[chaosengine]

Unfortunately none yet - I am following up with 3 Next showrooms around me - JP Nagar, Mysore Road and Nagarbhavi. No luck yet. The earliest they seem to promise a TD is in a couple of weeks' time. Will keep you posted if it happens sooner.

Originally Posted by blitz_nomad

@chaosengine: Did you have any success getting a Baleno AGS for TD?

[blitz_nomad]

Originally Posted by chaosengine

Unfortunately none yet - I am following up with 3 Next showrooms around me - JP Nagar, Mysore Road and Nagarbhavi. No luck yet. The earliest they seem to promise a TD is in a couple of weeks' time. Will keep you posted if it happens sooner.

This might help - I was able to do a TD. It is available in the Museum Road Nexa showroom (Pratham Auto). But the Vehicle is not yet registered - so no door step service, you will have to go there to take the TD.

Given the traffic around that area, was able to hit only 50-60kmph. The AGS was overall smooth, no head nods/jerks etc. We could sense the gear shifts though, so not as smooth as a CVT. But definitely not something I'd worry about - given my driving skills which are far from perfect, the AGS did very well.

[Bimmer_Sage]

Hello esteemed members of Team BHP
I am a car enthusiast. Have owned and driven many many cars both in India and foreign lands. Even when I am not looking to a buy a car I am researching cars . I am one of those people who keeps taking test drives even when not in the market for a car. I used to drive by used car lots or even dealerships looking for cars to test drive.
Anyway. I gave the introduction above as it is connected to the issue I am currently facing. I am in a fix. For someone who knows cars I am unable to finalize on a car that I want to buy some 6 months down the road.

I would not like to exceed a budget of 15 lakhs. I already own a 2020 baleno I as a beater. I have a 2019 venue and I have a 3 series. I am look for a car that is mostly to be driven in Delhi for commuting to law school and back home. The car would also be driven on highways mostly Delhi- Jammu trips, a couple of them in a year.
I am looking for comfort of course but not sedative driving. I like to overtake people on the highways so would need that punch. Can’t wait forever for the turbo to boost.
I am not going to buy another Maruti. Neither going to buy a TATA or a Mahindra. Going for safe bets but fun to drive. Your suggestions would be welcome. Help me choose my new car.

[blitz_nomad]

Originally Posted by blitz_nomad

Ok folks. I just came back after a test drive of the Atroz XZ+ i-turbo petrol.
Don't know if I just had a bad piece, but definitely not what I expected.

1. The engine was noisy. (A lot more than the swift I've been used too.)
2. There was quite a shudder each time it started up.
3. Overall throughout the ride (It was peak traffic time.. max we went to was 50/60kmph and for some parts bumper to bumper traffic) lots of vibration coming in.
4. The back seat was a little too upright as correctly noted in the Altroz review.
5. Also while I was in the back seat... definitely could feel every bump/trough in the road. Was pretty much like sitting on a firm bench.

#1,2,3 put together - Just didn't feel like a petrol vehicle. Let alone a 11L car at that. Definitely not the comfort level I was looking for.

The vehicle had ~1000km on the odo and was a 2022 piece as per the sales person.

In short... I'm no longer considering the Altroz. Just didn't like the feel of the drive overall, despite great looks and interiors.

Update after two more TDs:

I took a 2nd TD of the altroz with another dealer. There was such a stark difference in the ride quality - I was shocked. This one was much more silent, smooth and above all driving it was enjoyable. Just wondering whether I was imagining things or got conditioned after TDing various other vehicles.... I decided to take a 3rd TD, this time with my friend who had accompanied me in the first ride. To make sure he doesn't get biased, I didn't tell him about my 2nd TD. Sure enough, Post the TD, the first thing he told me (unprompted) was also the same - Surprised, That this one was a whole lot different and better than the other. The only difference between the two cars was the 1st TD was on the latest 2022 Altroz i-turbo, with less than 1000K on the odo. While the 2nd TD was on a Pre 2022 Vehicle (unfortunately I didn't note the odometer reading)

Just to put things in perspective for anyone in the future reading this thread, as compared to my comments earlier, here is my experience on these TDs:

