[rkmunjuluri]

Originally Posted by lina

So from the looks of it, Tata never increased the charging speed. The additional current drawn is just a result of more cells drawing the same power as they used to earlier. Tata should have increased the charging speed before releasing the Max. Hopefully XUV400 gets released with a better charging speed.

I think they did, it was only 21 KW earlier and now it is easily 29KW. An increase of close to 40% when the battery capacity was increased by 33%. But agree that they should have tried to achieve atleast 50 to 60 KW to boost up charging times. MG has 80KW capability now.

[maint1234]

Originally Posted by rkmunjuluri

I saw 30KW briefly and current was around 83 amperes at max. consistently it used to be around 29 KW and 81 Amps in 30 KW, 50 KW and 60 KW DC fast chargers.

could you check the charging rate when the car is below 50 % SOC .
By some reports it charges the fastest from 20 to 50 % and then reduces.
The charger ofcourse has to be a minimum 50 kW one.

This is a major sticking point for me in buying a ev. Though i have a nexon max under booking.
EV cars in the west have progressed to 250 kW DC charging capacity. With 100 kW as a minimum given.
For a car we will retain for atleast 5 to 8 years , having such a low charging rate is really sad . In the near future we might get cars with 100 kw charging rates and in comparison the slow rates in nexon ev will be very irritating.

[haribalram]

Comprehensively tabulated ownership experience. Thanks.

Originally Posted by rkmunjuluri

I tried my best for 4 to 5 weeks to ensure I drive the car in City and eco modes only and not allow the green bar in MID go beyond 2nd line when accelerating. Guess what, I was so damn frustrated seeing all the cars fly past me as I was not gaining enough speed quickly. Also it was just adding more and more cars in front of me during traffic hours. Ultimately I gave up and drive it like a petrol car, I am much happier and content now and least bothered about the range being only around 240 to 260 KMS per full charge.

Glad that you figured out the balance between having fun driving the car and the right mode to drive.

Originally Posted by rkmunjuluri

God forbid, none of you have to ever face this situation, but I had to traverse through around 60 to 80 meters stretch of road in Bangalore, where the water logging was up to 1/4th of the wheel of a tipper truck in front of me. I was so worried that water might cause some issue or the other. It has been more than 2000 KMS after that incident and everything is working fine, no glitches and no headaches.

Bangalore roads are notoriously known for water logging after an hour of rain (for that matter most of the Indian metros). To be able to have that assurance to navigate such water bodies is confidence boosting.

[rkmunjuluri]

Originally Posted by damodar

It would be interesting to know your charging log between Bangalore to Ongole and back.

Reliability of Charging infrastructure is one problem. Other issues are power outages and Weather playing spoil sport. I am writing down the experience of the highway trips now (which includes Bangalore to Ongole and back), should be able to post it by tomorrow.

Originally Posted by maint1234

could you check the charging rate when the car is below 50 % SOC .

The charging speed goes down after 85% SOC and then drastically reduces after it touches 95%. I don't recall the power values but the current values drop to around 60 after SOC reaches 85% and slowly goes down to 40 by the time we see 95% and after that it is only hovering between 12 and 13. Assuming proportional drop in energy as well, power might have been 21 KW (at 85% SOC), 14 KW (by 95% SOC) and 4 KW (95 to 100) respectively.

Most of the chargers I was able to find were between 22 KW and 25 KW only. So even the infrastructure is not ready to support vehicles which can take energy beyond 60KW. Who knows what will be the story 3 to 5 years down the line. One thing is for sure, that the needle is moving in the right direction

[rkmunjuluri]

Originally Posted by efgritesh

Thanks for details real world usage review! Did you tried something 400+KM in a day type? can you share some more details on what kind of max distance you were able to cover in a single day or something like that with real world examples

After doing 3 highway trips I learnt the following 3 sutras and I will have to live by them for making most of the EV.
1. Your best friend for EV Trips is "Plug Share" Desktop/laptop version for planning and mobile version during the trip.
2. Things you cannot control but which can drastically impact your trip - Reliability of charging infra, Weather and accompanied Power Fluctuations/Power Outages.
3. Worst enemies of EV Range - Altitude changes, HARSH THROTTLE and your state of mind (based on point 2)

Highway Trip 1
Bangalore -> Ongole -> Bangalore

This was the first highway trip in the EV which had completed 1081 kms and its first service the day before. I had also never utilized any fast charging infrastructure till that time.

