[StarScream]

An eye-opening thread!

I don't own the 4th-gen City so I have nothing to contribute on ownership experience. But I was one of the first people to book it. Looking to replace my 10-year old 2nd-gen City this year, the new one was an automatic contender. I was however disappointed when the launch happened because Honda retained the petrol engine and seemed to have focused on features rather than technology, which was a key attribute of the brand for me.

On the inside, it did nothing for me. The seating position didn't suit me, the dash was too high and the door panels were shockingly thin. At the same time, my VW dealer started getting some availability of the Vento TSI. That car just seemed built to a different standard, not to mention it's drivetrain technology was as modern as can be for an IC engine. I chose the TSI and haven't looked back since. Honda lost a very early customer in me.

[sidindica]

Originally Posted by Doge

Oh dear!

Seems like Hondas have lost their resale too.

http://newdelhi.olx.in/honda-city-sv...-iid-738160170

Have a gut feeling that its a car repaired after a major accident, look at the pic carefully. I have taken 22 warranty claims in my punto, with number 23 coming up tomorrow.

[DoctorKK]

First of all let me congratulate you for this thread,the amount of effort, time and energy spent in compiling each and every detail is impeccable!!
This thread nonetheless sends shivers down my spine as I took delivery of my 'V' idtech only last week. Yes there are obvious cost cutting measures used in the 4th generation city,the other aspects you pointed out are totally unacceptable. People spending 10+ lac deserve better. But when a car sells in as huge numbers as the City is selling,some minor hitches are supposed to happen. The earlier they are corrected,the better impression it gives about the brand and the company.

[vsrivatsa]

A good compilation of facts and figures taken from the Official Thread This thread would be definitely very valuable for Honda if they want to act on the issues being reported.

I was also one of the folks who did a pre-booking to get ahead in the queue and went ahead and bought the i-DTEC city. As RavenAvi has put forth, the engine is excellent despite the noise levels (which I was used to anyway coming from an earlier car with a 3 cylinder diesel engine).

Although I have not faced any of the major issues reported, the fact remains that the piano black panel needs very careful handling, the door pads move a bit when the window glass is rolled all the way up. It is these minor details which we as owners expect from a car in the C2 segment...

With City having sold 5,120 Units in October 2014 and Honda planning to add another shift, the Sales definitely is doing too well for Honda to wake up and address these issues immediately - but I just sincerely hope they do...

[pgsagar]

Interesting thread. This was to be expected. Honda, to me, means cars upwards of Civic (including Civic). Civic, Accord and CRV are what I call Honda. Small cars were never their forte, as far as my knowledge goes. They made small cars in late 70s and graduated to bigger cars. Sure there is Jazz and City now but I guess they are not a global cars. Only south east Asia, I guess. And now with Civic/Accord gone and CRV selling in small numbers they were forced to focus on small cars which are built to price. Hence the fall or rather absence of quality, i guess. But their cars are hugely reliable unlike those dumb German cars everyone seems to tomtom about these days.

[V.Narayan]

Kudos to Crazy Driver for this compilation. As a fan of Honda and the happy owner of a 2010 Jazz I feel a twinge of regret if Honda is indeed declining. Fact is we the customer are demanding more and more from our car manufacturers for a lower and lower price. This may be a feasible reality in the world of consumer electronics but less so in the world of mechanical products. The message we are giving to the OEMs is that to be profitable in the Indian market you should price low and after a point the only way to do that is by cutting corners on quality. It really would be a sad day if Honda consistently dips on quality. On another thread I shared comparisons of yesterday with today on two of my earliest cars. Repeating that here (with forgiveness sought from the moderators) to emphasize the point.

1985 Maruti 800; Rs 56,000 -- Today = ~Rs 500,000
[no power windows, no air con, no music system or radio, no seat height adjustment, no steering wheel adjustment, no fog lamps, no hub caps, no leather seats, no central locking and what not]

1992 Premier Padmini Rs 200,000 -- Today = ~ Rs 700,000
[no power windows, no air con, no music system or radio, no seat height adjustment, no steering wheel adjustment, no fog lamps, no hub caps, no leather seats, no central locking, no seat belts, and of course the poor poor build quality Premier was known for]

V.Narayan

[adimicra]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Interesting thread. This was to be expected. Honda, to me, means cars upwards of Civic (including Civic). Civic, Accord and CRV are what I call Honda. Small cars were never their forte, as far as my knowledge goes. They made small cars in late 70s and graduated to bigger cars. Sure there is Jazz and City now but I guess they are not a global cars. Only south east Asia, I guess. And now with Civic/Accord gone and CRV selling in small numbers they were forced to focus on small cars which are built to price. Hence the fall or rather absence of quality, i guess. But their cars are hugely reliable unlike those dumb German cars everyone seems to tomtom about these days.

You are wrong..Jazz/Fit is a global model and a very successful one too. The reason that the Jazz was priced very high here was due to low localization but the flip reside of that is excellent quality inside out with lots of attention to detail.

The City I agree is not a global product ...it is more for the Asian markets and some other developing countries.

I think a better strategy for Honda is to charge a slight premium but still maintain the quality and reliability expected from them..

One question to ponder is - if Hyundai/Maruti can maintain good quality and reliability levels at similar price, why can't Honda?

