[zenren]

Originally Posted by Aditya

Tata Motors has rolled out CNG variants of its Indigo sedan and Indica hatchback in Pune. The Indigo eMAX and Indica eMAX, as they are known will be available in six markets across India, namely Delhi, Maharashtra, Gujarat, Uttar Pradesh, Andhra Pradesh and Tripura.

So the Indigo and Indica are here to stay. Tata is unlikely to pull the plug on either of these anytime soon.

Originally Posted by volkman10

Next generation Tata Indica Vista (Falcon4) spied.

With additions like projector headlamps and a possible inclusion of a 1.2-litre turbocharged petrol unit, it's likely to be positioned above the current Indica Vista.

Projector headlamps, modified tail lamps and a new name - are they trying to do what Maruti did with Stingray and Wagon R?

Indicator and reverse light portion of the new tail lamp seems to be in the same shape and position they were in the Christmas tree cluster. Looks like they moved the brake lights from the top, placed it on the side and blacked out the area of previous brake light.

I sincerely hope they change the body shell too instead of letting all these engine changes go wasted as another facelift to Vista. Once that happens, even changing the body shell later would be perceived as 'new generation Vista' though it might not share anything with Vista then; just like Vista is still perceived by many as Indica in a different body.

[safari_lover]

Rohin Nagrani from BSMotoring has this to say on Twitter.

SCOOP: Tata #Nano with power steering to be launched by mid-Jan 2014.

source - https://twitter.com/rohinnagrani/sta...86400202846209

[IndiFuture]

@zenren: +1 on that thought.
The body shell is the biggest problem for Indica/Indigo. They are curvaceous, like a fat lady (no offence intended to anyone), but people prefer more sharp features (see Polo, Verna, City). And yes, the gaps through which spiderman can pass needs to be closed.

[MaxTorque]

By the way a friend of mine who is working in Tata's design arm said that, the new Indica is a completely new product. In his opinion, it will be difficult to believe that, it's a Tata product. Rest we need to wait and see.

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by MaxTorque

By the way a friend of mine who is working in Tata's design arm said that, the new Indica is a completely new product. In his opinion, it will be difficult to believe that, it's a Tata product. Rest we need to wait and see.

If they are re-doing the "Storme" strategy with the new Vista, let them NOT even waste their time.

From the spy shots, the new Vista (or is it the facelifted version with new Vista a completely different product) also looks a lot like the current gen. Changing everything and retaining the outer shell should be the last thing TATA should do now.

And did your friend say what is the expected time of launch of the Vista he is talking about?

[GrammarNazi]

Originally Posted by MaxTorque

By the way a friend of mine who is working in Tata's design arm said that, the new Indica is a completely new product. In his opinion, it will be difficult to believe that, it's a Tata product. Rest we need to wait and see.

I've heard that 2 of Australia's best auto-designers have been hired and are leading & training a Indian designing team. They're supposedly adopting a completely new design philosophy, hence the opinion.

As far as I can tell, if its an ALL-NEW product, then it's going to be really advanced. 'Advanced' in the sense of a 'BMW' kind of design.

[anjan_c2007]

By marketing shoddy cars for nearly a decade and a half, Tata Motors has sullied its reputation as a top of the line car maker.
The Sierra and Estate too had gremlins within, but people were still having hopes for the company to emerge out with quality cars.
I wonder as to how the Tata trucks that have been in the market since 1954 or so, were so foolproof as far as quality niggles are concerned. The trucks have been and are being driven for hundreds of kms everyday and are so rugged and reliable.
After all, we would like an Indian and homegrown car maker like Tata manufacturing quality cars to beat the hell out of the foreign competitors, most of whom are here to make money, with after sales spares and service at a premium.

"hum honge kaamyaab ek din"(meaning "we will taste success one day") needs to be sung by one and all at Tata Motors,Pimpri, Maharashtra. They also need to work hard apart from showing their vocal talents.

When will that day come ?

[san2]

as per my friend, the next Indica will have a tall boy design

[zenren]

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

"hum honge kaamyaab ek din"(meaning "we will taste success one day") needs to be sung by one and all at Tata Motors,Pimpri, Maharashtra. They also need to work hard apart from showing their vocal talents.

In a way, that song describes the state that Tata.

They believe they can do it ("poora hai vishwas") - but not now.

They hope they'll walk along with the top players some day ("hum chalenge saath saath ek din") - but not with the current lineup.

They are not afraid of anyone ("nahi darr kisi ka aaj ke din") - which is probably why they are not getting anywhere. They should be afraid of the customers if they want to be successful!

I guess they are singing it after every flop they add to their list. The lyrics is perfect for that context!

[JayPrashanth]

Originally Posted by san2

as per my friend, the next Indica will have a tall boy design

That's the Dolphin project. AFAIK, it will sit between the Nano & Indica. 800 cc petrol and 1.05 liter turbo diesel motor likely.

Cheers,

Jay

[mtnrajdeep]

Originally Posted by JayPrashanth

That's the Dolphin project. AFAIK, it will sit between the Nano & Indica. 800 cc petrol and 1.05 liter turbo diesel motor likely.