1. Sitting in the rear seat, the engine was barely audible.
2. Rear seat comfort was pretty good - although firm, it was nothing like the last experience that I had. We didn't feel like rice tossed around in a chinese wok with every bump in the road.
3. With #1 & #2 above combined - rear seat experience was indeed plush.
4. In the front seats - the engine was audible through out, esp the turbo noise - but nothing like the earlier experience. It was quite mild.
5. Starting the engine - a mild shudder, again not like earlier. The vibrations were also there but much milder and only draws notice from time to time at slow speeds.
6. Driving the car (and I can't believe I'm saying this after the first experience), once it picks up speed - was fun! It is a pleasure to drive.
7. The earlier ride, made me very motion sick. This one didn't during the entire drive. Strangely sometime after getting off the car - I had a mild headache, but nothing to worrisome.
8. Overall the best ride I had thus far among the TDs

I tried the NA engine too from the same dealer and liked that one too.

So the altroz went from: Being top contender in the shortlist - to - chucked out of shortlist (after 1st td) back to top contender in the shortlist.

The Punch was also quiet good and to my liking, but this one seemed to be the better of the two.

I've kind of more-or-less settled on one of these two: The Altroz or the Punch.

In a bind now and could use some help:


Unfortunately I can not ignore the first ride. That was an Altroz too and there is no denying it. As far as the rear seat comfort, it might be the tire pressure as was suggested in the thread earlier:

Originally Posted by PrasannaDhana

Regarding stiff ride you felt, it must be because the tyres would have been inflated to 36 psi. I also admit that the low speed ride is pretty stiff. My previous car was an extremely plush riding ciaz. I felt the difference instantly. I have been reducing the pressure to 32 psi and the ride is much better.

But what about the rest: Poor NVH and the severe motion sickness. The later is probably unique to me, but it makes me worry that if I end up with such a specimen, I will dread driving it.

So I imagine three things:

1. Tata's Production is not "tight" enough, that there is a large variance between different specimen.
2. Perhaps right off the mint - the car has NVH issues until a bake-in period of driving beyond which the ride is much better and representative.
3. The opposite of 2: For as long as the car is "new", NVH is good and the ride is comfortable and plush, but ages poorly in about a year or so? (There is nothing in my observations in the TDs that suggest this, but if #1 is true, This may also be a problem.)

Now, if #1 above where true - I'd expect mixed reviews from current Altroz owners. So I went searching in the forum, although not an exact match for what I was looking, I discovered two interesting posts:

Originally Posted by greenhorn

I drove the Altroz Turbo today and it was extremely underwhelming. It felt nowhere near the i20 turbo, Heck, it felt worse than the punch I drove immediately after it. So bad that I asked them for another Test drive of the altroz just to confirm.

Apart from the underwhelming acceleration, power delivery was very jerky. It felt exactly like my 15 year old indica - When you Give the throttle, it jerks, when you lift off the throttle, it jerks even worse. Perhaps the TD car was old, but so will be mine after a few years, and I do not want to end up back to where I am right now.

Originally Posted by greenhorn

Update: I td'ed an altroz turbo from another dealership and this one felt much nicer to drive. So probably some issue with the earlier one. If you want to td the altroz iturbo in Trivandrum, don't go to derik Tata. Their iturbo td car very badly needs a tune up.

So there is alteast one other person who had a similar experience as me. Gives credence to the theory #1 above.

And then I also see this:

Originally Posted by Nikhil Beke

I am a recent iturbo owner, and let me share my experience on this: I openly wondered at this 'underwhelming' engine aspect (please refer to my posts in this thread)- then discovered the Sport mode for city commutes post running-in period, and was awed by it for few days. Then the sprint feeling sort of... wore out. On few of the days, it gets a quick/lively throttle response in the sport mode (city mode is underwhelming from an enthusiast's perspective on any given day, although it does it's job in going from point A-to-B in city commutes), but on some (most?) days I have to push the accelerator really deep to build up the necessary torque, and the throttle response seems rather subdued thereafter as well. Tried having it shown to TASS guys while ISS stopped working for few days (and check engine light showed up) but according to their diagnostics there, everything seems OK.