Below was the plan chalked out for the trip using plugshare website and on the right hand side of the pic, I had highlighted the potential charging/refreshment stops enroute.


Elevation changes are chalked out below by the website and we can see that Bangalore is at an altitude of almost 900 meters from sea level and Ongole at almost sea level. So going to Ongole will be less demanding on battery than coming back to Bangalore.


Day 1 Summary
Charging Bill - INR 773.36
Restaurant Bill - INR 554
Relux charger performance & reliability - 5/5
Breakfast Buffet - 3.5/5
Restrooms - 3.5/5
Parking space and ease of access to hotel - 4/5
Distance Covered - 396.4 KMS
Total battery percentage consumed and Mileage - 132%, 300KMS per charge
Total time spent on Road - 8 Hours
Total time using ICE vehicle could have been - 6 Hours 30 mins to 7 hours.


Day 2 Summary
Charging Bill - INR 1867.31
Food Bill - INR 2800

Ravi Priya Mall, Zeon Fast Charger, Ongole.
Performance and reliability - 5/5
Washrooms and options to kill time - 4/5
Parking - 3.5/5

Kritunga Restaurant, Zeon Fast Charger, Gudur.
Performance and Reliability - 4/5
Restrooms - 4/5
Parking space - 5/5
Tea/Coffee/Food - 4/5

Taj Hotel, Tata Fast Charger, Tirupati.
Performance and Reliability - 5/5
Restrooms - 5/5
Parking space - 3.5/5
Tea/Coffee/Food - 4/5 (Too Costly)

Aaradhya Grand Restaurant, Zeon Fast Charger, Kolar.
Performance and Reliability - 5/5
Restrooms - 4/5
Parking space - 5/5
Tea/Coffee/Food - 4/5

Distance Covered - 680.7 KMS
Total battery percentage consumed and Mileage - 267%, 254 KMS per charge
Total time spent on Road - 15 Hours
Total time using ICE vehicle could have been - 12 Hours (For the kind of journey we had to do)

------------------------ ------------------------

If you want more details about the journey and the issues encountered, then read along:

Day 1 - Bangalore start time 5:30 AM, SOC - 100%, Total Passengers - 2, Luggage - 2 backpacks, some snacks and fruits, lots of water bottles, Google projected travel time - 9 hours

Close to Nandi Food Plaza, we still had 50% SOC left and the next point was some 90 KMS away, so we moved along to Tirupati, Hotel Bhimas by 9:10 AM with 17% SOC still left. In all we covered close to 249 KMS with 83% SOC. I did touch 110 speed at one time, but most of the drive was done using cruise control set to 100.

As this was my first fast charger usage, some time wasted (8 to 10 Mins) in figuring out the detail. We spent close to 1 hour 25 mins there and charged up to 96% SOC in two charging sessions.
It is 30KW DC fast charger by Relux.

We restarted our journey at 10:35 and the next stop was 95 kms from there in Gudur at Kritunga Restaurant. It was a 25KW charger by Zeon and was showing offline. Customer care informed us that there was some issue and it might come back up by evening or the day after.
We took a small break after Nellore Toll Plaza and when we restarted our journey, the air coming from AC seemed very hot. Even the ventilated seats were throwing hot air. Not sure why this happened, but never faced again this so far. So we switched off the AC, pulled the windows down and continued our journey as Nellore was around 15 KMS and we were confident we can find some charging option there and figure out the issue with AC then.
My cousin who was with me hails from Nellore and by the time we reached Nellore we had covered close to 135 KMS and left with 52% charge. We checked with MG showroom and they mentioned, they wont allow any other vehicles other than MG for charging. Tata Motors has a charger but it was not working as the showroom people did not install a Transformer which can support the charger.

Our final destination was a small village 15 KMS from Ongole and google was showing we had to still cover close to 145 Kms. Though we had charging infrastructure in Ongole, distance to it was close to 139 Kms. So we decided against travelling further and went to my cousins place.
Reached there by around 2 PM after covering close to 148 KMS and 47% SOC Remaining.

