[Ironhide]

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

Cars like Maruti Ritz/Swift have EGR valve and MASS replaces/cleans EGR depending on how clogged the valve is. A clogged EGR gives issue like stalling, erratic idling in petrol cars.

So cleaning the EGR is definitely possible in petrol cars.

Regards,
Shashi

Noob question, I know. But I still need this answered .

Does the Zen (Jellybean shape, MPFI, 2001, LX) have an EGR valve ?

If yes, where is it?


Cheers !

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by Ironhide

Noob question, I know. But I still need this answered .

Does the Zen (Jellybean shape, MPFI, 2001, LX) have an EGR valve ?

If yes, where is it?


Cheers !

Parts catalog shows that ZEN MPFIs got this EGR valve, and it is a part of the emission control system. Regarding the exact location, I am not sure where it is exactly located in your engine bay.



Regards,
Shashi

[Ironhide]

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

Parts catalog shows that ZEN MPFIs got this EGR valve, and it is a part of the emission control system. Regarding the exact location, I am not sure where it is exactly located in your engine bay.

Regards,
Shashi

Thanks. That solves one conundrum. Now on to another - its location ! Maybe MASS will help in solving it, the next time Zen goes for service.

Cheers !

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by Ironhide

Thanks. That solves one conundrum. Now on to another - its location ! Maybe MASS will help in solving it, the next time Zen goes for service.

Can you post an image of the engine bay? Preferably close up of the exhaust area and intake manifold?

[Sunney]

My 6 year/110000kms Diesel car showed problems of unnatural sound and feeble pickup. At sudden acceleration, emitting slight black smoke too.

At authorised service station, they found problems with EGR, as cause of abnormal sound(from Engine).
At a test-drive after checking at ASS, there was no abnormal sound. ASS said it is a trial with a blocked EGR, since the EGR found faulty.

I am driving the car with the blocked EGR, to confirm EGR alone is the culprit.

Can driving the car with a blocked EGR (No EGR) cause any problem?

To my knowledge, EGR is a component to divert part of the exhaust gas to the Combustion chamber to recirculate it "to reduce carbon emission" alone.
And blocking it may release little more carbon,and no other fatal damage/problem to a car. Hence you can even do away with it.

What is the real fact, long time effect please...?

[--gKrish--]

Originally Posted by Sunney

To my knowledge, EGR is a component to divert part of the exhaust gas to the Combustion chamber to recirculate it "to reduce carbon emission" alone.
And blocking it may release little more carbon,and no other fatal damage/problem to a car. Hence you can even do away with it.

What is the real fact, long time effect please...?

As far as I know, EGR only reduces NOx emissions and in fact increases the CO emissions. So blocking it will result in increased NOx emissions and lesser carbon particulate emission.

I dont have first hand experience disabling egr in any of our cars. But running the car with egr in city for quite sometime has made me aware of the impacts of having an egr. Accumulation of carbon in the intake, black cloud of smoke on acceleration. Unless egr is cleaned and you do the italian tune up it will give rise to the above problems. If the valve is stuck open or not closing properly you'll have performance drop, and increased lag and fuel consumption.

Many of the bhpians who have blanked out the egr or disabled it via remap will be in a better position to explain the long term effects of disabling the egr. Combustion would be better with more air and oxygen but it would produce more NOx.

Please check these threads
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post1809977

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/diy-do...-turbo-di.html

gk

[aerohit]

At 110k km it is time to get egr cleaned. If you can go as far as disabling the egr then why not just get it cleaned, effort will be almost same. Try going to smaller shop.

There is a thread here on egr cleaning. From technical point of view egr is important device as it makes burning more efficient, and personally why pollute your own air that it already is.

[tharian]

Originally Posted by aerohit

From technical point of view egr is important device as it makes burning more efficient, and personally why pollute your own air that it already is.

Burning will be efficient without the EGR. Without exhaust gases entering the combustion chamber, it will result in better combustion.

Agreed on the pollution front since EGR is specifically meant to cool down temperatures in the chamber so NOx is not produced at certain rpm's.


My car (Aspire TDCi) is running on a partial EGR delete since last 1500 kms since I did not want to end up with a fat bill later on in its life.

[Sunney]

Originally Posted by GrammarNazi

Yes, Depends on which ASC.

