gurgaon ( about 25 Km from here ).

Terrain was slush, ploughed fields some open jungle glades, some scrub.

Nothing very difficult.

But both nights some scrub, piece of wood or mud particle / small stone entered the front brake disk area of the Thar and started making ugly squeaking noises.

Is there a fault here ?

This should not happen in a purpose designed off road vehicle.

Shall i get the front wheels opened and cleaned up at the ASC.

Problem is they will make it into a half day of painful waiting to do just this much.

Have had the same problem twice in the past. Try getting it done by your driver or something, else add this item to your post OTR Mahindra S.C. checklist.

[Tejas@perioimpl]

Try driving in reverse for a bit with left-right steering inputs and stomping on the brakes intermittently. Have dislodged small pebbles in this way in my classic. Has worked 6 out of 10 times.

[samwagon]

Originally Posted by desertfox

Sir,
I understand the hardships you have faced.
I also now understand why the passenger side seat is longer than the driver side rear seat restricting the slide.

Everyone has to buy a Thar first in its showroom element and then work on modifications to suit individual tastes.

How did you manage to pass out the high mounted brake light clause ? Thars don't have one.

The clause is not applicable for soft top vehicles. And BTW i am glad for getting a 4x4 jeep in the showroom in the first place. The whole experience of re-building one from army disposal vehicles was not a pleasant one, at least for me. So a big Thanks to Dhabhar Sir.

[desertfox]

Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl

Try driving in reverse for a bit with left-right steering inputs and stomping on the brakes intermittently. Have dislodged small pebbles in this way in my classic. Has worked 6 out of 10 times.

Obviously I tried all that and it did not solve solve the problem.

Not me alone, the passenger sitting next to me was an off roader with over 30 years of experience in this terrain.

He had brought a Ford Eco Sport with him and left it in the village base camp.

[desertfox]

Went off roading in the Thar again yesterday, Sunday, Dec 29.

The terrain was rural tracks, dusty tracks, mud tracks and slush, nothing very difficult at all.

This was in Jhajjhar and Pataudi area of Haryana about 50 km from here in Gurgaon.

The noise from the front wheels was peristent throughout the day.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by desertfox

Went off roading in the Thar again yesterday, Sunday, Dec 29. The terrain was rural tracks, dusty tracks, mud tracks and slush, nothing very difficult at all. This was in Jhajjhar and Pataudi area of Haryana about 50 km from here in Gurgaon. The noise from the front wheels was peristent throughout the day.

Dear Shahidbhai - the oil seal seems to have dried up. The roadside garage solution is to remove the wheel and squirt some oil into the crevice behind the brake disc. You may like to try it if "Mr.Hightech" does not prevent you from trying. Or you may like to send you car where it is supposed to go and then witness the "lungi dance"!

It happens in the rainy season. I have done the same thing numerous times in my 1987 model Maruti 800 that I used for 1,87,000 kms with the original half shafts and the original seals + my Alto and my Zen that I still use. There, you loosen the axle nut slightly and push the shaft in a little to open up the ground diameter before oiling it. Of course I changed the nuts everytime. Two nuts cost 120 rupees, every auto parts shop stores original MGP nuts. Period! .

"Kya saab! Abhi mechyanique ka bhi training mangta kya"!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[desertfox]

Thank you Sir.
Why not at the Mahindra ASC will get it fixed there along with the tandem brake booster change, first service.

Competition has its advantages. Three ASC in Gurgaon, all three keep calling and welcome customers, two non dealer ones offer free pick up and drop service.

In this case axle nut or any clips etc. will be replaced under warranty.

Freezing cold in Delhi, not driven the Thar for over a week now. It has a heater of course just not used it for some time, I love the scorpio and Innova heating systems. Good.