After making a lot of phone calls and enquiring with many people and businesses, my cousin decided to get a 16A plug setup done at his home, to which my portable charger can reach.

Plugged the EV to charge from around 4:30 PM till around 10PM and then morning 5 AM till 8 AM the next day. SOC moved from 47 to 100.

------------------------ ------------------------

Day 2 - Nellore Start time - 8:15 AM, SOC - 100%, Total Passengers - 4, Luggage - Few water bottles

Uneventful morning. clocked 145 KMS in 2 hours 10 mins and leverage cruise control set to 100 most of the time. Reached the Function hall by 10:25 AM.

After Lunch went to Ravi Priya mall, Ongole for charging. Charging infrastructure again is provided by Zeon and it is a 50KW DC charger.
Reached there with 40% SOC remaining after covering 158 KMS in 60% charge. It took close to 1 hour 15 mins for attaining 100% SOC. 95 to 100 took close to 15 mins.

Finally the return journey started at 3:30 PM after running some errands at Ongole, added probably another 50 kgs luggage and reached Nellore to my cousins place by 5:15 PM. As the Zeon Charger in Gudur was up and and running, we felt confident we can make it back to Bangalore quick enough and also explore positives and negatives of driving EV at night. So quickly packed up bags, topped up water bottles and left Nellore by 5:30 PM.

Reached Kritunga Restaurant in Gudur by 6:15 PM and spent close to 45 minutes there. Topped up SOC from 25% to 59% using a 25 KW Zeon Charger. Total Distance covered, close to 180 KMS in 76% charge while driving it constantly around 100 in cruise, with very quick accelerations.

Decided to stop at Taj Tirupati for Dinner which had 2, 30KW Tata Chargers.
Reached Tirupati by 9 PM. SOC remaining was 26%. Distance covered 94 KMS in 32% SOC. Speeds were maintained around 85 as I had never driven this vehicle in the night using headlights even in the city till that time.
By the time we finished our dinner and freshened up, the battery reached 92% and took 65 minutes. So we restarted our journey from Tirupati at 10:10 PM.

Next stop was decided as Nandi Food Plaza, as it was around 90KMS away and after a quick 20 to 30 mins top up there we can reach home without range anxiety.
But fate had other plans. We were constantly monitoring the charger and it was showing online till 11:15 PM. We reached there at 11:22 and guess what, the charger was offline. We tried reaching the customer care with zero luck. We scouted for other chargers and figured out there is a 50KW DC charger in Kolar by Zeon in Aaradhya Grand Restaurant.

We still had close to 57% charge left and the charging point was around 95 KMS away. But the challenge was we were using high beam constantly, AC was on and the altitude changes that are going to come up are very steep and will take a toll on Battery.

So we decided to keep checking the battery drop speeds and then decide on switching off the AC and either opening sunroof or keeping the windows open.

I started the vehicle and the path to highway is a steep slope down from the charging point, so once the dial was set to drive mode and parking break was disengaged the vehicle gliding down, but when I was pressing the accelerator there was no response. Pressed the accelerator harder, no response. The vehicle was just gliding along and even the regen braking was not getting engaged. I slowly steered the vehicle to the side of the highway, kept the parking light on, took a deep breath and switched off the vehicle. Switched it on, nothing fishy on MID, no beeps or alarms from vehicle and it started gliding again, no power delivery even after pressing the accelerator all the way down.

By this time my cousin started freaking out, and panic started kicking in for me as well. It was almost midnight, apart from few ICE vehicles zipping past us every now and then, there was absolutely no soul around. We were also not sure how much help any of those fellow travelers be as we might have less than 30K EVs on Highways in India and probably the chance that the one we might flag down has the knowledge of an EV, was less than attaining Nirvana for myself.

I switched off the vehicle one more time and hoping for a miracle, switched it on again. Now I was unable to move the steering at all and when I observed the MID, it was displaying the steering locked symbol. Now both of us were literally freaking out. But I was defending my decision of buying an EV and using it for highway drives very strongly in my heart. So switched of the vehicle one more time, got out of the car, asked my cousin also to get out of the car. Took some deep breaths and started opening and closing all the doors. Switched on the car again, same old error of the steering wheel being locked. Switched it off again. Came out of the car, played back everything that has unfolded in the last 5 to 7 mins from the time we parked the car at Nandi Food Plaza.