FIAT ASC quoted 2600 to clean the EGR valve last year.

My Linea has a weird problem. The turbo seems to start spooling only 2000rpm onwards!

I've got the turbo hose checked for leaks, there's none (as per the super duper 'competent' FASC in Bangalore)

Anyway, the result is that it's giving me better fuel economy in 3rd gear than before ! Drivability is brilliant!

I shift to 5th (at ~2600rpm) only on the highways now !

But, to be serious, I guess I should really get the car checked at some place else.

The engine noise has surely increased since a year & even the surge has gone.

If someone knows a decent place in Bangalore, please suggest.

If you are looking for a "decent" place in Bglr means a FASC or 3rd party Workshop?
Well in Bglr, you may find another FASC, but I doubt on the "decency" part. They are all birds of same feather !

Think of our plight in Cochin: The big city has only ONE FASC.
They take minimum a week for minor repairs, and if any breakdown, 15 days to one month.
Quality of service? pathetic.

When NO competition, who need to care for good, fast service ?

Despite the fantastic cars they make, if only the boss FIAT bother for better service for their cars, FASC will perform.
But Fiat has no time churning out Engines, do not bother in cut-throat car sales: This is my impression of my 6 year experience with FASC.

Sorry for off-topic.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by Sunney

Can driving the car with a blocked EGR (No EGR) cause any problem?

Not at all. The car's engine will thank you for that.

Originally Posted by Sunney

To my knowledge, EGR is a component to divert part of the exhaust gas to the Combustion chamber to recirculate it "to reduce carbon emission" alone.

Part of the exhaust gases are sent back to the combustion chamber that will lower the overall combustion temperature which will prevent formation of NOx compounds.

This amount of gases that are sent back depends on the accelerator input (read power demand) from the driver. During acceleration, the EGR solenoid will be closed and not let any exhaust gases into the chamber but during cruising it will open the EGR valve.

Originally Posted by Sunney

What is the real fact, long time effect please?

No long term effects on the engine other than environmental and psychological.

The engine breathes better which is running with it's EGR blocked as compared to the one that has an running EGR.

Only thing is higher EGT (I haven't checked for this parameter but read about it) but that is going to noticed if you drive like you're on a race track. Regular city driving shouldn't effect the car in anyway post EGR block.

There will be a CEL on the instrumentation console.

If you are going to open and clean the EGR at workshop, ask them to clean the EGR valve, EGR cooler and intake manifold. Many ASC's ignore the intake manifold which holds more of the sooth generated along with the EGR blocking the air passage. This is a labour intensive job.

[tharian]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

There will be a CEL on the instrumentation console.

Which is the reason I did a partial block.

With this I took a guess by looking at the size of the hole in the blocking plate and in comparison with the dia on the actual valve, it should be around a quarter of the dia of the valve. So 75% less exhaust gases getting into the intake through the EGR.

With CEL always lit, the major concern is how will I know something else is faulty. I can do a check frequently with a OBD scanner, but that is not feasible on the long run.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by tharian

With CEL always lit, the major concern is how will I know something else is faulty.

The other possible way is to do a remap that can delete EGR from the map itself so no CEL due to EGR block.

[scorpian]

Isn't it possible to use a blanking plate and add couple of washers or plates to increase the height of the actual valve opening, so in this case the valve would open and not lead to CEL. Basically it would operate normally.
I am not sure if what i said is possible or is the system smart enough to realize that there is no flow happening in the combustion chamber?
In my car with the OBD connected,EGR seems to open most of the time in city and this worries me.
Is a map possible which would only delete the EGR and nothing more just to increase the longevity of the engine.

[Sunney]

Thank you very much a4anurag

You taught me what is EGR and more: give me confidence to get rid of EGR.
My Linea has completed 6 year and 11000kms, with one Leh and one Utarkhand drives.

Thank you once more )

[Dr.Naren]

Originally Posted by scorpian

Is a map possible which would only delete the EGR and nothing more just to increase the longevity of the engine.

Yes, EGR valve can be closed permanently in remap. Which is your car? All the tuners won't have EGR delete option for all the cars. It's very much possible to do only EGR delete in remap, but I don't know if our tuners would do only this job. I had asked one tuner about only EGR delete for my SX4 and he quoted the price same as remap.