Goes inline with #3. Would be very helpful to hear the experiences of current Altroz and Punch owners. If any are reading this please do share your thoughts.

I wonder what is the right way to reach out to this crowd. Perhaps, If it is allowed, I could quote post this reply with a suitable intro, in a separate thread titled 'Current Altroz/Punch owners - Comments Invited' in the Initial ownership reviews forum?

[Nikhil Beke]

Originally Posted by blitz_nomad

Update after two more TDs:

So I imagine three things:[list=1][*]Tata's Production is not "tight" enough, that there is a large variance between different specimen.[*]Perhaps right off the mint - the car has NVH issues until a bake-in period of driving beyond which the ride is much better and representative.[*]The opposite of 2: For as long as the car is "new", NVH is good and the ride is comfortable and plush, but ages poorly in about a year or so?

The problem is that Altroz owners seem to be trying out so many permutations and combinations to get the best performance/NVH/ride quality etc, that it seems difficult to find out what actually worked when/of it does! Even accounting for the subjectivity factor, one needs a bigger sample space and precise methodology to reach any conclusions! e.g. had heard of NA owners suddenly latching on to the trend of changing spark plugs on their cars (Champion to NGK) and claiming better performance- and then the trend died down. I'm nearly sure they had done something to my car at TASS (they say they didn't do anything apart from reflashing the same ECU update) which had made the car lively again to drive for a week or so, after my last visit to them.
As said by Greenhorn and by you above, TD vehicles showing such a big variation is a puzzle. At the same time, I sincerely doubt the owners of the better TD vehicle would be able to point out what they're doing right in a reproducible manner.

[PrasannaDhana]

Originally Posted by blitz_nomad

[u][b] I could quote post this reply with a suitable intro, in a separate thread titled 'Current Altroz/Punch owners - Comments Invited' in the Initial ownership reviews forum?

I own an altroz but a diesel. So my comments on NVH of iturbo is useless since I have not yet driven it. I have driven the 1.2 N/A and found it pretty good when driven sedately.

I find the Tata's 1.5 diesel very good in NVH levels. Not as refined as the Hyundai 1.5 diesels but much better than the IDTEC 1.5 diesel as well as the 1.5 TDI from VAG. I find it very close to Ford's 1.5 TDCI in NVH levels.

Altroz handles really well and it is fun to drive. But then, as an owner I won't recommend Altroz to anyone who is used to plush riding cars like the City/Ciaz/Duster/Hexa. It's not bad, but not very good either when it comes to low speed ride quality. Pick up pace, it gobbles up undulations and bumps very effectively.

Meanwhile Tata QC is not upto the levels. It's something all of us would agree on.

[chaosengine]

Nice to see you being so proactive and taking initiatives to get answers. I have a few observations and thoughts that I think may help. Pardon terms from statistics that I may tend to use.

I have a habit of circulating between 2-3 showrooms over the course of every year and test drive cars from each of them. I keep a single day earmarked for all test drives so that I get a good perception of each car when I drive them back to back, and also have the reference point of my familiar Chevy Beat while I hop between showrooms. That said, with the thread now being mostly about the Tata siblings, here are my thoughts:

1. Of the 2 occasions that I've driven the Punch in, the first felt rather good and I was mighty impressed with the car - mind you, this was after TD-ing the Kiger manual versions of both the Turbo and Non-Turbo engines.
2. I've driven the Altroz about around 7 times now - of all of them, only the first TD felt lacklustre and all the other drives have been terrific. I keep falling in love with the ride and handling balance on the car.

Your observations have been quite helpful, and I never really thought of the motion sickness/claustrophobic angle because I've always been behind the wheel with my mum sitting behind to share her experience as a passenger. She has similar tendencies as us with respect to motion sickness but has always come out of the Altroz smiling - in fact, she went back to the Altroz even after the test drive of the Nexon!

Originally Posted by blitz_nomad

Update after two more TDs:

So the altroz went from: Being top contender in the shortlist - to - chucked out of shortlist (after 1st td) back to top contender in the shortlist.