I am not sure why, but I thought about the charging port of the Car. Generally when we are plugged in, the car will not even allow us to start ignition till the time the gun is removed. So I opened the charging port, removed the lids and closed them again. Gave them a good knock after that and closed the lid. Got into the Car, switched on the ignition and the miracle became a reality. The Steering lock signal from MID vanished. Tapped the accelerator ever so gently and the car responded and the steering wheel was free. Can't explain the feeling and relief we had, in words.

At last we thought the drama has ended and we started our journey again. To save battery and remove any range anxiety from equation, we switched off AC, turned off High beam and started driving around 70 to 80 KMPH speeds. Just then the weather gods decided to send some rain along. It started drizzling and as the outside temperature was around 20, 21, with the windows up and AC off, fog was getting developed pretty quickly. So we had to switch on AC, keep couple of windows slightly down to reduce the fogging frequency. We switched on High beam as well to ensure better visibility in rain.

Just to be cautious we called up Zeon customer care and they assured that the Charger will be available 24*7. It was showing online in the App as well and in case by the time we reach there, if we face any issue, they assured of support even at that hour.

When we were around 30 KMS to the charger the SOC was showing 30% and I felt more confident and started driving more spiritedly as the rain also subsided by that time. At 12:55 AM on 1st Aug we reached Aaradhya Grand Restaurant in Kolar with 17% SOC remaining. Covered around 175 KMS with 75% SOC. This was while maintaining cruise speeds of around 90/95 till Nandi food plaza and after that till Aaradhya grand doing mostly 80.

My Cousin had enough adventure already and though we had to cover only around 70 KMS, he was unwilling to start the journey till we reached 50% SOC. So we ordered some tea, walked around the parking area to kill time.
After 30 Mins when we attained 56% SOC we restarted our journey at 1:25 AM. No further issues, surprises here after and were able to reach home by 2:40 PM. SOC remaining was 34% and we did close to 70 KMS with 22% SOC while managing cruise speeds of around 90 most of time.

Atleast we were able to conclude first ever Highway trip in EV Max. It lasted in all 45 hours while munching down 1058 KMS. This journey taught me a lot about how to plan a Highway trip in an EV and be prepared for the worst to come along.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by yashcosmos

Attached below is my average WH consumption for approximately 2700kms.

My takeaway after 70 days of owning the max is that acheiving 240-250kms range with 20% charge left is ideal scenario in which a lot of owners would fall into over the next few months. This is average Joe driving the car. Ofcourse you can squeeze in way more or less but that would totally depend on how conservative or harsh you drive.

A most useful post. Thank you for sharing your data with laymen like me. A safe real world range of 250 kms is decent if you don't intend {like me for example} to use the EV for inter city long distance trips. I expect over the next 3 years with improvements in battery technology, loss reductions, weight reductions this range will climb to say 350 to 400 kms in the real world.

I am waiting to learn from early adopters what happens when you drive through flooded roads where the battery {at the bottom} comes in contact with the flood waters swirling around it.

[yashcosmos]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

A most useful post. Thank you for sharing your data with laymen like me. A safe real world range of 250 kms is decent if you don't intend {like me for example} to use the EV for inter city long distance trips. I expect over the next 3 years with improvements in battery technology, loss reductions, weight reductions this range will climb to say 350 to 400 kms in the real world.

I am waiting to learn from early adopters what happens when you drive through flooded roads where the battery {at the bottom} comes in contact with the flood waters swirling around it.

I for one have not driven through any flooded roads yet, but as much as I've read it's not a big problem as battery is sealed and waterproof, but ofcourse there's a restriction to how much water height we talking about.

Also, they are already cars in India that do more than 400kms in one charge, BYD E6 is one example, they are selling to private owners too.

[DarthVeda]

Originally Posted by rkmunjuluri

To save battery and remove any range anxiety from equation, we switched off AC, turned off High beam and started driving around 70 to 80 KMPH speeds

The savings from switching AC off and high beam to low beam is minisicule compared to the savings you get from dropping speed from 100 to 70kph. Don't worry about the power consumption of light, infotainment system etc.

[GoBlue]

Originally Posted by shyampsunder

EVs will continue to be cheaper by atleast 80%.