Cheers,

Jay

Tata is also trying to develop a GDI system for the dolphin petrol motor.

[torquecurve]

This is not a nitpick but just an observation.
Why is it that most people who keep bashing TATA cars are non owners? From what I have seen and experienced most people who own Tatas (even the older generation cars) swear by their reliability, comfort and ownership costs.
I own a Vista Safire, in my friend circle there is every single model currently sold by Tata, and all of them are happy with their vehicles.

The only challenge I see is the 'Taxi' image. Otherwise I dont see why these vehicles are any worse than others.

I personally believe Suzuki makes really bad vehicles - Safety, driveablity wise (Swift is a notable exception). Hyundai ownership costs remain high, but I dont see anyone whining about them.

Please try looking at the high mileage vehicles that are from these brands and they are actually worse than an equivalent Tata/ Mahindra!.

And that by paying about 50K or more less than them!

rant over!

Go Tata!! Go Mahindra!!!

[vibbs]

Originally Posted by torquecurve

This is not a nitpick but just an observation.
Why is it that most people who keep bashing TATA cars are non owners? From what I have seen and experienced most people who own Tatas (even the older generation cars) swear by their reliability,

Disclaimer: I don't own a Tata. This is not a Tata bashing post.

I would like to share a few thoughts or rather experiences.
Once on a business trip to Kochi, I was driven around in a fiesta. Absolutely silent, no rattles nothing. When I glanced at the Odo, I was surprised as it showed 1.9x lakh km. I asked the driver how long has he been driving this car, he said for close to 2 years since the car was introduced into the fleet. I also enquired if they had to do any major work in the car, any major expenses. He told me, that apart from the servicing and routine things, nothing out of ordinary. The engine had not been touched. I don't know how much of this is true, but he went on to add that a typical Tata car doing cab duty would require some major work on the engine by 70-80k kms.

Just last week on another business trip to Vizag, I was again driven from Vizag to Kakinada and back in a Fiesta, 1.6x lakh km mileage and a pretty good example for a taxi with that running.

Every single Tata cab I have been in has been in worser shape than these despite having run less. I frequently do Pune - Mumbai for business, generally in indicas/indigos.

My colleague has two cars, a petrol Swift and a diesel Indica. Despite being the older car and running on a costlier fuel, he does office comute daily (25 km one way in Mumbai) in his Swift. When I asked him the reason once, he told that buying the Indica has been the biggest mistake in his life

There have been enough people in Team-bhp including the mods who have faced endless niggles on their Tata cars. These have been documented too.

There are some very good strong points with Tata vehicles no doubt, but generally reliability is not one of them I believe.
When I was in the market to buy a car, this did play heavily on my mind. It's a different matter all together that I bought a car that belongs to a brand that is not any better.

Sorry if this appeared a rant.

Mods: Please delete if off topic.

[sachinayak]

I guess each car/manufacturer has its own strengths/weaknesses. The buyer needs to be careful in his/her evaluation in determining what makes sense to buy. Not all buyers necessarily do that. I bought my Manza for only 1 reason - space. If i have bought it for quality or reliability, it would have been my bad. Does not mean Tata can get away with poor quality, but you get what you pay for. Indica was (and perhaps still is) the cheapest diesel, so cannot keep too much expectation there.

That said a side-effect of a cheaper car is you probably do not pamper it enough e.g. I drive my Manza over poor (or non-existent) roads on a daily basis with not much fear. A higher end car owner would (and does) drive very slowly and carefully. Thus if my car starts rattling after a few years, i am partly to blame as well.

Tata Motors does have a long way to go forward, but they do have their positives.

[GrammarNazi]

I'm not 100% sure, but I think post 2010 Vista/Manza's were built better because they introduced new advanced robots at factory to build the chassis.

As I've been following Team-bhp since 2007, I too have come across members spilling their hearts out with their plight over problems with Tata cars & incompetency of A.S.S.

Now, I guess when old members know SO many people who've suffered, they're wary of believing Tata's reliability. Hence, in good faith, they warn people not to overlook issues and follow due diligence when it comes to Tata. People don't like doing that, they like doing what 'everybody does', perhaps blindly buy a Maruti!

In the last 2 years, on various automobile forums, I've come across people with post 2010 Tata cars being VERY confident of the reliability. I guess many of them are ones who actually followed due diligence & went with TATAs.

Although there still are issues at T.A.S.S., it's probably ~20% of before, but by now even the rare occasional issue gets noted/amplified and the 'old sayings' re-iterate themselves.

Wrt the 'Horizonext' initiative, I guess it was meant to announce to Dealers & Customers that they're all in for improving their cars, their post sales service and everthing else that needs to be done.

They changed the gearshift from rods(?) to cable-shift in the 'Horizonext' initiative. Thats an honest attempt to, atleast for now, improve what they offer until they come up with something new.

Also, they're deeply invested, consumers may be King, but when I actually saw the factory I realised producers shouldn't be taken for granted either.