The Punch was also quiet good and to my liking, but this one seemed to be the better of the two.

I've kind of more-or-less settled on one of these two: The Altroz or the Punch.

I am wondering what can lead to such varying experiences of a test drive. I know for a fact that the low speed ride of the Altroz can feel a bit...stiff?

1. Like you've mentioned - it could most likely be the setup of the car itself - and largely down to the tyre pressure as well. I am positive most of the TD cars came with 16-inchers, and they probably do feel stiff.
2. The roads make a big difference too - so if you're taking TDs walking into the showroom, and you're driving these cars in a different set of environments, I'd suggest you have the dealer (from the showroom where you and your friend surprisingly liked the Altroz) to get the NA/iTurbo Altroz (whichever you're more inclined to buy) and Punch, and go for a longer drive on roads and patches you're most familiar with and get a sense of what the car is all about. This way, you also drive both the cars back to back and get a relative sense of which car behaves how.

In a bind now and could use some help:


Unfortunately I can not ignore the first ride. That was an Altroz too and there is no denying it. As far as the rear seat comfort, it might be the tire pressure as was suggested in the thread earlier:

As a final suggestion, and pardon me if we have already discussed this before - have you had a TD of the Honda Amaze? It costs less than 10.25L OTR Bangalore for the 1.2 VX MT and it has always impressed me and my sister with its ride and handling. An extremely consistent car that I have always loved driving sedately. Jazz is better built, but my mom loves the fixed cushion-type headrests of the rear seat on the Amaze than the flat bench on the Jazz/WR-V models.

[blitz_nomad]

Originally Posted by chaosengine

Your observations have been quite helpful, and I never really thought of the motion sickness/claustrophobic angle because I've always been behind the wheel with my mum sitting behind to share her experience as a passenger. She has similar tendencies as us with respect to motion sickness but has always come out of the Altroz smiling - in fact, she went back to the Altroz even after the test drive of the Nexon!

Thank you! How did she respond to the Punch in comaprison to the altroz?

2. The roads make a big difference too - so if you're taking TDs walking into the showroom, and you're driving these cars in a different set of environments, I'd suggest you have the dealer (from the showroom where you and your friend surprisingly liked the Altroz)

Actaully, I have the dealers bring them to my place and we do the same route for all TDs. I think something was definitely wrong with the first. The poor back seat ride quality - might be the pressure. The person from the dealer that brought the car for TD was also new and didn't know much about the car. The i-turbo badge in the back was broken in half. All the Altroz TDs I've taken are in the top variant with R16 wheels.

As a final suggestion, and pardon me if we have already discussed this before - have you had a TD of the Honda Amaze? It costs less than 10.25L OTR Bangalore for the 1.2 VX MT and it has always impressed me and my sister with its ride and handling. An extremely consistent car that I have always loved driving sedately. Jazz is better built, but my mom loves the fixed cushion-type headrests of the rear seat on the Amaze than the flat bench on the Jazz/WR-V models.

Yes. I did a TD on the Jazz, it was all ok, until I took the backseat. The weak A/C and the non-existent head rests killed the deal for me. Then I noticed that Amaze also has fixed head rests, but these were larger than the Jazz. So I've asked the dealer for a TD on that. Will likely be getting it tomorrow or day after.

I am more-or-less tending to the Punch now. Never had a single TD that I did not like and it was also the one in which I had absolutely no motion sickness issues. Its a pity, it doesn't have the turbo yet. I guess no matter which car we pick, there will be compromises to be made.

[chaosengine]

I found the Punch to be slightly more refined than the NA variant of the Altroz and felt a bit stronger in the low end of the rev band, and less noisy. It handled well, but more importantly the ride felt far more plush. The second TD of the Punch - this happened near Mysore Road and I took it towards the Bangalore University roads where I got to push the car. I felt the upper/upper-midrange of the rev band a bit lacking, but nothing I'd complain about. This behaviour was similar to how the Altroz NA behaved.

However, I fell in love with the Altroz iTurbo engine. After the Polo GT TSI (which is in a league of its own, hands down), this was the next car that I thoroughly enjoyed driving. I got out of the car at the end of a rather long test drive with a mile wide smile. Mind you, this test drive happened on combination of winding and bumpy roads.