The discom tariff’s need to be factored in as well. With increasing adoption of EV’s, tariff’s will continue to increase.

For your use-case (Bangalore - Chennai), a Hybrid seems like a better tool in case cost optimisation is the target.

A Maruti Grand Vitara or a City Hybrid that may give 25 kpl (for example). This would be several scales better cost/km than your current car, and would come without the need to stop for EV recharges as well as without the associated range anxiety.

Do note that capacity degradation of EV batteries over time is a genuine concern. The moment that starts happening, range anxiety will increase as well as the frequency of stopping for recharges. This will be exacerbated if one uses more fast charging, which would be unavoidable on highway runs.

This is mitigated in a Hybrid battery as the charging is done exclusively by the onboard control system (using the ICE engine as a generator), and is designed to optimise battery health.

PS: Autocar India demonstrated 29 kpl in a real world road test of a City Hybrid, which means 25 kpl is a realistic benchmark to consider.

[shyampsunder]

Originally Posted by GoBlue

The discom tariff’s need to be factored in as well. With increasing adoption of EV’s, tariff’s will continue to increase.

For your use-case (Bangalore - Chennai), a Hybrid seems like a better tool in case cost optimisation is the target.
.

Electricity tariffs are politically super sensitive. Many states haven't raised the rates for a decade+ because of that. They would rather let the state go bankrupt than raise power tariffs.

It's not going to be like fuel where you can get away with 50%+ taxes. Given that EVs can be charged on any socket, any EV specific higher tariff will also fall flat.

For my usage, nothing other than a petrol only car makes economic sense.

I keep my cars for 10 years+ and it makes no sense to get last gen or outdated tech. Range anxiety is not a big deal for me. It's more than compensated by the guilt free happiness I will get by driving an EV hard without worrying about costs. Or chill for hours with friends in a car without thinking about costs.



All super subjective of course. I am happy with the tradeoffs but I can perfectly understand someone who isn't.

[destinykid]

Originally Posted by rkmunjuluri

Atleast we were able to conclude first ever Highway trip in EV Max. It lasted in all 45 hours while munching down 1058 KMS. This journey taught me a lot about how to plan a Highway trip in an EV and be prepared for the worst to come along.

Wow! quite a saga. It seems so many things have to be improved to make intercity travel on EV more comfortable and reduce the duration. The range anxiety seems like a suspense thriller on these rides On a different note, I did similar distance from Bangalore to Vizag in 20 hours on an ICE with breakfast, lunch and loo breaks including a couple of coffee stops and one fuel refill in between.

So considering the time taken and distance covered you did an average of 23.5 kmph. Whereas on a regular ICE this could have been an average of 50 kmph. Putting aside the fuel savings, adding up the time differential and its cost implication, my question is are we saving money on these long EV trips? And I also feel to accommodate the charging breaks, we are spending more on food and coffee breaks.

I still feel Plug-in hybrids for intra city commute with a range of 30 to 50 km pure EV range and petrol engine with hybrid benefit for longer drives is the best solution.

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by destinykid

So considering the time taken and distance covered you did an average of 23.5 kmph. Whereas on a regular ICE this could have been an average of 50 kmph.

OP says 23hours of travel time for 1080kms, which is average of 47kmph.

[destinykid]

Originally Posted by SKC-auto

OP says 23hours of travel time for 1080kms, which is average of 47kmph.

Noted. I went by the total time given by the OP in the last line. It seems to have included the time spent at the location as well. Thanks. 47 kmph seems decent sans the anxiety drama

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by rkmunjuluri

To save battery and remove any range anxiety from equation, we switched off AC, turned off High beam and started driving around 70 to 80 KMPH speeds.

My Cousin just picked up an EV max a few days back and at delivery the technician mentioned that the car headlights draw power form the regular battery at the front and not the main battery used to run the electric motors.

[varkey]

Originally Posted by SnS_12

My Cousin just picked up an EV max a few days back and at delivery the technician mentioned that the car headlights draw power form the regular battery at the front and not the main battery used to run the electric motors.

Yep but the regular battery draws power from the HV main battery! 😉 The aux battery is topped up and recharged when the vehicle is running and when the vehicle is being recharged as required.