[nvramsub]

Originally Posted by StarrySky

This thread has come up at exactly the right time for me. Two days back, my BIL sent me pics from his Ciaz TD (to replace the ageing Fiesta at home) and I advised him to go for the City instead. I have now sent him the link to this thread. Maybe we have to now just wait a few months for a similar thread to come up on the Ciaz before plonking money on one

Considered the Ford Fiesta? If not I suggest a test drive before deciding.

[StarrySky]

Originally Posted by nvramsub

Considered the Ford Fiesta? If not I suggest a test drive before deciding.

We replaced one Fiesta (1.6 petrol) with another (1.4 TDCi) 4 years back. So, not really keen on the Fiesta this time. However, last time also, we had avoided the Fiesta from the initial list, but finally went back to it.

[motorworks]

Fantastic data mining by Crazy driver!
I didn't actually expect this in the new city. I always thought that Honda played the value game with the brio, amaze and the mobilio and was always under the impression that the city and Jazz would have no such compromises since they charge. Slight premium anyway.

On the other hand, it looks like Honda has undervalued the Indian consumer!

One my friend drove his relative's new city and complained of some of the incidents highlighted in this thread.

Unfortunately this would not get around much and the city would continue to sell since there is a fan following. A very close friend of mine just booked the city without even test Driving it, blind belief in Honda! Sad!

[suhas_raj]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

But their cars are hugely reliable unlike those dumb German cars everyone seems to tomtom about these days.

Really ?? Don't you think that is probably the last thing you should be saying on this thread !!

This thread is about how Honda in its latest conquest has turned out to be quite the opposite of "hugely reliable"

[carwatcher]

I don't think Maruti scores high on 'good quality' criteria on almost all their models including 'Swift' which is expensive. Just look at ownership review all over T-Bhp. For Eg. door panels.
All of their products are cleverly priced. Vxi variants sound like top end but the feature list is pathetic, they don't even give rear wiper, defogger, etc. like necessary features.
Even Hyundai is going the same way. Also Hyundai engines sound like 'power horses' but in reality, it feels like few of those horses went for sleep.
As I mentioned in my earlier post on this very thread, they too are compromising either on build quality or feature list.

Quoting extreme torque's signature...
Cheap and Fast is not Reliable.
Cheap and Reliable is not Fast.
Fast and Reliable is not Cheap.

Originally Posted by adimicra

One question to ponder is - if Hyundai/Maruti can maintain good quality and reliability levels at similar price, why can't Honda?

Though I wanted to ask this question to crazydriver but I guess we all can discuss this.
Aren't reliability and niggle-free are two different things. Why I am asking this is as almost all the Japanese cars are perceived to be more reliable (even with handful of dealers and service centers) than their European counterparts while its the overall build quality of European cars which is often talked about be it rubber parts or plastic switches along with their feel, fit and finish and this thread is highlighting this very issue.
Isn't time spent in garage is the main criteria for reliability and I am sure Honda City still scores high on this point as compared to European counterparts.
Either I am missing something and all I can say that at least I am fully confused on this matter.
Durable (parts like switches, etc.)
Reliable (Engine, Electric and Electronic parts, etc.)
Quality (proper fit and finish, consistent panel gaps, etc.)
Value for money (absence of basic features, cost-cutting like no rubber beadings, single reverse light, etc.)

Again quoting extreme torque's (version 2) signature...
Branded while VFM can't be Reliable.
Reliable while VFM can't be Branded.
Branded while Reliable can't be VFM.

Originally Posted by suhas_raj

This thread is about how Honda in its latest conquest has turned out to be quite the opposite of "hugely reliable"

[Kratos453]

Originally Posted by carwatcher

I don't think Maruti scores high on 'good quality' criteria on almost all their models including 'Swift' which is expensive. Just look at ownership review all over T-Bhp. For Eg. door panels.
All of their products are cleverly priced. Vxi variants sound like top end but the feature list is pathetic, they don't even give rear wiper, defogger, etc. like necessary features.
Even Hyundai is going the same way. Also Hyundai engines sound like 'power horses' but in reality, it feels like few of those horses went for sleep.

I beleive your post explains a lot about why we are worried about the latest honda city. It is pretty clear that a car which was like zeus (god of gods) is a mere mortal now. Honda city's quality being compared to maruti and hyundai (no offence to any owners) itself shows why honda is to blamed.

If I simply question myself; why buy a honda city, I can easily think of three reasons:
1. Reliability (Engine etc...)
2. Quality & Brand (build quality etc...)
3. Durability (Niggle free...)

We are missing the above three if whatever posted on the thread is true.

[reppy]

Originally Posted by fastraj

2. The tyre upgrade to primacy 3st has changed the ride and handling characteristics of the car.
These are the two must have upgrades that will improve the car according to me.

Would the Bridgestone Turanza AR 20 work instead of the Michelin P3ST? Size would be same - 195/60R15. Michelins don't have very good cut and chip resistance on Indian roads, plus I don't have a good experience with the XM2's on my i20: mileage/ride did not improve by much versus the stock acelere, and I actually got better mileage with Yoko S drives! Weird!

[hrman]

Originally Posted by sidindica

Have a gut feeling that its a car repaired after a major accident, look at the pic carefully. I have taken 22 warranty claims in my punto, with number 23 coming up tomorrow.

Seems suspect surely. A similar ad by the same seller, but at 7L. Same car snaps here with the registration number wiped off, although he claims it is unregistered.

http://newdelhi.olx.in/new-honda-cit...-iid-737627907