Originally Posted by blitz_nomad

Thank you! How did she respond to the Punch in comaprison to the altroz?

Amaze lacks rear-AC vents but I recollect seeing that the HVAC (please correct me if I am wrong) was borrowed from the 4th gen City. As long as the passengers aren't too tall, the fixed headrests do have enough support for the head against whiplash I suppose. Barring the slightly underwhelming but refined nature of the 1.2 iVTEC, Amaze has always felt really nice to drive and keep the passengers happy. Although I wish it did come with better noise insulation.

Originally Posted by blitz_nomad

Yes. I did a TD on the Jazz, it was all ok, until I took the backseat. The weak A/C and the non-existent head rests killed the deal for me. Then I noticed that Amaze also has fixed head rests, but these were larger than the Jazz. So I've asked the dealer for a TD on that. Will likely be getting it tomorrow or day after.

Punch is a good car, but for VFM reasons and my experiences with the iTurbo Altroz, I am heavily inching towards the iTurbo Altroz XZ. I wouldn't push you into investing into something you aren't convinced with buying, but I would strongly endorse you to try the iTurbo Altroz if you're fine with the ground clearance. It's probably a leap of faith given your previous experience with the stiff rides of the Altroz. Else among the Tata siblings with the NA engine, Punch does feel a bit more refined and better insulated from my experience (not sure what to attribute this difference to - engine tuning or insulation, possibly?)

[quote=blitz_nomad;5285530]

I am more-or-less tending to the Punch now. Never had a single TD that I did not like and it was also the one in which I had absolutely no motion sickness issues. Its a pity, it doesn't have the turbo yet. I guess no matter which car we pick, there will be compromises to be made.

[SavoyWalrus]

Goes inline with #3. Would be very helpful to hear the experiences of current Altroz and Punch owners. If any are reading this please do share your thoughts.

I wonder what is the right way to reach out to this crowd. Perhaps, If it is allowed, I could quote post this reply with a suitable intro, in a separate thread titled 'Current Altroz/Punch owners - Comments Invited' in the Initial ownership reviews forum?

I've owned the Altroz iTurbo for three months now and run around 3,000 kms. The harsh ride could be because of the tyres. The top-of-the-line iTurbo - which you'd have tested - is shod with 195/55 R16 which is a lower profile tyre than the Diesel or NA ones (they come with 185/60 R16). I feel that that makes quite a difference in ride quality.

Engine noise is quite prevalent while sitting up front, but if it's not caned around in the city, it's barely audible. With the music on, you won't hear much of the engine. Engine noise at triple-digit speeds is decently contained, but again, you can hear it more than its competition. I think you will have to live with the NVH if you were to buy one. I've read that sound dampening helps reduce cabin noise significantly in the cabin.

I couldn't find much difference in the two different iTurbos I tested. Maybe what you got was not maintained well or was due for service.

The Punch is quite peppy - perhaps even more so than the iTurbo - but I feel that it's perfect for the city only and may not be too comfortable on the highway. The engine settles in well after a while and can be a hoot to drive in Sport mode. I haven't encountered the throttle response issues that someone else mentioned. Sure, it doesn't have the explosiveness of the i20 turbo or Polo, but it's no slouch.

The iTurbo is great VFM when compared to the Punch as well. And it's quite a good handler too when compared to Punch, if that's an important criterion for you.

[blitz_nomad]

Folks,

I ended up booking the Tata Punch Petrol - Creative AMT. This was a bit of a compromise (Engine power wise as well as poor VFM).
The closest contender was the Altroz i-turbo, but decided to go for Punch mainly because of better NVH and higher ground clearance (will be helpful for my mother). Besides my first TD with Altroz gave me a picture of what the Altroz could be if there were issues...unfortunately there was no "unseeing" it.

Although I started out wanting a manual transmission, decided to switch to AMT mainly because of the responses in this thread as well as from various friends. Almost everyone recommending an automatic. I drove the Punch AMT for quite a distance (approx 15-20km) in bumper to bumper traffic as well as clear roads - got to experience in reality what the team-bhp review said. This was definitely at the bottom amongst the automatics I tried (Jazz CVT, Baleno AGS). However, given that I'm a new driver myself, as compared to my own shifting skills - it was acceptable and definitely more convenient.

A big thanks to all of you that responded in thread and helped with guidance.

[M_Poweredd_]

Hello everyone, before going on to my question a very happy Diwali to all!

My dad is currently dailying a Hyundai Grand i10 Auto 1.2 Magna and we were thinking about upgrading to a newer and a safer car overall. His daily commute is about 30-40 kms and his job demands a lot of moving around the city the whole day. We are very flexible with the feature list, as long as it has an auto climate control and an Automatic transmission. Since the i10 Magna was a barebones car to begin with anything else would be an upgrade. The ingress/outgress should be easier and its prefered if the car isn’t low slung.

We are also open to EVs(since thats what the government wants us to do) Budget would be under 10L, the rear seats are not gonna get used mostly not is the boot.

Thanks for your time!

[SixPistons]

A fronx delta plus might be a worthy consideration with appropriate egress/ingress, decent space in cabin(baleno on stilts), comfortable ride height.
Not sure on safety rating but it should turn out to be a good automatic if you are willing to consider an AMT. I have driven the Baleno 1.2 AMT and it was a well tuned engine transmission combination, with head jerks either well contained. Maruti DNA also means good efficiency. To that end, even Baleno/Ignis AMT are worthy considerations since rear seat and boot will not used that very much. I am guessing the engine/gb tuning would be similar in all three cars. Coming to a think of it, you could get the Ignis top variant or Baleno Delta AMT or Delta + AMT and still probably save some money, versus the Fronx as well.

i20, sadly, is the only other Automatic transmission comes to my mind here with a good ride height and comfort characteristics here. I wouldn’t suggest the Koreans as I had to get my alternator replaced within first few months itself on my i20 N Line, and few other hiccups. Safety isn’t too good here either, but hey, you get a CVT. On paper it might have a decent fuel efficiency, but that is not what the Hyundais are known for any way. Ride height and overall comfort are good though.

If safety is core concern, then Tatas all the way it is: Tiago/Punch. Not sure about how well equipped the AMT is. The 3 cylinder petrol mill is noted to be somewhat sluggish and AMT from Tatas have not been talked for about their smoothness. Rest, pretty sure you can find a decently equipped variant in your budget.

Shortlist some options and check out the cars in flesh with your family/dad on a Test Drive. That will give you a better idea if you like anything in the current market

[electric_eel]

Originally Posted by M_Poweredd_

Hello everyone, before going on to my question a very happy Diwali to all!


We are also open to EVs(since thats what the government wants us to do) Budget would be under 10L, the rear seats are not gonna get used mostly not is the boot.

Thanks for your time!

EV is a good option and no automatic can come even close to an EV in refinement. With a 10 L cap on budget the only real option is Tiago EV. Test drive and see how it goes. I hope you have option to slow charge at home (parking lot with 16 amps plug) otherwise you will not enjoy much.

[padmrajravi]

Originally Posted by M_Poweredd_

Hello everyone, before going on to my question a very happy Diwali to all!

My dad is currently dailying a Hyundai Grand i10 Auto 1.2 Magna and we were thinking about upgrading to a newer and a safer car overall. His daily commute is about 30-40 kms and his job demands a lot of moving around the city the whole day.

We are also open to EVs(since thats what the government wants us to do) Budget would be under 10L, the rear seats are not gonna get used mostly not is the boot.

Thanks for your time!

My sister had the same requirements recently and chose the Grand i10 Nios. She was driving our Xcent AT for about 3 years and needed a car at her new home. After all the research, we found the Hyundai twins are still the best value for money in sub 10 lakh segment. Aura's ugly rear side and this one being a single occupant car tilted the balance to Grand i10 Nios. The i10 now comes with six airbags and is not too bad in safety. The AMT is faster than our Xcent's 4 speed AT and the car is loaded with so many features. She did think about EVs, but the only EV available in that budget is Tata and we don't have much trust in their quality control.